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Originally posted by Odessit
Pak-fa will be better, do you know why? well because it is common sense that Russians would try to counter F-22 that is why Pak-Fa is made, otherwise , there is not sense in making the plane if it wouldn't be better than F-22, that's the whole idea about it.
Originally posted by Odessit
Pak-fa will be better, do you know why? well because it is common sense that Russians would try to counter F-22 that is why Pak-Fa is made, otherwise , there is not sense in making the plane if it wouldn't be better than F-22, that's the whole idea about it.
Originally posted by waynos
Originally posted by topsecretombomb
Yea in my point of view there is no way the Russians can all of a sudden create a fighter that can take down the raptor much less keep up with it. No matter how much their economy is doing good lol!
I remember exactly the same being said about the teen series when we were all relieved to find out that the MiG 23 wasn't really all that good.
the image linked to above is nothing to do with Pak Fa as the Russians have already ditched FSW. It is a very nice looking creation though, it looks part Flanker, part F-22 and part Su-47/S-37 (or whatever its called this week). I could see how it might fool a lot of people who wouldn't know any better.
Originally posted by topsecretombomb
Yea in my point of view there is no way the Russians can all of a sudden create a fighter that can take down the raptor much less keep up with it. No matter how much their economy is doing good lol!
Originally posted by Canada_EH
reply to post by emile
At this point emile the jet fighter you talk about hasn't been built its specs are speculation and the F-22 is flying and the pilots are becoming more practiced in its operation daily. Yes you have some point with strength in number etc but alot of that is just guess work in how it would play out. For me in the present and looking at the fact that the USAF and its fighter development never stands still technologically then at this point Russia is playing catch up to North America in that regard. Have they been in the lead before? YES. Could they Again? Yes. But it all remains to be seen.
Originally posted by Canada_EH
reply to post by emile
We haven't heard any more news on development which makes sense if its being guarded like it should but leaks will happen and its my opinion that if it doesn't fly by the end of 2009 it will be the next program to run into cost overruns and get cut for not moving forward enough.
Originally posted by BlueRaja
Originally posted by Odessit
Pak-fa will be better, do you know why? well because it is common sense that Russians would try to counter F-22 that is why Pak-Fa is made, otherwise , there is not sense in making the plane if it wouldn't be better than F-22, that's the whole idea about it.
[edit on 13-2-2008 by Odessit]
You're using a flawed paradigm here. It's true that the Russians would want to meet or exceed the Raptor's capabilities when designing a new aircraft. Having said that, it remains to be seen how good the PAK-FA is in reality, once it becomes operational. I seriously doubt it will exceed the Raptor's avionics capabilities, even if it's raw performance is equivalent.
Originally posted by emile
The time when PAKFA should get fly but factually not will really come, I invite you travel to China and I will accompany you with Champagne, then what do you say if it is adversed?
That estimate has now been superseded by the statement of Sukhoi CEO Mikhail Pogosyan, who stated at the Langkawi International Maritime and Aerospace (LIMA) 2007 exhibition in Malaysia on December 6 that the prototype will not fly until 2009....
Pogosyan said mass production of the future fighter could begin by 2015.
Originally posted by Odessit
Originally posted by BlueRaja
Originally posted by Odessit
Pak-fa will be better, do you know why? well because it is common sense that Russians would try to counter F-22 that is why Pak-Fa is made, otherwise , there is not sense in making the plane if it wouldn't be better than F-22, that's the whole idea about it.
[edit on 13-2-2008 by Odessit]
You're using a flawed paradigm here. It's true that the Russians would want to meet or exceed the Raptor's capabilities when designing a new aircraft. Having said that, it remains to be seen how good the PAK-FA is in reality, once it becomes operational. I seriously doubt it will exceed the Raptor's avionics capabilities, even if it's raw performance is equivalent.
There is no logic in your opinion. If it wouldn't be better, then there is no point in making it, that's a common sense. Russia purposely making this plane to counter F-22, therefore it will be better, just like when americans made F-15, Russians countered it with Su-27.
[edit on 14-2-2008 by Odessit]
Originally posted by American Mad Man
Am I the only one that wonders how they can claim it will be the Raptors equal?
All they know is that it can cruise over Mach 1 and it is stealthy. How in the world can they be taken seriously when they say they can produce a plane that will match the Raptor in every aspect?!
They don't even know half of what the Raptor can do.
This is Russian bravado at it's finest. It will take 10 years to develope an aircraft which will not be as good as the Raptor. Even more likely they scrap it after spending billions on it because they realise that UCAVs are the wave of the future.
Silly Russians
Originally posted by Odessit
And it is a joke Russia is 30 years behind USA? haha , that is really ignorant and stupid opinion. Because that's a same thing as saying US is 30 years behind in missile technology , because we know it is true.
Originally posted by West Coast
Originally posted by Odessit
And it is a joke Russia is 30 years behind USA? haha , that is really ignorant and stupid opinion. Because that's a same thing as saying US is 30 years behind in missile technology , because we know it is true.
Well thats contradictory statement if Ive ever seen one.. Is it just me, or does anyone else feel a bit "dumbed down" after having read any of Odessit's post's?
[edit on 14-2-2008 by West Coast]
Originally posted by Odessit
wow now the insulting, haha, aren't we a little bit emotional, sad and pathetic,shows how can't really take a debate and starting calling on crowd for help "by slandering" haha, that's shows real maturity, not.
Originally posted by West Coast
Originally posted by Odessit
wow now the insulting, haha, aren't we a little bit emotional, sad and pathetic,shows how can't really take a debate and starting calling on crowd for help "by slandering" haha, that's shows real maturity, not.
No, I was pointing out your contradictory view, I can see the obvious still eludes you.
Originally posted by Odessit
so you telling me that Russia is 30 years behind in aviation technology is that it?
Originally posted by Zaphod58
How do you make a plane better when you have NEVER built a stealth airframe and are 30 years behind, and you don't know the capabilities of the one you're trying to top? You can make it better than you THINK the other aircraft is, but there's no way to say "This airframe is better!" until you put them head to head and prove it.
Originally posted by Zaphod58
The Pak-Fa is going to be a very good aircraft I'm sure, but everyone saying it's automatically going to be better than the F-22 just because it's newer is making a major assumption.
Yes, the F-4s and other US aircraft were beaten by MiGs in Vietnam, but a MiG-21 which was one of the most feared aircraft in the war was shot down by a pair of A-1 Skyraiders. Does that mean the propeller driven Skyraiders were better? You have to look at ALL of the factors of the fights, like the fact that the US missiles fell off the airplanes more often than they actually fired.
Regarding experience, you have yours, others have others own, please don't make yourself to be Boris who are in Goldeneye played I am invincible.
Originally posted by Zaphod58
Knowing something, and having experience with something are completely different from each other. I know how a car works, but if I had to take one apart, I'd end up with extra parts and things not fitting right when I put it back together, because I don't the experience with it. (I know because I did it before. ) Just because you KNOW how something works doesn't mean you're going to build it perfectly on the first try.
Originally posted by Canada_EH
Originally posted by emile
The time when PAKFA should get fly but factually not will really come, I invite you travel to China and I will accompany you with Champagne, then what do you say if it is adversed?
I sorta want you to clear up what you meant here emile. I like the sound of champagne but what is it that your asking? The first part about when PAKFA will fly and the facts there is no real indication when that will be is pretty common considering the secrecy on the development process. The best info I have at this point is wiki.
That estimate has now been superseded by the statement of Sukhoi CEO Mikhail Pogosyan, who stated at the Langkawi International Maritime and Aerospace (LIMA) 2007 exhibition in Malaysia on December 6 that the prototype will not fly until 2009....
Pogosyan said mass production of the future fighter could begin by 2015.
en.rian.ru...
Are they going to build a 5TH gen fighter? No doubt. SU-27 came years after F-15 and did so for specific reason. SU-27 simply outclasses the F-15, and it has been shown in exercises over and over again.