To Arms! To Arms A Call for all Americans! Time to overthrow the Goverment!

wat kind of democracy are u looking for? Athens style type of Democracy? think that can work for this timeline with different people from around the world? different geography, etc?

What kind of democracy? That is a very good question!
That would be best answered by everyone and not just one person.
I do believe that a Greek style democracy that included more than just men and or land owners, would / could work, especially in light of today's technology.
If our goverment was actually addressing the concerns of it's people and not just the special interest groups, corporations, political power, then I would be happy.
In today's American society, the will of a single person, group, or company, summarily is given presidence over what the rest of the country.
An example, the electoral college and the way that it is set up now. On paper, it looks good, forcing candidates to canvass various states to garner support / votes. It was set up so that the candidates would not just campaign in those states with the highest populations.
Unfortuantely, this has it's drawbacks. Now, candidates spend millions of dollars as well as a large portion of their time campaigning in the states that have the largest number of electoral votes. Add to this that instead of the electoral votes actually mimicing the votes of the people, if a majority in one state votes republican, for example, then all the electoral votes for that state go for the republican candidate. Forget about the other 49% (example).

I would think that according to the Declaration of Independence, it's our DUTY as American citizens to hold our elected officials accountable. The Constitution is their leash, and like dogs who don't want to be restrained, they're chewing through that leash and we're not even keeping an eye on them.

And they'll turn on us.

I couldn't agree more with all of you. Now the question is, what now. Face it, most Americans could care less about anything, unless it is a direct immediate negative influence in their personal life, at the present minute.

They are all sheep, doctor.

"Well then, we must awaken them all."

In response to the original post, let me reply with this. Those words from the Declaration of Independance meant that our fore fathers were very unhappy with the King of England. They no longer wished to be Colonies of England and wanted to govern themselves. This is completely different from overthrowing a government. If our early fore fathers had overthrown the government, they would have killed the royal family and set up shop over in England. They didn't wish to control England, they only wished to control themselves. Of course, England didn't agree and war insued, but thats all in the history books.

Government of the people, for the people, and by the people means we are in control of who is elected. And terms of office are limited so that a monarchy can't happen. The most any president can hope for is eight years. It is every citizens duty to vote. If you don't vote, you can't complain, cry, moan or gripe. Take part in your democracy and be a little involved in civic affairs.

Here in America, we don't talk of overthrowing the greatest democracy on the planet. Besides landing you in a federal prison, it could get you deported. ( not the poster, just anyone in general ) We technically overthrow our government every election year. ( or at least get the chance ).

For arguments sake, lets say the USG was violently overthrown. What form of new government is going to be instated. Don't say a democracy because that is what you had to begin with. My best advice to all is to vote. Pay attention to whats going on. Get involved and vote, vote, vote.

What scares me ( as it did Eisenhower ) is the Military Industrial Complex. Who watches the watchers. You think toilet seats and hammers really cost $400 apiece. Eisenhower warned and nobody heeded. This is where your secret societies come into play. The Freemasons, the Illumintti, etc....Are they really in control via the Military Industrial Complex. And remember, Presidents and politicians come and go, but Generals in the Pentagon stay until they retire. Man that is scary. Thank God a general can't invoke administrative powers. OK I'm done. thanks for reading!!

Originally posted by kenshiro2012
We do actually have a voice in who sits in the White House. We do not have a voice when it comes to selecting those who make or interpet the laws.

We vote for our Congressmen. Senators and Representitives are voted in and out. And they make the law.

The Supreme Court of the United States interprets law and rules on its legality. They are appointed for life.

ATS Creative Commons License for This Post
Jeddyhi,
Why only worry about the military complex? Our goverment for the past few years / decades has shown a blatant disregard to the ideals and precepts that our forefathers stood by and for which they created this country.
The military yes is a scary thing to consider, but they are essentially only the enforcement arm of the goverment.
Of recent news, you may have heard of some of the new "emergency" orders for the military that would allow the military to declare martial law for any emergency. The timing of the return of authority to the local goverment is hazy to say the least.
Also check out the latest "buffer zones" that HomeLand security has just spent millions on.

Maybe you should try doing it in a peacful way, through constant activism, lobbying and vigilance, try to get people more involved and educated on these issues.
However I doubt many will care, unless as said before, it specifically affects their personal lives.

A revolution is not the way to go imo. Your political and governmental structure is kind of good, however I think it would require a few modifications, like for example the federal government is far too big and has too much power, it also seems it's being controlled by corrupt people.
I also personally find your two party system a bit disturbing. For one thing it's easy for a group of people to gain control of such a system, just make sure you have the top democrats and republicans in your pocket.
Secondly, I'm sure people can be divided into many more parties, because I think there are many more opinions than those of the party lines of the Reps and Dems.

However, I do think that when they start disarming the population en masse or gradually, or start putting more strict gun control laws, it's a much clearer sign that something is terribly wrong.
I think that could be sort of a catalyst and wake up more people or then they would just grunt and moan, and eventually get over it. 50/50 chance.

Swearbear,
I agree with 99% of what you have said. This thrtead is an attempt to open the eyes of john q. public. I also agree that lobbying as well as activism should be done first and foremost.
Infortunately the one area that you missed on your last post was the peice of the goverment disarming people. If you remember this was done during the Katrina aftermath in LA. Unfortunately, the sleeping bear that is john q. public is still sleeping

Well put kenshiro....good post...look me up when it happens.......

totalitarian : Designating a form of government in which one party exercises absolute
control over all spheres of human life and opposition is outlawed.
republic: a country governed by the elected representatives of its people.


"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or exercise their revolutionary right to overthrow it."-Abraham Lincoln

but,..I think that an ‘overthrow’ of the AMERIKAN govt will more likley come from the corporations and other bad guys that alreadyhave begun overthrowing the govt, or a group of other countries, and lastly...by those that are being controlled. Unfortunately, I think the most we can hope for is to rock the boat enough that our kids will see the light....

What more can I add....it is pretty obvious that the govt is placing more and more restrictions to free movement around the u.s. and it seem centered around cataloging and controlling the population while, for some reason, allowing a horribly porous southern border and seems oblivious to the contradiction. AMERIKA runs around the world yelling ‘TERRORIST!!’ and this rally word makes all AMERIKAN actions justifiable...even with the lack of evidence.

"You can fool some of the people all of the time, and those are the ones you want to concentrate on."
- George W. Bush, Gridiron Club dinner, Washington, DC, March 2001.

I think that pretty much sums up what the govt thinks of the people.......

“To the masses we mean nothing, but it starts in the hearts of a few..” KSG

wow…

My dad would have loved this thread…

Educating Joe Q. Public is a great thing. Sadly, JQP doesn’t come to ATS, he sits on his sofa and watches teevee.

ATS people read, ponder, and interact with other people who read and ponder. JQP sits on his sofa and watches teevee.

William Randolph Hearst had the right idea: To control a nation you need to control the information that they consume.

It’s been said that we in the U.S.A. have a “choice” as to who to vote for. The citizens of the former U.S.S.R. also had a “choice” as to who to vote for, as do the citizens of many other countries.

The choice between getting hit upside the head with crowbar or getting upside the head with a hammer is indeed a “choice” of sorts, but not much of one.

The option of “None of the above” is never placed on the ballot. You can choose the hammer, you can choose the crowbar, or you can choose not to participate. Many people choose not to participate. Not because they are stupid or lazy, but because they don’t like the first two choices so they take the only avenue left open to them.

To the person who said that an American president could only serve two terms, you need to be reminded about Franklin D. Roosevelt.

First. Your return to shore was not part of our negotiations nor our agreement, and so I 'must' do nothing. Secondly: you must be a pirate for the pirate's code to apply. And you're not. And thirdly ... the code is more what you'd call guidelines than actual rules. Welcome aboard the Black Pearl, Miss Turner.
Pirates of the Caribbean

mod edit to use "ex" instead of "quote"
Posting work written by others. **ALL MEMBERS READ**
Quote Reference.




[edit on 14-1-2006 by sanctum]

you are right, time do do something, it's time for a worldwide revolution.
You have the alternative's support. We are located in Canada.
We need weapons and men to do this.
Internet is a good way to get yourself found and 'interrogated',
It is wiser to set up posters with revolution messages, I will do this, once my own computer is repaired... and I buy some papers... and draw my poster... and print alot of copies. hey, at least I am doing something, my loyal partners are gonna help in distributing these posters, I suggest you do the same. We are tired of liberal corruption, and other parties aren't any better, corruption runs rampant, time for a civil war.

the new government will be a dictatorship, I am sorry to say, it can't be any other way, give the population power to choose and they will elect a moron who will quickly turn his country into his liking, in other words, lots of national debt and tax scandals while their swiss bank account receives injections of massive proportions. No, a dictatorship controlled by a council, not a president. If the government shows any signs of corruption, it is the citizen's duty to owerthrow it, no matter what the cost. Here is how the government will work. subdivided into Self-profficient regions, in other words, no more made in china crap, made in Quebec for those who live in Quebec, made in Utah for those living in Utah, etc. If anything lacks, regions have the resposability to aid other regions. The government itself has UNLIMITED FUNDS, it owns all financial institutions, inssurance, banks, etc. there will be private enterprises and industry, but it will not have the power to BUY nations of their choosing, as is the case these days. Gasoline is banned, as are all other forms of pollutants, alternative fuels will be used, such as hydrogen or electric cars, windmills, etc. All our Cities will be rebuilt, they will be the envy of the world. magnetic monorails are built as to speed up transit time and clear traffic. Food can be grown up north in isolated domes, so that the cold can't destroy the plants. Consuption will be done in regulation, re-education programs will take effect. etc.
Yes, this is a dictatorship, one that imposes the closest we'll ever get to Utopia. I can add more, but you'd get bored.

Please people, a little dose of reality here. Whom are you going to fight? Who is the power behind the various thrones? It ain't only the so-called bush crime family, the elites of this nation whom you are blaming for this tyranny(?) cross the political spectrum. You gonna kill 'em all, and let god sort it out? The french tried that, and got Napoleon as a result, and decades of war and suffering. You do remember the tyranny of the guilletine, and Robspierre, in the history books in school?
The only way a revolution will work is to start holding the politicians and their powerbrokers responsible for their actions. That requires an educated and interested populous willing to vote. Remember, in a democracy, you get the government you deserve. Get active, get educated on the issues, get involved. Complaining about it won't get you anywhere, except ignored by the very people you are trying to enlighten.
Oops, I'm starting to preach. Think about what it is you are advocating, an overthrow of a government is nothing to start lightly (Think Iraq) unless there is no other option. We ain't out of options yet, not even close.

Radekus. A benevolent dictatorship? Sorry to burst your bubble, but there ain't no such critter. It's been tried throughout history, and hasn't worked yet. Unless you are talking of that paragon of earthly delight North Korea, or any of the despotic little regimes in other parts of the world that practise freeing the oppressed with thier trusty machetes and such.
America isn't perfect, far from it, but it's the best thing going. So keep your dictatorship of the proletariot to yourself thanks. Try voting. Try getting politically aware and active. The options are numerous, try some of them before advocating world revolution, eh?

Originally posted by kenshiro2012
Katrina aftermath in LA. Unfortunately, the sleeping bear that is john q. public is still sleeping

And you're also disarming yourself:

San Francisco Approves Gun, Military Recruiting Ban
www.newsmax.com

Voters approved ballot measures to ban handguns in San Francisco and urge the city's public high schools and college campuses to keep out military recruiters.

The gun ban prohibits the manufacture and sale of all firearms and ammunition in the city, and makes it illegal for residents to keep handguns in their homes or businesses.

Only two other major U.S. cities - Washington and Chicago - have implemented such sweeping handgun bans.

Old news, but I hadn't heard of it before. Not such a smart move in the longrun

There are various groups out there that propose financial revolution as opposed to physical (violent) revolution. Either through educated spending on products or by not paying taxes… they reason that voting with your dollar is more powerful than voting in a booth.

Again, no matter how well educated you are, when the only choices you are given are a hammer or a crowbar (and, occasionally, a rock) the whole act of voting becomes rather silly.

“None Of The Above” needs to be placed on the ballot. It is a legitimate option. It allows people who normally wouldn’t vote to vote and honestly state their opinion.

how about the #emall cantidate
if that gets the majority a #load of people enter in a lottery to become leaders.
we'd probably end up with better leaders to though
sad but at least partially true

Look, I don't think anyone is anxious to go revolt on any government, for the simple reason that it could very well cost them their lives, and I'm sure they aren't wanting to die yet. I'm one of those people that isn't looking forward to death, so I'm gonna side with not revolting, on the grounds that I need more evidence than what I'm about to present below.

That being said, I think there are a few signs that the government is heading down a bad path. Something was stated earlier about the Electoral College, and their influence over the election of the president. This is a terrible misuse of power, in the sense that, like that poster stated, the rest of the people in that state that voted the other way are not even counted as having voted. They effectively threw those votes out. Take the 2000 election for example. Gore had more overall national votes than Bush did, but because Bush focused more on the areas that had more Electoral votes, he got the majority and won. This is WRONG!! How is it Democracy when the choices of "we the people" are thrown out (squelched), just because a select few people said so? That to me makes this country no longer a country "by the people, for the people". It's a country of by the few, for the few.

Our choices no longer matter. We've been squelched in many ways. It's against the law to threaten someone, even though that person may not even intend on carrying out the threat. Since when is the freedom of speech being infringed just because someone doesn't like what someone else said? That's unconstitutional as far as I'm concerned. I'm sure the list could go on and on, but I'm gonna choose to stop here, because if I go on, all I do is rant, and I have no time to write a book on this.

Originally posted by seagull
Radekus. A benevolent dictatorship? Sorry to burst your bubble, but there ain't no such critter. It's been tried throughout history, and hasn't worked yet. Unless you are talking of that paragon of earthly delight North Korea, or any of the despotic little regimes in other parts of the world that practise freeing the oppressed with thier trusty machetes and such.
America isn't perfect, far from it, but it's the best thing going. So keep your dictatorship of the proletariot to yourself thanks. Try voting. Try getting politically aware and active. The options are numerous, try some of them before advocating world revolution, eh?

You point out other people's mistakes, not mine, besides, my dictatorship would have a council composed of all types of left-wing right-wing extremists willing to bitch about their solutions. The only reason you've got corruption in dictatorships is cause politicians aren't fired and publicly whiped when they screw everyone over. Look at Canada, Liberals are loosing cause they #ed us over too much, it's time for the conservatives to start digging into the bowl of money. Mind you, in my eyes, all parties are equally corrupt, why? Because you don't have THE PEOPLE talking, you have single individuals with their close minded views. This is why a democracy cannot work, something like a republic, like a UN inside of a nation, without the whole waste of time and bull# the UN is doing inside of it's building.