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NEWS: 2.5 Million May Starve in Niger

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posted on Jul, 20 2005 @ 10:47 AM
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souljah
You're only seeing what you want to see in this case.



WAR - If the West Wanted to, they could stop or prevent Most of the Civil Wars that have been Tearing this continent apart from WWII - but they dont want to.


War has been going on in Africa longer than it has any place else. We could stop or prevent the wars, how? By dumping hundreds of thousands of troops into the desert and telling them to play cop for a few million Africans? Do you think the Africans would appreciate that? I wouldn't if I were them.

Or maybe the UN? They could do more of their tried and true "stand by and watch the machete massacre" maneuver.

Or do you want to go stand in the middle of the desert and do the job? Cause I won't, and I don't know anyone who will.

The Africans can put down the rifles and machetes if they so choose. Or they can keep dying by them. It's ALWAYS been their choice.

Do people have no responsibility for their actions in this day and age?



DISEASE - If the West Wanted to, they could stop or prevent Most of the Diseases that have been Killing the population of this continent - but they dont want to.


True Story: Aid worker tells African children to stay out of the pond to prevent flesh-eating parasite infection. African children play in pond. Aid worker asks why, while treating them for flesh-eating parasite infection. Children say they were hot. Aid worker tells them again not to play in the pond to prevent flesh-eating parasite infections. Children play in pond. Repeat until you get sick and tired of it and go home.

People in this country don't get free medication for their own stupidity and shortsightedness, so why do we pay to give it to other countries? That makes about as much sense as suicide.



FAMINE - If the West Wanted to, they could Feed ALL the Hungry Mouths of this Continent - but they dont want to.


Normally the hungry mouths can feed themselves for the most part, but the perennial wars, droughts, and plagues make it practically impossible to live in that part of the world. If a guy planted a stake at the top of mount Fuji, sat on it, and started starving to death, would it be our responsibility as a country to bring him a cheeseburger?

To the extent that a condition is preventable, I lose compassion. (And I start with very little) This condition is partially preventable by staying in that region and acting responsibly. The condition is entirely preventable by leaving that region.

All the Africans I've ever known made it to America, and not ONE of them is starving to death outside a hut made out of cow #. They're bishops, gigolos, computer programmers, limo drivers, drug dealers, or bouncers. They're making money, eating out, providing for their children and sending money home to help with things like irrigation and minor village level infrastructure. Getting out is a surefire way to prevent dying there.

So let's not blame the west for the desertification of Africa and everything that has followed because of that. What happened to Africa happened a long time before white folks and "The Man" existed. To suggest otherwise is to ignore history.

Unlike Native Americans, Native Africans already had slavery, international war, and disease. They had it all before anyone, and they've classically had it the worst. We didn't bring them squat!



posted on Jul, 20 2005 @ 11:33 AM
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Originally posted by Souljah
A Story from Africa:

Every day, vast Russian planes (major snippage)


West Gets Richer.

Africans Get Poorer.

Who Wins - Who Looses?


And YES, the West is Responsible for MOST of Africa's Problems

[edit on 20/7/05 by Souljah]

WTF? When the hell did *Russia* become "The West"?

As soon as any nation does something deplorable, you call it "The West" so you can keel deriding "The West" for tings wrong there?

So if China exploits Africa, they become "The West" too? How about their own leaders and other nations?

A little history lesson-the biggest nations of early Human history were in Africa, and wiped out centuries ago-not by "The West" because even Europe was still playing around with rafts and not even able to get out of the area. They were wiped out by *their own wars*. Their own cultures led to their own downfall long before "The West" was even on the scene.

Even today, the greatest genocides are internal tribal conflicts that aren't even fought with "western" weapons but steel and iron blades based on "traditional" designs, often forged from agricultural equipment sent to "help". Anyone remember the whole saccharine "We are the world" fluff? What good did the millions of dollars and tons of food do? The food left to rot on the docks because "leaders" of African nations new distributing food would also strenghen the "rebel" groups that wanted to take power.

Until Africa steps up and accepts responsibility for it's own wasted heritage, as long as corrupt jumped-up tribal leaders rule for their own benefit, nothing "The West" can do, or not do, will make a damn bit of difference.



posted on Jul, 20 2005 @ 07:39 PM
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I sense a lot of heat against Africa and it's people. It could be prejudice or some sort of bias - just a thought, (let's not forget that Africans help make this world unique.)

What I really want to say is this-
Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for life.



posted on Jul, 20 2005 @ 07:46 PM
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I don't believe that there is any type bias or racial connotations represented by those who are contesting some assertions made about the West and aiding Africa.

What I am getting and sensing out of this is what was mentioned by another respected member on page one:

as posted by FredT
People have gotten "Famine Fatigue" when it comes to Africa.


I think the above quoted mention pretty much says it all.




seekerof

[edit on 20-7-2005 by Seekerof]



posted on Jul, 20 2005 @ 08:17 PM
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Currently the west (mostly the United States), is fighting terrorism, and 'liberating' the middle east. We've changed most of their governments and as funny as it sounds, the hands on help stops there. I wonder why our governments havent dont the same for the nations in Africa or South America?

I'm not saying that we constantly pour in food, and aid, or even money. Rather I believe we should teach them how to 'fish'. A first step would be reforming their corrupt governments (hopefully underway). A good second step is trying to liven up their markets, with our own (not to exploit them but to teach them the basics of business and economy, etc.). Unfortunately this would take time. I hope you see where I'm going with this. We should break away from our older perceptions of just giving, and teach them how to give for themselves.

'Famine Fatigue' is no reason to let people suffer and die. To me it sounds like you're tired of hearing people suffer, so you'll just give up and turn your back on them since you have your own troubles. If we all give into 'Famine Fatigue', consequent generations will never know a helping hand.

Someone once told me that seeing someone die and turning your back on them is just as bad as killing them.

Suffer the imperfections of the human race.



posted on Jul, 20 2005 @ 08:41 PM
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You are aware that the West has been aiding Africa with billions of dollars for quite some time and rotates between humanitarian efforts to crisis control to AIDS to teaching them the techniques of farming and irrigation in a modern type form, among many, many others efforts?

I have asked before and I will ask again: What more do you want the West to do?

There is currently a Forgive Africa its debt initiative going. Western governments, along with the UN, are steadily pumping hundreds of millions into Africa to help alleviate, contain, etc. these type occurances.

When will the governments of Africa be held accountable when, in truth, they are some of the cause for what is repeatedly happening?
When will the governments of Africa accept responsibility for these tragic occurances?

I definately do not mind helping anyone or any nation or the continent of Africa.
The problem becomes when you steadily 'help and give' and 'help and give' and 'help and give', and find that the African governments are doing nothing themselves but waiting for more of that 'help and give.'

Teaching one [Africa] to fish is great and all, but when the one [Africa] your teaching to fish expects you [the West] to do the fishing for him all the time, there comes a time when helping one to learn to fish becomes 'pointless', if thats the proper word to use. The lesson in effectively teaching one to fish is that they will sooner or later take it upon themselves to do the fishing, not expext the one that is doing the teaching to keep fishing for them.




seekerof

[edit on 20-7-2005 by Seekerof]



posted on Jul, 21 2005 @ 06:13 AM
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Tribal War

Well, HELLOU - We all have had the Periods of Tribal Wars, not Just Africans, but also Europeans, Americans, Asians, Russians, Chienese - Everybody! Why are you all Isolating them, AGAIN? Yes, they have problems among themselves and they have also problems with Religions, since most of the struggles lately come out of the Religious Conflicts: Muslims against Traditional African Religions. That is happening in Sudan for a Decade! Rwanada? Somalia? They all have Ruthless Muslim Dictators that perform Genocide, while People in the West just TURN THEIR HEADS AWAY and say, well Fu** it, its just Tribal War, what can we do! That just Pisses me Off! In the case of a Ruthless and Violent Dictator Saddam Hussein a Response Army was QUICKLY FORMED and the Coalition Forces needed little push to "Liberate" the Iraqi people from the Hands of Evil and Bloody Dictator. And in the case of Ruthless Taliban Ruling over Afganistan US Forces needed little Push to "Liberate" the People of Afganistan from their Evil and Bloody Rule. But in the Case of Africa, no EVIL and no BLOODY SPILLED is going to persuade the Western Coalition Forces to come and help these people. And ALOT of Innocents are Dying by the Second on this Continent, proving only one thing over and over and over again: That the Blood of the White Child is MORE IMPORTANT Then the Blood of a Black Child! Sad, but True. Today in Niger ALOT of Children Will Die because they have NOTHING to eat. Imagine the Headlines if these children were WHITE: 250.000 White Children Will Die of Hunger! WoW! Now that would make an Impact in the Western Society or just about any other, huh? The RAW TRUTH is that Death, Destruction and Despair are at Home in Africa and the West knows that, but does NOTHING in order to Help Remove it or Remove it Alone. But thats not going to Happen. I know how that FEELS like - I have Watched my Country of Yugoslavija being Torn apart by Evil and Ruthless Dictators that spread Hatred, Racizm, Nationalism, Blood and Revenge throught the Land. They have dug out old Hatreds and they have awaken the Devil Himself in this Land. People were slaughtered, Pregnant Women were being cut alive and their fetuses were being torn out. Old Men and Women were no exception here - everybody was on the Hit List, as long as they were the Wrong Nationality or the Wrong Religion. And it went on for Years, when the West just stood still with their Eyes Opened and their Mouths Full of Sh**, doing NOTHING but "Talking about it" - which politicians are very good at. It took them too long to stop the killings, and the Balkans are located in EUROPE. Imagine how long these people WILL Wait to start doing SOMETHING to help the people in Africa - for it is FAR FAR AWAY, and Nobody gives a Damn Today! But thats the World Today, right? Ignorant, Selfish, Ruthless and Bloody.

And then you ask me why I blame the WEST?



posted on Jul, 21 2005 @ 07:32 AM
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Wow.....

Pure white hate and anger.

You've got to realize that you cannot solve all of the worlds ills.

We help as we can. We give to Charities and Churches, who distribute aid better than any government organization. We even go on trips to third world countries to help others better themselves and the world around them. After we pay all of our bills, our debts, and our needs, we still go to church on sunday and find a twenty to drop in the pot, and sometimes another for things such as international aid. We push our friends to do the same, and we push for our government to help also, though it never seems to be enough. We push for our corporations to be more concientious, though it sometimes seems a lost cause. We try to buy fairly traded coffee(It tastes horrible, btw), and items not manuafactured by oppresive corporations with slave labor or bad wages. But THAT IS ALL THAT WE CAN DO. Unless we're willing to run for office and exact REAL change, we are at the limit of our reach.

Sure, you can march on Washington, protest Wal-Mart, or rant on a conspiracy site, but don't fool yourself into thinking that it makes a difference. Action works, real action and money. Not Live8, not protesting G8, not throwing pies at Ann Coulter. If you are so passionate about something, show it; show your friends, and show your God. Make it better, not more divisive.



posted on Jul, 21 2005 @ 02:30 PM
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double post

[edit on 21-7-2005 by Amuk]



posted on Jul, 21 2005 @ 02:33 PM
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Originally posted by Souljah
And then you ask me why I blame the WEST?


Africans killing Africans so it must be our fault right? You say we should go in and do something but YOU would be the first to post every lie you could find on the internet claiming we were eating babies and such if we did.

Whats the matter, tired of whining about Iraq and looking for new things to spew your hatred toward the west about? Hoping we will go into Africa so you can post Rense and Jahiadunspun articles about how we are slaughtering the innocent Africans?

How about blaming the people killing each other? How about blaming the rulers starving their own people?

But you would have to admit that there evil in the world that doesnt spring from Washington DC and you arent capable of doing that are you?Its amazing to hear you whining about us not "saving" yor country from itself and then see you spew your selfrightious indignation because we are invading a country you dont want us too.



[edit on 21-7-2005 by Amuk]



posted on Jul, 21 2005 @ 04:11 PM
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Originally posted by Amuk
Africans killing Africans so it must be our fault right?

Dont Tell me that the Mighty West does NOT have the Power to stop all this Killing and all this Madness?



Whats the matter, tired of whining about Iraq and looking for new things to spew your hatred toward the west about?

No Sir I am not "Tired of Whining" if thats how it looks to You.

And do you think I Spew Hatred?



Hoping we will go into Africa so you can post Rense and Jahiadunspun articles about how we are slaughtering the innocent Africans?

Yes thats my only Wish in my Life - is that so Obvious?



How about blaming the people killing each other? How about blaming the rulers starving their own people?

OK - we blame them so now what?

Who is going to Stop them in this Madness?

Blaming is the EASY Part - now who has got the Courage and the Heart to Stop them Fighting?



posted on Jul, 21 2005 @ 04:14 PM
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Words can't really express my feelings, bro.. And I try to always speak from an unbiased standpoint, but considering I am a brotha it kinda hits me hard.. I will say, "Good job.." Alot of people are afraid to post articles and excerts such as this.. Good to see that things like this are still relevant to some people.. I would of sent you a message a while ago, but you have to have 20+ posts to do so.. But I will definately be looking out for you..

Hit me up sometime..

-Jago



posted on Jul, 21 2005 @ 04:17 PM
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Souljah

If we did go in you would be the first to scream about us invading a poor defenseless country and would tirelessly search the internet to find ANYTHING no matter how far-feached to back your claim that we were killing babies and Bush was eating them.

Isnt the west the root of all evil? Why should we try to impose our lifestyle on the peaceloving Sudanese? So you can cheer the sucide bombers as they blow up the children THERE?

With people like you we are damned if we do and damned if we dont.

[edit on 21-7-2005 by Amuk]



posted on Jul, 21 2005 @ 04:25 PM
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I think this thread has become a fight between Souljah and bunch of others. How about both sides quit the catfight and turn back to the subject of African starvation? Good idea, no?

So, I'm curious as to what people think we should do. Is giving money enough or should we do something else? Would a cure for AIDS solve much of the problem? How about some solutions instead of blaming one side or the other?

I've got my own ideas, but I'd like to hear other people's first.



posted on Jul, 21 2005 @ 04:31 PM
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Originally posted by Flinx
So, I'm curious as to what people think we should do.


Thats the million dollar question.

Money alone doesnt help because 90% of it goes into some warlords pocket, food rots on the trucks because the proper bribes werent paid to move it etc.

The entire continent is a mess, massive starvation, a HUGE AIDS problem, tribal warfare, slavery, mass murders, etc.

To be honest I wouldnt know where to start.



posted on Jul, 21 2005 @ 04:59 PM
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Originally posted by Amuk

Originally posted by Flinx
So, I'm curious as to what people think we should do.


Thats the million dollar question.

Money alone doesnt help because 90% of it goes into some warlords pocket, food rots on the trucks because the proper bribes werent paid to move it etc.

The entire continent is a mess, massive starvation, a HUGE AIDS problem, tribal warfare, slavery, mass murders, etc.

To be honest I wouldnt know where to start.


The number one priority should be curing AIDS. That would solve about 60 percent of Africa's problems. Beyond that, I don't really know. My idea involved the already existing African Union tightening up and becoming more active. They need to develop some muscle and clamp down on many of the conflicts. African nations need to start working together to solve their problems. United, Africa could become a superpower. They definately have the resources. If you've ever seen all the Africans in tech schools over here, you realize they have the know-how too.

Despite what many think Africa is a very diverse place. It has the greatest genetic diverstiy of any continent in the world. There are many different ethnicities and cultures. As we know humans tend to mistrust that which is different. So having the entire continent get along would be quite difficult.
Africa needs a someone to bring them together, a leader. Someone that will appeal to all sides. Maybe this person will appear sometime in the future.

It needs to be said that all countries in Africa aren't hellholes. Many of them are doing relatively well and have rapidly growing economies. So it's important to not associate all of Africa with machete massacres and the like.

Anyway, what WE can do right now is work on curing that pesky AIDS and provide money to responsible African nations. Depsite the broad generalizations put forth earlier in this thread, all African nations aren't corrupt and run by greedy warlords. If we can just help some nations get on their feet it will be a start. Their success might help the nations around them.



posted on Jul, 21 2005 @ 05:25 PM
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Originally posted by Flinx
The number one priority should be curing AIDS.


Its at least high on the list. I have seen reports where in some countries 1 in 4 have AIDS, in America that would be almost 100 million people. How can you hold togather under those numbers?




African nations need to start working together to solve their problems. United, Africa could become a superpower. They definately have the resources. If you've ever seen all the Africans in tech schools over here, you realize they have the know-how too.



I think this is the key. But how this could work without a LOT of bloodshed unseating local warlords and even the rulers in SOME of the countries I dont know.



It needs to be said that all countries in Africa aren't hellholes. Many of them are doing relatively well and have rapidly growing economies. So it's important to not associate all of Africa with machete massacres and the like.


If my post gave this impression it was unintended. I have two friends from Africa (Guiana? and South Africa) both are educated and have dispelled a lot of my ignorance about the place. The MAIN problem is with the countries WITH the warlords and dictators, but giving them money just helps prop up THEIR regime and little if ANY gets to the starving people.

If the west just mounted an Army and started invading the countries one after another the cries of imperialism would start immediately.



posted on Jul, 21 2005 @ 05:52 PM
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Originally posted by Amuk



It needs to be said that all countries in Africa aren't hellholes. Many of them are doing relatively well and have rapidly growing economies. So it's important to not associate all of Africa with machete massacres and the like.


If my post gave this impression it was unintended. I have two friends from Africa (Guiana? and South Africa) both are educated and have dispelled a lot of my ignorance about the place. The MAIN problem is with the countries WITH the warlords and dictators, but giving them money just helps prop up THEIR regime and little if ANY gets to the starving people.

If the west just mounted an Army and started invading the countries one after another the cries of imperialism would start immediately.


No no, it wasn't your post that I was responding to when I said that. It was no post in particular. I just think that alot of people think that the whole contient is like that. I know when someone mentions Africa sometimes plague and war is the first thing that comes to my mind. I've read about many of the countries in Africa and SOME of them are stable and making progress. But like you said, if a large proportion of your population have AIDS, your country won't be able to function.

As to the West invading Africa, that would probably be the worst possible thing to do. Not only would it be seen as imperialism, it probably would be. No one undertakes an effort that costly (in money, resources, and lives) out of the goodness of their heart. I think the "United Africa through military conquest" solution might be one that would work, but it can't be the West (or any outside force) that does it.



posted on Jul, 22 2005 @ 06:19 AM
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Originally posted by Amuk
Why should we try to impose our lifestyle on the peaceloving Sudanese?

The PEACE LOVING SUDANESE are DYING by the Second, SIR.

Thats All I Want to say about it....



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