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Conservative NC Republican Calls For Withdrawel From Iraq

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posted on Jun, 12 2005 @ 03:36 PM
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Originally posted by djohnsto77
.there are some good Democrats I admit, like Zell Miller.








You are kidding me right? That racist lunatic?!





posted on Jun, 12 2005 @ 03:37 PM
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Originally posted by Kidfinger
I just thought of something. What if Ann lipservice C is actually reffering to the Neocons who use to be Democrates but were ostensibly ran out of the party for bieng fringist, when talking about the few 'bad Republ;cans'?


But then you'd have to actually consider them to be Republicans!!!

NEVER!




posted on Jun, 12 2005 @ 03:38 PM
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Originally posted by Kidfinger

Originally posted by djohnsto77
.there are some good Democrats I admit, like Zell Miller.








You are kidding me right? That racist lunatic?!



What he said!!!!



posted on Jun, 12 2005 @ 03:51 PM
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Originally posted by EastCoastKid
What I want to know is how many other conservatives here who supported the war have come to change their minds on this. And why.

Is the silence here due to the fact that people are just so stubborn that they refuse to acknowledge when they are wrong?

Changing one's mind is NOT weakness. It's quite the opposite.


Funny, I remember having several heated discussion with you regarding the War on Iraq. I was hell bent over it. I was one of the armchair warriors that preached about the war's rightousness daily.

Look at my last 5 months of posts and you wont see one Iraq post. If that isnt indication of my (and MANY other's) views, then I don't know what is.

Alot of us "warmongers" simply took in the facts (*or lack thereof*) and inserted our foots into our mouths.



posted on Jun, 12 2005 @ 03:54 PM
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Originally posted by QuietSoul

Originally posted by EastCoastKid
What I want to know is how many other conservatives here who supported the war have come to change their minds on this. And why.

Is the silence here due to the fact that people are just so stubborn that they refuse to acknowledge when they are wrong?

Changing one's mind is NOT weakness. It's quite the opposite.


Funny, I remember having several heated discussion with you regarding the War on Iraq. I was hell bent over it. I was one of the armchair warriors that preached about the war's rightousness daily.

Look at my last 5 months of posts and you wont see one Iraq post. If that isnt indication of my (and MANY other's) views, then I don't know what is.

Alot of us "warmongers" simply took in the facts (*or lack thereof*) and inserted our foots into our mouths.


I applaud you for your willingness to say that. It takes integrity.



posted on Jun, 12 2005 @ 03:55 PM
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Originally posted by EastCoastKid

Originally posted by Kidfinger


DJ, why are there no good Democrates? Im a regestered Dem. I have a young daughter and a stable marriage. I go to school and work during the day. I attempt to live a life that is kind and respectfull to others. What is not good about that?


That's pure rhetorical bunk. As a former fire-breathing conservative Republican I will just point to you as a good example of how ignorant such talk it. There are some Republicans out there who are as slimy as they come. Evil does not reside in one party or another. It lies in the heart of man.


So true. I used to claim I was slightly to the right of Atella the Hun, and that Kahn was a bleeding heart liberal. Man times have changed. Not that I still don't consider myself a capitalist. I have always thought of the economic system as being like a shell over top of our lives and that while a capitalist system doesn't help everyone, it helps the most people, most of the time, andis a more fair way of governing the economy. I still agree with that, however how the political system is now, the larger the copreration is the larger the pull in parliment and thus, the more the direction of the country goes towards the interests of large multinationals that have no real stake in the actual area they reside or do business in.

I have always wondered why there isn't more of a call to treat multinational corperations more like a seperate country, because in actualaity they are.IMO.



posted on Jun, 12 2005 @ 04:08 PM
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Originally posted by QuietSoul

Look at my last 5 months of posts and you wont see one Iraq post. If that isnt indication of my (and MANY other's) views, then I don't know what is.

Alot of us "warmongers" simply took in the facts (*or lack thereof*) and inserted our foots into our mouths.


QS, its nice to hear that from someone who was 'hell bent' towards the war. Admittance of the truth is in no way an inferior trait.


You have voted QuietSoul for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have two more votes this month.


I always like to see someone in their most honest light



posted on Jun, 12 2005 @ 04:13 PM
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Originally posted by Passer By
So true. I used to claim I was slightly to the right of Atella the Hun, and that Kahn was a bleeding heart liberal. Man times have changed. Not that I still don't consider myself a capitalist.


I have always supported Capitalism. I believe its the best way. Is it the fairest? That's debatable. In this day and age, in a capitalist society, anyone can go as far as their talents and abilities will take them.

Does that mean you have to support an unecessary war of profit and regional dominance? Absolutely not!

This nation seems to have lost its moral compass since 9-11. I guess that's what the desire for vengeance will do to humans.



posted on Jun, 12 2005 @ 04:14 PM
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posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 10:39 PM
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I am not very happy about this news. It's definitely bad news.

The war in Iraq and the entire big picture has become one big joke. It's absolutely pathetic. How ignorant do we have to continue to be before we get ourselves together? Does this stupid Congressman think that all he has to do is apologize and have the president withdraw from Iraq and everything will be okay again? That all our problems will just go away? That we can start over again and our nation will be great once again? The problem with our government and this entire country is that so many of us take war lightly. We don't take it seriously. It's a joke to us. All of a sudden, when things go south, even the most vehement supporters of war decides to take the other route? And he thinks things can change for the better? He thinks France will forgive him for advocating Freedom Fries? He's wrong! It won't change for the better. The moment we withdraw from Iraq, we will be facing an entirely new world of problems, critical problems, and we will pay an astronomical price for that. You think the world hates America right now? Just wait until we prematurely withdraw from iraq.

What ever happened to that ridiculous "deliver freedom and democracy" rhetoric? Whatever happened to "complete the mission?" Have even the people who supported this awful measure proven their stupidity by showing the whole thing was a joke and a lie? Have they proven without a shadow of a doubt (not that it wasn't obvious) that they really don't give a s**t about the rest of the world, like they CLAIM they do? Have they really lost their minds to think that withdrawing is a victory, when it is actually the worst of losses? Have they finally proven they don't support our soldiers in Iraq, who have given all they have so that Iraq, at least in their own minds, would be a better place to live?

War is death and destruction. You can rebuild cities, but you can never rebuild lives. People like this Congressman are traitors to this country. When the supporters of drastic measures such as this give up, it's not a good thing. It's a sign something went terribly wrong. If they don't like what is happening, they should've thought about it the first time around, BEFORE they went with it. Now they know how it is and because of them, it is the Americans that will pay the price for their actions.



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 11:28 PM
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ECK, there is no quagmire, that I am being told about. From what I am hearing, things are getting better there all the time. The folks I know who have been and are involved in-country are dismayed at the way the press ignores all the progress being made. It doesn't surprise me, death sells, as well as do men biting dogs.

Regardless, I want us out of there as soon as possible, but without risking the collapse of the nation into chaos, which is what the "insurgents" are trying to do to Iraq.

Surely, that isn't too much to ask, is it? As a matter of fact, that is exactly what should be expected of a civilized country, especially a country that has a history of doing exactly that. See, this way, Iraq can join the ranks of the other nations we've helped who now spit on us every chance they get! I wouldn't want them to lose their right to do that, would you?



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 11:42 PM
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TC, you seem like a fairly balanced guy. Why are the insurgent's there? In Iraq I mean. Are they naturalized Iraqi citizens or did they go there to fight the western, as they see it, invaders?

If it is the first one, by definition they are freedom fighters and not insurgents, not to mention a completely internal matter now.

If it is the second, then doesn't it follow that if they went there to battle America, when America is gone....

The rational doesn't seem sound to me.



posted on Jun, 14 2005 @ 12:14 AM
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Sooner or later, we're going to have to pull out.

Despite all the happy talk, we're two years and 1700 American lives (and nobody knows how many Iraqi lives) into this thing, with no end in sight. Iraq is still in chaos, with massive unemployment, unreliable power and water supplies, and terrorist attacks on a daily basis.

If the recent rumors of talks between some of the more moderate insurgents and the Iraqi .gov are true, we may see an end to a big chunk of the insurgency, but the fanatics are the ones doing the mass casualty attacks against Iraqis, and that wont stop till the US leaves, if then.

We should have never gone in in the first place, and that's becoming clear even to a lot of the people that supported it initially.



posted on Jun, 14 2005 @ 12:49 AM
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1700 people..... for lies?

Man, how does America sleep at night knowing he is still in charge - or worse, he might have been the better chioce
, or worse, there really was no chioce



posted on Jun, 14 2005 @ 08:33 AM
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Originally posted by sweatmonicaIdo
The war in Iraq and the entire big picture has become one big joke. It's absolutely pathetic. How ignorant do we have to continue to be before we get ourselves together? Does this stupid Congressman think that all he has to do is apologize and have the president withdraw from Iraq and everything will be okay again? That all our problems will just go away? That we can start over again and our nation will be great once again? The problem with our government and this entire country is that so many of us take war lightly. We don't take it seriously. It's a joke to us. All of a sudden, when things go south, even the most vehement supporters of war decides to take the other route? And he thinks things can change for the better? He thinks France will forgive him for advocating Freedom Fries? He's wrong! It won't change for the better. The moment we withdraw from Iraq, we will be facing an entirely new world of problems, critical problems, and we will pay an astronomical price for that. You think the world hates America right now? Just wait until we prematurely withdraw from iraq.


To be fair, people make mistakes and people change their minds. None of us are immune. And I understand your complete aggrivation/frustration. Trust me. I opposed the invasion from the git-go for very solid reasons. YOu have no idea how frustrating it was for me to see them go ahead with it, and to go ahead with it all WRONG.


These folks in this administration havn't listened to ANYBODY outside of their own echo chamber. Many people have died and been maimed for life unecessarily because it. YOu have NO idea, as a vet, how furious that makes me.

No body is leaving Iraq.. at least not in the foreseeable future. Actually, probably not in your lifetime. Even talk of phased withdrawel is utopian right now. Let's remember the Neo Con agenda. It is they who are in charge. And THEY have plans for Iraq.

Congressman Jones has seen the light, and the error of his ways. He has confessed it and now is seeking a way to lessen our forces there, without abandoning the mission and with honor. I applaud his honesty, at least now; however late. If more of his colleagues would be honest with themselves maybe, just maybe they would do their job for once and MAKE this administration do right by our men and women in uniform.



posted on Jun, 14 2005 @ 09:27 AM
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- He toed the party line at the detriment of his constituents ( NC & Military bases - perfect together )

- He was one of the soudbyte idiots so plentiful in the Republican party that pushed forward abject jingoism as the grand distraction for the corporate imperialism of PNAC

- he now plays that role again by adding to the 24 hour news cycle a plausible denial-ability to a cut & run cover, since the monumental theft of US taxpayer funds in the Afgan & Iraqi campaigns is starting to come to light

- He's in the Legislative body at the Fed level - if he's sincere, let him draft papers of impeachment for what he's acknowledged as false information. Let him draft a plan & put it up for vote. Let him do something, anything that's real, to add legitimacy to his mia culpa reappraisail

Until then, it's just another Republian crying at the pulpit to the TV audience.

As for one of my favorite Zen Masters of Cognitive Dissonance......

"Death Sells, Good things not reported" is to noteworthy amidst a complete clusterf**k AS a .50 Caliber chest wound is fixable with Neosporin!



posted on Jun, 14 2005 @ 09:42 AM
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Originally posted by Bout Time
- He's in the Legislative body at the Fed level - if he's sincere, let him draft papers of impeachment for what he's acknowledged as false information. Let him draft a plan & put it up for vote. Let him do something, anything that's real, to add legitimacy to his mia culpa reappraisail


So he should.


Unfortunately, the strange thing about an impending trial of our "leader..." Me thinx Osama would stage "his" return, should this course be taken.



posted on Jun, 14 2005 @ 09:59 AM
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The insurgents you refer to are freedom fighters. They will take control over Iraq the minute we pull out whether it is today or 10 years from now. Arabs want a theocracy and/or a Dictatorship. Isn’t it a bit obvious by now? To them that is freedom.



posted on Jun, 14 2005 @ 10:18 AM
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If it wasn't only a year until the senate elections, R-NC, would never of 'changed his mind'. Since the liberal and far-left have had alot of exposure he obviously feels threathend. He knows that we can not leave Iraq until the job is done and he's only playing to the liberal crowd for extra votes.

What happened to the days when a politician actually stayed with their veiws and didn't, no matter how unpopular, didn't pander to the masses to just get re-elected.

I think its also very funny on how Zell Miller was 'well liked' by democrats and liberals until he told people how the democratic party has lost it way and supported George Bush over Kerry....now he's labeled, as liberals generally do, as a racist. Get a life libs.



posted on Jun, 14 2005 @ 11:04 AM
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Originally posted by ferretman
He knows that we can not leave Iraq until the job is done and he's only playing to the liberal crowd for extra votes.


You're talking about NORTH CAROLINA. It's a RED state, minus a few blue-ish areas. One of the biggest MILITARY states. His constituents (that he is finally listening to) are largely Republican.


What happened to the days when a politician actually stayed with their veiws and didn't, no matter how unpopular, didn't pander to the masses to just get re-elected.


If someone refuses to change his views in light of facts made new to him, he is unworthy to hold office. As he said, his lawmaker father taught him to 1. go with his conscience 2. go with his constituents 3. go with his party. The man changed his mind. Is it late? Yes. Is that bad? NO. Not when it involved our men and women in uniform and what is best for them. BETTER LATE THAN NEVER.


I think its also very funny on how Zell Miller was 'well liked' by democrats and liberals until he told people how the democratic party has lost it way and supported George Bush over Kerry....now he's labeled, as liberals generally do, as a racist. Get a life libs.


I'm a Republican. Miller is a FRUITCAKE who has lost his way.


[edit on 6/14/05 by EastCoastKid]




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