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The Mind Dimension

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posted on Jun, 16 2005 @ 05:41 PM
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Wait a second, who said that anyone who tells you the meaning of a dream with certainty is full of baloney?


And I cannot remember any dreams, sorry. Perhaps I've been this way a little
too...long..




posted on Jun, 16 2005 @ 05:52 PM
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Originally posted by Raideur
Wait a second, who said that anyone who tells you the meaning of a dream with certainty is full of baloney?


And I cannot remember any dreams, sorry. Perhaps I've been this way a little
too...long..


Actually noone did...I was just answering MemoryShock's inquiry...
...

So, Raideur you don't remember any dreams at all...not even a Daydream?

May I ask you what had happened (good or bad) that led you to the person that you are Now...?



posted on Jun, 16 2005 @ 05:55 PM
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Oddly enough, I do not daydream about anything. Someone is going to call a BS on that remark, but I really do not. I either read odd pages in a book, or look for something to focus on during harsh periods. No "daydreaming."

If this clears up anything, I am a very deep sleeper.



posted on Jun, 16 2005 @ 06:34 PM
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Originally posted by mwen
According this book, "The Healers Handbook: A Journey Into Hyperspace"
under the Dream Dictionary section, on page 137, the mind pattern for Tooth or Teeth: Adjustment to life...


Interesting.......teeth representing significant life stress points or dilemmas was the thought I was given years ago........I hold it neutral as well, though that it was given as an explanation makes it relevant in that I have that association and am stuck with it.........though dreaming of teeth falling out due to literal concern over cavity issues is a thought as well.........

Raideur.......can I suggest an experiment to you..........before you go to sleep, think heavily about dreams and all the various aspects of it......be determined to remember them....I want to emphasize that point.........then report what you find hear. It's okay if it takes a few days...........



posted on Jun, 17 2005 @ 02:14 AM
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For some one such as Raideur I would suspect it would take weeks, if not months, of serious, daily effort, to gain any significant Dream retention.

As many nights as possible, think about Dreams and remembering them for a moment. Every morning write down something.

It would be nice if you would R, spend a couple of months, and then tell us how unimportant Dreams are. I really do see them as essential to a rich, full life, one where emotions add spice to whatever we do.


A.T
(-)


[edit on 6/17/05 by Alexander Tau]



posted on Jun, 17 2005 @ 02:40 PM
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Why, MemoryShock, you are in incredible luck as last night, I was awaken by a flash of lightning, which I do not enjoy, combined with pre-college prep worries, and while attempting to fall asleep, I heard the sound of a squirril above my head. Now, these pests were thought to have been lured to their doom by peanut-butter long ago, but obviously one remained. However, while not asleep, I now remember going into the closet to find the furry beast attacking my hand. However, I remember nothing else. Im fairly sure I didnt get assualted by any rodents last night, so it seems I "dreamed" it....even though I thought I was awake.

This is most unusual, as you could fire grenades into my room without waking me. I assure you it will not happen again, and thus, I will fall into a deep sleep once again, bypassing any fantasy dreams.

For the record, I do not like little rodents.



posted on Jun, 17 2005 @ 02:48 PM
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Originally posted by Raideur
...so it seems I "dreamed" it....even though I thought I was awake.

This is most unusual, as you could fire grenades into my room without waking me. I assure you it will not happen again, and thus, I will fall into a deep sleep once again, bypassing any fantasy dreams.


Power of suggestion........really, there is alot you can get out of dreams.......but it's your choice.......we've just established that you can......where you go from here is up to you.......



posted on Jun, 17 2005 @ 03:05 PM
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Im going to directly to sleep, and Im not passing dreamworld on the way there.

Perhaps I really did have a close encounter with a bushy tailed varmit, and simply forgot where I placed his body.



posted on Jun, 20 2005 @ 03:44 AM
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You certainly make for an interesting case study Raideur.

Interesting for me because when I was your age I was just like you. Science was my religion and I scoffed at all the religious wackos I met. I was lucky enough to pretty much totally escape any religious training when I was young. I went to Sunday School twice, asked some questions they did not like (I think I was all of 7 at the time) and did not enjoy the experience. I think my mother was sad when I said I did not wish to return but she was always good about listening to me and did not force the issue.
And yes I realize how lucky I was, few people have parents like mine.

I am guessing you are young because of some of the comments you have made about College and a couple of other things. But the funny part is that when I first encountered your posts I thought you were some sad old man who was lonely and angry at the World for not providing a wife or other things that everyone assumes will be part of their life.

I do not belittle young people, in fact I find their open-mindedness to be inspiring. I can honestly say that I have never taught anyone that I did not learn from, and with young people that is even more true.

The nature of the Universe is Infinite, anyone with any wisdom at all knows that no matter what they, or we as a collective, have learned, we really know nothing at all on the Universal scale. Any finite thing on an Infinite scale is the same as Zero.

I am sure you acknowledge that we will learn all sorts of new things in the next 100 years. But what about the next 1,000, or 100,000? Think about where we were 1,000 years ago, can we even begin to know where we will be in another 1,000?

People know this, they laugh at the people of old when references to the Earth being flat are mentioned. And then they go and do the same thing themselves when it comes to some other thing that is yet unproven.

I do not believe in the paranormal, I do not think there is any such thing, what there is are things we have YET to explain. The real danger is being so arrogant to think that what we know today in any way allows us to say what cannot be. Science can tell us what can work, and it does of course.

You are a bright guy, anyone can see that. Guess what, so am I. Did you learn young not to be the first to turn in a test? Did you learn that correcting the teacher in front of the class does not earn you any friends? I learned both very young and it helped me get through a lot.

You know what the difference between you and me is? Experience, plain and simple. You think that this is all we are, flesh, blood, chemicals, I know we are more. I know this because of direct person experience.

I hope that 10 years from now we meet again. It will be interesting to see what you have experienced in that time. And I will predict that instead of mocking you will have questions.


A.T
(-)



posted on Jun, 21 2005 @ 03:23 PM
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Thats surprisingly accurate.....

Perhaps I do not like confusion.
The world seems to be a confusing place, with mountains of knowledge and answerless questions. Even more are people who are themselves far too deep.

The majority of the world, however, is entirely understandable through simply reason and stoic observation. This includes people to a degree. However, that seems to be a unknowing comfort zone of being aware of why everything occurs. The glass moved because something hit it. People do stupid things for attention. No need to wonder. However, the mind just continues to disrupt my system. People who just live on the fly and dont even feel the need to understand anything. How can they deal with events if they dont understand them? How can someone live on emotions and faith if they have no way to rationalize anything.

It is the most difficult thing to explain. I cannot handle questions without answers. Even more disturbing are questions or doubts of logic from within.....

One particular oddity is becoming involved in a group and simply "having fun" or going along. Then an almost "paranormal" sense of rationalism will occur, and suddenly, you can take an objective look and realize you are doing something totally stupid or absurd. You feel the need to moniter yourself and catch yourself before you lose your concious understanding of your surroundings.

Several people I've spoken to say "oh just enjoy it and dont think so much," but obviously I cannot.

No one likes a person like that now do they? The stick in the mud who cant express himself. Perhaps, but there is a certain feeling, perhaps a inferiority complex, about being in total control of ones self.

Perhaps this is why hypnosis and dreams just make me all the more disturbed. The idea of not being able to "realize" what is happening is probably more of a phobia than I am aware of. Especially hypnosis.....

Just thinking about shows of other people under hypnosis will eat at me for weeks. Some people would probably find it odd that someone could be so utterly obessed with keeping his sanity and control that he would knowingly cut off everything that is evenly remotely "preoccupying.

Perhaps those people who think less do enjoy life more.



posted on Jun, 21 2005 @ 03:52 PM
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Originally posted by Raideur
Several people I've spoken to say "oh just enjoy it and dont think so much," but obviously I cannot.


i had the same. everything had to be logical and couldn't stop thinking. but because i kept on thinking i didn't stop to feel and actually live and see that there is more. a lot science cannot proof yet.

in the past there were people with "religious" experiences that science couldn't proof yet, but that can be proven today. paranormal is the same way. due to experience a lot of us know it's there and eventually science will catch up and proof that all we see is there. it just takes time...a lot of it.

but i'm not the kind of guy that waits for science to catch up. i'm one that teaches himself and then when science can proof it i'll teach people to use it and share all my knowledge.



posted on Jun, 21 2005 @ 03:57 PM
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Welp different points of views are always good. I can luckily say my life philosophy is basically I care as little as I can about things, I don't let anything get to me and being spontaneous is key. Life is to short to overanalyze everything.. ok well we have drifted quite a bit from the original topic so i'm not sure what i'm even talking about but yes that is my 2 cents.



posted on Jun, 21 2005 @ 04:10 PM
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Originally posted by Raideur
Perhaps this is why hypnosis and dreams just make me all the more disturbed. The idea of not being able to "realize" what is happening is probably more of a phobia than I am aware of. Especially hypnosis.....


But they are real, and stating that they aren't to satisfy your worldview isn't the most rational way of going about it.......their is alot of literature on the subjects(not as much as I would like, seeing as it's 'majic of the higher orders') but getting past the initial discomforts is key.......a good place to start would be neurophysiology......understand how the mind physically and chemically interacts and manifests the bodies experience into an inclination, or preference......if thought is physically traceable along a synaptic tree, then wouldn't it be rational to think that control over dreams and other 'trance-like'states is possible, given that all neurons are implicitely connected?..........

The answers are there, padawan, you just need to know where to start looking for answers.........



Originally posted by xxblackoctoberxx
Life is to short to overanalyze everything..


1) Life is the longest thing you can ever do........

and

2) depends on what your drive is.......scientists and scholars enjoy the quest for knowledge and explanation.......then there are others who enjoy the experience of social interaction.......really just depends on what you want out of life.........


[edit on 21-6-2005 by MemoryShock]



posted on Jun, 21 2005 @ 04:15 PM
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Its quite a strange feeling to be doing something like a game, and realize, very quickly and suddenly, "what am I doing? This is ridiculous"

Also quite the same with urges and desires. Better to repress those and remain fully aware.



posted on Jun, 21 2005 @ 04:20 PM
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how about letting it all out and experiencing them fully and increasing your awareness? emotions no matter what type are there to aid you. but they're not easy to master and control. not even i mastered them and i'm not called a universal mage because i enjoy picking my nose so often



posted on Jun, 21 2005 @ 04:28 PM
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Originally posted by MemoryShock


Originally posted by xxblackoctoberxx
Life is to short to overanalyze everything..


1) Life is the longest thing you can ever do........

and

2) depends on what your drive is.......scientists and scholars enjoy the quest for knowledge and explanation.......then there are others who enjoy the experience of social interaction.......really just depends on what you want out of life.........



Ha yes you are right. I worded that wrong. I meant, doing things in life, like the small things, are not going to matter in the end. Even if you invent something that can change many lives, say a cure for cancer. In the end you will die and it will not matter for you. That sounds pretty selfish but its true. But then again it all depends on what you believe in.



posted on Jun, 21 2005 @ 05:53 PM
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Some of us cannot "just live life."

True, I examine everything, and everybody far too much, and my mind toils with questions I will never have the answer to, but would I want to be blissfully unconcerned? Would I rather be loving than being rational?

No. Knowledge is strenght. It is the only thing that allows you to justify the world. I am content with knowing the entire world works on logical, predictable events. And as much as I hate it, I know I wont ever understand the mind, but I can at least reject those parts I do not understand within my own thoughts.



posted on Jun, 21 2005 @ 10:19 PM
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I cannot tell you how happy I am we have found some common ground Raideur. Now perhaps we can build upon that.


BlackOctober,

Actually we are right on topic, the study of the Dimension of Mind has to be made by ourselves, with ourselves as both topic and investigator. This is both the easiest and the hardest thing possible. To me that makes it highly rewarding.

How is it easy? We are with ourselves 24/7 what else can we study in such a comprehensive fashion.

Why is it hard? Because objectivity when it comes to one's self is possibly the most difficult thing one can hope to achieve.

A Challenge no?

You cannot study something if you allow your study to affect that thing too much. It then becomes something other than what it is in it's natural state. So unless you wish to study the effects of study you have a bit of a problem to overcome. I have found that it is vital to remain true to what I think and feel but at the same time I wish to observe those things and understand what drives them.


Raideur,

We share so much more than either of us has realized up til now. My passion to understand everything has driven me for my entire life. The feeling that if I did not understand I was not in control was a real problem until I confronted it head on.

We must learn to live with the unknown, to embrace it even, if we are indeed to ever escape these feelings. The more I tried for control the less of it I seemed to have, there was always something beyond me and that was both frustrating and scary. I learned one thing, and then knew of 10 more things that I now knew I did not know about.

(Aside: Everyone, I am trying very hard to be clear here, but the subject does not make it easy. If something does not make sense after a couple of readings please ask even if it is what seems like a minor point.)

I found that it was my need for the Illusion of total control that was the problem. Simple logic told me that I can never know everything, I can never control everything, it will never... be... possible... So my longing for control was my problem. From an objective point of view (expressed to me many times by others but I would not listen) compared to most people I not only knew more but I had more control.

Others looked at me as a model of how one can decide their own fate, and yet I felt my control was limited at best.

Turns out, they were right. And if you think that was not a bitter pill to take then you just have not been paying attention.

By the simple act of accepting that I could never have perfect knowledge or total control I was freed from the very things that limited me. I feel that since that time I have attained a level of understanding and a control over my own life that most would envy.

Logic, finite ideas, can never encompass the Universe, they will always fall short. To really understand anything you have to be able to drop all forms of rational thought (just for a moment) and see that you are indeed as much the Universe as you are a piece of it.

I am very harsh when it comes to people in the past. Aside from how to make wine, and a few people like Plato, I know they did not understand even a fraction of what we know today. They wrote on parchment, we send messages around the globe in an instant. They walked, we fly.

But... and oh man was this also hard to accept. Humanity has always understood far more than I ever realized. They had an advantage you see, they knew little but without the clutter of theory, science, global communications, they were able to better accept the Infinity that is Reality than we are today.

You cannot understand Infinity with your rational mind. Sure you can do the math 'any finite number is zero when compared to Infinity'. But our rational mind is basically finite and the Universe is not. The only path to whatever level of real understanding we can achieve is through letting go of the rational (again for a moment) and just 'be'. So while it may be hard to understand and seem laughable when someone says 'if you stare at a Tree, not 'thinking' at all, you will learn something you can get no other way' it is the truth.

What you will learn you might never be able to express but you will know that somehow something new has been understood. With that comes a sense of peace, perspective, and belonging that we in this modern age lack.



A.T
(-)



posted on Jun, 22 2005 @ 12:37 AM
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...wow.. and that is that. Alexander Tau this has nothing to do with the topic but I must say, you are an excellent writer with a brilliant mind.. same goes for all of you that have been contributing. I've a much better understanding of certain aspects of the human mind now, this is wonderful.



posted on Jun, 22 2005 @ 03:24 AM
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Thank you BlackOctober, always nice to be appreciated. Now if I could just learn to spell.




A.T
(-)



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