Two Flashes, And A Bigger Bang Than 'Expected'...

Here's an interesting article that says that nasa may never get the images of the impact that it wanted:

www.newscientistspace.com...

"NASA's Deep Impact may fail to live up to its billing as the first mission to look inside a comet. Computer processing designed to correct the spacecraft's defocused camera cannot fully correct the images taken just after impact. If the situation cannot be rectified, there will be no way of seeing the newly formed crater - one of the mission's major goals."

"The problem lies in the High Resolution Instrument (HRI) on the flyby spacecraft. In March, mission managers discovered it was out of focus. The fuzzy images were blamed on moisture settling in the camera during the spacecraft's final few hours on the launch pad and during its flight through the Earth's atmosphere. Scientists tried to bake-out the moisture. But when that failed to fix the problem, they turned instead to image-processing techniques, which they felt could restore the images.
Dust mask
Unfortunately, the techniques only work on high-contrast images. And when the impactor struck Tempel 1 at more than 10 km per second, it raised more dust than anyone expected. This masked the surface features, rendering them too faint for computer processing to reliably correct."

This COULD fit in with the argument that the science end of things was just a cover.

Originally posted by Hannah
ehm..since when is ESA going to launch a "copy" of deep impact ?

perhaps you are talking about "Rosetta" ? it's already on the way and it will not impact anywhere ( i hope... ). Rosetta consists of a orbiter and a lander, nothing will impact if everything works out as it should.

www.esa.int...

No, I was talking about this:

www.esa.int...

"Don Quijote is an asteroid investigation , geophysical characterisation and deflection technological experiment mission."

It's another impactor and observer type mission, only to an asteroid, not a comet.

Originally posted by onlyinmydreams
No, I was talking about this:

www.esa.int...

"Don Quijote is an asteroid investigation , geophysical characterisation and deflection technological experiment mission."

It's another impactor and observer type mission, only to an asteroid, not a comet.

whops

sorry i was not aware of this one, thanks for correcting me

Chakotay


My apologies, I didn't realize how much smarter than me you were. I guess it must be all that college education you have under your belt. A few questions for you though:

Where exactly are you getting your information from? I'm not the only one asking this question, but your refusal to provide any sort of resource or reference other than "I said so" only shows that you are "making this all up". And I do mean provide a reference aside from Hoagland. I could quote several paranoid schzophrenics who believe they are Jesus, but that wouldn't be proof that Christianity is correct. But then, their sources for that information aren't "confidential" either.

You frequently say "Do the math". Yet no where do I see any math from you. You keep talking about "crunching the numbers", well, why not share that information with the rest of us? I also noticed you threw out the very basic equation e=mv2, wondering if the math worked out in this case.

Of course, I'm sure you knew that the correct mathematical equasion that should have been used in this situation was KE=mv, not e=mv2, since we are trying to verify whether or not this was simply a Kenetic Energy explosion caused by the impactor, and that the outdated equation of e=mv2 was based on the old, and now proven false idea that momentum was not a concerved quantity. But it is. But then you probably knew that, since you're college educated.


You wrote:
'Someone' does not want us to know:

A. what the impactor was made of, and/or

B. what the comet is made of.

I'd like to suggest a third option. I know this is a bit of a stretch, but maybe, just maybe:

C. They're not entirely sure what a comet is made of. Which is why they launched the mission in the first place.

Or is that to obvious for someone of your formidable intellect. All I asked was that you cut back on the condescending remarks so we could have an intelligent conversation, but apparently, since my intellect is so beneath you, I'll just wait for your informative answers, and work on getting my online degree, since it's obviously done wonders for you.

Originally posted by Garden Spider
All I asked was that you cut back on the condescending remarks...

You get what you give.

Originally posted by OnlyInMyDreams
The problem lies in the High Resolution Instrument (HRI) on the flyby spacecraft... This COULD fit in with the argument that the science end of things was just a cover.

OIMD, thanks for the links! JPL is claiming excellent imaging- and is sitting on (almost) all of it. Not only are we viewing admittedly 'shopped' images, but they must have messed up the spectroscopic 'cover' data so badly that they had to sit on it. I think we are dealing with a 'Clementine' situation here, where encyphered high-resolution images that were never intended for the public were degraded then released- without releasing 'other data'. The question remains: why? Why fuel the fires of conspiracy theory instead of maintaining mission transparency? When 'all data' is released, how will we know it isn't as phonied-up as a Battlestar Galactica re-run?

Originally posted by OnlyInMyDreams
Don Quijote is an asteroid investigation , geophysical characterisation and deflection technological experiment mission."

At least ESA comes right out and describes it as a 'deflection' experiment. Good on ESA. Rosetta is also a way cool idea. Thanks Hannah. Cool pics, Irma.

I am twitching to see the before-and-after orbital parameters for Temple-Tuttle. That data will allow us to calculate very accurately the amount of energy released.

Could this have been an operational mission - an interdiction of a future impactor?

[edit on 18-7-2005 by Chakotay]

Originally posted by Chakotay
You get what you give.

Exactly... You're getting a lot of people not buying into this because your sources are either known for thier inaccuracies or are "confidential."

Perhaps you need to reread the Terms and Conditions of ATS

1.) You will not post any material that is knowingly false, misleading, or inaccurate.

So, since you can't provide any credible or actual sources for all that you're saying, I'm going to start assuming that you're breaking rule number one.

Originally posted by cmdrkeenkid

Originally posted by Chakotay
You get what you give.

Exactly... You're getting a lot of people not buying into this because your sources are either known for thier inaccuracies or are "confidential."

Perhaps you need to reread the Terms and Conditions of ATS

1.) You will not post any material that is knowingly false, misleading, or inaccurate.

So, since you can't provide any credible or actual sources for all that you're saying, I'm going to start assuming that you're breaking rule number one.

Call. Close the thread and kick me off ATS. I have never posted any material that is knowingly false, misleading or innacurate on ATS.

Links to NASA sources, scientific journals and physics search engines are credible sources, at least to me. Assume nothing.

Well if that's all you're linking to, why not actually give the links over instead of saying that "my sources remain 'confidential'...?"

Would it really be that hard?

Richard Hoagland will be on CoastToCoastAM radio tonight with an update of the 'Deep Impact Scandal' as he calls it. Whatever side any one of us is aon, this is sure to be interesting (either as a joke or a set of 'revelations').

BTW, though I still haven't seen any evidence for an antimatter bomb, here, I do have to state that it's odd NASA hasn't been releasing photos. This is because NASA lives off of releasing 'cool' photos to the public... as imagery equals funding... and so it makes little sense to hold pictures of an explosion on a comet back.

Originally posted by cmdrkeenkid

Explanation C
Aliens are living on the comet and the first flash was them launching a missile to blow up the anti-matter impactor, which caused the second flash. (Hey, we can't take life TOO seriously, can we?

)

Explanation D
It was an Alien Spaceship and NASA knew it. They were testing their ability to knock it out The first flash was the impact, the second was the Alien ship's power source exploding


Well hey why not? The curious thing is that it was "venting" gases "unexpectedly" before impact, but this did not worry the scientists...

Like its normal to have a comet venting gases?

Explanation D version 2:

it was an alien spacecraft and the second explosion was caused by their message drone jumping into faster than light speed to report to their homeworld that yes there is life in this solar system and it is hostile.

or maybe we just thought we saw two explosions but the second one was merely light from the sun being reflected of the dust particles and crystals blown off by the first explosion.

did anybody hear the BOOM!?



[edit on 26-2-2007 by toreishi]

Originally posted by cmdrkeenkid
That website is one of a new trend of websites I've been seeing more and more. That trend being to have good, accurate sounding science while at the same time being complete and utter bullsquash.

Bullsquash?

The second explosion was recorded by Hubble lasting over 19 hours and 'still burning"


I love the way the armchair scientists here have all the answers (okay your Alien theory is not bad ) but perhaps you could explain to NASA what happened, so they won't have to waste your taxes to send another probe to check it out...



And as an update from a non fringe website...

Sept. 26, 2007: The flash! The dazzle! The front page of the New York Times! Two years ago, NASA's Deep Impact spacecraft dropped an 820 lb copper projectile onto Comet Tempel 1, unleashing an explosion that made headlines around the world.

Exploding comets tend to have that effect. But how many people know what happened after the blast? The surprising answer is none--not even NASA.

So much for your fringe websites... THIS is from NASA itself. I do believe they are getting a sense of humor in their reports...

science.nasa.gov...

They also started a new sport "Flyby Shootings with Laser Cannons"

Oh yeah? well it says so right here....

June 5, 2007: Picture this: A spaceship swoops in from the void, plunging toward a cloudy planet about the size of Earth. A laser beam lances out from the ship; it probes the planet's clouds, striving to reach the hidden surface below. Meanwhile, back on the craft's home world, scientists perch on the edge of their seats waiting to see what happens.

Sounds like science fiction? This is real, and it's happening today.

The spacecraft is MESSENGER, and the planet is Venus. On June 5, 2007, MESSENGER will fly past Venus just 338 km above the planet's surface--and it will shoot a laser into the clouds.

science.nasa.gov...

Someone needs to take these guys toys away before they hurt someone

Originally posted by toreishi

did anybody hear the BOOM!?

Nope no sound in Space

But Hubble DID catch it on film... look at the times on the images

Originally posted by onlyinmydreams
It's another impactor and observer type mission, only to an asteroid, not a comet.

Wernher von Braun said that America would 'manufacture' four enemies to keep the war dollars flowing willingly out taxpayers pockets..

1) Russians (been there done that they never were our enemy)
2) Terrorists (read the daily news)
3) Asteroids (we need really big space weapons for those)
4) Alien Invasion (we need huge space fleets for this one)

#1 you can google CIA documents and even NASA has a paper.. also read the book "The Two Sides of the Moon" by a Cosmonaut and an Astronaut...
#2 well that is current news at ATS
#3 seems they are honing their 'target practice' and now ESA is following suit.

Galileo carried 34 lbs of Plutonium... they smashed that into Jupiter (it was heading for Europa but they didn't want to mess up that pristine environment)

Casini carries 72 pounds of Plutonium they plan to drop that on Saturn, raising concerns that it might ignite the hydrogen (Saturn is 75 % hydrogen 25% helium) and crate a mini sun

This likely will not happen, but WHY ARE THEY DOING IT? For comparison Fat Boy dropped on Nagasaki carried 12 pounds of Plutonium

Keep on busting your butt at work folkes, and keep those tax dollars flowing..

You know it takes a lot of Money to play these 'war games'


And for those who don't know google "Carl Sagan's plan to Nuke the Moon"

Yuppers Him and the Airforce wanted to do just that

I believe Stefan gave the most likely answer a couple of pages back, confirmation of the electric comet model! and more proof of for a electric universe. Wall Thornhill successfully predicted the discharges before impact, X-rays and the surprising lack of water.
The dirty snowball theory is dead, proven false conclusively a few years ago, still the theory that best fits the evidence is still ignored.


[edit on 28-9-2007 by squiz]

Originally posted by Chakotay
Deep Impact has produced several interesting 'unexpected' results:

1. Two flashes: a first, smaller flash, then a second larger flash- from a single impactor (!)
   
2. A larger explosive outburst 'than predicted'...
   

The impactor was supposedly made from copper.
Could there have been a 'Twinkie filling'? Say, U235? Plutonium?
Or a Penning Trap- filled with milligram quantities of antimatter?

You have an imagination as fertile as JL and Zorgon

There could have been a filling of cold custard or cheese sandwiches which is just as outrageous as your totally unscientific guesses

Heres a possible and more likely scenario.
It impacts .........FLASH
It vapourises and ignites
The vapour explodes.......BANG

I know it isnt as exciting as sitting there inventing conspiracy theories but thats probably what happened.







[edit on 28/9/07 by Chorlton]

Originally posted by Chorlton
Heres a possible and more likely scenario.
It impacts .........FLASH
It vapourises and ignites
The vapour explodes.......BANG

I know it isnt as exciting as sitting there inventing conspiracy theories but thats probably what happened.

That's a fair scenario, except the first flash was before the actual impact. (as predicted by Thornhill.) I agree no need for conspiracy unfortunately. Except the conspiracy of silence or denial regarding the true nature of comets.



Doesn't look like a dirty snowball to me.

Originally posted by squiz
Doesn't look like a dirty snowball to me.

Nice I didn't have that set yet

LOL many at Pegasus share the "Electric Universe" concept... and when I get more time I will finish adding to our section on that..

Any contributions? (Besides this comet? )

www.thelivingmoon.com...