Well, they killed her....

Maybe they Killed her but, guess one is innocent till proven guilty... ay least thtas what the "american justice system says"

But I think here on ATS there are a lot of guys who would fit the Gitmo Prisioner guard profile perfectly...screw human rights lets torture them, screw justice lets kill them...and they say that the KLAN does not exist anymore...welcome to Georgeland 2005, the land of the judges

lets smoke em out of their holes...Yeee haaaaa!!!!

18.

She only is responsible for her behavior. As stated above we dont seem to care about sending our 18 year old men/women into war, but God forbid they get to go on the trip of a life time to have fun in a foreign country and then unfortunately make a BAD decision.

Drinking too much + wanting to have fun CAN = Death

Of course i feel terrible for her and her last minutes on earth hurting scared, etc and it is horrible for a parent to lose a child at any age. and i dont believe that just because she drank and wanted to have fun she deserved this, no one does, but she im sure has been told since she was a little girl dont leave with strangers.

i have also put myself into some dangerous and stupid situations when i was 18 and just by sheer luck and god did i not end up like her.

Indeed. This will not affect repeat male tourism, unless the female tourists stop repeat visiting.

Not that I think American girls are gonna make me want to go to the Caribbean more than anything else...

Its great!

But really, people need to realize that she could have died in an accident, and things would still be handled like this.

And then secondly, people need to realize that something like this can be entirely orchestrated if desired, and blown out of proportion, as it has been. People are crying for justice for ONE girl, ummm, how many young men have died?

Totally twisted thinking by people, its not that they don't think, just they don't know how, or where to begin. I suggest watching the South Park episode titled " Stupid Spoiled Whore"
Its about Paris Hilton.

[edit on 28-6-2005 by akilles]

No one, no where is reporting her body found OR an admition of her murder.

Originally posted by Jakko
Erm, yo what if he really didn't do it?

A million things could have happened on the Island, when someone goes missing it does not automaticly mean that this someone was victim of a crime. The place where Joran says he "left" the girl (because the girl wanted him to) was on a beach. Now a lot of things could have happened at the beach after Joran left.

The thing that stinks the most Jakko, is that the original stories have changed from they dropped her off at her hotel to a completely different story that it was a beach on another part of the island. In my mind that means they were lying in the beginning - what reason would they have to lie? They know something, so they’re either guilty or involved with her disappearance in some way.

It almost looks like the security guards that were arrested first were setup to take the fall. As they are poor uneducated and come from the wrong side of the tracks. They are also implying there was consensual sex which could be interpreted as a way to get the suspect/s off the hook if the body was found & DNA evidence was present & attempt to derail the prosecution from calling it a rape/murder.

I agree they are innocent until proven guilty, but the fact is the investigation was bungled so unless a body turns up there probably wont be any evidence & we will never know what happened.

Only time will tell how much impact it will have on tourism, but it will have an impact nonetheless. Would it stop me from going there - no it wouldn't stop me if I'm traveling through the area, but I surely wouldn't choose it as a destination - Just because I don't support people, corporations, or countries that do things I don't agree with. Serve me bad food - I'll go eat somewhere else. If I hear about bad food somewhere - I'll probably never try it unless my choices are few. There are too many beautiful tropical Islands on this planet & if one gets a bad reputation from one incident then people will go somewhere else - at least for a while

You really never can tell, but some people that age just decide not to go home. Once in such a wonderfull place that far from parents...its a whole new world. A life of freedom. Perfect in every way.
Maybe this young lady made a choice to cut the cord so to speak.
I know...but its my wishfull thinking. I'm a parent, so I pray for the best for both of these families.
I pray she will be found alive and well.

Originally posted by outsider
The thing that stinks the most Jakko, is that the original stories have changed from they dropped her off at her hotel to a completely different story that it was a beach on another part of the island. In my mind that means they were lying in the beginning - what reason would they have to lie? They know something, so they’re either guilty or involved with her disappearance in some way.

BINGO!!!! Hello people!!! O.J. was innocent as well, but we all know he did it or had something to do with it.

If these scumbags don't know anything why are they changing their stories and running away from people??? I think they know that her body is never going to be found. Maybe they hacked her up and spread her out all over the place........who knows? The judge is smart enough to know that without a body a conviction of any sort will be hard to come by.

As far as it being her fault, yeah she was 18 and an adult legally, but from all I've heard about her she was a religious girl who in all likelihood was more than a bit naive. She went out drinking wanting to have fun I'm sure, but an attractive girl like that can cause liquored-up males to try and do things they wouldn't otherwise try to do when they were sober. I was a young male once and I know I know what I'm talking about. I'm sure one or more than one of those boys were trying to get the panties. Everyone with half a brain in their head knows that this is a recipe for disaster. It doesn't always end up bad, but sometimes it does. It's just human nature.

You people need to pull your craniums out of your rectums.

Peace

Well, they moved this post here to the "People" forum to die a quiet death.

*sigh*

Was a good discussion while it lasted...

[edit on 29-6-2005 by skippytjc]

Originally posted by skippytjc
Well, they moved this post here to the "People" forum to die a quite death.

*sigh*

Was a good discussion while it lasted...

Yeah skippy. I tried to get it moved back to it's proper place but I chose the wrong way and was repremanded for it. I'm still not sure which mod moved it but I am sure that the mod in question doesn't want to reveal themself or their reasons for moving it.

Peace

[edit on 29-6-2005 by Dr Love]

I know what i am about to write wont add anything to this thread but probably the idea that i may be nuts, BUT...

2 days after the news of this girls disapearence came to public, everytime the name of this girl was mentioned i had CLEAR visions of water and sharks, and they would not stop. Yet later on the police found out that in the night she went missing she was in a boat with those other guys. And when this came to be known these "visions" stopped.

Dont ask me what this meens cause it never happened to me before, but i serioulsy believe she is long gonne with the fishes. Now either she got drunk and fell off the boat or they killed her and got ridd of her body.

but those images of water and sharks were very very clear.

so ... go figure...

BaastetNoir

Interesting post. It would be a quick and efficient way to dispose of a body. Drop a whole lot of chum in the water, draw the shark in and drop her body in to start a feeding frenzy. To be honest this method of disposal never occured to me.

I hope your vision was wrong though.

Peace

[edit on 29-6-2005 by Dr Love]

BaastetNoir~ That's wild, but I strongly suspect that your vision is reality. In regards to justice, someone here mentioned that we are innocent until proven guilty according to law. I believe that it is important to remember that because otherwise we would be back to the Salem Witch Era when lynching people was justified as long as people believed you were a witch. I believe that Yoran Van der Sloot accidently killed Natalee with the date rape drug or Ecstacy, but I do not think that he should be put to death. If he raped her and then killed her out of panic, then he should be put to death, but should receive a proper trial first.

Does anyone know what kind of criminal justice system Aruba practices? Is there a distinction in sentencing murder as "Manslaughter" and "First Degree Murder"?

There is no death sentence here in Aruba. Because we're part of the Dutch kingdom, which is itself part of the EU. If I'm not mistaken you get 25 years for murder, manslaughter is less.

Originally posted by Dr Love

Originally posted by skippytjc
Well, they moved this post here to the "People" forum to die a quite death.

*sigh*

Was a good discussion while it lasted...

Yeah skippy. I tried to get it moved back to it's proper place but I chose the wrong way and was repremanded for it. I'm still not sure which mod moved it but I am sure that the mod in question doesn't want to reveal themself or their reasons for moving it.

Well it looks like not only can they make the police bungle investigations, but they had enough influence to make ATS demote the post to get less public view.

I like the date rape drug idea; they put a Mickey in her drink and accidentally overdosed her. Then they took her out in one of the boats they had access to, and then wrapped her up with something non-buoyant (chains, ropes with concrete blocks attached, sleeping bag filled with rocks etc) and she dropped to the bottom where she became food for the sea creatures.

While they might not be mad dog killers & likely none of them will turn into life long criminals, they took a life and they deserve to be punished for what they did - bottom line. Yeah, I know there's an unwritten rule that if you have enough money or influence through your postition, bloodline or even social connections you can get away with murder.

If I were the girls family & I didn't have enough resources to pay for an investigation, I would advertise & Spam the internet with anti-Aruba information to force them to do what's right or at least show them they will pay in the pocket when they do things they way they did.


[edit on 30-6-2005 by outsider]

Originally posted by outsider
If I were the girls family & I didn't have enough resources to pay for an investigation, I would advertise & Spam the internet with anti-Aruba information to force them to do what's right or at least show them they will pay in the pocket when they do things they way they did.

So when are we going to spam the internet with anti-USA information because of the THOUSANDS of missing cases there? Don't be so ridiculous and hypocrite.

Originally posted by outsider
If I were the girls family & I didn't have enough resources to pay for an investigation, I would advertise & Spam the internet with anti-Aruba information to force them to do what's right or at least show them they will pay in the pocket when they do things they way they did.

This is an idiotic, inane suggestion.

Exactly what would that accomplish?

Nada.

You're blaming an entire population for the acts of a few, and worse, advocating taking action before a conviction has been obtained? Nice.

If you were in the accused's boat, you'd be screaming wilder than a banshee for due process.

I had a very weird but vivid dream last night and it can probably be explained by the fact that while flipping thru channels yesterday I caught a glimpse of psychic detectives and that I was thinking to myself if the family had thought to bring in a psychic.

Anyway the dream I had was that she was buried under land at a pig farm.
Blood was coming to the surface and that is how it was discovered.
The farm was on the shoreline of a bay and the word New Ark or Newark was specific to the dream.

Bandit, are there many pig farms in the area she was missing from? Of course, if any.

There are wild pigs, but no pig farms that I know of.

Originally posted by Dr Love
...The judge is smart enough to know that without a body a conviction of any sort will be hard to come by.

And then in today's USA Today:

www.usatoday.com...

Gee, this case is getting really hard to figure out!!

Note to Natalee's parents: Sorry, but your daughter is not among the living anymore. Peace and God bless.

Originally posted by TheBandit795
There are wild pigs, but no pig farms that I know of.

Thanks for confirming that. I tried to google pig farms in aruba but nothing came up.

What about a place called New Ark or Newark? Of course when I google Newark and Aruba I get airline sites.