Ancient Site Buldozed by Gov't?

I was reading a very interesting article about an 'ancient' site in Oklahoma. The pictures look interesting:

The discovery of the hilltop fortress and furnace came about, it seemed, by casual chance. My wife publishes a little community newspaper distributed in the counties bordering the Red River around Lake Texoma, called TGIF The Weekend Bandit. It is a general interest paper focusing mainly on local events and history. I write a weekly column on history and sometimes feature articles. Since I grew up near Rockwall, Texas, it was of great interest to me to discover that in January 2000 excavation of the mysterious buried wall there had finally been undertaken. I had been obsessed by that wall since childhood.

Only a week or two earlier, I had done an article on Gloria Farley's work on the Heavener Runestone. The rock wall seemed a logical follow up, especially since "runes" had been unearthed there in 1949. In the article, I asked any readers who knew of similar writings or walls to contact me. Following that, I gave a synopsis of Viewzone's expedition to the Purgatory River canyon.

www.mondovista.com...

Then I read an update that said the government had buldozed the site ...

Following our last report of an unusual stone structure found in the East Oklahoma area, several samples of the layered and mitred stones were analyzed. The striations appeared to be the result of extreme heat and rapid cooling over many -- perhaps several hundred -- years. This was expected since the structure appears to be a huge smelt for refining gold ore. Certainly this was not the work of the indiginous population in North America. Gold crystals and red mercury oxide were found in traces on the specimen that Viewzone examined.

We were just about to form an expedition to the site when another huge foundation was located nearby. Some symbols, possibly First Tongue, were described on one of the stones. But, sadly, the site was abruptly shut down and the excavations were bulldozed with earth by some arm of our own government. An informed source close to the family that owns the land reported that the family was threatened with harm if they allowed anyone to dig on their land in the future. They were told to forget what they saw. This type of threats remind one of the aftermath of Roswell in the late 40's.

The results of the burial are pictured above.

At Viewzone we receive many such reports from all over the globe. Ancient sites that appear to be very old are shut down or quickly buried by the host governments. Why?

www.mondovista.com...

Does anyone know anything about this site, or whether the government actually did destory the site?

The structure looks pretty interesting. Maybe even alien.

They do look strange, I doubt there alien, I mean why would they us stone?

But it does remind me of the Aztecs for some reason, dont know why but it was the first thing that popped into my head when I saw the pictures.

This isnt really anything new, during WW2 the RAAF bulldozed an ancient druid shrine to expand a runway.

Erf... after reading the article, you gott ask "WHICH site" because 3 are mentioned. There's something (maybe) in Rockwall here in Dallas County, near where I live. Then there's the "Purgatory river" canyon. Then there's "somewhere near Colbert, OK" and a tale that mixes known Native American lore with more modern folklore. And the writer, annoyingly, doesn't go into specifics that would help make his case... like WHERE the site in question really is.

Still, I'm the curious sort.

Colbert is in Bryan County, Oklahoma. "Kiamichi" could be in Atoka, Bryan, Haskell, or Leflore counties.

The armchair archaeological researcher always starts out at the National Register of Historic Places. There are several places to check in researching locations, and this is an easy one:
www.nationalregisterofhistoricplaces.com...

Bryan County gets no hits.

Atoka County has the McAlister, Bo, Site

Haskell has perhaps the most interesting collection: Mule Creek Site (village site with material dating to 9,000 BC... amazing stuff!), Otter Creek (more village, dates to 0 AD and onward AND (interesting) part of it is underwater)

Le Flore has the Lake Wister Site (2000 BC and onward, unlike most of the others it's on Federal land so we know this isn't the site)

...so it's a reasonable guess based on the number of sites that the place was perhaps in Haskell County

The next question a scientist asks is "what kind of rocks are in the area"
www.okgeosurvey1.gov...

My first thought on seeing the "tubes" was "well, that's lava." The map shows that this is a bad guess... there's Pennsylvanian and Silurian and Devonian rock layers there, but the igneous stuff is not that close. So "volcanic dykes/sills from lava outflows" is put into the "not without better evidence" category. So we've got sedimentary rocks.

The "walls joined together" look like Pennsylvanian limestones, fractured in the Ouachita uplift... but after many and many a geology road trip, I've learned to not base an opinion on just a few pictures. However, a look at the faults maps show that the area in question does have some fault lines, so that would be something to be investigated if/when the site was found:
www.okgeosurvey1.gov...

That's about as far as anyone can go with conclusions without actually finding the place.

As to the bulldozing, I'm going to say "not if there was ANYthing remotely Native American there." The medicine people are very active in Oklahoma and there are a LOT of Native American activists in the state with good national and international contact. That's not something you could "cover up" by paying off the "right people."

It's a pity that the writer took the Standard Mysterious Objects reporting style rather than good reporting technique. A good sense of where the site was would enable armchair researchers to look up who owned the land, what (if any) archaeological sites were in the area, what use the land had been historically, and what the exact geology and soil characteristics of the area are.

Instead, all we get is "out there, thataway."

Fie on lazy reporters! If we KNEW where that place was, we could find out quickly who owns it and if they were bulldozing it and why.




Stuff for the Armchair Researcher to look at:

History of Native Americans in Oklahoma:
www.shopoklahoma.com...

The activist group that is interested in protecting Native American burial sites and getting material back from museums is the Repatriation Group (Vine Deloria is a name that may be familiar to some of you):
www.repatriationfoundation.org...

NAGPRA's fascinating "Culturally Unidentifiable Objects" list (look up Oklahoma just for fun):
64.241.25.6...

(I'm not finding the othe links I wanted, but there's a list of known Native American sites that the local tribes are fighting to control... if someone stumbles across the link, please U2U me about it and I'll add it to my bookmarks on del.icio.us)



[edit on 17-6-2005 by Byrd]

this quote from the mondovista site i found interesting

"Each day as Lisa and the other Park's Department employees went onto the site, they were searched for cameras. Similarly they were searched as they left the site each day to make sure they weren't removing artifacts. They were also obliged to sign "secrecy documents" ensuring that they would never divulge details of their participation in this undertaking. The reason for this degree of secrecy stems from the fact that the skeletons were of people who were about 8 feet tall. They had six fingers on each hand and six toes per foot. They also had a strange, double row arrangement of teeth"

any one here ever hear of this???

I was willing to go along with most of that until I saw the bits about "ooo! We are telling you about a super secret site with huge skeletons with multiple digits and DOUBLE ROWS OF TEETH!!"

No.

That's just stupid.

It's a reworking of one of the less believable "alien burial sites" things that was going around a few years ago. You can't forget the mindnumbingly stupid stuff like that.

In order to "cover things up" the "FBI" (must stand for Fictional Brand of Investigators because the tactics come straight out of a bad spy movie) has to silence all the Indians in the area, the folks who found it, the people at the dig, the people in the Smithsonian, the people in the testing labs, and the people whose land it was on and all their families...) The Fictional Investigators are running out of places to hide all those bodies.

Unless you think Bush started a war in Iraq so he could slide the payments for all this hush money into the budget under "miscellaneous Haliburton Projects."

Nope.

Totally stupid.

The weird structures COULD be stromatolites.

www.ersdac.or.jp...

(scroll down... there's eventually a picture of them in cross section.) This would explain why they weren't magnetic.

I can't say for sure that they are, but given the geology of the area, it's one hypothesis to check. And it makes a lot of sense over metal-carrying pipes that are crammed together (that would make the pipes melt and cause other problems. And you can't get metal to flow very far before it starts to cool.)

Hmm. Those stromatalite things look like something I saw before when we were touring Canada. And now that you mention it, I think what I saw looked sort of like the picture of the "ancient site."

At least "ancient sea life" is a bit more believable than "weird aliens with double rows of teeth who pump concrete through tubes."

Originally posted by Indellkoffer
Hmm. Those stromatalite things look like something I saw before when we were touring Canada. And now that you mention it, I think what I saw looked sort of like the picture of the "ancient site."

At least "ancient sea life" is a bit more believable than "weird aliens with double rows of teeth who pump concrete through tubes."

yup thats a lot more believable..look at some of the rock formations over the world that are known to be natural

www.northantrim.com...
www.northantrim.com...
www.unmuseum.org...
www.unmuseum.org...


[edit on 20-6-2005 by Heratix]

I am from oklahoma, and have recently been enlightened to a number of peoples who have settled this area in the past

first off... the "wall" was probably torn down by the farmer who wanted to use the land, instead of have a tourist site set up in his backyard... (not the Government)
no conspiracy neccessary to explain why a land owner would do that... (especially if he heard rumors about researchers at another site)

now as to the other peoples who might have constructed this...
there were a people related to aztecs that migrated northward thousands of years ago... could be them...

it could also be celtic or teutonic... we have many Runes sites in oklahoma...
these were all considered to be fake, for many years but due to other recently found rune sites, and new understandings of runes, they are now considering the authenticity again...

Of course we have native americans, but not ones who worked with stone in construction much, but who is to say, that it was always that way...

Oklahoma would have also been an inland sea in the early days of earths development so unusual fossils are common (jellyfish, aquatic plant life, ect) so take your pic...

there is obviously a lot more to discover in Oklahoma, as I am sure with most of america... we are only seeing the "top layer" right now...
don't forget... thousands of years have buried it underground...
while I have trouble finding the shovel buried under dog poo in the backyard...

We bulldoze archaeological sites all the time. It's sort of a given in the construction industry that if you find something you put it in your pocket and make sure that Caltrans or any other inspecting agency doesn't see it. There's a lot of money to be lost if the job gets shut down.

At least two of the guys who work in the aggregate mine have pulled Megalodon teeth off of our conveyor belts, and my grandfather has one that he brought up while drilling for oil in Oklahoma.

Actually the one that my grandfather claims to have owned (we haven't been able to locate it so far- although he swears it must be in his attic somewhere) was far bigger than what I generally hear Megalodon teeth are supposed to be. By his description, the one he found was somewhere in the neighborhood of 8-10 inches. Then again, he's a Texan.

Edit to add: All the time might have been an exageration. It's not all that common that we find anything of significance anyway. Usually just a tooth or two, or maybe an arrow head. All the same, we do more digging that pretty much anyone else, so naturally our industry finds a lot of stuff. Who knows how much of it we never even notice too. But that's not to say we do it "all the time" i guess. Just sometimes.

I'd like to think that if we found something really interesting- like human remains inside of T-rex remains or a small city, we'd probably have the decency to take the rest of the day off and call the academic types in for a look-see before we ran it all over with the Cat.



[edit on 22-6-2005 by The Vagabond]