Scientology a Cult?

That depends on the individual practicing Scientology.

While most people who use the techs would consider themselves Scientologists, not all of them would call Scientology their religion.

It's an individual choice. You do not have to consider it a religion to use the tech.

Thanks for clearing that up...What its basic tenets...isn't it that you control your own outcome in life and that you can change things through only yoursefl...I hope that makes sense...

Well, at least we can agree its destructive, manipulative, and a problem. I just find it interesting how much anti-Scientology sites there are, and how few Pro-Scientology sites there are. I think that general wisdom should apply, thus showing people how bad this 'religion' actually is.

No offense, but that's a ridiculous assumption. So you're saying that if a majority of people misunderstand something, so that the general concensus on that thing is negative, then it MUST be bad because a majority believes so? That's completely ridiculous.

Then allow it to be absurd. Im sorry, but a majority that has come to the same conclusion cannot be totally wrong, as your implying

Plus I think in this case, Scientology can clearly be defined in this destructive light. Alot of people that are falling for this stuff are emotionally vulnerable as it is. Hell, they targeted 9/11 workers, and are now targeting returning troops from Iraq. They may initially offer some kind of comfort, but they are only doing it to increase thier profit margin.

WissNX01

I will agree with you that the Church, based on current policies and for personal gain by the current top executives, can be very dangerous and vindictive. As for Scientologists, they are just regular people like everyone else.

You talk about the lack of pro-Scientology sites out there. You've actually raised a very good point. The problem is that the Church goes after anyone who uses their writings or copyrighted terms with guns ablazing, whether it be for negative or positive purposes. The only people who are willing to withstand this kind of legal attack are the ones who are vehemently anti-Scientology. And the lawsuits give the opponents more fuel and examples of irrational behaviour.

In my opinion, the amount of anti vs. pro sites is the fault of the Church. With the heavy use of lawsuits they have managed to make it seem like there is something dangerous about the use of Scientology. They have created their own monster. When the truth is Scientology is not dangerous, only the Church.

BoonePanic

I will answer this the best I can, but it won't be until later. Ok?

edited because they Azeari had answered the questions, and I now I have less typing to do.

[edit on 2-7-2005 by Duzey]

Originally posted by WissNX01
Then allow it to be absurd. Im sorry, but a majority that has come to the same conclusion cannot be totally wrong, as your implying

I'm not talking about Scientology specifically. I'm personally opposed to Scientology (well, the "church" anyways, not the practice) as well, but we cannot assume that it is bad simply because the majority of people have a negative impression of it. People misunderstand things like this all the time!

Freemasonry suffers from the exact problem. People misunderstand the secrecy and silence, and ASSUME that it's something nefarious! It's an absolute mistake and, if we were to use your logic to make judgement on the fraternity, we would be the most ignorant people on Earth!

I'm just saying that you need to use a more proactive and investigative approach when trying to decide if something is good or bad.

Originally posted by BoonePanic
What its basic tenets...isn't it that you control your own outcome in life and that you can change things through only yoursefl

The super simple explanation follows...

Each person is a spiritual being that is seperate from the physical body. Because of this you are able to control your body through the power of your mind. It covers a lot of different areas, from simply learning how to focus on something by shutting out distractions to things such as OOBE's and projection of will, at the higher end of the levels.

When you are ready to move to the next stage of learning, at the end of your physical body's life, you 'leave the body' and your spirit moves to the next one.

[edit on 2-7-2005 by Duzey]

Originally posted by sebatwerk
Freemasonry suffers from the exact problem. People misunderstand the secrecy and silence, and ASSUME that it's something nefarious!

They do suffer from the same problem, but I think the Church in some ways invites the accusations, through vindictive behaviour. The secrecy will get people curious every time. The more things are denied, the surer opponents become that something is going on. Freemasonry has shown more wisdom and understanding of this by not suing the pants off of anyone who criticizes them.

In value systems and morals, Freemasons and Scientologists are very similar. Scientologists tend to be highly ethical people. In most respects, a Scientologist would fit almost all of the requirements for Freemasonry.

Edited to add the following.

If a male Scientologist of the age of majority were to present himself and request to be considered for admittance to the Freemasons, I see absolutely no reason why, based on his beliefs, he would be denied membership.

There is the belief of a Supreme Being - they believe in a creator, they just don't try to explain Him. They are very anti-drug, they are often very active in good works, and in general are upstanding, law-abiding, productive members of society.

It is possible that my reasoning is flawed. Because of gender, Freemasonry is not something I could become involved in if I wanted to, so this is based on what my uncle, who is a Freemason/Shriner, has told me about it.

[edit on 2-7-2005 by Duzey]

To WissNX01 -

Stick with the conscience that God gave you. It's working fine !

Stay away from these cults like Scientology and Masonry.

Their own form of teachings, symbology or lessons or anything else you would like to call it are all in the same group of cults, teaching Secular Humanism with their own flavor of religion to boot.

These teachings only seperate the individual from God by relying on ones self to change your own mindset which goes against the teachings of
God.

God can and does do the same things for people on a daily basis that these individuals are trying to achieve on their own to reach their own power of enlightenment in their lives.

The difference is that they will praise themselves for their own achievements in enlightment instead of praising God for giving them the capabilities- ( The Mind and Spirit )

Don't fall for the imitation ! Go directly to the source Himself and read His Words- They will give you everything you need for this life and also instruct you how and why to stay away from these cults.

It's all right there in One Book ! It couldn't be any easier !

Don't let man muddy the waters more than he already has !

Truth !

Originally posted by Truthisoutthere
To WissNX01 -

Stick with the conscience that God gave you. It's working fine !

Stay away from these cults like Scientology and Masonry.

While I believe that Scientology is a cult, I do believe that Masonry is not and a force for good, while Scientology seeks to destroy people. Otherwise, I agree.

I've actually known a lot of people and there are actually large groups apart from Scientology who use the concepts of Dianetics but do not associate with Scientology. Dianetics, I haven't read the book but it's apparently the use of the various mechanisms and same techniques as Scientology but without all of the misc. brainwashing and assorted crap that goes along with it. So if you're just interested in those concepts I'd read the book "Dianetics" or do some research on the E-Meter, which is what they use. The group of Scientology is a rampaging beast, but some of the technology they imploy and the way they use it are things I can agree with. I just think it needs to be seperated from them, much like a baby being saved from a family of crack whores.

Originally posted by Incognita
The group of Scientology is a rampaging beast, but some of the technology they imploy and the way they use it are things I can agree with. I just think it needs to be seperated from them, much like a baby being saved from a family of crack whores.

Well, that's not exactly how I would have put it, but.....

If by group you mean the Church, I would say this is a very accurate assessment of the situation.

Just a word about anti vs pro sites.

Basic humanity:

When one wishes to complain, one makes a loud noise about it, at any given opportunity.

When one is happy with the situation though, there's usually far lesser need to make a loud noise.

The same rule can apply to surgery websites ("Ooooh ths is ebil and bad, yo" versus "my life chnged for teh gud"), food websites ("I ate sushi once and my marriage broke up!" versus "Sushi is teh bom, evry1 shud eat it"), you name it.

A lack of "pro" websites doesn't necessarily imply the subject is negative, or bad. It's also a good habit to question the author's agenda of these websites - if they're "too good" or "too negative", there's usually an agenda behind it...

S'all

I guess "pro" websites would be all the official ones. And there are many, I've seen them. They aren't always under the word "scientology" though, those people have a lot of code words for their different departments, but you can find official and "pro" websites really easy if you just take a few minutes.

The "con" websites aren't really what I would call "against" scientology. Like the "clambake" website, which professes to be composed of former and present scientologists who just wish to spread truth of their own experiences. There's quite a mix of different people on that website, each with different opinions about the organization.

As for people having their own agenda, well, that's obvious. Many of the people I've spoken to are just terrified of being snuffed and assorted nonsense like that, and there's a few people out there who can tell you stories about having attacks on their life after defecting, etc. Then again, you have to wonder why a church would even bother to have it's own CIA type organization within the organization. I mean, really, what would a true "church" need something like that for. But then again, even the Catholics have the Knights of Columbus. So I guess we're all screwed no matter what religion we suscribe to.

I know alot of Gay people that join the Knights of Columbus just to get thier kids into a Catholic school. I didnt know it was an intelligence agency.



[edit on 3-7-2005 by asala]

Originally posted by WissNX01
I know alot of queers that join the Knights of Columbus just to get thier kids into a Catholic school. I didnt know it was an intelligence agency.

No Way lol - Is that True ?

Haven't heard that before. I am not denying it. Jtts don't know too much about the KOC ? What does the Knights of Columbus have to do with kids getting accepted into a Catholic School ?

Yeah, my dads second wife had a homo brother, of course, he had a boyfriend, and they all hung out with other flamers. But I swear to you, they all joined the KOC, were converted Catholic, and allowed to enroll thier kids into a private school.

Wow, you really know how to roll down your shorts and take a crap all over a thread, don't you.

Knights of Columbus is supposed to be the "Strong Right Arm" of the Catholic Church. Scientology has a similar organization, reportedly responsible for such things as clipping brake lines on cars of people who've left Scientology.