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NEWS: Teen Sent To Gay "Treatment" Camp Against His Will

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posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 05:12 PM
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Originally posted by Odium
You allow them to harm you due to the fact you think they are immoral.

So I can make sure that they don't harm me by making sure that me and my society curbs this evil in its buds! And hence the case of the 17yr old!


Go and get a State Referendum on this issue and see what it shows. So far the only one goes in favour of the Homo-sexuals and against you.

Sooner or later this will happen and then you will see for yourself that your view that gays are acceptable in society is steeped in fallacy!


Simple fact is, you are allowing it to harm you. You are the one thinking they are harmnig you..

You still don't understand do you?
The parallel I called up between cannibalism and homosexuality is because I know nobody will accept cannibalsim as acceptable even if it is consented but why is it that people like you parade yourselfs as some pseudo-champion of this equally reprehensible act! If you see cannibalism as horrible then so should you homosexuality as your argument that it should not harm others works for both equally well!
You seem to be misinformed about the extent that a person can receive harm, but spiritual harm is definitely an acceptable form of harm as the following articles will attest:
www.nrtw.org...
www.nrtw.org...
www.usiap.org...
www.newsbull.com...
There are hundreds more! Unlike other nations, religious freedoms are taken very seriously in America!


You allow them to harm you and come off as though it is their fault. Why? It has been shown that homo-sexuality can be due to their "brain" so it is "natural" not "artificial".

So can I shoot every homosexual i meet? That will protect me from them !
Your argument is vain! If some one spits at your countries flag does that harm you? It must if you have patriotism, similarly if some one openly preaches homosexuality then they are in effect spitting at my faith and my values which are important to me!
Also to the ignorant poster earlier who said that beef should be banned if homosexuality is should know that a Mc Donalds was sued for having beef in its veggie fries! And so you cannot impose on people without respect of their faith.
money.cnn.com...
[urlwww.mindfully.org...[/url]


It is clear the majority of the people on this forum can see homosexuality does not harm you but you allow it to harm you. They can see it does not harm society but people allow it to harm themselves.

How can you say a majority? Thats arrogant ! You haven't studied all the earlier threads on all the various posts to make such a prefidious statement!
Jsut because of a few "GAY-STAIGHT" friends happen to be here now doesn't prove that most people on this forum feel "gay" about homosexuality!


If you can debate this with any facts rather then feelings please do,

I have based my argument on logic till now which you sadly fail to appreciate so as you want "documented" proof to every claim as you so readily have provided!
The fact that nature has instances of homosexuality and that this argument can be used to justify homosexuality in humans is shear fantasy. I can show instanves in nature that shows a cat with wings, a frog with 8 legs and other such grotesq abnormailites does that mean they are all normal ?
Also as your search to show the ill effects of homosexuality on society is an expected failure I am burdened to educate you about this:
Let us begin with ATS shall we!
politics.abovetopsecret.com...
politics.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
politics.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.belowtopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
And now lets try google;
Marginalization of Family
Gays more prone to AIDS than Normal peopleThe curroption of marriage by GaysWhy homosexuals should not get married!Homosexuality and Child moloestationHomosexuals and Drug use!Homosexuals and Social decadence!How Homosexuals were sold to America!What is homosexuality!
And i can go on all day but i am not here to educte the ignorant!

Also here is an article that says homosexuals are not born gay !
www.narth.com...




posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 05:49 PM
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Originally posted by WyrdeOne
IAF
You say you're spiritually wounded by the existence of homosexuals, and you think that they should be banned from America because of that fact? I'm spiritually harmed by your existence. Do you think you should leave the country?

Firstly you are not the majority, so what you say means diddly squat!

Secondly, Through which action of mine have I offended your religious faith?
Homosexuals by commiting sin in our neighbour hood mock our faith and our values. Just like somebody pissing in Solomons Temple or ejaculating on the Koran!
Okay, let the government have a vote and see how many vote for and against!
You most probably have lived in the city and are deluded by the your life there so i excuse you!


I find Christianity distastefully submissive and subversive, so are you going to find your own way to the camps, or do you need me to arrange the train?

Well it stems from the teachings of judaism so that is the actuall cause of all your hate!
Oh! I travel by plane, First class only!




You say they cause you spiritual harm..how do you define that? How do you quantify that? How do you prove that in a court of law? How do you separate the harm that was caused by the act and the harm that was caused by your particular perception of the act?

harm Pronunciation Key (härm)
n.
1. Physical or psychological injury or damage.
Thats how you define it and What I mean in the psychological injury. As for how do i quantify that, i would say in intensity from serious to extreem!
I'm no lawyer! What kind of question is that?

When somebody burns kills your parents before you - how do you separate the harm that was caused by the act and the harm that was caused by your particular perception of the act? Something similar!




You want to banish homosexuals because they offend you and your people. Well, a long time ago my people were unceremoniously targeted for extermination for the very same reason. Way to keep the flame of Auschwitz burning buddy.


My god! Don't give me that ' my people were persecuted by the Nazi's' crap! I'm not going to be drawn into your pathetic attempt at a guilt trip!

What astounds me though is the very fact that you are shameless enough to use such a tragedy for the support of people who are considered deviants in your religion as well!
I have no problem with homosexuals in any other country or region or even state! As long as tehy do not defile my immediate surroundings and come in contact with me or my family I couldn't care less!



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 06:35 PM
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Wow there alot of frivilous arguments going on.

IAF,
Just because someone isnt the majority, does not mean what they think means squat.

Also, I've noticed a pattern with BadMojo, Odium will ay something, Badmojo will say he's wrong and call him an idiot, Odium will back up his claims with credible sources and links, Badmojo stops responding about it, when Badmojo uses links, they are biased religious ones.



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 06:47 PM
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IAF101, you are a religous extremist and that is fine. Just remember you are a minority. That is a good thing.

You pick and choose which part of the bible you agree with and follow it, that isn't spiritual, that is emotional. Even if you did not follow a specific "faith", you would still dislike gay people.

The fact that these "treatment camps" exist is an outrage. Frankly parents sending young people to these places do not deserve to be parents.

I do support sending children to rehabilitation camps for issues such as drug addiction.

Why can't people just accept the way people are born, respect them as people.

I could understand if it was something that could harm any of us in any way. But, you know what, it can't. Maybe its the imagined imagery of the act or something. Well I have a good solution to that problem, stop thinking about gay sex!

My rant is over....for now.



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 07:37 PM
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Let us take this step by step:

AIDs/HIV.
Center for Disease Control and Prevention give their 1998 statistics as only 31% of new cases coming from Homo-sexuals the other 69% coming from those who engage in hetero-sexual activities.
www.aidsandafrica.com... - shows you are more likely to get AIDs if you are in fact African and not gay.

Remember world wide view here.

Marriage:
The only thing homo-sexuals can't do that hetero-sexuals cannot do is breed. So should those people who can't have children be unable to get married also?

Also why did this become about marriage? It seems you have had to move it onto that? (As I don't remember typing anything about that prior to this post.)

Also none of those go on to proove that homo-sexuality is un-natural, due to the fact it has clearly been shown to exist within animals. All they do is "claim" this and that without really giving proof. Nor have I ever mentioned anything about homo-sexuals being able to raise children - which I don't fully agree with at this present moment.

Simple matter of fact is, the majority of people seem to agree homosexuals do not cause any direct harm, never have and probably never will. They have existed for thousands of years and will exist long after you do. If you think you are spiritually correct then take the high ground and do not agree with them.

Furthermore, if you think you have a moral case then take it to court and get homo-sexuals outlawed. The courts are there to protect the majority from harm. If you have evidence to show homo-sexuals do so much harm to Society show the courts so they can act!



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 08:38 PM
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IAF


Firstly you are not the majority, so what you say means diddly squat!


We have that in common at least.



Secondly, Through which action of mine have I offended your religious faith?


Your intolerance is offensive, not to mention dangerous.



Homosexuals by commiting sin in our neighbour hood mock our faith and our values.


Your faith and values are not above mockery. They are sacred only to you. We live in a society that has freedom of religion, not mandatory religion. Understand the difference?



Just like somebody pissing in Solomons Temple or ejaculating on the Koran!


Thanks for the imagery.
On the record, if two gay men fornicated in front of you with the intent to cause you distress, you'd have a case, you'd have every right to be offended to the point of seeking retribution. However, imagining what people are doing and being offended doesn't give you the right to persecute them. Off the record, I couldn't care less who does what in Solomon's temple, or what people do in the privacy of their homes.

When you walk down the street, and see two people of the same sex kissing, I'm sure you're offended. Thing is, they're not doing it to cause you distress, your distress comes entirely from you. When I see those people kissing, I don't get offended, so the act in and of itself is not patently, universally offensive. That means you're the problem, you're the lens through which everything passes.

It just so happens your lens is clouded by religious views, and so you see through the glass, but darkly. Instead of a live and let live approach to life, you have chosen a more controlling path. You seek to direct the lives of others, and that is unacceptable to me, and to many others in this country, not to mention the world.



You most probably have lived in the city and are deluded by the your life there so i excuse you!


I've lived all over. I personally think cities originally spawned homosexuality, but that's immaterial. If cities disappeared, and people went back to living in small, closely knit, mobile family groups, homosexuality would likely vanish almost entirely. It would remain in isolated cases, but it certainly wouldn't be as widespread as it is now.

Again, sending people to re-education camps is not the solution. If you want to change society, we can talk about that. But you want to change people, and historically that's been proven impossible, and messy.



Well it stems from the teachings of judaism so that is the actuall cause of all your hate!
Oh! I travel by plane, First class only!


Sorry, calling me an anti-semite is the height of hilarity. I am a semite, at least in blood. I'm glad you're a first class flier, maybe you can answer a question for me. Do they serve the same peanuts, or do you get mixed nuts or something?



harm Pronunciation Key (härm)
n.
1. Physical or psychological injury or damage.
Thats how you define it and What I mean in the psychological injury. As for how do i quantify that, i would say in intensity from serious to extreem!


I once knew this girl who was so grossed out by whipped cream she would become physically ill when she saw it or even heard the schlupping sound of the cream coming out of the can. She was really hurt by that, yaknow? It straight freaked her out, she would shiver uncontrollably and scream bloody murder. It was hilarious. Your distaste, indeed your religion's distaste for homosexuality strikes me in the same exact way.



I'm no lawyer! What kind of question is that?
When somebody burns kills your parents before you - how do you separate the harm that was caused by the act and the harm that was caused by your particular perception of the act? Something similar!


Wow. That's a doozy.
The answer is the vast majority of people would be traumatized by watching their parents burn to death. Thinking about homosexuality has never, to my knowledge, ever sent someone into shock or caused them severe psychological damage.

You can choose not to think about homosexuality. You can choose not to rent gay porno. You can avoid the gay bars and miss this year's parade. You can avoid the damage by either a.) reducing your exposure to it, or b.) changing your response to the stimuli.



My god! Don't give me that ' my people were persecuted by the Nazi's' crap! I'm not going to be drawn into your pathetic attempt at a guilt trip!


Your guilt is your business. I have no interest in your struggles.



What astounds me though is the very fact that you are shameless enough to use such a tragedy for the support of people who are considered deviants in your religion as well!


So what do YOU think my religion is? Do you think I even HAVE a religion? You shouldn't assume things. So for starters, don't assume you know me. While I myself am not homosexual, I happen to feel a certain kinship with them, as they were also targeted for extermination alongside my family.

Kindred spirits you might say, or at the very least, a common enemy.



I have no problem with homosexuals in any other country or region or even state! As long as tehy do not defile my immediate surroundings and come in contact with me or my family I couldn't care less!


So you're one of those people who wants to break up the country into little idealogical boxes and build a bunch of walls to keep people apart? You do that if you want, establish a sovereign nation in your living room for starters. Make the dog an ambassador, it'll be fun.


But when you start building walls, you make my life more difficult, so I won't allow it to happen. If it does happen, I certainly won't abide by your arbitrary limitations on movement. You're entitled to your personal space, no doubt, but this is a free country. People are free to live their lives, with or without your approval.

[edit on 18-6-2005 by WyrdeOne]

[edit on 18-6-2005 by WyrdeOne]



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 08:41 PM
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It's amazing how human beings have a knack for inventing more ways to dominate, hurt or punish those who are different...

I've read the entire "rules" of that camp and the expression "American Taleban" yet again comes to mind to describe people like this...


6. No television viewing, going to movies, or reading/watching/listening to secular media of any kind, anywhere within the client¹s and the parent¹s/guardian¹s control. This includes listening to classical or instrumental music that is not expressly Christian (Beethoven, Bach, etc. are not considered Christian).


Very close to what the Taleban prescribed in Pakistan, where owning music tapes or records was forbidden... it was said to distract the mind from the contemplation of God.


Women: In addition to these guidelines, women may also wear skirts which fall at or below the knee.


Not quite Taleban, but it's pretty close to Pius XII's prescription on "modest clothing so as to not tempt men".


5. Refuge clients may only read materials approved by staff.


Yes, back to the good old 1940's, where men were men and women were submissive, and every good Catholic read what was approved only by the Church!

And that horrific quote from Love in Action, saying that they'd rather the youths in their care commit suicide than leave the camp!


To IAF and Mojo... if Jesus Christ were here, he would storm that camp like he stormed the market at the Temple.



posted on Jun, 19 2005 @ 12:20 AM
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iori, it seems you have me confused with odium. I have been the least bit derrogatory in my discussion. You seem to be biased yourself. For that matter, EVERYTHING is tinged with bias...not matter the angle; take your side.

We are not dogs...we are not apes...we are not fish...we are not giraffes. If you believe that our actions are beyond reproach because an animal acts in a similar manner, by all means, fling your feces at the chimps.

As for my links, are you denying that these events happened? The Pink Angels
incident was criminal. These people were merely protesting and quoting Bible verses. I thought we were allowed this freedom in this country. Am I wrong? Don't the gays frequently protest?

So, what HAVEN'T I answered of odium...or anyone addressing me for that matter? If I missed something, I would be more than willing to address the issue. If you wish to join the fray, by all means do.



posted on Jun, 19 2005 @ 12:31 AM
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Originally posted by Otts

6. No television viewing, going to movies, or reading/watching/listening to secular media of any kind, anywhere within the client¹s and the parent¹s/guardian¹s control. This includes listening to classical or instrumental music that is not expressly Christian (Beethoven, Bach, etc. are not considered Christian).



Beethoven & Bach, ah yes, devil music I tell you .......... DEVIL MUSIC !!!!

I am curious if this boys parents read these rules - I mean READ THEM (ie: no skimming) or if they just shoved him in there.
I mean hell, classical music is the most mentally POSITIVE stimulating music there is. Grand-daughter here has it every nite to go to sleep with. Crap, guess the grand-daughter is possesed now.

Can the dude pee? Or is there a rule about that?

Jeez, fundies, head so far up the wazoo they have NO CLUE there is a real damn world out here, it's easier to make like it does not exist (don't wanna hear it, been there done that LIVED IT!)

Misfit



posted on Jun, 19 2005 @ 12:58 AM
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Anything that will happen whether Zach is cured or not, is what happened in "A Clockwork Orange": He will overcome his "disorder" but others will not forget and will continue to persecute him. The religious right is so #ed up that they forget their own message. You are to choose the path of God willingly. As a Roman Catholic, I am slow to forget the attrocities commited in South America and in the Iberian with the Reconquista. Forced "conversion" only proves that those who flaunt their faith are the true corrupted.


IBM

posted on Jun, 19 2005 @ 01:21 AM
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His parents did the right thing. Some parents send thier kids to fat camp for them to lose weight which is healthy. Being gay is unhealty to life, because there is a higher chance of contracting HIV. It is in Zacks best intersest this program. He will thank his parents when he is older.



posted on Jun, 19 2005 @ 01:36 AM
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Originally posted by IBM
His parents did the right thing. Some parents send thier kids to fat camp for them to lose weight which is healthy.


That is a piss-poor excuse for an analogy. You think fat kids LIKE being fat? This Zach had no problem with himself .... EVERYONE ELSE DID!! Not to mention, have you went to the site and read all about it, read the protocols, the outlines of doctrine, the rules fit for Alcatraz?



Being gay is unhealty to life, because there is a higher chance of contracting HIV.

Donno where you've been for the last decade or two, but its UNSAFE SEX raising those odds. Damn!!



It is in Zacks best intersest this program.

ZACH'S best interest is to BE GAY !! It is the parents who can't deal with his life, their little jr not growing up to be a god-boy like they planned. Mabe they should go to reform camp instead.



He will thank his parents when he is older.

He may hate them.

Misfit


IBM

posted on Jun, 19 2005 @ 02:28 AM
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Misfit, my facts are in order, gay men have the highest chance of contracting the HIV virus. You can find the statistics on the CDC.gov website.



posted on Jun, 19 2005 @ 03:01 AM
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Originally posted by IBM
Misfit, my facts are in order, gay men have the highest chance of contracting the HIV virus. You can find the statistics on the CDC.gov website.


I'm not about to trapse thru that sites links trying to find one percentage factor.

You made the statement that gays have a higher chance of contracting HIV - as with any statement of such, commonplace of this site dictates that the poster provide the source.

Don't go with my "unsafe sex" comment to nullify this - common sense tells one that no rubber = higher chance.

Not to worry, I'm not one to not "want" to see a fact, just not going to rumage thru the clusterfuk of links of that site to find what you should have included to back up your statement.

You might want to include, for relevancy, their findings of the same scenario, only not related to sexual genre, but related to use/non-use of preventitive measures.

Misfit



posted on Jun, 19 2005 @ 07:33 AM
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Originally posted by IBM
Misfit, my facts are in order, gay men have the highest chance of contracting the HIV virus. You can find the statistics on the CDC.gov website.


Actually black males are more likely to get AIDs then any other group. Already posted the statistics.



posted on Jun, 19 2005 @ 09:27 AM
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Originally posted by BadMojo
Homosexuality is immoral...nuff said.


Bah!!! can you explain why? or you are just another zealot?



posted on Jun, 19 2005 @ 09:32 AM
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Originally posted by BadMojo
I think it is sick for people to say it is "ok" to be gay. Our society as a whole has degenerated as far as to say it is alright to go against natural order. Homosexuality is contradictory to nature.


Our society has not degenerated more than the past. In fact, people were acting much more animalistic in the past.



As it has been said before, "God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve."


And who made gays? Wasn't God that made them?

And why two "Christian" parents are not blamed for raising a homosexual child? after all, according to the Bible, the children are being punished for sins of their parents.



posted on Jun, 19 2005 @ 09:36 AM
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Originally posted by BadMojo
Murdering is immoral.


Murdeing is immoral because it violates the right of a person to live. Homosexuality does not violate any rights, it only affects the person that does it.

We are getting crazy by the day, as a society. The time we again burn witches is not far!



posted on Jun, 19 2005 @ 09:41 AM
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Originally posted by grover
What part of "Judge not lest ye be judged" don't these damn fool funnymentalists understand? I swear if I were the Son of God and I had these damned scantimonious, self-righteous, judgemental, hypocritical repugnican idiots calling themselves my followers, I would put off returning as long as possible. Hell, I would just turn the whole lot of em over to Luicfer and let him deal with em.


Man, you are so right! if Jesus was around, he would certainly piss off those "followers".



posted on Jun, 19 2005 @ 09:49 AM
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Originally posted by BadMojo
I believe chanteuse was referring to Babylon, Greece, Medo-Persia, Rome...global dominant civilizations. But, of course, odium wouldn't recognize that. Not until sexual deviance was the "order of the day" did these emipires fall.


That's a damn lie. Greece at its prime (5th century before Christ, the golden era of Pericleus) was open to homosexuality as it is evident in writings and theatrical plays. There are also more more ancient (1200 - 1500 BC) artifacts with gay-loving scenes.

I am not gay, but I can't stand such discrimination. I had a friend who nearly commit suicide because of how society treated him.

BadMojo, no one gave you the right to play the judge. Since you believe in God, shouldn't you STFU and let God decide? what happened to "don't judge or else you will be judged"? (I know it is a rhetorical question - you direct your depression onto those that are easy to blame)



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