India the next superpower?...along with others.

www.iht.com...

India's image is starkly different from that of China, the other fast-developing country, which is seen as a menacing rival, especially after President Hu Jintao said it would become a "world power second to none."

Compared to the United States' relationship with China, there seems to be less conflict with India, despite India's efforts to project its economic, diplomatic and military influence more assertively - including in ways that contravene U.S. desires.

It raises the question of whether India, which has jealously lagged behind China economically, will have a long-term advantage because it can be a world power without being a threat.

MUMBAI, India: The visit to Washington this week by India's prime minister, Manmohan Singh, symbolizes a change in the fraught but inextricable relationship between the world's two largest democracies: an unrivaled superpower and an aspiring one.

For decades, it has been a dalliance of love and hate. Indians have craved American visas, denim, cinema and music. But the two countries were "estranged democracies" in the past, as Singh said recently. Previously, the Cold War had resulted in chilled relations, with Washington backing Pakistan and New Delhi the Soviet Union.

Regardless of how soon uranium will flow to this fast-growing country of one billion, Singh's visit may signify America's welcoming of a new type of superpower: militarily potent, economically dynamic, regionally assertive, independently minded, but still nonthreatening to the United States. Call it superpower light.

India's image is starkly different from that of China, the other fast-developing country, which is seen as a menacing rival, especially after President Hu Jintao said it would become a "world power second to none."

It raises the question of whether India, which has jealously lagged behind China economically, will have a long-term advantage because it can be a world power without being a threat.

The Bush administration earlier this year said that it was the United States' official policy "to help India become a major power in the twenty-first century." It is a startling contrast to the harsher vocabulary used in Chinese-U.S. dialogue.

The deal would usher India into the inner sanctum occupied by other "responsible" nuclear states like the United States, Britain, France, China and Russia - the permanent members of the United Nations Security Council. In a speech to U.S. Congress, Singh asked lawmakers to back India for a permanent seat.

Yet India is no geopolitical shrinking violet. It is pushing its influence in Asia with trade agreements, direct investment, military exercises, aid funds, energy cooperation and new infrastructure. Its circle of friendships spans from Iran to Japan and includes emerging ties with countries like Tajikistan, Thailand, Myanmar and Vietnam

The Hindustan Times, a national newspaper, said that the nuclear agreement this week was "a historic bargain which could transform the global balance of power in as significant a manner as Richard Nixon's opening to China." It said the deal recognized India as a "thriving Asian nation that possesses sufficient gravitational force to keep the balance of power stable."

But Bharat Karnad, a defense analyst at the Center for Policy Research in New Delhi, argued in a newspaper article just before the agreement that India's unthreatening posture symbolizes its submission to the United States.

"A deep-rooted mother vein of servility mixed with complacency prevail in New Delhi," he wrote in The Asian Age, another national daily. He bemoaned the "easy option of riding another state's coat-tails" and projected that "India will continue to be what it has always been, a big little country bobbing along like cork in water - all buoyancy and drift, and no substance."

its possible, wen u look at India's potential, even in American where Indian-Americans are even more sucessful than Vietnamese or Chinese Americans. India is investing in new technologies, making friends,cooperating with the U.S. on military projects, etc. no doubt China be lookin at this very closely, nobody likes to have a competitor next door.

Today India is technologically much more advanced than China ....India is a country with great potentials of being a superpower but has a complex set of problems which will make it impossible for India to become a super power within the next 30 years unless there is some miracle

there are many problems but the most important problem i feel is POLITICS

India has got a big pool of English knowing(which is considered to be "well educated" in India ) population but generally the worst people in India come to politics ...during my stay in India I noticed that in India joining politics is never considered to be respectful by the educated class .
As a result traditionally Indian politics houses one of the most badly educated and illmotivated politicians in the world .

However there are a few signs of positive changes ... today the PM is one of the best practical Economist India has ever produced while the Indian President is of the best nuclear scientist ...but the lower level is still poorly educated and ill motivated.


[edit on 20-7-2005 by prelude]

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God bless America........God is Russian

So this God prefers Americans ??

... citizenship is available

Hahaha ... I don't know which is worse ... A Soviet Union that is "Godless" ... or a Russia with a God that favors America!

ROFLAO

LCKob

God didn't "perfer" Communists.

oh father
please forgive them ...they don’t what they are doing.... they may be sex maniacs ,homosexuals etc ...but above all they are ignorant ...so father Russia please forgive them ...please be kind to them

If India is the next superpower why do they need to keep coming to Britain to make ends meet. Looking at news reports on India shows me 80% of the people still live in poverty. India is rife for the exploitation of cheap labour, many companies have gone there from the USA and UK leaving many people without jobs in there home countries. Looks like the US and UK are making them a superpower , not.

Originally posted by Bulldog 52
If India is the next superpower why do they need to keep coming to Britain to make ends meet. Looking at news reports on India shows me 80% of the people still live in poverty. India is rife for the exploitation of cheap labour, many companies have gone there from the USA and UK leaving many people without jobs in there home countries. Looks like the US and UK are making them a superpower , not.

Not really, I see US companies go to china for cheap labor... not much of India.

If India was communist they could become a super power in 5-7 years, In my opinion communism is much more progressive than democracy, and in theory it favors people, if only it wasn't exploited . But I would give India about 20-25 yrs.

Originally posted by Bulldog 52
80% of the people still live in poverty.

agreed that poverty is a MAJOR problem in India, but the 80% claim is too damn high. And besides no one is claiming that India is a superpower now, give them time and they will be close to bieng one (we cant really rule out China for the top spot after the US can we?)

hmmm..This belongs in this forum?? mods??

Anyways..I heard that the gestures and leases that the US has promised to make in light of this visit are in a quid-pro-quo sort of arrangement...

I have heard from certain sources that the US expects in return a military deal in the region of 5 billion USD!!!

And unfortunately poverty does not stop a country from achieving superpower status...It never did.. True democracy makes it harder to achieve growth because you ALWAYS have to take the people along with you.. Any moves that leave the people behind will always result in an anti-incumbency vote in every election..
Communism if headed well can achieve these targets much faster because there is no opposition..But then the choices have to be right..There is no room for "constructive criticism" in cmmunism..

Having said that, one must note that India has a large representation of communist parties that are a part of the govt. and influence govt. policies to a great extent..

Bulldog, stop sounding like a dog;

19% of India's population lives under the poverty line as of 2004 figures.
In 1990 a whopping 46% of India's population lived in poverty and at the time of Independence in 1947, it was about 70%, but was never 80%

and 10% of China does. India has fixed the poverty line at 365$ a year, while China has fixed it at 75$ a year...and one $ can buy you more stuff in India than China....infact 1$=~50 Indain Rupees, and 1kg of rice for the poor in India is 2.5 Rupees.

Sure China is way ahead of India now, but in practise China opened its economy 25 years back in 1978, while India did so only in early 1992.

And the rate of poverty reduction is greater in India that China.

Although India is not a poor country, a sizeable chunk of India's population lives in poverty.

And besides, India is and always has been a democracy and is the world's largest democracy. China is a communist dictatorship. And the majority of India is english speaking.

One of the major reasons for India's slower growth compared to China is because it harder to get things done in a democractic set up than in an arbitary communist state.

But a democracy, imo gives better long term prospects than a communist set up. As a wise man once siad, "China may win the sprint, but India will win the marathon"

But all said and done, IMO India does not have the stomach for superpowerdom that China does.

[edit on 20-7-2005 by Stealth Spy]

^^^HaHaha.. You got a warn for that doggie thing!!

For the past couple of years, I have probably been the only person on defense forums to remind everyone that India will become a superpower a few years after China.

Originally posted by prelude


Today India is technologically much more advanced than China ....India is a country with great potentials of being a superpower but has a complex set of problems which will make it impossible for India to become a super power within the next 30 years unless there is some miracle

?? technology more advanced.

its the other way around. china is more advanced than india

Originally posted by Stealth Spy


19% of India's population lives under the poverty line as of 2004 figures.
In 1990 a whopping 46% of India's population lived in poverty and at the time of Independence in 1947, it was about 70%, but was never 80%

19%...........its more like 25

Sure China is way ahead of India now, but in practise China opened its economy 25 years back in 1978, while India did so only in early 1992.

indias economy was opened to the west since 1947. chinas only opened in 1978. they dates you mentioned were reforms in the economy. changing the way the economy works.

And the rate of poverty reduction is greater in India that China.

???

give some numbers please. china had done more to bring their population out of poverty

Originally posted by chinawhite

its the other way around. china is more advanced than india

yes certainly china is more advance but only in copying stuff no matter which sector is it and exporting that stuff which is well below the par.

Originally posted by mirza2003

Originally posted by chinawhite

its the other way around. china is more advanced than india

yes certainly china is more advance but only in copying stuff no matter which sector is it and exporting that stuff which is well below the par.

Not to mention most of their tech comes from US and other companies, looking for a place to produce it more cheaply.

name the indian high-tech stuff???

none. they cant make jack. thats why they dont export jack

Originally posted by rogue1

Not to mention most of their tech comes from US and other companies, looking for a place to produce it more cheaply.

what tech does the US export to china.? computers? planes? cars?

do they invest in the high-tech sector.

they have restrictions on how high the tech they can export to china.

UN sets the poverty line at 1$ a day StealthSpy so I have no idea where you got your poverty line thing from. The Poverty line is an international figure, not a number each country sets according to their will. You can do impossible things in China with money, 1 Yuan for breakfast (full breakfast, fills you up so good), hire a full time maid for 500 Yuan a month, buy SuperA level goods for 300 Yuan (don't ask what this is, its an insiders thing), get a hair colouring (an excellent one) for 200 Yuan compared to the 200-300$ you'd spend for the same stuff here. Everything is cheaper in China is all I'm gonna say, Chinese money is more than enough if you spend it in China.

In 2001, China had a 10% of population below the poverty line. Keyword 2001. That was 4 years ago. Here is the link that proves it: www.odci.gov... Gotta trust the CIA when they're writing a factbook.

India has 25% of the population living under the poverty line www.odci.gov...

StealthSpy, care to give a link saying that India's reduction of poverty is greater than China's? As far as I know, when I was born, my parents were making 50 Yuan a year or 6 USD a year, thats poverty but back then it was real communism, work your share and you get your share. Food, clothing, utensils, work.......... The CIA world fact book 2005 stated that India reduced its poverty by 10% from 1994 to 2004, check it out

India was never isolated as China was, China was isolated for pretty much 40 years with no contact to the outside world. China had quite a lot of problems in the years after 1949. The great leap forward, cultural revolution, Kang Mei Yuan Chao (Korea), Vietnam............. India was never isolated.

India still has many problems that needs to be solved before any significant progress can be made such as litteracy (check the factbook, Litteracy rate at 59.5% of population www.odci.gov...), outflow of brain power (keep the smart ones in India, it doesn't matter if they're Indian or not, they're contributing to another country because of more $$), overcrowded population because of the lack of land, industrialized farming to improve efficiency of land and produce more food for the population (60% of population works in agriculture).

China might be communist on the outside but look to the inside and you'd see the real thing. The only thing different of USA and China is more government control over the economy and you don't get to vote, its that simple. The state that China is in is the best for China's growth, democracy takes time and is a pain in the a$$ and don't get things done on time. A group of enlightened people are in charge of the planning of China, not for their own sake, or their party's sake, but for the sake of China.