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Reconsidering the Patriot Act
by Rep. Ron Paul, MD
When Congress passed the Patriot Act in the emotional aftermath of the September 11th terrorist attacks, a sunset provision was inserted in the bill that causes certain sections to expire at the end of 2005. But this begs the question: If these provisions are critical tools in the fight against terrorism, why revoke them after five years? Conversely, if these provisions violate civil liberties, why is it acceptable to suspend the Constitution for any amount of time?
Lets let anyone do anything they want, come and go as they please, communicate however they choose, plan without scrutiny.
Yup, this way we can all have our total freedoms until death.
And that just might not come to you, but your neighbor.....your relatives...your countrymen.
To hell with fighting these bastards, I would rather die than give up any liberty, I want to be able to walk unto a bus station in July wearing a bulging topcoat. To hell with searching me as you would be violating my rights to do as I please.
The PA did not take your right to own guns now did it.
To start calling this a police state is ignorant.
This reminds me of the good ol moral "If it feels good, do it!"
Originally posted by NoJustice
You have a disease called Nationalism my friend, you think your Government is above the possibility of ever turning on you. Yet they're taking your liberties away that have NOTHING to do with terrorism. Tell me how the Government taking our property away will fight terrorism? You are a false Patriot, as choosing the Government over the the people is not Patriotism, it's actually un-american. I'll sure you'll choose to counter, but you'll still be wrong.
by Rep. Ron Paul, MD
When Congress passed the Patriot Act in the emotional aftermath of the September 11th terrorist attacks, a sunset provision was inserted in the bill that causes certain sections to expire at the end of 2005. But this begs the question: If these provisions are critical tools in the fight against terrorism, why revoke them after five years? Conversely, if these provisions violate civil liberties, why is it acceptable to suspend the Constitution for any amount of time?
Originally posted by Xerrog
By the patriot act I right now am acting as a terrorist. I am overtly acting against our goverment. Wheter they choose to "detain" me or not they legally can.That is wrong.
Originally posted by Xerrog
The Patriot Act does nothing to help close up our porous borders, to help protect ports. It does nothing to direct homeland security's squandering of money towards those or other immediate dangers. The Patriot Act does nothing to refit the CIA or FBI with better equipment and procedures to deal with terrorism.
Originally posted by Xerrog
Several years ago when the National ID card was first stated all that was heard concerning it was outrage that our goverment would attempt to violate our privacy like that. Not to mention the fact that they would circumvent our constitution which specificly forbids federal goverment from wielding such power. Now its all but certain to pass without much press or protest.
Originally posted by Xerrog
Our goverment routinely wages war without declaration of war. This is directly against our constitution.
Originally posted by Voice_of DoomC'mon guys...Edsinger's a plant. Don't take the bait. Remember that, "the single act of obediance is the cornerstone of authority."
Originally posted by awshucksme
Pretty much. Isn't it interesting that in those countries that have had 'terrorism', the populace suffers from onerous oversight and control...and nebulous 'terrorism' continues. Look at Ireland, 'Israel', and any tin pot dictatorship in SA for salient examples. And surprise of surprises many of the incidents are traced back to gov't or gov't controled entities.
Originally posted by awshucksme
Yup, this way we can all have our total freedoms until death.
Exactly!
Originally posted by awshucksme
And that just might not come to you, but your neighbor.....your relatives...your countrymen.
Enemies come and go...which is why we have the Constitution and a Republic. Enemies foreign and Domestic.
And that is why you should be defending your nation in a time of war instead of condeming it for trivial #.
Originally posted by awshucksme
To hell with fighting these bastards, I would rather die than give up any liberty, I want to be able to walk unto a bus station in July wearing a bulging topcoat. To hell with searching me as you would be violating my rights to do as I please.
So long as I'm not hurting anyone, let me wear pink pajamas with yellow spots...bulging or no. And I will die before giving up liberty that generations have bled to protect.
I don't know much what to say to that?? I guess you dont ride the subways huh? What you ask is not workable. You will scream that the government let it happen and did nothing. There is no satisfying you. WE ARE AT WAR, deal with it.
Originally posted by awshucksme
The PA did not take your right to own guns now did it.
Nice straw man. You very well know what an enabling law is all about...its an attack on the rule of law. Gun control would be the end game, because it tips ones hand completely and won't be tolerated here. No, its far easier to brainwash those with guns into believing there is an outside threat and to trust domestic powers implicitly. Once achieved you don't need to take their guns...they're cowed. A metanoid is just as dangerous as a paranoid, but a healthy distrust of government is crucial to the development of a moral, thinking adult.
Well whatever you say, tell you what, next time I am using my brainwash er I mean mouthwash, I will laugh about that one.
Originally posted by awshucksme
To start calling this a police state is ignorant.
Have I stated or implied that you are ignorant because you act like a metanoid and have forgotten your conservative roots? Nice indirect ad hominem. Of course the truth is that the trend towards a police state is well established in all major western countries...the gov'ts fear the end of the age of oil, and the populations that rely on easy energy.
Mentoid , whatever. The definition of ignorance it "not knowing" so in that respect I was wrong. You know and choose to believe some bull# crap you read on a conspiracy board instead of the truth. When is the last time you had the FBI come by and abuse your rights? Anyone you know have that happen? It a real long stretch to say we are a police state. We can still speak our minds as I have done to congressmen in person and it wasnt pretty. (R) by the way.
Originally posted by awshucksme
This reminds me of the good ol moral "If it feels good, do it!"
Actually, it should remind you of 'Pursuit of Hapiness', which is far more acurate and less inflamatory. It's far easier to play off fear and over emotionalize an arguement than it is to find support for the tactics of 'fascism' or 'communism'.
Play off fear? WTF?
These sons a bitchs want to kill millions of Americans and you are worried about their civil rights? Screw them, racially profile them, whatever it takes. I expect my government to do what is nessesary to protect me and my family and if the liberals dont like it, TOUGH # - MOVE.
[edit on 24-7-2005 by edsinger]
Originally posted by NoJusticeYeah it's pointless to ever debate with ed. ed you are one citizen that these terrorists have gained a victory from. You live in fear of them and are willing to suspend the constitution because you think they're going to come to your house if you don't. That's what they want don't they? They don't want Americans to be free, you're playing into their hands, you're so gullable. There's an absolute needle in a haystack of a chance that a terrorist attack would happen to you, or anyone even on this message board. Yet you think the constitution is worth throwing away for that? Let me wake you up to something, there's a much larger chance that another American will murder you than a foreign enemy doing so.
Originally posted by NoJustice
Don't give me that pathetic, unthoughtout sentence of "our property was not ours before 9/11" If you don't pay taxes that's one thing, but now they can cease your property because it makes the city more money. When are you going to learn that it's all about money ed? For example there's a reason our schools have food that's bad for our children. There are lobbyists that keep the Government in check and make sure they never pass laws that goes against them feeding our children this so called food because it would take money away from them, this shows they don't care about us, they care about the money and being reelected.
Originally posted by NoJustice
You think the Patriot Act is in your best interest? It's not even about catching terrorists, it's about tracking us. Our Government has been completely corrupt since around the time the CIA came along. JFK tried to change our corrupt money system and rid the CIA and weeks later he was killed. You say we should protect ourselves from the enemy? I say the enemy lies in many members of our Government.
Originally posted by NoJustice
I don't see how you can like Ron Paul and like the Big Government we have at the same time. He has the complete opposite view of you. He's against the Patriot Act, he's against the Government taking our land, he knows the Iraq war is a farce, and from reading enough of his opinion I believe he knows 9/11 is a farce too, but can't come out and say it. You see he cares about the people of this country. Apparently you don't, you live in fear of an invisible enemy, and to you that's more important than the constitution we've been fighting for over 200 years. So go on and live with that opinion, but you're living in fantasy land. I guess it's easier for some to live there rather than face reality.
You have voted NoJustice for the Way Above Top Secret award.
You have used all of your votes for this month.
[
I take it your not near a potential target then, but for those in the big cities, something needed to be done.
Have a good weekend
Originally posted by NoJustice
You are far from a patriot, a Patriot cares about the laws that are being passed that effects his country.
There is evidence all around you that the Government's story about 9/11 was a total farce, but you refuse to look at it. How patriotic is that? www.abovetopsecret.com...