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criss angel discussion...

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posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 12:30 PM
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reply to post by Paul_Richard
 



So why take your term from RPGs and not from any of the original ones quoted, I don`t understand the logic.




posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 12:32 PM
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Originally posted by eyewitness86
PR, this is rich!! This guy says he is a professional magician specializing in levitation!! Unreal. Of COURSE he cannot tell us HOW Criss does it; that would be violating the ' code ', right? What a lame and indefensible excuse for not being able to come up with an intelligent and valid answer.

At this point EW, I'd be pleased to just have a good illusionist here in ATS submit a video of himself or herself levitating - even without a genuine Gift and with only props and/or camera editing to pull it off





posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 12:33 PM
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reply to post by Qwenn
 

Get a grip.

The terms existed long before RPG's came out. They were not borrowed from RPG's - RPG's borrowed those terms for their games.



posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 12:38 PM
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Originally posted by eyewitness86
Nitpicking silliness. PR says Criss did not come from a ' wealthy family ', and you say he came from a ' middle class family ". Both statements are true. PR was correct, as are you. The terms are not exclusive to each other.

Instead of quibbling over the income of the family, please answer PR's question: Why have no other performers done what Criss did, if he supposedly is just fooling people with film editing and paid witnesses? Why didn't THEY just rig a few stunts and do some street magic and make a fortune too? What, is Criss the ONLY one that has a brain and like's money?


PR said Criss came from NOTHING, he used all caps to emphasise he was a nothing, and he came to this conclusion not by doing any research, but by looking at his family pictures and deciding his family was poor. Yet he claims he's a medium and is receiving information on CA from this dicarnate community (that reside in his head).

I'm not the one quibbling over CA's imcome, you and PR mention his financial status in almost every post you make!

CA probably does have more of a brain and desire for money, so you're correct there.

I've answered that question as to why Criss is the most successful umpteen times. Can you refrain from saying "answer the questions" when they have been answered?


[edit on 16-2-2008 by violet]



posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 01:00 PM
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Originally posted by eyewitness86
Oh, and by the way: I consider it an homor to be placed on IGNORE by those who must flee from fact and logic and go sulk about the fact that they are always exposed as vaccuous and empty guessers with no substance whatsoever to their arguments; thats why they leave: They know that to continue will only bring them more ridicule from logical thinkers and those without the temerity to assume that they are all knowing and all seeing deciders of that constitutes reality.

I see those who push the ignore button on me as vanquished foes who have admitted defeat and must retreat before they endure another trip the the woodshed of logic and common sense. It is the last refuge of the desperate and agonized denier who has run out of steam and needs a place to go where they are not exposed as having exhausted all means to convince, short of actual evidence. Retreat if you will ...


Is this why YOU put a member on ignore!

Please pass on the above sentiments to your friend PR who has me on ignore.



posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 01:00 PM
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Originally posted by eyewitness86
reply to post by Qwenn
 



Your immature and foolish reply just got you a psuh of the ignore button.
Prove it to me. Prove it to me. Go back and do your own research and prove that I am wrong.You are entering a machine gun fight with a rubber knife; better read up on this thread before jumping in.



Talk about the Pot calling the Kettle black! Go take a look at your recents posts, you have done the exact same thing you accuse Qwenn on. The funny thing is you don't even realize he was making fun of you by doing that.

I love how you and PR just brush off things that you state as truth when shown your are inncorrect. "it doesn't really matter". LOL

Just for the record, CA was already wealthy by the time he did the ONE and ONLY "high levitations" on his MIndfreak show. So now that CA was rich and had his own TV show, we should consider him just like DC right?

Thank you for disproving your own logic there.



posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 01:15 PM
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Originally posted by pavil
Just for the record, CA was already wealthy by the time he did the ONE and ONLY "high levitations" on his MIndfreak show. So now that CA was rich and had his own TV show, we should consider him just like DC right?

Nice try.

No, I would not assume that he was already rich and neither should you. The MindFreak series consisted of his breakthrough performances which made him wealthy. He had no international television series prior to that...or Vegas gigs either. His regular stint at and for the Luxor occurred after the MindFreak series was well under way - not the other way around.

Can Criss Angel NOW afford the high-tech equipment that David Copperfield uses (and possibly others) to fake levitations?

That would be a reasonable logical extrapolation.


Care to purchase an anti-gravity pack?




posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 02:23 PM
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Isn't it amazing that not ONE of these nitpickers will answer the question? Not one. VIOLET, please answer the question at the bottom of PR's posts. Qwenn, PLEASE answer the question. WHY won't they simply answer this one little question?

You do not realize how empty you look when all you bring are important issues like whether or not PR said that Criss came from ' nothing ' and whether or not that can be understood to mean ' middle class' or not. That really adds a lot to the debate, doesn't it? Thats really critical to the issue, right?

Sad, it is. To ask for one simple question to be answered in an intelligent and sensible manner, and NO takers. Are ALL the deniers losing it? If all they have left is Violet's microscope of inconsequential nitpicking and Qwenn's elementary ramblings that were covered a hundred pages ago or so, then we truly have vanquished them. Like the fall of Berlin, the only remaining troops are teens and the elderly, holding the line for the cause, never realizing that relief is not on the way and that all is lost.

If we cannot press on to the core issues, isolate them and come to logical conclusions, then there is no use continuing. If logic and comon sense are not in the repertoire of the denier, then we are fighting a losing battle: They will never concede regardless of how many times we expose their utter lack of evidence. They cannot relent because to do so would mean accepting new paradigms and to recognize that they are NOT the all knowing seers that have the truth of both the seen and unseen realms.

Once again, will ANY denier please answer the question, and lets see if it makes any sense. Are you afraid or just...afraid?



posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 02:26 PM
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Originally posted by Paul_Richard
No, I would not assume that he was already rich and neither should you. The MindFreak series consisted of his breakthrough performances which made him wealthy. He had no international television series prior to that...or Vegas gigs either.


A&E's answer to your repetitive question:


A relentless work ethic combined with enormous talent, skill and vision propelled Criss into the spotlight - he is now recognized as one of the most provocative artists of our day. From creator, producer and performer in his television series and specials to his live shows, soundtracks, other music and book, he has redefined the term artist for the 21st century.


Response to your false assertions he was "nothing" before his A&E Mindfreak Show. Here are a few :


1994 - Prime-time television debut - ABC one-hour special "Secrets."

1998 - Criss Angel: World of Illusion headlined Madison Square Garden's annual Halloween spectacle. The sold-out 12-day run received an overwhelming response from an audience of over 80,000.

Criss performed nearly 600 shows before completing his extended engagement on January 6, 2003. in his critically acclaimed Broadway production Criss Angel Mindfreak at The World Underground Theater in Times Square

February 2002, Criss astounded more than 75,000 people in Times Square when he set a world record for body suspension as he hung for five hours and 40 minutes from eight fishhooks while passersby stared in wonder and amazement

During his Times Square run, Criss' television career began to really take off.

October 2002, Criss' first-ever hour-long television special, "Criss Angel Mindfreak," debuted on the ABC Family channel, which led the network's "13 Nights of Halloween" campaign as the highest-rated original program.

August 2002 - 220-gallon water torture cel
October 31, 2003 - third one-hour television special, "Supernatural" - Sci Fi Channel


No international television series prior to that ?
Wrong again.


October 4, 2003 - two-hour television special aired on TBS in Japan

The special resulted in Criss being awarded the Silver
Telly - the Telly Awards' highest honor - at the 25th Annual Telly Awards for the Criss Angel Made in Japan DVD.


Other accomplishments:


Musician and composer. Criss wrote, produced and performed the music on four CDs entitled Criss Angel: System 1, 2, 3 In The Trilogy and the Mindfreak soundtrack.

2004 and 2005, Criss created and designed much of the visual effects for the $105 million production of Le Reve, the show created and directed by Franco Dragone for Steve Wynn's new $2.6 billion casino resort


Source: A&E Mindfreak

[edit on 16-2-2008 by violet]



posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 02:38 PM
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reply to post by Paul_Richard
 


Not only a nice try but right as well. Care to tell me what seasons he did the building to building, Luxor float and top of Luxor levitations?



posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 02:40 PM
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Originally posted by eyewitness86
Isn't it amazing that not ONE of these nitpickers will answer the question? Not one. VIOLET, please answer the question at the bottom of PR's posts. Qwenn, PLEASE answer the question. WHY won't they simply answer this one little question?


What's wrong wth you?! I've answered this *^%* question so many times!
I've also just supplied another answer from the A&E site, as to why Criss Angel's at the Top.

Just because you refuse to believe or accept his success is based on his own efforts and talent you resort to saying 'no such thing" as success, it must be magic and all that other nonsense.

[edit on 16-2-2008 by violet]



posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 03:42 PM
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Originally posted by eyewitness86
reply to post by jfj123
 


If you had read the last few pages here you would have answered yopur own questions: But I will save you the trouble: The Statue Of Liberty event was done by having the spectators sit on a slowly revolving stage, that turned the view away from the Statue. Simple mechanics and distraction.

Go back and read this thread and you will no doubt have many more of these questions answered as well.


Wait a minute. You're saying that this incredible illusion has a simple explanation that eluded people for years? That this incredible feat isn't the result of magic? I guess the next logical conclusion you could draw is that maybe Criss Angels feats also have a more mundane explanation.

The reality is that many, many magicians have been "the first" to perform amazing feats but years later, when know how those things were really done. Criss Angel is the new "it" guy just like David Blane was or David Copperfield or Penn & Teller or Harry Houdini. No magic just an incredible vision that allows them to pull off incredible illusions.



posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 03:49 PM
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Originally posted by Qwenn
reply to post by eyewitness86
 


The Statue Of Liberty Vanish:

Do you know this for sure or is it just something you read, see without personally witnessing it you are assuming that because you read it somewhere, it must be true. Now that is the exact thing you are accusing us of, double standards or what. I personally believe that Copperfield ate a whole box of CHI FLAKES that morning and used his newly found Chi teleportation skills to move the Statue of Liberty into another dimension for a while, then safely returned her. Can I prove I am right, can you prove that I am wrong.

[edit on 16-2-2008 by Qwenn]


You beat me to the punch on this one !
I was going to say the exact same thing.
eyewitness claimed the following

He does NOT have to fake any level levitation. It is so plain and clear why he did that low level act: He can make a few bucks more selling stunts like that in his catalog, and it keeps the fires stoked for the crowd that thinks that ALL levitations must somehow be faked

Why not apply the exact same logic to David Copperfield?
Lets try....here we go !
"David Copperfield does NOT have to fake making the statue of liberty disappear. It is so plain and clear why he described how the trick was done. He can make a few bucks more selling stunts like that in his catalog, and it keeps the fires stoked for the crowd that thinks that ALL vanishings must somehow be faked.

What makes this OPINION any more or less reasonable then eyewitnesses? After all, it uses his exact same argument and reasoning yet he doesn't believe David Copperfield injected himself with Human Chi Hormone
I am currently focusing my Chi in preparation for an ignore as I can't imagine this question will be answered



posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 05:05 PM
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Originally posted by violet

Originally posted by eyewitness86
Isn't it amazing that not ONE of these nitpickers will answer the question? Not one. VIOLET, please answer the question at the bottom of PR's posts.


What's wrong wth you?! I've answered this *^%* question so many times!
.

[edit on 16-2-2008 by violet]


Oh right..I remember now..you said that only Criss is low enough to deceive the public by tricking video's and paying off witnesses to lie...that all of his natural competitors do not have the means or backing to do the same thing, right? And also you beieve that Criss alone has any interest in doing high levitations in public and gaining the fame and fortune, that all the others are too honest and principled to stoop to his level..is that correct? Does that sum up the essence of your belief? If so:

Pardon me, I should have been clearer: I am asking for RATIONAL, INTELLIGENT,LIKLEY reason that no one else on earth has duplicated Criss events. Your ' answers' are totally illogical and so far fetched that they would be laughable except for the fact that you sereiously belioeve them. It borders on delusion.

You are looking for an illusion, yet when you cannot find it, you descend into delusional thinking. Who in their right mind would believe that all other Vegas and worldwide performers would consider what Criss has done in his career as being dishonest? NONE. They KNOW there are no paid witnesses. They KNOW there are no young turks tryiung to make a name for themselves that would be willing to allow Criss to take number 1 spot and keep it, and the money and fame...because they do not have backing or because they are to honest? Please.

First, it is totally UNPROVEN that Criss does ANY of the things that you MUST presuppose in order to even extrapolate the allegatiop nthat others would be affected by it!! Unreal.

Violet, NO ONE with any shred of rational though processes would ever believe that the reason that Criss has no peers is because no one else wants what he has bad enough to try and go get it....or because Criss is regarded as a dishonest video trickster who alters film and pays witnesses. WHY won't any rational person believe that? Because there is NO PROOF OF IT. No proof of paid witnesses. No proof of deceptive video.

Your excuses simply do not pass muster. They are unbelievable. No thinking person could accept that as more likley than Criss levitating.
You are grasping at desperate straws when you ask us to believe the incredible, over and over again, merely so you can be placated in your safety zone of thinking that you have the answer. You do not.



posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 05:15 PM
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reply to post by jfj123
 


Totally dishonest comparison posed: Criss does TWO events which are similar only by association. He does a low level trick for some crowds and he sells trick books that show the minor stuff, like they all do.

Then, he does a high levitation, which could not POSSIBLY be done using the same trick.

How in God's name could you compare a trick with a revolving stage that was set up with precision to events like Criss? It is nuts. It is disengenous. How can Coppefield sell a tiny duplicate of his Statue trick? Huh? Thats what it is..if Copperfield could show us a little statue disappear on a city street in plain view from all angles..THEN maybe you could compare..it would'nt be a very good one, but without two event for each performer that are associated can you do that.

Face it: You CANNOT come up with the goods. HOW did Criss do it? we know that your response about no one else doing it will never come, because you cannot guess anything better than Violets and hers is embarrassing at minimum. So you will ignore that and keep on insisting that Criss is somehow the slickest trickster to come along...he manages to do what no one esle does and all because of reason that boggle the mind.

You guys are too much.



posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 06:12 PM
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Originally posted by eyewitness86
reply to post by jfj123
 


Totally dishonest comparison posed: Criss does TWO events which are similar only by association. He does a low level trick for some crowds and he sells trick books that show the minor stuff, like they all do.

It's a perfectly legitimate comparison. I was using your logic so either your logic is flawed or it is not.


Then, he does a high levitation, which could not POSSIBLY be done using the same trick.

I never claimed it was the same trick.


How in God's name could you compare a trick with a revolving stage that was set up with precision to events like Criss?

You say the stage rotated but can you prove it? Can you prove he didn't use the same magic as you claim Criss uses?


It is nuts. It is disengenous.

It's sane and genous


How can Coppefield sell a tiny duplicate of his Statue trick? Huh?
he can sell the basic plans. It doesn't have to be a giant statue, it could be anything really.


Face it: You CANNOT come up with the goods. HOW did Criss do it?

Please prove he uses real magic. Of course you can't



posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 06:39 PM
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Originally posted by pavil
Care to tell me what seasons he did the building to building, Luxor float and top of Luxor levitations?

The seasons are irrelevant.

He did all of them on the MindFreak show that initially made him rich. Then came the Vegas gigs.




posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 06:59 PM
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Here's a video explaining Criss' levitation TRICK

www.youtube.com...

Here's another video explaining Criss' building to building levitation TRICK.

www.youtube.com...

Definitive proof that the magical being known as Criss Angel uses video editing to create the-ehem "illusion" . This myth has been busted


Maybe the reason all the other magicians aren't doing it, is the same reason other good comedians don't use other comedians material? Maybe magicians don't want to be labeled a copycat and maybe, just maybe they want to be known for their original work
Just maybe



posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 07:16 PM
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Hi Eyewitness86 & Enlightened Co-Patriots,

In addition to the financial aspect in Criss Angel only recently having the funding to afford high-tech levitation equipment, there is another key difference between David Copperfield and Criss Angel.

Criss Angel often has an abundance of witnesses on the street, park, golf course, hotel pool, etc., that serve to validate or confirm that what the camera sees the spectators do also. These are not people who pay to see him but who happen to be in the area, as with the crowds outside the Luxor Hotel on the sidewalk.

Secondly, if Criss Angel could perform high levitations and teleportations before he got rich from doing them, it is to his advantage to keep using that method, as high-tech levitation equipment is expensive and because it is basically impossible to detect the cause of the feat with physical instruments.

This is one of the failings of parapsychology.

One can measure electromagnetism, radiation, electricity, view things in the infrared spectrum, etc., but one cannot actually measure Prana-Chi with instruments. Detecting Chi was attempted with various sensing equipment - like those used by parapsychologists - with John Chang, a Qigong practitioner with a Gift of Chi.

As is clearly demonstrated in the documentary, all their instrumentation registered nothing.


But the effects of the Chi-Prana were quite real and acknowledged by all involved


Hence, Criss Angel is smart to keep using his Gift of Chi or Prana or Chi-Telekinesis instead of high-tech equipment for his high levitations.

Humorously, there is no high-tech equipment for teleportation, no matter how much money one has to spend on it. See my ATS post on teleportation.

Ki-Prana-Chi, only a few of the many words that describe the same energy, cannot be directly measured by ANY physical device, no matter how sophisticated, as it represents a spectrum of energy that transcends the material universe.




posted on Feb, 16 2008 @ 07:16 PM
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reply to post by Paul_Richard
 


This is one of the failings of parapsychology. One can measure electromagnetism, radiation, view things in the infrared spectrum, etc., but they cannot actually measure Chi. Detecting Chi was attempted with various sensing equipment - like those used by parapsychologists - with John Chang, a Qigong practitioner with a Gift of Chi.


Anything that can affect the physical world, can be measured.


All their instrumentation registered nothing.

Assuming instruments are used properly and they are indeed the correct instruments, if nothing is registered, no Chi.


Hence, Criss Angel is smart to keep using his Gift of Chi or Prana or Chi-Telekinesis instead of high-tech equipment for his high levitations.

Or wires and harnesses.


Humorously, there is no high-tech equipment for teleportation,

Actually there is! It's called quantum teleportation. Although currently in it's infancy, it exists nonetheless.


no matter how much money one has to spend on it. See my ATS post on teleportation.

Your thread is obviously outdated.


Chi-Ki-Prana cannot be directly measured by any physical device, no matter how sophisticated, as it all represents a spectrum of energy that transcends the material universe.

Once again, if it can affect the physical universe, it can be measured. This is a universal constant and a fact with no exceptions.

Criss Angel has specifically stated that he has no magical powers and he even has mentioned that he despises people who pretend to. So is he a lier or is he telling the truth? I wouldn't think being a lier would be beneficial to your Chi



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