What if.......................

Many years ago, whilst on a SNCOs course here in the UK, I was introduced to the nightmare scenario of Battlefield Appreciation.

Now guys, I guess that most of you know about Murphy's Law of Armed Conflict, but what about battlefield appreciation? What do you know about that?

For example, you're a squad or platoon leader - ordered to storm a fortified bunker. You are pinned down by this bunker but, because it's half hidden by heavy undergrowth on top of a small hill, and you can't see whats there with it, what do you do?

If anybody's got their own ideas about battlefield appreciation, I would love to hear them.

I'll start you off with: Of the two courses of action available to the enemy (for which you have prepared for) the enemy commander will always chose the third (which you have ignored as being impracticable!)

Originally posted by fritz
For example, you're a squad or platoon leader - ordered to storm a fortified bunker. You are pinned down by this bunker but, because it's half hidden by heavy undergrowth on top of a small hill, and you can't see whats there with it, what do you do?

u go around it.. also use infrared or thermal to identify where the target is and call in airstrike. since u say its half hidden that mean the enemy only hid the front of the bunker which means u can find the bunker easier by flanking it. throw grenades or use flame thrower on it killing and burning anione who is occupying the bunker.

Delta Boy, I think you missed the point. The scenario was there to illustrate the 'What if?' questions a battlefield commander has to ask himself before he achieves his onjective.

Incidentally, is the bunker on it's own? IAre the flanks not protected by other bunkers or trenches? Is the bunker merely using weapons firing on fixed lines - controlled by clockwork mechanisms?

The thread asked what battlefield appreciation anecdotes you could think of. Obviously DeltaBoy, you is losing the plot. LOL

First question, what do we know?
Second question, what do we have?
Third question, do we act or do we observe?

Originally posted by devilwasp
First question, what do we know?
Second question, what do we have?
Third question, do we act or do we observe?

dam u devilwasp, cant believe it was an easy answer. i was thinking too hard to answer it. jus kiddin.

Originally posted by deltaboy
dam u devilwasp, cant believe it was an easy answer

. i was thinking too hard to answer it.

jus kiddin.

I've been on enough courses and sat in enough lectures at cadets its drilled into me....

i hope i didnt leave my coffee back at base.....

Ah Devil.............So close, but not right.

What do we know? - Nothing!
What do we have? - Not a lot!
Do we act or do we observe? - Your choice of course - BUT what if?

Nothing on a battlefield is as clear cut as it seems. Always remember Murphy's Law of Armed Conflict No 10. When in doubt, give it 10 rounds - rapid!'

Or am I missing the point? Does nobody understand Murphy's Law of (Modern) Armed Conflict?

Has nobody writing to these hallowed pages, been in a combat situation and thought 'Sh1t! What happens if I (we) do this?'

I’m a little slow so I don't understand the question, what are you asking? Are you asking what we would do or what?

Shouldn'tthis be n BTS ? This has nothing to do with weaponry.

Originally posted by fritz
Ah Devil.............So close, but not right.

What do we know? - Nothing!
What do we have? - Not a lot!
Do we act or do we observe? - Your choice of course - BUT what if?

Nothing on a battlefield is as clear cut as it seems. Always remember Murphy's Law of Armed Conflict No 10. When in doubt, give it 10 rounds - rapid!'

Or am I missing the point? Does nobody understand Murphy's Law of (Modern) Armed Conflict?

Has nobody writing to these hallowed pages, been in a combat situation and thought 'Sh1t! What happens if I (we) do this?'

Ok I'll give it a bash,
I'll answer my own questions.

1) What do we know? That we are under fire from and unknown agressor that most likely knows where we are.
2) What do we have? A squad of soldiers , I'm guessing with gear.
3) Do we act or do we observe? As any soldier/marine is taught winning the firefight in any engagement is essential if you wish to acheive victory (Or so I can remember from marine camps).
So the course of action is to return fire, there by; showing the enemy you are able to fight back, giveing the enemy something to worry about (flying bullets) and giveing you more information , wich is the key to any battle.

I take a page out of a battle in Afghanistan, and have my CAS drop 500 pound bombs 50 meters away from us on the bunker.

Actual radio calls:

"We need you to hit the pine tree in the middle on the top of the hill, we're 50 meters below that."
"I'm travelling 500+ knots, and you want me to hit a specific tree, with an air to air canon?"
"That's exactly right."

Guys - you just don't understand what I'm driving at. Not a problem.

All to do with weaponry. Their effects, their range, how you deploy them, and most important of all, your skills as a battlefield commander - or lack of them.

'What if?' is the question you should ask. For example, 'That bunker has us pinned down! Too close for CAS. What if I send Bill & Mike right flanking? What happens if there is another trench or bunker on the right flank?........................................................ and on and on. Don't need no genius to work it out.

All I asked was does anybody know any 'sayings' or 'quotes' that apply to battle appreciation? But there agin, I suppose I'm back to Sadism, Necrophilia and Beastiality!

Hmm a qoute...
"If doubt call the comando's out.."