I think you are bang out of order. Your argument is and analysis of liberalism and State control is very succint, infact I was thinking the best post
I have read in some time as it encapsulted a lot of the theory and practise so well. I couldnt have put it better myself. However.... I then saw
But, nevertheless, there is apparently an issue of assimilation in Britain, which lags far behind the US in incorporating Arab and other muslim
I take it youve been watching too much CNN or Fox though admiring your other posts i doubt it..... Nygdan have you ever been to britian? spent anytime
in the community away from hotels?
London is the most multicultural and diverse city in the world. All nations of the world were settling in the UK when America still was 'tended' by
its original Indian Population before america was even thought about. My great grandmother who is British was a wife of Sea Captian in the middle of
the 1800,s her best friends were as follows 1.Somali wife of her husbands first mate (Somali Sailor very very good sailors) 2. Asain woman who husband
had set up the Chinese shop in the Docks area of the city she lived in which she visited and the two families became very close.
My great grandfather and mother where seen as upper/middle class at thetime living in the most expensive part of the city (sea captains jobs where
once very highly respected and paid) they were members of the local church, political parties etc. They were never seen as strange or recieved any
hassles from the rest of their community due to these associations? why? Because as the UK was the busiest commercial and trading centre in the world
for many many years and with the Naval History, our communities were already integrated then. In the late 1800's.
We allow asyslum to Muslims who are refused it everywhere else when other countries will let them go home and be executed. This openess, tolerance of
others beliefs values and religeon, rather than forcing asimilation on people to conform/fit in is what has made the United Kingdom the desired
destination for muslims and other races. If you believe there is no integration I really believe you are just stating someone else false uniformed,
untrue view Fox? Washington Post?
One of my close friends is a Muslim, he was born here in the UK but still practises.....no integration.... mmm lets see just one example, we go to
London to visit his dad some years ago..... I have a particular moral choice diet arrangement i.e. vegatarianism, have followed this for many years.
Well we were welcomed into this Muslim community and a big party for the family was going on that night. My friends Dad's wife overheard my friend
discussing with me food arrangements for later saying he would arrange a seperate meal for me... All the women went into the kitchen nattering away in
their mother tongue.... they all disapear in two to three cars...so anyhow later on they return and are all at full steam in the kitchen... the meal
time arrives about 20 people their...all the food was brought out...I soon noticed that all the food was the same for everyone..... I didnt want to
eat anything till I asked my friend if it was meat free...it was a bit embaressing because I didnt want to upset any of the hard work the cooks had
done. My mate saw my predicament, looked around at the meals and could see we were all served the same... he lent across to his Dad's new wife and
asked her if she had something seperate veggy for me.... she started laughing and all the Women did too.... They had heard me and my friend talking
earlier, they respected my beliefs and out of respect for those beliefs and I suppose for my friendship with their Son.... the women had all gone
shopping and got extra food so that we all had vegetarian food, everyone, they stored the original food and cooked for 20 people all new food. MMM no
integration their of beliefs and cultures?
I was asked to be the best Man at Sihk weeding too but couldnt do it due to work committments at the time. There is more diversity, respect, pride and
integration in the UK than any other place on the Earth.
These guys who were the bombers were born here, spoke only English until a few years ago and brainwashed. One was a teachers assistant one worked in a
youth club, the issue is not integration because these guys never had or wanted a beard, or not to be part of our society. From initial news reports
all of them at the past or currently had White english Girlfriends and Friends. One of the fathers of one of the Bombers was local businessman.... he
owned a fish and chip shop and take away, a local shop and also a taxi firm. He is a member of the School Board. He is a regular voluntary worker. He
helps his political party of choice on election time.... no integration? hes o integrated he probably more of a Middle aged Bald Fat Republican/Tory
than many 100% british. So if integration is the reason as your trying to Posit that one bomber shouldnt have existed.
Its brainwashing and Ideology not integration.
Uni Bomber? maybe the American people should integrate the luddites more eh? Oh of course you have integration all worked out.... funny that 4 weeks
ago on TV in Europe showed taht trial of the Klu Klux Clan member going to court for murder many many years ago....hey that was then though its all ok
now, it was ok to do it at the same time as your 'integrated model' of a Country still had 'no black' signs on buses and the kids were kept apart
in schools... yep sorry thats the thing that led to your amazing integration, yep They
had no integration in the UK ofcourse...hey but we abolished slavery and any form of public/private discrimination in the mid 1800's. In America,
Abraham Lincoln signed the emancipation proclamation in 1863, ending slavery...so good there, but one differance in the UK no slavery meant just that,
no seperate names, shops, schools or anything full integration! sorry but America was still 'integrating so well' 100 years later with burning
That being that and I feel my point backed up and discussed openly and honestly in the whole big picture the subconscious mind of the american people
just cant wait to have a dig at the British... The USA' s standing politically moraly economicaly has plummeted over the last 5 years in world views.
To be fair besides Israel (who do it just because they have to/rely on the USA) you have had no allies or friends.
Corporate Scandal/Fraud on truly huge scales
Lying to the UN Fraudulant Evidence
Duplicity of the Goverment in 911 (anyone who denies a link of some type really needs to seek some help the evidence is overwhelming, blatant and
Invasion War again
Breaking the Geneva Convention on Human Rights (and also disalowing red cross visits on several occasions....even the Nazi's in the concentration
camps allowed red cross full access as they wished)
No Global Warming ?? are you **ck*ing insane, are you abel to read and have any real scientists at all? yep its ok as long as oil and stocks are ok
^)ck all of the life on earth... nope everyone else can sign but we wont.
So Nygan far from their being an issue on integration within the UK the whole issue has been the integration of the opposing world view/actions of the
USA and its place in the world. The USA has been as said slipping in all internation viewpoints, and the sight of good ole GWB coming to the UK (with
his aircraft carrier sooo sad) whilst Britian and Europeans were all focusing on integration issues like the Live 8 and make poverty history campaign,
when our political leaders were working soo hard to share the wealth of the world and create
A WORLD with no THIRD WORLD ...(BUsh gives more Aid to israel than all of africa nd latin america if you take out columbia and egypt.... so 0.001% of
the worlds pop get more than nearly two continents....mmm real integration there!) there was no drive like in europe especially in the UK
to help these people t make this something differant, society the press ignored it practically till it was on.... most of the people i know in Europe
started getting involved in february this year... Britain and the british
were showing our true nature and it was Human, Optimistic, Realistic, Caring, Exciting and the truth. The whole worlds media was just waiting again to
slate Bush for his oppo
sing views on Aid/Trade/Environment than the rest of Humanity
please keep showing us Uncivilised Undemocratic Unintegrated people your soo succesful way please please tell us before you invade and force it on
us...well thats the USA way eh? our way , integrate now or we will force you with money or bullets? imlearning each day thank you all of America &
people like Nygdan who show us the hidden treasure of the model for a racialy, religeous, and fair integrated society...im in sooooo much awe!
well seeing all of that and our olympic win, the differance in reactions perceptions by the Iraqis on the ground (when was the last time a british
unit hit? happens about once a month the soldiers wear no helmets they respect the people = they dont get targetted so often) The US nearly daily.
So with the plummeting of the US view pretty conclusively since GWB came into power, these extra shuffling
Britain does not need to integrate any more. We believe in true democracy and human rights not the American Version. We live side by side each other
with our pride in who we are (be it muslim black or white or even american) where we came from and wht our morals and Values are, without loosing
respect for the traditions and heritage of other people. We dont need to strip peoples heritage, religion or traditions for them to be integrated,
thats cloning and repression not integration.
Truthfully Nygdan list the current morals and values of the american people by their society and government actions and leaning. for the last 10
No do the same with the UK. mmm if your honest America doesnot come out on top. However that is very subjective depending on your own vlaue/Belief
system. But in reality things done action
taken the UK is leagues ahead of the US. Sorry but true.
Keep yours to yourself and stop enforcing yourselves on the rest of the world or slating them. No one else believes wants or cares about the american
society model especially not on relation to integration. Hey Nygdan why dont you pop up today to the Mexican border and chat to the illegal armed
civilians who are trying to integrate so well? im sure the mexicans and the good ole boys will agree with you.
PS I have been to both the california florida and new york. I have very close friends in the states. I fell in love with an American girl some years
ago, we are still friends and close im popping across to Cali in two months time. Whenever ive been to the USA I have stayed with these friends in
neighborhoods and with the local community I really did not see this amazing ntegration, LA was the most secularised place ive been in the world (and
traveled alot). So I am just making it clear im not a USA basher... I admire and love much of the American People and culture but reality and truth is
[edit on 14-7-2005 by asala]