WTC Challenge, page 52
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reply posted on 18-8-2005 @ 10:08 PM by bsbray11
The building was 200 feet wide. THis would mean that the top of the building would have to rotate over 100 feet laterally. The structure would have never been able to cope with the stresses of that.


I didn't think this would be an extremely hard concept for you to understand. Maybe I was wrong. Falling straight down and crushing all the building below, besides requiring all columns to give out simultaneously, would also require much more force and would be much more difficult than to just fall off the side, resisted by nothing but air.

Do you get what I'm saying? If the top section of the building was going to collapse, it would collapse inward towards the area of missing columns (least resistance to gravity, and the weak part of the structure), and continue falling in that direction, right off the side and down onto the surrounding buildings. Ok? Simultaneously snapping all of the columns required for a clean, downward sweep would not be likely in this situation without some sort of detonation blowing the columns out.

I didn't say it would be pretty, and that the rest of the building would be fine, but the rest of the building would certainly not continue collapsing as a result of this, if that's what you're suggesting. As far as I know, basic physics and common sense do not change and bend around the logic of an engineer, and buildings are not that freaking weak. In fact, the more we discuss this, the more respect I lose for the intelligence of engineers.

I've already addresses the footprint issue.


Probably in the same way you allegedly debunked that link I posted showing how the fires could not possibly have been at the alleged temperatures. I should post that again soon, and then maybe you can actually show us how you debunked it so we can all take a closer look for ourselves?

Here you go:

911research.wtc7.net...

Again, from earlier, since you never responded but claimed you had debunked it earlier. It shouldn't be too far off, if flawed at all in the first place.

As for the steel shooting out, there were a lot of torsional forces on the individual components. When some of the bolts broke, those pieces shot out like arrows.


You are aware that the same feature is distinctive of demolitions, right?

Couple that with the fact that progressive collapses can't be reproduced going off the way you think they work, and that these features aren't typical of other types of collapses... Only demolitions, and the unreproducible "progressive collapses".. Hmm.


reply posted on 20-8-2005 @ 04:03 PM by Hector
Originally posted by Shroomery
Originally posted by Hector
Originally posted by Shroomery
Originally posted by Hector

The extreme heat in the lobby came from the explosion at WTC 6 at 9:03 AM which was next to tower WTC 1.

Jules Naudet saw two persons on fire (to his right) as he entered the lobby.


Yeah from a neighbouring building... and we're the conspiracy theorists ?


World Trade Center 6 was north of World Trade Center 1. Here is a photo that shows where the missile exploded in the center of 6. The blast affected the lobby of WTC 1 and damaged the southwest corner of WTC 7; which is the reason WTC 7 had to be pulled.

Also please note the rectangle and semicircular holes in the roofs of the surrounding buildings. This is where superheated steel beams from WTC 6 landed and started some of the fires. If you trace the straight edges of the semicircular holes where the beams hit they direct you back to the center of the crater.

911research.wtc7.net...



Missile ?
And you're telling me they decided that day, judging from the damage, that building 7 had to be pulled ? And by some wonder there were detonator charges planted in the building ?

Do you realize what you're trying to prove here ?

Or maybe I'm just misunderstanding you.

[edit on 20-8-2005 by Shroomery]


Here is the streaking missile. WTC 7 was pulled by a demolition team later that afternoon due to the damaged caused by the explosion at WTC 6. It is possible two missiles hit, one in the center of WTC 6 and the other at the southwest corner of WTC 7.

www.geocities.com...


reply posted on 20-8-2005 @ 04:47 PM by bsbray11
Hector,

Granted that I don't know wtf that streak is, it may be a little premature to start calling it a missile. Is there any evidence of it actually being a missile, especially evidence independent from that film footage? And is there any other footage that proves the streak was there and not an anomaly on the film?

At any rate, the hole that was created in WTC 6 is not consistent with any missile impact so far as I know. It looks more like big assed chunks of something fell on it. Nor have I seen any photographs of Building 7 showing that it was hit with a missile, either.

911research.wtc7.net...

Building 7 seemed to be in no real danger of collapse until it was pulled. And while we apparently agree that it was pulled, I seriously doubt that it could have been rigged up with the demolition equipment correctly, plans and all, on 9/11. In all likelihood, all three buildings had been rigged up just before 9/11, ie, the week before, when security had been laxed and all bomb-sniffing dogs removed. Especially if a building was on fire would you not be able to set up such a success top-down, footprint-resting demolition. If it could happen that fast, you'd see it happen that fast in the demo business, but it does not. It's more a matter of weeks and months of planning and preparation before demolitions can occur, than mere hours.


reply posted on 20-8-2005 @ 05:08 PM by Hector
Originally posted by bsbray11
Hector,

Granted that I don't know wtf that streak is, it may be a little premature to start calling it a missile. Is there any evidence of it actually being a missile, especially evidence independent from that film footage? And is there any other footage that proves the streak was there and not an anomaly on the film?

At any rate, the hole that was created in WTC 6 is not consistent with any missile impact so far as I know. It looks more like big assed chunks of something fell on it. Nor have I seen any photographs of Building 7 showing that it was hit with a missile, either.

911research.wtc7.net...

The link you provided shows the smoke from the explosion at WTC 6. This CNN photo is NOT the collapsed of WTC 2 as claimed by others. To prove this, the smoke from WTC 1 is blowing in an opposite direction when WTC 2 collapsed.

Why wouldn't it be a missile if fighters from Otis were on the scene as the second plane hit WTC 2? It looks like they were aiming at the plane from a distance and missed due to the plane's impact into WTC 2. The missile fell to the ground hitting WTC 6 or possible the south west corner of WTC 7.

Gideon Naudet took the missile photo as he was riding in the back of a pickup truck with volunteer firemen heading toward WTC 1.


reply posted on 20-8-2005 @ 09:34 PM by bsbray11
Originally posted by Hector
The link you provided shows the smoke from the explosion at WTC 6. This CNN photo is NOT the collapsed of WTC 2 as claimed by others. To prove this, the smoke from WTC 1 is blowing in an opposite direction when WTC 2 collapsed.


As you can see in the following photos, the dust from the South Tower's collapse did not discriminate in regards to which direction it went:




You can find more pics (too large to post here) by clicking here.

If you can find additional sources for that dust besides the collapse of WTC2, feel free to share, but at least provide us some evidence to back it up (ie, photos clearly showing a secondary source, unrelated to WTC2's collapse).

Why wouldn't it be a missile if fighters from Otis were on the scene as the second plane hit WTC 2?


I'm not saying it wouldn't be possible. I'm asking: what evidence do you have that this was the case? And again, was this captured from any other angles so as to show that it wasn't a film anomaly? Just questions; I'm inquiring.


reply posted on 21-8-2005 @ 06:21 AM by Hector
This link is of Secretary Elaine Chao's speech given to OSHA employees. OSHA was one of the agencies in building 6. After the first plane hit WTC 1 government employees evacuated WTC 6. Chao speaks of the destruction of WTC 6. She says the OSHA employees were outside building 6 as the second plane hit WTC 2.

Then she says after the second plane crashed into WTC 2, the north tower WTC 1 then collapsed onto WTC 6. This can not be the case. WTC 2 collapsed BEFORE WTC 1. A missile hit WTC 6 seconds after the second plane hit WTC 2. She has the timing right for the destruction of WTC 6 but not the cause.

www.dol.gov...

"On the morning of September 11, 2001, OSHA employees had begun a routine day when an explosion shook the building. The Assistant Area Director immediately issued the order to evacuate. As the first plane hit the North Tower of the WTC, debris began falling on Building 6. OSHA staff rushed into the hallway. Three employees helped their co-worker in the wheelchair down the corridor and into a freight elevator they had used during the practice drill. They descended to the basement, into a garage, down some steps, and into another garage, where they escaped from the building.

The group moved outside just as the second plane hit the South Tower. As the group moved away from the site, the North Tower collapsed, destroying OSHA’s Manhattan Area Office as it fell. We are so thankful that no Department of Labor employee was lost during that tragic day. Thanks, in no small part to OSHA’s careful emergency planning, everyone knew what to do—even in this unprecedented circumstance."
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