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Why do Masons ridicule others ??

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posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 06:52 PM
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I am still not understanding why this thread hasn't been locked yet.




posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 06:56 PM
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Originally posted by Majestic12
I am still not understanding why this thread hasn't been locked yet.


LOCKED.



Just kidding.



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 06:57 PM
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You are an evil man.



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 06:59 PM
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Originally posted by Majestic12
You are an evil man.


With a sense of humour.



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:05 PM
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eh, you know what I've had enough I'm not here to make a certain group of people that I disagree with feel good. My grandfather was a mason even though he was like a father to me. He was a great man who made a wrong decision. If this forum wishes to censor me then censor me but to be a Mason is to be deceived and deceive others. I don't care that 20 Masons are going to reply and cry, you need to reevaluate your lives if you really care about them. What was put in your brain that you have to be in a secret society to love god? My grandfather had a Masonic bible and it shows the all seeing eye and much other Mason propaganda. I don't know if most of you are truly deceived or if you do not believe in god and you're to tell the outside world otherwise but Masonry is a deception. That's my opinion, backed with facts about the cult taught to me from my grandfather.

Salvation from Sin:

The Bible’s View: Jesus became the sinner’s sacrifice before God when He shed His blood and died as the propitiation (payment) for the sins of the whole world (Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 5:8, John 3:16).

Mason’s View: The very process of joining the Lodge requires Christians to deny everything Christ accomplished on their behalf. A person will be saved and go to heaven as a result of his good works and personal self-improvement.

The Doctrine of Jesus and the Trinity:

The Bible’s View: Jesus was God in human form (Matthew 1:18-24, John 1:1). Jesus is the second person of the trinity (Matthew 28:19, Mark 1:9-11). While on earth, He was fully human (Mark 4:38, Matthew 4:2) and fully divine (John 20:28, John 1:1-2, Acts 4:10-12). Christians should pray in Jesus’ name and proclaim Him before others, regardless of offense to non-Christians (John 14:13-14, 1 John 2:23,

Acts 4:18-20).

Mason’s View: There is no trinity, therefore there is no doctrine of the deity of Jesus Christ. A mason cannot invoke the name of Jesus when praying, or mention His name in the Lodge. Suggesting that Jesus is the only way to God contradicts the principle of toleration. The name of Jesus has been omitted from many biblical verses that are used in Masonic writings. Jesus is on the same level as other religious leaders.

Masonry makes Christian men swear that they will remain silent in the Lodge and not talk of Christ.

So whatever lies you want to reply with go ahead and I really don't care, I spoke to someone who was into your little cult long before you and had no reason to lie to his grandson.



[edit on 13-6-2005 by NoJustice]



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:14 PM
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Well, I can't speak to the rest of your post but the idea of a "trinity" is logically unsound. If "god" was to die for our sins, who raised "god" back up after 3 days? "god"? If so "god" didn't die then, therefore NO SACRIFICE.

When Christ said, "The Father and I are one", he meant that they were in agreement, not that they were the same person.

Paradox?

I don't think so.



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:20 PM
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Originally posted by NoJustice
What was put in your brain that you have to be in a secret society to love god?


FREEMASONRY IS NOT A SECRET SOCIETY! We put our address and numbers in the phone book, we have websites, our members are VERY public about their affiliations. Just because certain websites and books tell you it is, doesn't mean it's true. How about you take your own advice and look at the facts!?!?



Masonry makes Christian men swear that they will remain silent in the Lodge and not talk of Christ.


Can you back this up with some proof? Show me WHERE Freemasonry has ever made a CHristian man swear this. Our rituals and oaths are on the internet for everyone... please point me to the right text!

[edit on 13-6-2005 by sebatwerk]



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:21 PM
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Ooops. Double post. Sorry.


[edit on 6/13/05 by The Axeman]



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:21 PM
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Originally posted by NoJustice
Mason’s View: The very process of joining the Lodge requires Christians to deny everything Christ accomplished on their behalf. A person will be saved and go to heaven as a result of his good works and personal self-improvement.


As far as I know, that is completely false (and before you say "how would you know," I have researched the subject extensively. Much more than just talking to my grandfather (who was, BTW a Mason; he left the lodge because his church (not him) had a problem with him being a Mason if he wanted to be an elder. He felt that his duty was with the church, but he loved Masonry, and since Masonry teaches your duty to your God comes before your duty to Masonry, he left.).).


Mason’s View: There is no trinity, therefore there is no doctrine of the deity of Jesus Christ. A mason cannot invoke the name of Jesus when praying, or mention His name in the Lodge. Suggesting that Jesus is the only way to God contradicts the principle of toleration.


False. Masonry does not define the Diety. If a Mason wishes to pray to Jesus, he is welcome to do so.


The name of Jesus has been omitted from many biblical verses that are used in Masonic writings.


Such as? Got any examples? I'm all ears.


Jesus is on the same level as other religious leaders.


Not to Christian Masons, He's not.


Masonry makes Christian men swear that they will remain silent in the Lodge and not talk of Christ.


I don't believe that is true. Discussion of religion is not allowed in lodge, but no one swears not to speak of Christ, that's just silly.


So whatever lies you want to reply with go ahead and I really don't care, I spoke to someone who was into your little cult long before you and had no reason to lie to his grandson.


Irritable, aren't we?

Wow, you spoke to one person, and all of a sudden you're an expert?



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:22 PM
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Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by NoJustice
What was put in your brain that you have to be in a secret society to love god?


FREEMASONRY IS NOT A SECRET SOCIETY! We put our address and numbers in the phone book, we have websites, our members are VERY public about their affiliations. Just because certain websites and books tell you it is, doesn't mean it's true. How about you take your own advice and look at the facts!?!?


Yeah just ignore half my post. My grandfather told me this. He was a Mason LONG BEFORE YOU EVER WERE! So if it hurts your feelings to expose your lies then maybe you shouldn't lie in the first place?



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:25 PM
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Originally posted by NoJustice
Yeah just ignore half my post. My grandfather told me this. He was a Mason LONG BEFORE YOU EVER WERE! So if it hurts your feelings to expose your lies then maybe you shouldn't lie in the first place?


Wow, what a powerful retort.


Really, what's your point?



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:25 PM
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Originally posted by NoJustice
Yeah just ignore half my post. My grandfather told me this. He was a Mason LONG BEFORE YOU EVER WERE! So if it hurts your feelings to expose your lies then maybe you shouldn't lie in the first place?


Scroll back up and read the edits I made. I asked you to please point me to the place in our ritual where we ask a CHristian mason to never mention christ in lodge, or where we forbid a christian mason to pray to jesus, or where passages relating to jesus were removed from masonic texts.

All of our texts and rituals are available for everyone to go through. If you know all this then you should have NO PROBLEM showing me where you got this from. of course you won't, will you? Because YOU ARE THE LIAR.


[edit on 13-6-2005 by sebatwerk]



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:28 PM
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Originally posted by Off_The_Street
As I've said before ad nauseam, I am not a Mason and never have been a Mason and am not interested in becoming a Mason, thank you very much.

However, most of the anti-Mason rants I've seen here were written by people that I consider (based on their posts, of course) to be dirt-bags; cowards who pretend to be Christian or some other faith, but whose intolerance is truly disgusting.

And then, when the Masons come out to defend their organization (as anyone who actually upholds their beliefs would be expected to do), all of a sudden there's a boatload of whining because the Masons are men enough to actually stand up for their beliefs and respond to the attacks!

I've certainly gained a lot of respect for the Masons, merely by judging how low their attackers are on these forums.


I'm with you on this, ots...there are some excellent responses from the Masonic presence here in secret societies. However, there are some who are, erm...less respectful in their choice of words than others. I'm not going to start naming names (although a couple come immediately to mind), but they are far less of a problem than some of the official opposition who love nothing better than to slander and flame.

So...all in all, I'm impressed with the masons I have been priviledged to have read on this board.

My observation on this issue is this...the very few who are driven to use terms of disrespect (as in the old adage "fighting fire with fire") do nothing to further the cause of their good works, but only seem to lower the bar in contentious threads.

Kudos to Intrepid for keeping this interesting boxing match going and also to Axeman, who parallels my thinking in so many ways.

On a final note, I used to be a regular poster for a short while and was enthused by the intelligence shown by the mason members. However, it was those few who discouraged me by their vitriol and high handed methods in dealing with those who come into this board on a CONSPIRACY site like ATS.

C'mon, fellas...you gotta have expected this...and if you didn't, know this: there will ALWAYS be new peeps coming in here with conspiracy on their mind and the secret societies are, of course, fair game to these new members.

My advice is to start treating things with a bit of humour instead of bile. You never know...some might actually be interested in joining their local Chapters.



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:29 PM
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This is the line____________________

Seb, you're about here----------------------------------

Piece of advice.



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:30 PM
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Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by NoJustice
Yeah just ignore half my post. My grandfather told me this. He was a Mason LONG BEFORE YOU EVER WERE! So if it hurts your feelings to expose your lies then maybe you shouldn't lie in the first place?


Scroll back up and read the edits I made. I asked you to please point me to the place in our ritual where we ask a CHristian mason to never mention christ in lodge, or where we forbid a christian mason to pray to jesus, or where passages relating to jesus were removed from masonic texts.

All of our texts and rituals are available for everyone to go through. If you know all this then you should have NO PROBLEM showing me where you got this from. of course you won't, will you? Because YOU ARE THE LIAR.

[edit on 13-6-2005 by sebatwerk]


Does Freemasonry lift up Jesus Christ as the only way to salvation as is documented in John 14:6? NOPE. You cannot participate in paganism and be a Christian.

You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons too; you cannot have a part in both the Lord's table and the table of demons. (1 Corinthians 10:21)



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:30 PM
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Originally posted by intrepid
This is the line____________________

Seb, you're about here----------------------------------

Piece of advice.


Why, because I said He's the liar? So he calls ME a liar, but I'm crossing the line? You serious!?!?



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:31 PM
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Originally posted by NoJustice
Does Freemasonry lift up Jesus Christ as the only way to salvation as is documented in John 14:6? NOPE. You cannot participate in paganism and be a Christian.

You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons too; you cannot have a part in both the Lord's table and the table of demons. (1 Corinthians 10:21)


What's wrong? Can you not back up the claims you made with proof?

There is nothing wrong with tolerance for other religions. If there is, I don't want to be right.

Now please back up the claims you made about Freemasonry with some solid evidence!



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:32 PM
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Originally posted by NoJustice
eh, you know what I've had enough I'm not here to make a certain group of people that I disagree with feel good.


Nor did any of us ask you to.



My grandfather was a mason even though he was like a father to me. He was a great man who made a wrong decision. If this forum wishes to censor me then censor me but to be a Mason is to be deceived and deceive others.


Whatever you want to think....



I don't care that 20 Masons are going to reply and cry, you need to reevaluate your lives if you really care about them.


Oh thanks.



What was put in your brain that you have to be in a secret society to love god?


Nothing at all. What put it in YOUR head that we felt that way, the ramblings of your grandfather? (God rest his soul)



My grandfather had a Masonic bible and it shows the all seeing eye and much other Mason propaganda.


Yes. It was a King James Version of the Holy Bible with some Masonic symbols and history in it. Several fraternal societies had those made up. They're pretty nice-looking, aren't they?



I don't know if most of you are truly deceived or if you do not believe in god and you're to tell the outside world otherwise but Masonry is a deception. That's my opinion,


Yes, and you know that opinions are like @$$holes...everyone has one, no one wants to hear anyone else's.



backed with facts about the cult taught to me from my grandfather.
Poor soul. If that's true, he must have either become senile, or he NEVER understood the truth about Freemasonry to begin with. Sadly there are a LOT of Brothers who fall into that category.



Salvation from Sin:
Mason’s View: The very process of joining the Lodge requires Christians to deny everything Christ accomplished on their behalf. A person will be saved and go to heaven as a result of his good works and personal self-improvement.


Nope. Wrong. Mistake. Masonry does NOT have a "plan of salvation" Masonry does NOT teach that being a Mason or doing good works or paying off the preacher will "save ones' soul" That's because Masonry is NOT a religion. A "plan of salvation" is left to the teachings of the Church (whatever church it may be) and has NO PLACE in the Lodge. That's NOT what we're all about. If your Grandfather told you that, he was mistaken.



The Doctrine of Jesus and the Trinity:
Masonry makes Christian men swear that they will remain silent in the Lodge and not talk of Christ.


Nope. Wrong. A lie. Masonry makes it's members swear NO SUCH THING. I DEFY you to PROVE (not just SAY...PROVE) otherwise. Again, Masonry is NOT a religion, but it respects EVERY man's religion.

Know why??????? Because Christian, Jew, Moslem, Buddhist, etc. etc.... EVERY MAN was created by God....and God Himself said "Love One Another" That's ALL we're taught to do. Too bad you weren't taught that.



So whatever lies you want to reply with go ahead and I really don't care,


I believe that. You don't care because you don't KNOW. Truly you THINK you do...but you're mistaken. Too bad for you.



I spoke to someone who was into your little cult long before you and had no reason to lie to his grandson.


No, he didn't have any reason to lie to his grandson (God rest his soul) but he obviously didn't understand Masonry. As I said earlier...there are many who don't. Despite the efforts of the investigating committee in the Lodge, MANY duly and truly unprepared make their way into our Lodges. Too bad for us.

Oh well. Someday nojustice you'll understand, and if you don't, well, my advice to you is don't petition the local Lodge. We don't want you....and THAT'S the TRUTH.

Regards,



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:35 PM
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Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by intrepid
This is the line____________________

Seb, you're about here----------------------------------

Piece of advice.


Why, because I said He's the liar? So he calls ME a liar, but I'm crossing the line? You serious!?!?


Actually I think he is a she. AND you've been around longer, let's not play this game again. YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN.



posted on Jun, 13 2005 @ 07:36 PM
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BRAINWASHED, ALL OF YOU!



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