criss angel discussion...

Originally posted by Paul_Richard
Originally posted by NephraTari]
There is no street magic video in the 1980s of David Copperfield flying around a golf course, surrounded by witnesses, or of him levitating above a hotel, surrounded by witnesses, or of him levitating off of a city sidewalk in broad daylight, surrounded by witnesses - all of which who confirm/testify to him levitating.

Someone care to find us one?

Why do you keep contending that CA was doing high levitations early in his career? Please proove it.

By the time he was performing them he had a porsche, lamborghini and a Ferrari plus other cars at the Luxor Suite. I love how you dismiss DC levitation as trickery yet can't do the same for CA. Care to tell me how DC did it exactly, because as some on your side contend, if you can't explain it completely with proof for each of your contentions then DC MUST be really levitating.

I just love this logic train you and Eyewitness have.

Originally posted by pavil
Why do you keep contending that CA was doing high levitations early in his career?

I contend that his levitation and teleportation ability is what got him rich and famous in the first place

Otherwise, Criss Angel would just be doing a small nightclub act somewhere. He would not have more air time on television than any magician, mentalist (which is another word for psychic or telekinetic) or illusionist in history.

You don't go from having nightclub acts to an international television show unless you have something very special to offer, as there are many other magicians who would give their right arm to have that opportunity.

So where are they?

If it is all just an illusion, then why haven't veteran magicians decades older than Criss Angel perform their own street magic videos on international television?

Answer:

Because they don't have a Gift of Chi-Telekinesis that grants them the opportunity to do so and rake in that kind of cash.

Just a few points and observations, I have taken my own advice and am now looking into the area of the now famous CHI-TELEKINESIS so that I can understand the other side of the argument more. One of the first problems I have found with it is Spoon bending, made famous by Uri Geller. If this is a natural step in the training, why does Uri Geller have to resort to cheating ( caught out many times ) when not only is he the one who introduced the public to this, but has made a fortune out of it. The secret is, he has personality, so has Criss and most of the other top professionals out there. However you would not want to meet most of them in real life, I have only found a handful of them that are half human off stage, most are arrogant, rude, not the sort of people most of us would want to mix with. Uri geller says he is not a magician, yet regularly attends magic conventions and even buys things, the funnyest thing I know he bought was a video on spoon bending! TWO of the MAIN tenets in Chi-telekinesis training are Selflessness, well Criss even admits to being ruthless, and leading a very modest Sex life so as not to corrupt the purity of spiritual love and turn it into Lust. Well I guess Criss fails on this one too, as he flirts and perv`s both on stage and off and boasts of the numerous women on offer. Lacking two of the MAIN levels in the purity of the Chi experience, explains why he can`t even float onto a chair without assistance.

Perhaps the pro Chi camp can address these questions in detail, then perhaps we can understand how Criss, without many of the key disciplines needed for Chi energy could still be a CHI MASTER. Why would he then need to become a C.G.I. MASTER.



[edit on 16-2-2008 by Qwenn]

Originally posted by Paul_Richard
Criss Angel did not come from a wealthy family. His early home pictures of him growing up illustrate this. He basically came from nothing and got rich and famous BECAUSE of his high levitations and teleportations. While David Copperfield got rich and famous (much more slowly) only BECAUSE he was a very good illusionist.

Wrong!
Once again you demonstrate how little you know about who we are discussing in this thread.
Some medium you are!

Chris came from a middle income family. His father owned a business and was also a male body builder model for Magazines. He is not a rags to riches story. His money was not made overight. He's 40 years old and has been working magic since early childhood.

reply to post by Qwenn


Another CHI related question I would have is, why doesn't anyone else have this levitation gift that has been studying martial arts for decades? Some even have been studying for close to a century!

Here's a video of Cris explaining how he does his low levitation trick

www.youtube.com...

So why does he need to fake the low levitation trick but not the high levitation trick? Is his Chi broken and only works when 3 or more feet off the ground?

Criss is a great magician and very marketable, and that is why he is on TV. Somebody has to be the first to do something and Cris is, as far as I know, the first to do the high levitation TRICK so successfully.

That being said, why isn't David Copperfield a magical being? I didn't see him on the magical being list in previous posts? He made the entire statue of liberty disappear outside! Isn't that harder to do then have one guy float in the air for less then a minute? Wouldn't it take much more Chi to disappear the statue of liberty? So why is Mr. Copperfield getting the short end of the Chi stick here?


[edit on 16-2-2008 by jfj123]

[edit on 16-2-2008 by jfj123]

reply to post by violet


Nitpicking silliness. PR says Criss did not come from a ' wealthy family ', and you say he came from a ' middle class family ". Both statements are true. PR was correct, as are you. The terms are not exclusive to each other.

Instead of quibbling over the income of the family, please answer PR's question: Why have no other performers done what Criss did, if he supposedly is just fooling people with film editing and paid witnesses? Why didn't THEY just rig a few stunts and do some street magic and make a fortune too? What, is Criss the ONLY one that has a brain and like's money? No denier ever wants to face up to the really hard to answer questions because they know that their answers will be too ludicrous to believe.

reply to post by jfj123


You asked : " Why does he need to fake the low level..". and here is your answer: He does NOT have to fake any level levitation. It is so plain and clear why he did that low level act: He can make a few bucks more selling stunts like that in his catalog, and it keeps the fires stoked for the crowd that thinks that ALL levitations must somehow be faked; although there is NO rational reason to relate the two events at all, most people will use faulty logic and say just what you did. Criss benefits as long as the public is scratching it's head; when the mystery is gone so will the money.

Here is a video of Criss doing a lower level event, literally from the hands of the observers:

reply to post by jfj123


If you had read the last few pages here you would have answered yopur own questions: But I will save you the trouble: The Statue Of Liberty event was done by having the spectators sit on a slowly revolving stage, that turned the view away from the Statue. Simple mechanics and distraction.

Go back and read this thread and you will no doubt have many more of these questions answered as well.

If I could`nt trust my Chi energy to lift me a couple of feet onto a chair, I certainly would not trust it to lift me above the Luxor. I can just imagine it Criss there floating high above the Luxor, thinks of a beautifull woman, whoops Chi energy turns into Lust energy and poor old Criss falls to a certain death, hundreds of feet below and lands on one of the only half a dozen people really there, a double tragedy, oh no sorry, a single tragedy!
At least he paid someone up front for the rig, no installment arrangements in this game, I`m afraid.

reply to post by eyewitness86


The Statue Of Liberty Vanish:

Do you know this for sure or is it just something you read, see without personally witnessing it you are assuming that because you read it somewhere, it must be true. Now that is the exact thing you are accusing us of, double standards or what. I personally believe that Copperfield ate a whole box of CHI FLAKES that morning and used his newly found Chi teleportation skills to move the Statue of Liberty into another dimension for a while, then safely returned her. Can I prove I am right, can you prove that I am wrong.

[edit on 16-2-2008 by Qwenn]

reply to post by Qwenn



Your immature and foolish reply just got you a psuh of the ignore button.
Prove it to me. Prove it to me. Go back and do your own research and prove that I am wrong.You are entering a machine gun fight with a rubber knife; better read up on this thread before jumping in.

A good question was brought up so I will answer it.

Originally posted by Qwenn
One of the first problems I have found with it is Spoon bending, made famous by Uri Geller. If this is a natural step in the training, why does Uri Geller have to resort to cheating ( caught out many times ) when not only is he the one who introduced the public to this, but has made a fortune out of it?

It is not a natural step in training. That being a common misconception.

Uri had to resort to cheating because Gifts of the Spirit cannot be directly controlled, as they come not from within but from without, and they are therefore not available one-hundred percent of the time. For those periods that the Gift of Chi-Telekinesis was not there for him but he was still expected to perform, Uri used electronic gadgetry as a back-up.

Even Criss Angel doesn't have access to his Gift of Chi-Telekinesis all of the time. He has to wait until he feels the energy coming on and/or when he gets the telepathic go-ahead from his large Group Entity, before he attempts one of his high levitations or teleportations.

David Blaine, who has a less powerful Gift of Chi-Telekinesis than Criss Angel, has said that he has energy given to him that helps him get through a feat. That energy or Gift is not always completely efficient either. For example, in the opening scene of his Street Magic video (later omitted) when he levitated above a highway, he then fell down to the grass and suffered from abdominal pain. He even asked someone to call for an ambulance.

Feeling sick to one's stomach and/or a headache are signs that the energy of levitation or teleportation were not done correctly, i.e., not within a margin of safety. In other words, David Blaine's large Group Entity slightly screwed up: they made him levitate but they did it in such a way that it caused him to get sick immediately afterwards. Like I stated, that segment was omitted in the DVD version of Street Magic but the original version was shown on television, which I dubbed.

That is the nature of all Gifts of the Spirit. They are never completely reliable

This is why Criss Angel doesn't levitate and teleport much more often than he does. His large Group Entity or discarnate community is somewhat limited in scope of power and ability. They and he are not spiritually evolving.



[edit on 16-2-2008 by Paul_Richard]

reply to post by eyewitness86



Why is it that no one ever answers your question at the bottom of your posts, PR? It seems to me that they should have a very good answer for that. Nothing but silence. Pretty telling, huh?

The fact that NO ONE but Criss Angel can do these things, or does do them, should be easily explainable with a likley and sesible reply: Should we wait or will the deniers simply ignore that as they do all the questions that blow them out of the water?

Originally posted by eyewitness86
reply to post by Qwenn

 

Your immature and foolish reply just got you a psuh of the ignore button.
Prove it to me. Prove it to me. Go back and do your own research and prove that I am wrong.You are entering a machine gun fight with a rubber knife; better read up on this thread before jumping in.

Well it seems someone has no sense of humour. Perhaps I can jog your memory a little on a few points to answer your post, ignored or not here I go for anyone else following this thread.

I do not have to ask you to do any research for me on this subject, as you know I am a professional Magician and Magical inventor, specialising in Levitation, so why would I need you to research anything for me in this area.

Asking you to prove that the statue was not achieved by Chi, was being ironic, I need not question you on such matters, as I have seen Davids original manuscripts at the Magic Castle in America.

You say that I am entering into a machine gun fight, with a rubber knife, well, well if my inside knowledge and expertise on this matter is a rubber knife, I would hate to know what you are equipped with, lets all hope that the bull does`nt want it back. Was this meant as a threat, or was this just another of your aggressive and angry outbursts, as I know you like to mention that you like using your machine gun, in your personal details. These outbursts crop up every time that you know that you have been shown to be wrong?

If you think that I am guilty of breaking a protocol issue with you, feel free to ask the Moderators to investigate.

[edit on 16-2-2008 by Qwenn]

Hi Eyewitness86,

Originally posted by eyewitness86
Why is it that no one ever answers your question at the bottom of your posts, PR? It seems to me that they should have a very good answer for that. Nothing but silence. Pretty telling, huh?

You bet

Originally posted by eyewitness86
The fact that NO ONE but Criss Angel can do these things, or does do them, should be easily explainable with a likely and sensible reply: Should we wait or will the deniers simply ignore that as they do all the questions that blow them out of the water?

I think they will pretty much keep using the same lame responses.

Good work.

Hey Eyewitness86,

This is fun.

You parry violet's insulting and sophomoric remarks since I ignore her, and I parry Qwenn's insulting and sophomoric remarks, since you ignore him.

Originally posted by eyewitness86
Your immature and foolish reply just got you a push of the ignore button.
Prove it to me. Prove it to me. Go back and do your own research and prove that I am wrong.You are entering a machine gun fight with a rubber knife; better read up on this thread before jumping in.

Originally posted by Qwenn
Well it seems someone has no sense of humour. Perhaps I can jog your memory a little on a few points to answer your post, ignored or not here I go for anyone else following this thread.

I do not have to ask you to do any research for me on this subject, as you know I am a professional Magician and Magical inventor, specialising in Levitation, so why would I need you to research anything for me in this area.

Oh...well THAT EXPLAINS IT.

Originally posted by Qwenn
Asking you to prove that the statue was not achieved by Chi, was being ironic, I need not question you on such matters, as I have seen Davids original manuscripts at the Magic Castle in America.

What would we do without your expertise?

Ah...maybe look it up on the Internet?

David Copperfield's well-known illusion of making the Statue of Liberty vanish.

Originally posted by Qwenn
If you think that I am guilty of breaking a protocol issue with you, feel free to ask the Moderators to investigate.

He might be inclined to do so but only if he felt the need to take you off his ignore list.

Which I doubt he will do.

Why would he want to?

reply to post by Paul_Richard



Well a new sparring partner would be nice, but then I would need one with more in them than stealing the term Chi- telekinesis from a RPG fantasy card game, especially one that warns of prosecution for unauthorised use of their game content. As for being ignored by Eyewitness, well that is akin to a child sticking his fingers in his ears so that he can not hear the truth, hardly mature behaviour for an adult.

PR, this is rich!! This guy says he is a professional magician specializing in levitation!! Unreal. Of COURSE he cannot tell us HOW Criss does it; that would be violating the ' code ', right? What a lame and indefensible excuse for not being able to come up with an intelligent and valid answer.

It is HONEST at least to admit that you do not know how Criss levitates, it is another to claim that you know but cannot tell...that is an insult. I think that what we have here is some kid with a big imagination and a lot of leeway with the facts and truth trying to bluff his way out of the challenge.

He no more knows how Criss levitates than the other deniers, but he alone has the gaul to try and ask us to TRUST him with ZERO proof!! Why should anyone trust the word of a person that makes sweeping and grand claims, but will not verify it by simply telling us what the facts are, if he is right. Prove that you are some poobah of magic and levitation:

Answer the question at the bottom of PR's posts!! If you cannot even answer THAT, then there is no reason to believe that you have a clue about any of this. Tell us please, why CRISS is the ONLY person in the world that can perform high levitations, both at night and in braod daylight, iof it is all a hoax? why is HE the only one able to hoax us? Why is HE the only one to get fame and fortune from it?

Until at least ONE deniers answer tha question in a likley and believebl;e way, a way that meka sense, that convinces...then we can safely assume that they are all running on empty and are nothing but hot air and bluff. Well, I am an old poker player, and I am calling your bluff!! Answer that one simple question or slink away with your tail between your legs...if you stay after that, then you really do have no shame.

If you can afford to purchase one of my levitations, or any of the other ones that are out there, then you will know exactly how they are done, why give away for free, what we charge for. Mine start at £3.000.000 the top ones have no fixed price, they are open to offers. Whoops I forgot, you can`t read this as you are ignoring me, right?

reply to post by Qwenn

The terms "Chi" or "Qi," "Telekinesis," "Ki," and "Psychokinesis" existed long before there were any video games in existence

The following is a list of related terms in other cultures from around the world which essentially mean the same thing. Like the terms above, all of these were also used long before there were any video games:

* Polynesian mythology: mana
* Australian Aboriginal mythology: maban
* Egyptian mythology : ka
* Finnish mythology: sisu
* Turkish mythology: can
* Greek mythology/Christianity: psykhe
* Roman mythology/Christianity: spiritus
* Roman mythology: numen
* Hebrew mythology: nefesh
* Inuit mythology: inua, sila
* Leni Lenape mythology: manetuwak
* Norse mythology: hugr
* Druidry: Awen
* Yoruba mythology: ashe
* Ghedee practice: mbec

Also related are the philosophical concepts of:

* European alchemy and philosophy: aether, (or ether), quintessence
* Hindu philosophy: prana

Source: Qi In Wikipedia

Thank you.




[edit on 16-2-2008 by Paul_Richard]