Permenant Magnet motor

Hi All,
Shortly I will attempt to build what is outlined here:

www.keelynet.com...

Basically it is a permenant magnet motor without any coils or anything. Looks pretty good from what I can tell. Anyone interested in building as well, and collaborating? Looks pretty inexpensive, and if you read some of the updates that the bottom, there are some ideas for making it easier to construct. Let me know what y'all think!

-P

You do realize that a magnet is similar to a battery in that it will loose its magnitism over use, just as a battery looses power over use. It is a great concept, but it will not run forever as touted.

Eh, are you sure? Why do they call them permenant magnets?

-P

Originally posted by Kidfinger
You do realize that a magnet is similar to a battery in that it will loose its magnitism over use, just as a battery looses power over use. It is a great concept, but it will not run forever as touted.

Originally posted by Kidfinger
You do realize that a magnet is similar to a battery in that it will loose its magnitism over use, just as a battery looses power over use. It is a great concept, but it will not run forever as touted.

www.science.ca...

Que no?

-P

Originally posted by postings
Eh, are you sure? Why do they call them permenant magnets?

-P

Originally posted by Kidfinger
You do realize that a magnet is similar to a battery in that it will loose its magnitism over use, just as a battery looses power over use. It is a great concept, but it will not run forever as touted.

They call them perminate magnets becasuse they retain there magnetisim much longer than other ferretic (magnetic) materials i.e. iron, copper, tin etc. but they are NOT perminate. The more you use them the more that there flux lines become less orginized and power decreases.

Although, the new NEOS (neoydium) NdFe are so powerfull that any use that they have a life expectancy way beyond the life of the motor that it is being used in, they are not perminate.

Originally posted by postings


www.science.ca...

Que no?

-P

Take a good look at that web sight before you start taking it for fact. It is a place where you can put anything you like for an answer to someone elses question. Magnets will not last forever. None will. It is all simple physics really. BTW, Permanent really doesnt exist as nothing in the universe is infinite except me

As far as the ND mag's go, Bill Gates would have a hard time affording a few of those.

Originally posted by Kidfinger

Originally posted by postings


www.science.ca...

Que no?

-P

Take a good look at that web sight before you start taking it for fact. It is a place where you can put anything you like for an answer to someone elses question. Magnets will not last forever. None will. It is all simple physics really. BTW, Permanent really doesnt exist as nothing in the universe is infinite except me

As far as the ND mag's go, Bill Gates would have a hard time affording a few of those.

for real man, I just spent $700 building a generator for a single wind turbine, but they are friggin powerfull

www.perendev-power.com...

Don't know if this is a scam or not, but I have been watching this for a couple of years. Evidently, you can buy one here to power your home. Sign me up if true.

I personally don't believe that the design on that website Postings linked to will be much good. There are permanent magnet motors in existence, but they all have some sort of electrical current that they need to produce useful work. From my schooling, I know that a mathematical proof has been developed that proves any motor powered solely by permanent magnets will not produce a net gain in work. But, you never know, mainstream science has been proven wrong before. (Planck, Einstein, Newton, Copernicus, Galileo, etc)

In any event, the device should be easy to build, and not very expensive, so the claims are easily verifiable.

That is my thinking. Kidfinger is correct too about the how well/long they last. I read elsewhere that permenant isn't actually permenant, but just REALLY long lasting depending on the type. In any case, replacing magnets doesn't seem that bad to me, especially for a demo unit.

BTW, the plans I saw don't actually require any kind of input energy to get it going, other than moving the North end of a magnet so that it is close to a wheel. You don't need to keep moving it back and forth evidently, and once it is there the wheel will begin spinning, and will speed up dramatically. The reason I am giving this idea more credit than others is because:

A) The guy states that you need to use iron filings to really see the lines of force, and therefore make appropriate judgements on how to place the magnets.
B) Because there are evidently patents out there for magnet motors (so we know they exist). Even if I have to replace magnets, it is still a TON better than the boring alternative.

Either way, I am going to build it. I may be wasting my time, but I think it would be worth it anyway. I plan on getting started in about a week or so.

-P

Originally posted by DragonsDemesne
In any event, the device should be easy to build, and not very expensive, so the claims are easily verifiable.

The instructions to build it were rather difficult to read and imagine as well, but from what a gathered, its more of a "perpetual motion" sort of thing that a motor of sort, and you most certainly cannot get power from nothing, thus even if it did power anything, it wouldnt for long, unless you put in as much as you would get back out, minus any friction. Even if its perpetual motion, any air friction will slow it, as well as normal friction, and misplaced magnets.

Look. Building a magnetic, near zero input motor is piss-easy. I have no idea why no one has marketed them yet. Just think about it logically. Most of the mag motors look more or less the same and go on the same theories.

Ok nothing lasts FOREVER. It may last for hundreds, thousands or millions of years but not forever. Perhaps even time may not last forever.

[edit on 16-6-2005 by Shadow88]

You cant take energy out of something if you dont put the same or more into it.
It just cant happen. Conservation of energy, its the Law.

The term of "motor" is somewhat misleading, as it doesnt power anything, but just spins for a very long time with no input.

Taint an issue of taking energy out of something. When youre dealing with magnetics (not electromagnetics) its not about energy its about forces. If set up magnets in a certain way they can spin indefinately, it is simply an issue of finding the most effective position of the magnets.

Yea its not technically a conventional motor, but the word motor comes from the word motion. While its spinning indefinately on a central axis you should probably fit a generator style thing connected to the out-sticking axis. This is the fairly crude example of a simple way to do this. I dont care if you want to act upon this or not, besides its a fairly costless experiment to do. So you dont need millions to construct a fairly simple prototype of it.

[edit on 16-6-2005 by Shadow88]

This isn't new.built one with a couple other students similar in design in the early 70s as a physics project.Worked ok but we found that the bhp was not sufficient enough to perform any usefull tasks beyond generating a low voltage currant with very few watts of power.Not 100% exactly the same but similar.It was fun though,i'd probably do it again if the opportunity arose.Remember to take into account the amount of power different tasks take when you size your components.

(after i come back from a 12 day holiday) I am working on a hoverboard project, AND a permanent magnet motor. Yes the tech obviously is simple enough to get a low voltage without much effort. The hard part is gaining maximum voltage, with the most powerful magnets, at the optimum angle of repulsion...etc......i will explain when its complete.....for now i cant really argue for it can I!

Can you give me some pics/drawings of the magnet motor you made Bargaindan? Just proof alone would be great and I have alot of rare earth magnets.

yea i sent some, (very quick) drawings through U2U about the tech, ill see if there on my ats uploads, otherwise i will get them off my other computer.

Additionally if you wait a while i will have VIDEO footage when i build a scale model, most likely hooked up to a voltmeter.

As far as the ND mag's go, Bill Gates would have a hard time affording a few of those.

Actually, they are reasonably priced...
stores.ebay.co.uk...
and available in a number of forms/sizes.
As to the concept, I would think it might work although efficiency would be reduced by the friction of the rolling magnet, the friction of the bearings etc. (magnetic bearings have been spun to *if memory serves* 66,000 rpm and took something like 8.5 hours to spin down)
As to the permanence, this type of model would be a good place to R&D but an electro magnet would (theoretically) last forever. The thing that limits this design is the rotational axis needing to be on a shaft that needs to be braced by some sort of supporting mechanism (as in the plexiglass plates that hold the bearings, the shaft, ...and then the generator would cause friction as well since it needs to be "driven" It would be a trade-off but perhaps there is a balance there somewhere whereby you would get more out than you put in.) Feeding/chasing itself is at the heart of perpetual motion though.
If you "floated" the wheel in a suspension field...

Can't help but feel for all them wheel-less hamsters out there

Conservation of energy, its the Law

It's a dogma all new discoveries have faced. Laws were broken as understanding increased.
Go with your dreams guys, don't be shackled just because it has been written that it ain't so. We don't know everything (contrary to what science tells us)
Call it pseudo-science if you will, there is a hyper-dimensional physics at work here that relatively few understand... and many more disagree with. It is an entirely new realm of thinking.