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criss angel discussion...

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posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 10:43 AM
reply to post by keymaster

The levitation trick comes from a concept invented by Jacob Spinney. Magicians run in a circle with each other hardly ever divulging their secrets to anyone else. You don't need paid off witnesses if you're good enough. He wears the prop below his clothes as I alluded to earlier.

Actually some of the inventors of the tricks are not that good performers, though many are. There are people who make a living inventing tricks and then selling them to people with stage presence and charisma, like Criss has.

Since one of the biggest parts of stage magic is 'selling the trick' it requires some acting skills and a lot of practice.

Criss and a few other top magicians are just the top of the stage magic support pyramid. At the bottom are the extras, and the gaffers and the stage crew and further up are the people who invent the tricks and the carpenters and other people who build them. I'm sure he has several experienced stunt men on his crew, not to mention drivers and other experts who handle any tricks that require motor vehicles, like the prisoner escape and the car through the wall. They don't leave anything to chance, just like the guys who jump cars over busses.

Criss doesn't need to have any master abilities in welding and electronics and carpentry. He just employs people who do. It's a whole industry and he's basically one of the 'front men'.

If you look at his biography you'll see that he's been doing these things since he was a teenager, and slowly worked his way up.

If he has any gifts, it's street savvy, charisma and charm and of course good looks.

Good post, Key-master!

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 10:56 AM
reply to post by Badge01

Thanks. I think I am done arguing my point. I have shown as much as I feel is necessary to prove that he isn't magic. However, certain people refuse to see the real evidence as it is shown. They run around in circles getting more and more frantic as the illusion that encircles their life starts to rip apart and truth starts to shine in. I don't have to convince anybody that Criss Angel is just an ordinary magician, albeit an excellent one. Some people just refuse to accept the facts.

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 11:06 AM

Originally posted by eyewitness86
The hotels deny there was props, Criss denied that he uses props or fools with the video, witnesses from the entire world claim that Criss did the events and that NO props were evident or possible. yet the deniers still claim that those props are there! Unseen and never proven but surely they must be there!! Why? Because if they are not then the whole world comes crashing down on the deniers and they will be forced to admit that they are seeing soemthing that they cannot explain away with lack of evidence and lack of proof and lack of witnesses. the whole story about deniers is LACK.

To the bolded: And yet, pavil testified to seeing the exact same coin travelling down the arm trick, with props, twice. Your explanation was basically, that illusionist used props, but Criss doesnt. What does this trick represent? It represents a recreation of on of CA's illusions, something you boast that has never been done.

To the italics: Pages back, we got you and PR to admit to video editing. You refute your own claim.

To the underlined: Where are these witnesses from around the world? Show me the independant testimony of them.

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 11:07 AM
reply to post by eyewitness86

I didn't say no one else can do it. I said no one wants to try to compete with him in this area. He has more experience and is better at it than they are. Why would they try to perform a trick CA already does but not do it as well? No one gave up. But it takes a while to get that good, and they are probably practicing as we type.

I have offered as much evidence as I feel i need to to prove the evidence you have shown. I have answered every question that you have asked and still you say I haven't answered anything.

Again, the props for the levitation are worn under the clothes. He doesn't need wires or anything else.

The dvd shows how to levitate up to a foot off the ground. He's not going to give away the higher ones because, 1. that's his thing right now 2. the expense for the gimmicks needed is probably very high.

I am done arguing with someone who refuses to provide any evidence other than some videos of a television show.

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 11:08 AM
The only way to get a real response from those two is to pose a single question in a post. Otherwise you get the rambling response that doesn't answer a single question that you are witnessing.

We have provided you pretty detailed answers to most of your questions and each time you dismiss them as "cheap tricks". It's like you just start closing you eyes and covering your ears going "La La La I can't hear you or see you"

This part is my favorite:

By Eyewitness86

Deniers have to be held to very specific and detailed points or all we will get is more dise issues that mean nothing and allegations totally unfounded by the evidence. You are IMAGINING and GUESSING and we are SHOWING and STATING what the real deal is, with as much evidence as possible. If we were in a courtroom and the jury was asked to believe one of us, who would they believe? If they were shown the films, with NO evidence of tampering, and were shown the witnesses reactions while they see the events, which has NEVER been shown to be coerced or paid for in any way, ever, we would win hands down.

I don't claim to know the result of such a courtcase but the preponderance of the evidence clearly shows that CA's major illusions are done under very controlled conditions and the video record of them is heavily edited. I doubt you would be even able to admit his own company's video recording of it as evidence. It would be like the police just using a portion of a sting video case without releasing all of the entire video. Again, I am not a Lawyer but I did stay at a Holiday Inn.

You yourself have already admitted that CA did in-fact "tamper" with the building to building levitation. Your sole evidence is CA's Midfreak Productions version of his "demonstrations" which are clearly heavily edited. So in keeping with my one question to get a direct answer and response to it:

What other evidence do you have of witnesses to his "high levitations, outside of the Mindfreak episodes"?

Do not include the Luxor outdoor levitation at no one was closer than probably 700-1000 feet to it.

Does anyone know why my size code doesn't work, it looks good in preview? I don't get it.

[edit on 29-8-2007 by pavil]

[edit on 29-8-2007 by pavil]

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 11:20 AM
Enough nonsense!! Here is a video that says it all; try and tell us how this was rigged, OK? No more slipping and sliding about tricks that no one else on earth can perform, no more weak excuses, here is a video that gives you all the proof you need. Lets hear how Criss puled this one off!!!

So, all of you deniers out there, how did Criss use props to do this while the people, whom he had never met, were right there and in the middle of Fremont Street with a multitude of witnesses. Lets hear it!!

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 11:45 AM
Here is one of Criss teleporting through an armored car, with multiple, and skeptical witnesses on hand. Lets hear the ways that this could have been hoaxed deniers. Too many assumptions have to be made to undo what we see here. This is the real deal.

Amazing isn't it that only Criss among all others can perform these feats; no other performer has ever done such things under the most stringent conditions. Of course the deniers will say that Loomis/fargo and all the crowds were on the payroll and silent forever, right? So sad that people can be so willing to deny the realities that are becoming more and more apparent as people like Criss hsow us the other side of reality.

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 12:11 PM
For those of you just joining: sorry for all the youtube links. I wanted to have them handy for new people.

Good Metacafe one

This next one answers my "why does he have to do that weird leg motion thing;"

And here's another one with clear evidence of multiple takes being combined into a single supposed demonstration". Busted.

Here is the car chicken video, that they never wanted to take me up on:
Busted again.

Here's the one that made them admit CA does edit for dramatic effect:

[edit on 29-8-2007 by pavil]

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 12:17 PM
Here is a video of Criss being interviewed by Conan O'Brian. In this interview, Criss states clearly that he uses verious means for doing his events, including illusion and MIND/BODY/SPIRIT DEMONSTRATIONS. He clearly says on this video that he used mind and body to perform, and he does not say that he has no special abilities. When he does say he is doing nothing supernatural, that is a clue: There is nothing UNnatural whatsoever about what he does; it is natural for those able to access the spirits that PR tells us so much about.

See for yourself: first Criss gets interviewed and tells the ways he uses various abilities, including ILLUSIONS AND MIND/BODY/SPIRIT demonstrations. He calls the feats ' demonstrations' and not illusions. Then, he easta string and has it come out his eye socket, which as we know is no easy thing considering the make up of the human head.

So much for Criss never saying that it is anything more than an illusions; he says here exactly what he is doing if you will listen.

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 12:26 PM
reply to post by eyewitness86

I have already commented on how the armored car stunt is done. Must have had me on ingore back then. It's the classic, another person is swapped out while CA makes his miraclous reappearance in the Car. Not sure how he got in the car but I would venture to say the back door. So obvious you don't even consider it. Look closely based on the video record, you can't say for sure he didn't enter that way.

For the Freemont levitation, have you every been down there, It's pretty crowded even late at night. Anyhow. The girl that was "selected" was part of it. I forget the actual mechanism, but the girl is "rigged" for it. I know, I know "invisible rigs that you have NO EVIDENCE for" . Nonetheless what I say is true.

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 12:27 PM
Ever watched that old show "Guiness book of world records?" I sure did when i was a kid. I remember a specific feat that some people were able to do. They drank a glass of milk, and were able to shoot it out of their tear duct in the eye socket.

Its nothing special and is not indicative of a Gift of Spirit.

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 12:32 PM

Originally posted by pavil
Umm, that's the best defence you can come up with. He busted your links wide open and you offer that as your rationale?

A number of the links that have I provided (more than once in this thread) were instructional in regard to Chi-Telekinesis. That hardly constitutes "busted."

The only thing that is "busted" here is your warped reasoning ability and prejudice.

Welcome back to my ignore list.

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 12:35 PM
reply to post by Paul_Richard

Pretty easy to be right when you can't see the other sides argument because you have everyone on ignore.

to another ignore

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 12:37 PM

Originally posted by InSpiteOf
Ever watched that old show "Guiness book of world records?" I sure did when i was a kid. I remember a specific feat that some people were able to do. They drank a glass of milk, and were able to shoot it out of their tear duct in the eye socket.

Its nothing special and is not indicative of a Gift of Spirit.

You are absolutely right

What is does indicate is someone who has pursued advanced yogic training, as with fakirs.

Good point to bring to the discussion.

Criss Angel has both.

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 12:45 PM
CA must get a lot of his props from Wayne Houchin. Check it out:

I'm just wondering if anybody knows where, or if it is even possible, to purchase the instructions on a version of the "swallow thread and pull out of eye" effect. I saw one on Wayne Houchin's site and am hoping he may release that , but I am unsure whether or not it a version is available.

Here is a list of things for sale:

You simply must try harder Eyewitness86

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 12:52 PM
Armoured car stunt debunked


1 – when mr angel askes the “ guards “ – is this a set up ? they answer NO! – that is a lie , the ‘ money sacks ‘ in the back show it is a set up – no cash in transit operator uses such sacks – its all lock boxes and dyepacks

2 – when mr angel states that the truck only has 3 door – that is a lie , there are 4

Ever wonder why the camera never shows the entire truck ? its because showing that door would give the game away


The guy in the white shirt and sunglasses that holds the right hand side of the frame – is an accomplice

Note how smoothly he answers ‘ its aluminium frame and spandex ‘ when asked what the frame was ? How did he know that – if not at least briefed ?

PS – he pretentds to tap the skin of the amour car and check for seams – that’s so you do not think he is a shill

The trick

The fabric and ‘ pressing hands ‘ is so dammed silly it beggars belief – as mr angel himself states ‘ there is` a sucker born every minuite ‘ – the entire charade enables him to slip under the truck while maintaining the pretence he is still stood there

It is farce – any one stood there who actually believed that was , to be blunt – unfit to be left unattended

How did he get into the secure compartment ? Note how when mr angel shouts “NOOOW “wonder its so long and high ?

Watch it again – you can hear a beep as he says NOO………

The theatrical shouting is to mask the opening of that 4th door – the one he lied about

When the rear door opens – you hear the same beep

Is that the best he can do ?

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 12:54 PM
Hi Eyewitness86,

Good videos.

On Mindfreak last night Criss did a teleportation onto a moving roller coaster that plowed into him and he simultaneously switched places with a cameraman in the same front seat.

It may be too new to be on YouTube but I am looking for it now.

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 12:57 PM

Now that was very mature to ignore me once again. Somebody ask PR to post all of his supposed Chi-Tk links on one post. That should be good for a laugh.

Someone else referred to Wayne Houchin for another Illusion CA does, I forget which one.

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 01:18 PM

Originally posted by InSpiteOf

To the underlined: Where are these witnesses from around the world? Show me the independant testimony of them.

Right here in ATS we have excellent testimony about Criss Angel from Alex (aka 1 Tru Criss Angel Fan) that goes above and beyond just seeing him perform a high levitation off of a magician's stage:

Originally posted by 1 Tru Criss Angel Fan
... I Know Criss Angel Personally. I Live Really Close To Him. I Visited His Secret Cabaret One Day, And He Said, "Now Alex, I Want You To Close Your Eyes." He Gave Me A Second Or Two And He Said "Is That Completed?" And I Said, "Check!" He Said, "Now Stick Your Hands Out, Cross Your Feet, And Your Fingers." I Said "Check!" And He Said, "Now, Breathe. Gently." And Right Then, I Lifted Into The Air, He Yelled "Open Your Eyes, You Motherfugger!" I Opened My Eyes, And I Was Levitated 15 Feet Off The Ground.

Alex in ATS testified that he was actually levitated by Criss Angel FIFTEEN FEET IN THE AIR

posted on Aug, 29 2007 @ 01:39 PM
reply to post by Paul_Richard

Same old tired response. I wonder if "1 Tru Criss Angel Fan" is slightly biased in any way?


Can't you guys come up with just one normal amazed person who witnessed one of "higher levitations" as you like to call them. No Luxor light witnesses now.

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