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Patriot Act Approved! House approved the measure 257-171.

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posted on Jul, 23 2005 @ 11:07 AM
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ed, it's like you said about the Patriot Act. Terrorist attacks having effected me yet, so I don't care.

You could counter that "they'll be at my door step if I don't care" but I don't believe that. I believe giving up our liberties is way more dangerous, a trick that has been pulled many times before in history, feel free to research. Give up your liberties and we'll give you security, give up more liberties and we'll give you more security. Yet instead of more security and less terrorism, there's an ESCALATION of terrorism. So the terrorism doesn't decrease, and your civil liberties do. It's a scare tactic that has been pulled since the days of Rome. It is only the ignorant such as yourself that fears foreign terrorists more than their Government. Because they will just continue to feed off your fear, and once you realize it, it will be too late.

You have a disease called Nationalism my friend, you think your Government is above the possibility of ever turning on you. Yet they're taking your liberties away that have NOTHING to do with terrorism. Tell me how the Government taking our property away will fight terrorism? You are a false Patriot, as choosing the Government over the the people is not Patriotism, it's actually un-american. I'll sure you'll choose to counter, but you'll still be wrong.

Government loyalty does not equal Patriotism, The Patriot Act is a farce to take away our civil liberties, making many ignorant Americans feel they are not Patriotic if they don't blindly give up their freedom. There is nothing Patriotic about the Patriot Act, it is only meant to undermine the Constitution, wake up.


But don't just take my word for it. Take the word of a TRUE PATRIOT in Government. Congressman Ron Paul, who is a REPUBLICAN, believes the Patriot Act is just a way for Government to get more power. He is a true American that should run for President, over the scum that is in office now.

www.lewrockwell.com...


Reconsidering the Patriot Act

by Rep. Ron Paul, MD

When Congress passed the Patriot Act in the emotional aftermath of the September 11th terrorist attacks, a sunset provision was inserted in the bill that causes certain sections to expire at the end of 2005. But this begs the question: If these provisions are critical tools in the fight against terrorism, why revoke them after five years? Conversely, if these provisions violate civil liberties, why is it acceptable to suspend the Constitution for any amount of time?


I recommend you read more from him as he is outspoken against this corrupt Government. He is what America needs.

www.lewrockwell.com...



[edit on 23-7-2005 by NoJustice]




posted on Jul, 23 2005 @ 11:18 AM
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NoJustice is right.

Tum tum tuuuuuum...




posted on Jul, 23 2005 @ 06:51 PM
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By the patriot act I right now am acting as a terrorist. I am overtly acting against our goverment. Wheter they choose to "detain" me or not they legally can.

That is wrong.

The Patriot Act does nothing to help close up our porous borders, to help protect ports. It does nothing to direct homeland security's squandering of money towards those or other immediate dangers. The Patriot Act does nothing to refit the CIA or FBI with better equipment and procedures to deal with terrorism.

The Patriot Act in short does very little to protect against Terrorism. It was wrote years before 9/11 during Clintons Term. He tried to have it passed once before and it was handidly rejected. The US had suffered NO terrorist acts on our soil. The patriot act was not designed during or for "The war on Terror" as many of you like to act.

I do not beleive 9/11 was a inside job, but it did make it possible for our goverment to take more control over our lives. The Patriot act worries me, but I am worried more about how much of our rights we could loose if another attack happened.

These laws WILL NOT go away when the threat is gone. No law ever has. Time after time antiquated laws are voted through again and again because the system gets used to having them, and they are fought for by those in power.

Several years ago when the National ID card was first stated all that was heard concerning it was outrage that our goverment would attempt to violate our privacy like that. Not to mention the fact that they would circumvent our constitution which specificly forbids federal goverment from wielding such power. Now its all but certain to pass without much press or protest.

Year after year, law after law our rights are waining and the power of our RESTRICTED federal goverment is growing.

Some people used to beleive that rain was God's tears. In the US we don't need him to cry for our forefather's I'm sure are crying enough.

Our goverment routinely lies to us and tries to hide it. They are routinely caught. Years passed the magnitude of this alone would not have been tolerated.

Our goverment routinely hands out no bid contracts to companies known to have conducted fraudulent business with the goverement before. This also would not have been tolerated.

Our goverment routinely passes laws directly against our constitution and has no qualms about it.

Our goverment routinely wages war without declaration of war. This is directly against our constitution.

Tell me again why I should trust our goverment to do whats right for me, my family, my friends and my property? Time and time again they are proving themselves untrustworthy and unfit to hold office. Time and time again they directly violate the very foundation of this country.

Now I ask ALL of you one question, I dont expect a answer but you do owe it to yourself to find one.

When will YOU say enough?




[edit on 23-7-2005 by Xerrog]



posted on Jul, 23 2005 @ 07:25 PM
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C'mon guys...Edsinger's a plant. Don't take the bait.
Remember that, "the single act of obediance is the cornerstone of authority."

Thats all you need to take with you into the fight on the next level.




There is no enemy anywhere - Lao Tse
(Never has been)



posted on Jul, 23 2005 @ 11:12 PM
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Lets let anyone do anything they want, come and go as they please, communicate however they choose, plan without scrutiny.


Pretty much. Isn't it interesting that in those countries that have had 'terrorism', the populace suffers from onerous oversight and control...and nebulous 'terrorism' continues. Look at Ireland, 'Israel', and any tin pot dictatorship in SA for salient examples. And surprise of surprises many of the incidents are traced back to gov't or gov't controled entities.


Yup, this way we can all have our total freedoms until death.


Exactly!



And that just might not come to you, but your neighbor.....your relatives...your countrymen.


Enemies come and go...which is why we have the Constitution and a Republic. Enemies foreign and Domestic.



To hell with fighting these bastards, I would rather die than give up any liberty, I want to be able to walk unto a bus station in July wearing a bulging topcoat. To hell with searching me as you would be violating my rights to do as I please.


So long as I'm not hurting anyone, let me wear pink pajamas with yellow spots...bulging or no. And I will die before giving up liberty that generations have bled to protect. There are all those silly quotes to that effect by all those dead white guys who bled to death for one to live up to.



The PA did not take your right to own guns now did it.


Nice straw man. You very well know what an enabling law is all about...its an attack on the rule of law. Gun control would be the end game, because it tips ones hand completely and won't be tolerated here. No, its far easier to brainwash those with guns into believing there is an outside threat and to trust domestic powers implicitly. Once achieved you don't need to take their guns...they're cowed. A metanoid is just as dangerous as a paranoid, but a healthy distrust of government is crucial to the development of a moral, thinking adult.



To start calling this a police state is ignorant.

Have I stated or implied that you are ignorant because you act like a metanoid and have forgotten your conservative roots? Nice indirect ad hominem. Of course the truth is that the trend towards a police state is well established in all major western countries...the gov'ts fear the end of the age of oil, and the populations that rely on easy energy.



This reminds me of the good ol moral "If it feels good, do it!"


Actually, it should remind you of 'Pursuit of Hapiness', which is far more acurate and less inflamatory. It's far easier to play off fear and over emotionalize an arguement than it is to find support for the tactics of 'fascism' or 'communism'.



posted on Jul, 24 2005 @ 01:11 AM
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Originally posted by NoJustice

You have a disease called Nationalism my friend, you think your Government is above the possibility of ever turning on you. Yet they're taking your liberties away that have NOTHING to do with terrorism. Tell me how the Government taking our property away will fight terrorism? You are a false Patriot, as choosing the Government over the the people is not Patriotism, it's actually un-american. I'll sure you'll choose to counter, but you'll still be wrong.


by Rep. Ron Paul, MD

When Congress passed the Patriot Act in the emotional aftermath of the September 11th terrorist attacks, a sunset provision was inserted in the bill that causes certain sections to expire at the end of 2005. But this begs the question: If these provisions are critical tools in the fight against terrorism, why revoke them after five years? Conversely, if these provisions violate civil liberties, why is it acceptable to suspend the Constitution for any amount of time?



I for one like Ron Paul but he wants to implement many more things in which most I agree with.

The government has owned my property for many years, I just rent it. Try not paying you taxes and see if you own it.

I am a Patriot, one that has served and understands this is a different world we live in, people will no longer fight with honor, they go after the innocent. These people are around you and want you dead, they could be even your neighbor. All the governemnt is asking for is the ability to confront them, heck they can do it with child molestors so why not people planning to kill many innocents. Its subversion and it already can be confronted, but the leftists wacko's are more concerned about their baggage being looked at than the lives of their countrymen.


I guess you speak out when you are at an airport don't you? I mean there go the rights to baord a plane with a bomb, even IF you have no intention of harming someone.









Originally posted by Xerrog
By the patriot act I right now am acting as a terrorist. I am overtly acting against our goverment. Wheter they choose to "detain" me or not they legally can.That is wrong.


Well I think that is horse pucky. All the PA will let them do is come watch you a bit closer if you start talking about the 70 virgins you will soon have - oun intended.



Originally posted by Xerrog
The Patriot Act does nothing to help close up our porous borders, to help protect ports. It does nothing to direct homeland security's squandering of money towards those or other immediate dangers. The Patriot Act does nothing to refit the CIA or FBI with better equipment and procedures to deal with terrorism.




I agree here on the border, but on the other item, you have no idea what is being spent and being DONE with that money.




Originally posted by Xerrog
Several years ago when the National ID card was first stated all that was heard concerning it was outrage that our goverment would attempt to violate our privacy like that. Not to mention the fact that they would circumvent our constitution which specificly forbids federal goverment from wielding such power. Now its all but certain to pass without much press or protest.


YOu already have one, its called a Social Security card, a credit report, a background search database, all pre 911 and pre PA.




Originally posted by Xerrog
Our goverment routinely wages war without declaration of war. This is directly against our constitution.


On this I somewhat agree, if we had done that in Vietnam and Korea we would have been better off. Actually I wanted Bush to declare it through Congress on Sept 13th 2001, but he didnt have the balls. And yes we know who the enemy is.



Originally posted by Voice_of DoomC'mon guys...Edsinger's a plant. Don't take the bait. Remember that, "the single act of obediance is the cornerstone of authority."


A plant for whom? This always cracks me up, I am a private citizen working for a private corporation. Why do I come here then? I love to confront the Tulipwalkers on the crap and call them on it. There are many young in here who need to hear the other side other than the peacnick capitulate version of events.


I think I am doing my part coming here and I think I do a fair job considering how outnumbered I am in here.








Originally posted by awshucksme

Pretty much. Isn't it interesting that in those countries that have had 'terrorism', the populace suffers from onerous oversight and control...and nebulous 'terrorism' continues. Look at Ireland, 'Israel', and any tin pot dictatorship in SA for salient examples. And surprise of surprises many of the incidents are traced back to gov't or gov't controled entities.


This country is the furthest thing from what you present its laughable to even give that one a notice.


Originally posted by awshucksme

Yup, this way we can all have our total freedoms until death.


Exactly!


So you would rather die than give up some minor freedoms that cause you minor inconvienance? Ok yell "Praise Allah Kill the Infidels next time the airport folks search your bag or person.

Call me and tell me if there are 70 virgins awaiting you?


Originally posted by awshucksme

And that just might not come to you, but your neighbor.....your relatives...your countrymen.

Enemies come and go...which is why we have the Constitution and a Republic. Enemies foreign and Domestic.


And that is why you should be defending your nation in a time of war instead of condeming it for trivial #.


Originally posted by awshucksme

To hell with fighting these bastards, I would rather die than give up any liberty, I want to be able to walk unto a bus station in July wearing a bulging topcoat. To hell with searching me as you would be violating my rights to do as I please.


So long as I'm not hurting anyone, let me wear pink pajamas with yellow spots...bulging or no. And I will die before giving up liberty that generations have bled to protect.



I don't know much what to say to that?? I guess you dont ride the subways huh? What you ask is not workable. You will scream that the government let it happen and did nothing. There is no satisfying you. WE ARE AT WAR, deal with it.


Originally posted by awshucksme

The PA did not take your right to own guns now did it.


Nice straw man. You very well know what an enabling law is all about...its an attack on the rule of law. Gun control would be the end game, because it tips ones hand completely and won't be tolerated here. No, its far easier to brainwash those with guns into believing there is an outside threat and to trust domestic powers implicitly. Once achieved you don't need to take their guns...they're cowed. A metanoid is just as dangerous as a paranoid, but a healthy distrust of government is crucial to the development of a moral, thinking adult.



Well whatever you say, tell you what, next time I am using my brainwash er I mean mouthwash, I will laugh about that one.





Originally posted by awshucksme

To start calling this a police state is ignorant.

Have I stated or implied that you are ignorant because you act like a metanoid and have forgotten your conservative roots? Nice indirect ad hominem. Of course the truth is that the trend towards a police state is well established in all major western countries...the gov'ts fear the end of the age of oil, and the populations that rely on easy energy.


Mentoid , whatever. The definition of ignorance it "not knowing" so in that respect I was wrong. You know and choose to believe some bull# crap you read on a conspiracy board instead of the truth. When is the last time you had the FBI come by and abuse your rights? Anyone you know have that happen? It a real long stretch to say we are a police state. We can still speak our minds as I have done to congressmen in person and it wasnt pretty. (R) by the way.




Originally posted by awshucksme

This reminds me of the good ol moral "If it feels good, do it!"


Actually, it should remind you of 'Pursuit of Hapiness', which is far more acurate and less inflamatory. It's far easier to play off fear and over emotionalize an arguement than it is to find support for the tactics of 'fascism' or 'communism'.


Play off fear? WTF?

These sons a bitchs want to kill millions of Americans and you are worried about their civil rights? Screw them, racially profile them, whatever it takes. I expect my government to do what is nessesary to protect me and my family and if the liberals dont like it, TOUGH # - MOVE.


[edit on 24-7-2005 by edsinger]



posted on Jul, 24 2005 @ 07:37 AM
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i guess the constitution doesn't mean much to you Ed.

At most maybe a "nice set of ideals that have become outdated"

If it REALLY meant anything panties in a bunch would be an understatement over this blatant circumvention of the entire bill of rights.

i think i am going to be sick!

Crack down all you want with this type of legislation but it will do nothing to prevent terrorists - NOTHING. I've seen the arguement that now (under this draconian law) we have the tools to track the terrorists down. Uh huh . . . . riiiiiiight. Their body parts are normally mingled with the wreckage.

Did someone miss the fact that the terrorists have been suicide bombers?

Did you consider that there will never be enough police to have one for every citizen to make sure none of them commit an act of terror?

Have you considered who is going to police the police?

Random acts of violence are a thing of life- somethings you just cannot prevent with any level of effort. Have you cinsidered how the term "postal" became an everyday phrase? where is the legislation mandating total survialance of this section of the population? WHAT WOULD BE THE POINT?

I'll bet most are old enough to remember the series of mass homicides at different McDonalds around the country. gunman walks in and opens up. Is this type of thing preventable??? i don't think so. i've heard all the arugements in my life. ban guns; give everyone guns. Pass this law. repeal that one. blah, blah, blah. It happens.

is the entire populas in threat of annilation? don't think so. terroist acts are actually pretty RARE. Are our FREEDOMS in jeopardy? you betya!

Instead of cowering on the lookout for "terrorists" enjoy your life while you have it and charish the FREEDOMS you have.

You have over a 1000 times greater chance getting killed in a car accident TODAY then even wounded by a terrorist in your LIFETIME. No one is out to ban cars or wage a war on their manufacturers.

If the PA goes through you have 100% chance of having your freedoms curtailed. Only you may never even know it. If a tree falls in the woods and no one is around, does it make a sound? If your freedoms are stripped and you have never needed to exercise them are they really gone?

So what is more important? The rights for the entire country for generations to come or the nearly impossible odds of being a victim????

Dang that is as black and white as the "Shall"s and "shall not"s in the constitution.



posted on Jul, 24 2005 @ 09:06 AM
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Yeah it's pointless to ever debate with ed. ed you are one citizen that these terrorists have gained a victory from. You live in fear of them and are willing to suspend the constitution because you think they're going to come to your house if you don't. That's what they want don't they? They don't want Americans to be free, you're playing into their hands, you're so gullable. There's an absolute needle in a haystack of a chance that a terrorist attack would happen to you, or anyone even on this message board. Yet you think the constitution is worth throwing away for that? Let me wake you up to something, there's a much larger chance that another American will murder you than a foreign enemy doing so.

Don't give me that pathetic, unthoughtout sentence of "our property was not ours before 9/11" If you don't pay taxes that's one thing, but now they can cease your property because it makes the city more money. When are you going to learn that it's all about money ed? For example there's a reason our schools have food that's bad for our children. There are lobbyists that keep the Government in check and make sure they never pass laws that goes against them feeding our children this so called food because it would take money away from them, this shows they don't care about us, they care about the money and being reelected.

You think the Patriot Act is in your best interest? It's not even about catching terrorists, it's about tracking us. Our Government has been completely corrupt since around the time the CIA came along. JFK tried to change our corrupt money system and rid the CIA and weeks later he was killed. You say we should protect ourselves from the enemy? I say the enemy lies in many members of our Government.

I don't see how you can like Ron Paul and like the Big Government we have at the same time. He has the complete opposite view of you. He's against the Patriot Act, he's against the Government taking our land, he knows the Iraq war is a farce, and from reading enough of his opinion I believe he knows 9/11 is a farce too, but can't come out and say it. You see he cares about the people of this country. Apparently you don't, you live in fear of an invisible enemy, and to you that's more important than the constitution we've been fighting for over 200 years. So go on and live with that opinion, but you're living in fantasy land. I guess it's easier for some to live there rather than face reality.



[edit on 24-7-2005 by NoJustice]



posted on Jul, 24 2005 @ 10:22 AM
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Originally posted by NoJusticeYeah it's pointless to ever debate with ed. ed you are one citizen that these terrorists have gained a victory from. You live in fear of them and are willing to suspend the constitution because you think they're going to come to your house if you don't. That's what they want don't they? They don't want Americans to be free, you're playing into their hands, you're so gullable. There's an absolute needle in a haystack of a chance that a terrorist attack would happen to you, or anyone even on this message board. Yet you think the constitution is worth throwing away for that? Let me wake you up to something, there's a much larger chance that another American will murder you than a foreign enemy doing so.





They have gained no victory from me? They have only gained the war in which they desire. As was supposedly said by my may tagline,

"I believe that forgiving them is God's function. Our job is simply to arrange the meeting." Gen. Schwartzkopf


YOu see the Patriot Act has already had its fruits. It a town called Lodi in California -- look it up and then say how much you car about these bastards civil rights ok? You sound like a lawyer for the ACLU, next in line will be the Chirstian bashing....whatever.

You are the lost cause , not I.

Yes, for me personally, the odds of being a victim of terror are remote at best. But, if the WMD attack comes, we all might wish we were dead quick and easy. I dont really know. But at that time, it will to be to late to wonder if we could have caught the bastards and to hell with the civil rights. Your an idealist, not a realist.






Originally posted by NoJustice
Don't give me that pathetic, unthoughtout sentence of "our property was not ours before 9/11" If you don't pay taxes that's one thing, but now they can cease your property because it makes the city more money. When are you going to learn that it's all about money ed? For example there's a reason our schools have food that's bad for our children. There are lobbyists that keep the Government in check and make sure they never pass laws that goes against them feeding our children this so called food because it would take money away from them, this shows they don't care about us, they care about the money and being reelected.


What? I dont agree with the Supreme Court decision either. As for the Food, I bet it is more nutricious than some of the junk food. Your paranoid.




Originally posted by NoJustice
You think the Patriot Act is in your best interest? It's not even about catching terrorists, it's about tracking us. Our Government has been completely corrupt since around the time the CIA came along. JFK tried to change our corrupt money system and rid the CIA and weeks later he was killed. You say we should protect ourselves from the enemy? I say the enemy lies in many members of our Government.




At this point I think for the most part yes. I will sacrifice some of my convienences if it will help save the lives of my countrymen, even the mistaken ones. Some within are corrupt no doubt. You they way you make it sound , its pure hell here. Why not get out why you have the chance? Run to where?

You are eaten up with conspiracy, it eats away at you.


Originally posted by NoJustice
I don't see how you can like Ron Paul and like the Big Government we have at the same time. He has the complete opposite view of you. He's against the Patriot Act, he's against the Government taking our land, he knows the Iraq war is a farce, and from reading enough of his opinion I believe he knows 9/11 is a farce too, but can't come out and say it. You see he cares about the people of this country. Apparently you don't, you live in fear of an invisible enemy, and to you that's more important than the constitution we've been fighting for over 200 years. So go on and live with that opinion, but you're living in fantasy land. I guess it's easier for some to live there rather than face reality.


I do not like big Government and Bush has totally dropped the ball on the one, he is no physcal conservative for sure but at least he has balls.

Ron Paul would not be unable to come out and say anything, he doesnt hold back.


invisible enemy? Did you know anyone that was killed on 911? OKC? the COLE? TWA800.......how blind! Oh wait I forgot that was all the work of Halliburton.



posted on Jul, 24 2005 @ 11:06 AM
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You know you're so close minded that you're not even worth arguing over. This is the last thing I'll bother with saying to you, I actually am a christian, but I see what's happening with the media and the Government trying to demonize all muslims. You are just buying into it my friend. Go ahead and think what you like, but racial profiling is already here as they shot an innocent muslim five times in London. You obviously are too narrowminded that you only see the immediate past and don't think about what could happen in the future by tearing away at the constitution, something you obviously care nothing about. If you really looked at the past you would realize that giving up freedom for security has never ever done what it's intended to do. But I'll let someone else debate with you. I mean you've admitted yourself you come on here, a conspiracy site to try and "set things straight" if you don't believe in any of the conspiracies you would think you would find something better to do with your time? I guess you have nothing better to do. 2/3rds of Americans actually believe the JFK assassination was a conspiracy, so don't talk to me like I'm out in right field on that one, you need to open your eyes. So go ahead and give another rediculous response, I'm done. You are far from a patriot, a Patriot cares about the laws that are being passed that effects his country. A saying I like goes "You can't wake up someone pretending to be asleep" that obviously describes you to a tee, so why should I bother trying? There is evidence all around you that the Government's story about 9/11 was a total farce, but you refuse to look at it. How patriotic is that? www.abovetopsecret.com...



[edit on 24-7-2005 by NoJustice]



posted on Jul, 24 2005 @ 11:16 AM
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You have voted NoJustice for the Way Above Top Secret award.
You have used all of your votes for this month.


Nice post, NoJustice! (Your post beginning "Yeah it's pointless to ever debate...")

You've pointed out one of the saddest facts of America today. Those who are supporting and believing in the Patriot Act, this administration, the 'official' stories of the 'terrorist attacks', the media, those who are eating it up and acting out of fear have lost to the terrorists. They're doing just what the terrorists want. While they sound off against terrorism and prepare for the next big attack, they're living in the fear that the terrorists are feeding them.

Terrorism is a tool, using violence, to create the state of terror in a society. The violent act of 9/11 itself wasn't really that important to the terrorists, it's the state of terror that is created as a result of the violent act that gives them their juice. It's the vulnerability that the people feel that they get off on. It's the willingness to give up one's freedoms and rights that the terrorists just love! They laugh at a society filled with fear!

Here we are 4 years after 9/11, and many people are still scared. So much so that they make irrational choices and judgments about other religions and races. They're willing to use violence to somehow make themselves feel safer. They're willing to sacrifice the very freedoms they accuse the terrorists of hating us for! Don't you realize that if you give up your freedoms the terrorists have won? That seems so obvious to me! But fear makes people do irrational things.



[edit on 24-7-2005 by Benevolent Heretic]



posted on Aug, 12 2005 @ 02:22 PM
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[

I take it your not near a potential target then, but for those in the big cities, something needed to be done.

Have a good weekend


I live in Los Angeles. I am not the least bit nervous of an attack. I take the bus every single day. If i am not mistaken LA is one of the biggest "Targets" of them all.

It's all BS if you ask me. Just like the Patriot act. The real terrorists are supporters of such a dispicable bill.



posted on Aug, 12 2005 @ 11:47 PM
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Originally posted by NoJustice
You are far from a patriot, a Patriot cares about the laws that are being passed that effects his country.


There is evidence all around you that the Government's story about 9/11 was a total farce, but you refuse to look at it. How patriotic is that? www.abovetopsecret.com...


Oh I see the laws and I see what is being passed and although I am not totally for the Patriot act I can see the need. We are at war after all and you can go on denying it and believe that the US Government or Bush planned 911 all you want, I mean they are the guilty one in your eyes anyway.

And btw, I gave an oath to protect this nation against all enemies both FOREIGN and DOMESTIC and I took that seriously, and the DOMESTIC part of it I do not think is Uncle SAM at all.......sorry to burst your bubble.


Talk with someone who saw A PLANE fly into the Pentagon, just talk to them and tell them it was a cruise missile and that they must have been high or drunk because they didn't see what they thought they saw.



posted on Aug, 13 2005 @ 12:44 AM
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We as a people need to look closely at this Patriot act. If it stinks like fish, then maybe it is fish? But it certainly would be to our advantage if our government leaders were working to protect us and not harm us. I'm just not sure at this point in time.

Troy



posted on Aug, 13 2005 @ 04:35 PM
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I feel sorry for you Americans. Some of you have truly taken your freedom for granted and been really really brainwashed, but there will always be some that are ignorant and live in denial.
However, I'm glad to see that many of you don't agree with the Patriot Act, giving up your freedoms and liberties will not solve this terrorist "problem" (especially when corrupt US government officials orchestrated the attacks) or anything else for that matter, PA will only give the control freaks in your government more control over you, it doesn't require a rocket scientist to figure that out.
I'd say, a real patriot cares about what happens to his/her country and people.

The next step will probably be martial law.

Anyway, I hope you people who support the Patriot Act, will enjoy the police state:
swearbear.pp.fi...


"To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting."
-- Sun Tzu, the Art of War

(by taking away your freedoms and liberties, your government is breaking your resistance without fighting, so that you can't rebel against them, soon you will be helpless, then the system will flip, you will be servants for the government, and not the other way around, as it should be.)

[edit on 13/8/2005 by SwearBear]



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