Wicca and Paganism... The old religions

Originally posted by LoneGunMan
Why the "New religions" (Catholic, Christain, etc.) try to put Wicca into the evil trick bag. Pagan goes back to its roots in the Dravidian living in the Indus valley goes back 30,000 years or more.

Wicca is from these old religions and is the power of nature. We derive our power from the source, the universe. It has nothing to do with Satan, and has everything to do with what is natural and good.

Just a point of fact: 'paganism' and 'wicca' are both products manufactured in and after the 1960's. The claim to be ancient is nonsense.

All the best,

Roger Pearse

Originally posted by jake1997

Originally posted by masqua

When you think of God, do you visualize a man somewhere observing us all or do you look at a rock and visualize that rock BEING God?

You see, Jake...the Creator to me is everything that exists, whether it is Earth or a star in some distant galaxy.

The creator to me is a being. We are the image of Him.

"We are the image of Him", interesting choice of words that may substantiate the view of the previously quoted.

You stated "We are the image of Him", not: We are the resemblence of the image of Him, or: We are the image that is a reflexion of Him.

If We are the image of the Creator, then we are God's image, not likeness.

The Model T isnt the creator. Neither is the factory. Henry Ford is.

interesting analogy, but the model T is still the manifestation of Henry Ford's creation. I realize you are stating that Henry Ford is not the Model T, however: There is an aspect of Henry Ford within the Model T, just not actually a physical part of the Model T.

Then again, the Creator may not be a physical being.

in the analogy wouldn't:
We = The Model Ts
Jesus = The factory (medium between the creator and the finshed product)
Henry Ford = The creator.

In which case: The Model T (we the finished product) pre-existed before the factory (Jesus, medium between us and the creator)?


Or, perhaps pre-christians were prototypes, as the model T was just the mass production of the automobile, but there were motorized horseless carriages prior to the model T?

[edit on 08/12/71 by Esoteric Teacher]

Originally posted by roger_pearse

Originally posted by LoneGunMan
Why the "New religions" (Catholic, Christain, etc.) try to put Wicca into the evil trick bag. Pagan goes back to its roots in the Dravidian living in the Indus valley goes back 30,000 years or more.

Wicca is from these old religions and is the power of nature. We derive our power from the source, the universe. It has nothing to do with Satan, and has everything to do with what is natural and good.

Just a point of fact: 'paganism' and 'wicca' are both products manufactured in and after the 1960's. The claim to be ancient is nonsense.

All the best,

Roger Pearse

Agreed, saying Wicca has ancient origins is like saying the new Dukes of hazard movie is exactly like the old TV series

But I find it interesting that wiccans usually end up saying "You don't understand" to help prove thier superiority over non-wiccans. I would like to understand but they never offer thier wisdom to others. Sounds like the trappings of a cult IMHO

I have said before that I should not have used th term Wicca. It should have been witchcraft. Wicca was invented in 1951. Paganism goes back to its roots 30,000 years ago to the Indu vally. Pagan is nothing but the worship of the power of the universe, and nature. Native Americans can be considered Pagan. Look up the history of religion. Look up the Christain holidays.

Then come back when you are more informed!

Wicca is "based upon " the old ways. Much the same as ALL forms of xianity
are based upon the the teachings of Saul of Tarsus as interpreted by ( insert
leader du jure here).
In its simplest form Pagan can and has been defined as " anyone who does
not believe EXACTLY as the writer/speaker does. ( please reference Jack Chick,
Tex Marr, etc,etc, Billy Grahm, Jim Baker, yada yada yada.)



To quote a Native American, "You tell me my ways are wrong. How can you say
my ways are wrong? you cannot even decide amongst yourselves who is right.
When you have decided amongst yourselves who is right then come again to me and we will speak of this."

It is interesting to note that those who are credited with starting the "new
religion" of Protestantism, did not advocate the creation of a "new religion"
but a return to the old ways of the religion. they PROSESTED (hence the term
Protest-ant) the largess of the church hierarcy just as Jeshua did 1500 +
years earlier. Jeshua did not advocate a "new belief but a return to the old ways.

Originally posted by roger_pearse

Just a point of fact: 'paganism' and 'wicca' are both products manufactured in and after the 1960's. The claim to be ancient is nonsense.

All the best,

Roger Pearse

Easter is a Christian holiday incorporated into Christianity thousands of years ago, but named after Esther, the spring goddess of fertility. Hence, the symbolism of the Easter egg (fertility, birth), and the Easter Bunny (also fertility), and reffered to as "Pagan" thousands of years before the 1960s.

The fear of "Paganism" and so-called "satanic worship", was indeed utilized as the driving source behind the inquisition, and the word "paganism", was used then. Constanine aslo used the word "paganism". My point is "Paganism" can not be a product of the 1960s. And, the word "Wicca", is merely a new word to label very ancient beliefs.

"Just a point of fact: 'paganism' and 'wicca' are both products manufactured in and after the 1960's. The claim to be ancient is nonsense."

According to my dictionary the word "pagan" derives from "paganus" meaning pagan in Greek, circu 600 b.c.

Just a point of fact: Something can not be a product of a time, when it existed 2,140 years prior to the time it supposedly was supposedly conceived as a new idea.

Before you all run off with a wild thread, let's get one thing straight! Paganism is not a single religion or belief system. It is a collection of related faiths, just like Christianity. The whole concept behind Paganism is the idea that God reviles himself to people through the elements of nature! You don't need to build huge temples and monuments to find God.

It help to know what your talking about!

Tim

Originally posted by LoneGunMan
Why the "New religions" (Catholic, Christain, etc.) try to put Wicca into the evil trick bag. Pagan goes back to its roots in the Dravidian living in the Indus valley goes back 30,000 years or more.

Wicca is from these old religions and is the power of nature. We derive our power from the source, the universe. It has nothing to do with Satan, and has everything to do with what is natural and good.

The "New religions" took over during the Aryan expansion of 2100 B.C.E. It was with the need for rulers and followers in a warlike culture, and created a need for dieties to enforce a ruling class and a warrior class, with a priesthood to stand between the masses and the elite.

Very interesting observation… I think something people should remember and think about …

Originally posted by mrwupy
Religion, ALL RELIGIONS, are a form of control. Each and every one is nothing more than a cult for no other reason then they close your mind to the broader realities of our existence.

They battle among themselves not for the glory of the creator but for the converts and sheeple that will bring them the power and gold of this world, which they so hungrily lust after.

It matters not what religion you follow, each is just a differant label on the same bottle of snake oil.

Free the chains from your mind and the chains on your soul will melt away.

Love and light,

Wupy

PS: this is just my humble opinion

I think that is generally true.. although I think there is also basic MIXED in fundamental truth within all religions

Originally posted by ghost
Before you all run off with a wild thread, let's get one thing straight! Paganism is not a single religion or belief system. It is a collection of related faiths, just like Christianity. The whole concept behind Paganism is the idea that God reviles himself to people through the elements of nature! You don't need to build huge temples and monuments to find God.

this in itself is not entirely accurate either. not all "pagan" religions believe in one god. although in general most do revere nature, not all do. not all of them are "related faiths" either. some were more alike than different because of geographical location, like rome and greece, but then again....we all experience for the most part the same forces of nature that is why many religions have deities for similar things( like gods or goddesses of the sea, or thunder).

i myself am a norse heathen and proud to be so.