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NEWS: Schiavo Autopsy Clears Husband of Wrongdoing

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posted on Jun, 17 2005 @ 05:21 PM
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Originally posted by SMR
Would it not be best to 'let go' in a more humane way though?
Starving someone to death regardless of condition seems unethical regardless of relgion or belief.She was a human being despite being in her state.
I think 'lettting her go' could have been done medically, but thats just my opinion.


Not legally - that's the problem.

There are many ways her death could have been speeded up, but it's still illegal to (effectively) euthanise a human in that manner.

We'll do it to animals who are suffering...but not our human counterparts.

I'm not a big fan of the idea to start with - but yes, if we are to let patients die like this...then perhaps the least we can do is make it quick and painless.



SMR

posted on Jun, 17 2005 @ 06:33 PM
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Originally posted by Tinkleflower

Originally posted by SMR
Would it not be best to 'let go' in a more humane way though?
Starving someone to death regardless of condition seems unethical regardless of relgion or belief.She was a human being despite being in her state.
I think 'lettting her go' could have been done medically, but thats just my opinion.


Not legally - that's the problem.

There are many ways her death could have been speeded up, but it's still illegal to (effectively) euthanise a human in that manner.

We'll do it to animals who are suffering...but not our human counterparts.

I'm not a big fan of the idea to start with - but yes, if we are to let patients die like this...then perhaps the least we can do is make it quick and painless.


Agreed

I know she may have been suffering, perhaps not.We really dont know since all they could see were small reactions.Im just against doing what they did.I dont care what faith you have, to make a human starve to death so they die is just sick.Maybe they should look into Dr. Kevorkian's method after all.



posted on Jun, 17 2005 @ 06:45 PM
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I'm truly not being a twit here....but she didn't die from starvation. It was basically dehydration;

"she died of marked dehydration (a direct complication of the electrolyte disturbances brought about by the lack of hydration). The state of her fatty tissue and and laboratory findings indicate that she did not starve to death".

Full autopsy report here.

Regardless though - yes, it seems less than humane that we let people die this way.


SMR

posted on Jun, 17 2005 @ 07:00 PM
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Food, water, still starving in the same.Thanks for the report.
Number 8. looks odd to me.They say what she died from, but also list it as undetermined?

I think this case may have set some tone for those writing wills.I know I wont want to go this way and will state it!If there is no hope for me, ram a steak through my heart or give me an overdose of a good drug.



posted on Jun, 17 2005 @ 07:07 PM
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Originally posted by SMR
Food, water, still starving in the same.Thanks for the report.
Number 8. looks odd to me.They say what she died from, but also list it as undetermined?

I think this case may have set some tone for those writing wills.I know I wont want to go this way and will state it!If there is no hope for me, ram a steak through my heart or give me an overdose of a good drug.


Yeah, I know what you mean.

Now. The autopsy report.

There's a legal difference between the terms used; here's a simplification.

Cause of death:: The cause of death is the injury or disease that begins the process that leads to death.

Manner of death: The manner of death is the circumstance surrounding the death. Traditionally, the manner is classified as one of the following: homicide, suicide, accident, natural, or undetermined.

Mechanism of death: The Mechanism of death is the biochemical or physiologic abnormality resulting in death. Common mechanisms of sudden death include arrhythmias of the heart, shock, or exsanguinations (bleeding).

More info can be found right here

Hope this helps


SMR

posted on Jun, 17 2005 @ 07:23 PM
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They really seperate things rather than giving a simple answer

It almost is made to confuse so nobody really knows what they die from.

I think things like this need to be addressed in courts now.
Like rather than have a verbal agreement for this type of wish, that maybe people now need to go and be in front of an attorney and sign papers.This way we dont have people going through this again.



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 07:16 AM
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Originally posted by SMR
They really seperate things rather than giving a simple answer

It almost is made to confuse so nobody really knows what they die from.


LOL, yeah, I know it seems that way. But in all honesty, it actually simplifies things a lot (in terms of legal and medical stuff, anyhoo). Technically, we all die from heart failure, whether we have cancer, a gunshot wound, strangulation, obscure diseases, natural causes......but that would be totally unhelpful if there was only one space to write "cause of death".




I think things like this need to be addressed in courts now.
Like rather than have a verbal agreement for this type of wish, that maybe people now need to go and be in front of an attorney and sign papers.This way we dont have people going through this again.


I couldn't agree more. This is why we need to stand up, be proactive and get those Living Wills taken care of!

There are sites online where you can do this, and it's virtually hassle-free. Of course you've then got to get it all signed and notarized, but I suppose I'm trying to reassure folk that it's not complicated or intimidating.

Living Will

Advance Directive/Living
Will



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 02:48 PM
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Contrary to popular belief, Terri was NOT in a PVS.

There have been cases where people were in Terri's situation. They knew what was going on, but could not make their body respond, so it looked like they were just lying there doing nothing.

Why don't you guys do a Google search on the Scientology connection?



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 03:09 PM
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Amethyst,

Out of curiousity, were you able to look at the MRI images of Terri's brain?

With such a devastating injury, it's hard to imagine any awareness being present. The condition to which you're referring (Locked-In Syndrome) will not generally produce a flat EEG - Terri did produce a flat EEG on more than one occasion. To paraphrase from various medical texts, "Locked in Syndrome is a rare neurological condition in which a person cannot physically move any part of the body except the eyes. The person is conscious and able to think.." This last bit was highlighted to illustrate the EEG result; a flat EEG precludes this possibility.

There's an interview here with a doctor who did actually examine Terri (as opposed to the "Pro-family" doctors who didn't examine her but had an opinion anyway). Also on the site is an image of Terri's grossly abnormal brain scan.



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 05:18 PM
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Originally posted by Amethyst
Contrary to popular belief, Terri was NOT in a PVS.

There have been cases where people were in Terri's situation. They knew what was going on, but could not make their body respond, so it looked like they were just lying there doing nothing.

Why don't you guys do a Google search on the Scientology connection?


I'm sorry Amethyst -- what Scientology connection -- to the families or to the condition? Very tired today and need things spelled out exactly


But I agree with Tinkleflower -- I think if she had been "locked in" her scans, MRI, etc. would be normal where her's didn't show up as normal at all.



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 06:21 PM
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Originally posted by Amethyst
Contrary to popular belief, Terri was NOT in a PVS.



Yes she was in a PVS, that was based on facts not guesses.


An autopsy on Terri Schiavo backed her husband’s contention that she was in a persistent vegetative state, finding that she had massive and irreversible brain damage and was blind, the medical examiner’s office said Wednesday.

Schiavo autopsy



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 06:23 PM
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Originally posted by Amethyst
Contrary to popular belief, Terri was NOT in a PVS.


As Shots pointed out the Autopsy was quite clear on the matter. Funny, what is the next step in the villification of her husband?



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 06:32 PM
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Well since you asked what was next, here it is:



Gov. Jeb Bush asked a prosecutor Friday to investigate why Terri Schiavo collapsed 15 years ago, calling into question how long it took her husband to call 911 after he found her.

In a letter faxed to Pinellas-Pasco County State Attorney Bernie McCabe, Bush said Michael Schiavo testified in a 1992 medical malpractice trial that he found his wife collapsed at 5 a.m., and he said in a 2003 television interview that he found her about 4:30 a.m. He called 911 at 5:40 a.m.

"Between 40 and 70 minutes elapsed before the call was made, and I am aware of no explanation for the delay," Bush wrote. "In light of this new information, I urge you to take a fresh look at this case without any preconceptions as to the outcome."

Schiavo 911 call investigation



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 06:36 PM
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:shk: sad that's what this is, simply sad. Well, this whole mess pretty much kills old Jebs presidential asperations as far as I am concerned.



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 06:41 PM
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Originally posted by Duzey

Gov. Jeb Bush asked a prosecutor Friday to investigate why Terri Schiavo collapsed 15 years ago, calling into question how long it took her husband to call 911 after he found her.

In a letter faxed to Pinellas-Pasco County State Attorney Bernie McCabe, Bush said Michael Schiavo testified in a 1992 medical malpractice trial that he found his wife collapsed at 5 a.m., and he said in a 2003 television interview that he found her about 4:30 a.m. He called 911 at 5:40 a.m.

"Between 40 and 70 minutes elapsed before the call was made, and I am aware of no explanation for the delay," Bush wrote. "In light of this new information, I urge you to take a fresh look at this case without any preconceptions as to the outcome."

Schiavo 911 call investigation


of course it couldn't be that he (the husband) woke up from a sound sleep and didn't look at the time when he was trying to help his wife -- he was just estimating.

Jeb should just let this go -- it isn't going to help him in future elections.


[edit on 18-6-2005 by justme1640]



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 06:54 PM
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"In light of this new information, I urge you to take a fresh look at this case without any preconceptions as to the outcome."


Take a fresh look at the case without preconceptions as to the outcome. That's some good advice. Perhaps Jeb should try it himself?

Let it go.



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 07:01 PM
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Originally posted by Duzey

"Between 40 and 70 minutes elapsed before the call was made, and I am aware of no explanation for the delay," Bush wrote. "In light of this new information, I urge you to take a fresh look at this case without any preconceptions as to the outcome."

Schiavo 911 call investigation


So he is basing this on what he stated in a televison interview.............

What does the police report state that is all that counts!

I am with Fred on this Jeb just lost any possibilty of running for prez



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 07:02 PM
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Originally posted by Aelita
[
Grady, this has been beaten to death here on ATS, but let me ask -- if her brain was indeed fried as the autopsy suggests, doesn't this mean her life ended a long time ago?


Yes, Aelilta. The sad truth is that she was dead all those years ago when her brain was without oxygen for more than 10 minutes. They should never have revived her after so long.



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 07:04 PM
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Originally posted by Duzey


"In light of this new information, I urge you to take a fresh look at this case without any preconceptions as to the outcome."


Take a fresh look at the case without preconceptions as to the outcome. That's some good advice. Perhaps Jeb should try it himself?

Let it go.


I couldn't agree more.

Why - WHY?! - is this being allowed to continue?

Is he seriously going to try and gain some kind of criminal conviction based upon events which happened 15 years ago - which have no bearing on the outcome at all??

I'd be surprised if any court could come to any conclusion other than "Uh...so he might have gotten the time wrong....that doesn't exactly mean he killed her...isn't anyone else thinking the guy could have been in a highly emotional state at that point?!? More prone to not giving a toss about what time it was, considering he was more worried about his wife lying there?!."



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 07:31 PM
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Originally posted by Tinkleflower
Why - WHY?! - is this being allowed to continue?


Because the father/family is still ticked off because he/they did not get part of the money from the lawsuit. They will not let it die until then can get the husband convicted for some wrong doing thats why. Money after all is the root of all evil.



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