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Former president calls for end of Gitmo.

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posted on Jun, 7 2005 @ 06:14 PM
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news.yahoo.com.../ap/20050607/ap_on_re_us/carter_guantanamo_1

The U.S. continues to suffer terrible embarrassment and a blow to our reputation ... because of reports concerning abuses of prisoners in Iraq, Afghanistan and Guantanamo," Carter said after a two-day human rights conference at his Atlanta center.

Such reports have surfaced despite President Bush's "bold reminder that America is determined to promote freedom and democracy around the world," Carter said.

About 540 detainees are being held at Guantanamo Bay in Cuba. Some have been there more than three years without being charged with a crime. Most were captured on the battlefields of Afghanistan in 2001 and 2002 and were sent to Guantanamo Bay in hope of extracting useful intelligence about the al-Qaida terrorist network.

Carter said the United States needs to make sure no detainees are held incommunicado and that all are told the charges against them.

Despite his criticism of Guantanamo Bay, Carter said Amnesty International should not have called the prison "the gulag of our time" in a report last month. President Bush has termed the report by the human-rights group "absurd."

Carter said the alleged abuses at Guantanamo Bay could never compare with the forced labor camps operated by the former Soviet Union.

at least he agrees that it aint like the gulag of our time with the Soviets.




posted on Jun, 7 2005 @ 06:57 PM
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The fact that anyone still listens to this guy just blows my mind. Didn't he already do enough damage to our country when he was President?

I think our nation would be well-served to do the exact opposite of whatever Jimmy Carter tells us to do!



posted on Jun, 7 2005 @ 07:34 PM
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Might be reasonable enough to dismantle Camp X-ray and move everyone to any of the other bases that are had, just for the public relations benefits. That might outweigh any efficiency benefits in having the single gitmo base.

But the best thing to do would be to investigate actual abuse charges as they are brought up and actively work to prevent them. Recall that the government was dismissive of international rights groups saying that there were abuses at places like garaib and gitmo, when they ended up being right. There is something of an attitude problem in that. Also, refusing to release more photos of more abuse is a bad idea, its more important to show to rational people that the US is willing to admit its failings and work thru them than to cover it up out of hopes of not 'inflamming' a population. Especially when its a population that is looking for something to get inflammed about anyway!



posted on Jun, 7 2005 @ 07:49 PM
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jimmy Carter!!!!!!!!!



CTO

posted on Jun, 7 2005 @ 08:04 PM
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Originally posted by Rasputin13
The fact that anyone still listens to this guy just blows my mind. Didn't he already do enough damage to our country when he was President?

I think our nation would be well-served to do the exact opposite of whatever Jimmy Carter tells us to do!



Amen! Jimmah Carter is an embarrassment... He courts Castro, insults the United States and held the reigns while we endured the worst foreign policy in the history of this country...

Take a quick look at the people who praise Carter... it could be a Who's Who of the extreme left up to and including the few remaining Communist leaders in the world...

He's a bright man, a generous man but he's no world leader and he certainly doesn't reflect the opinions of the vast majority of this country...



posted on Jun, 7 2005 @ 08:05 PM
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Originally posted by deltaboy
at least he agrees that it aint like the gulag of our time with the Soviets.


A gulag is a gulag.


CTO

posted on Jun, 7 2005 @ 08:28 PM
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Originally posted by EastCoastKid

Originally posted by deltaboy
at least he agrees that it aint like the gulag of our time with the Soviets.


A gulag is a gulag.


Very true... the problem is that Gitmo is no gulag... Far from it... the detainees at Gitmo get treated far better than the Russians treated THEIR OWN CITIZENS in the REAL gulags...

I have no sympathy for anyone who executes a war which has innocent bystanders as targets...



posted on Jun, 7 2005 @ 08:38 PM
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You know when I read the topic to this discussion I thought to myself "that sounds like Carter." Sure enough, the failed president again trying to make a name for himself.

Why does he want to make a name for himself now? Because he destroyed himself while in office



Carter's presidency was marked by a period of American supremacy being challenged abroad and economic recession striking at home. Sixty-six hostages were taken inside the American embassy in Tehran on November 4, 1979 by Iranian revolutionaries. Later that year, the Soviet Union invaded Afghanistan. Inflation and interest rates reached their highest levels since World War II as the administration froze domestic oil prices in response to rising prices from OPEC. These problems, many of them outside of Carter's control, and the perception that he failed to deal with them decisively contributed to his re-election defeat.


en.wikipedia.org...

In Short Carter is the worst US president ever.



posted on Jun, 9 2005 @ 07:44 AM
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Originally posted by Nygdan
just for the public relations benefits.

I respectfully disagree. Nothing is wrong with GITMO. To close it
down would be pandering to the radical left that has nothing better
to do than throw sticks and stones at America. It would encourage
more unsubstantiated complaints against America. Leave GITMO
up and running. It does the job it's supposed to do and it is just
fine.

Ref: Jimmy Carter. The guy does good work with Habitat for Humanity,
but he was a LOUSY president and hasn't got a clue how to take care
of America or defend it.



posted on Jun, 9 2005 @ 07:57 AM
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Originally posted by EastCoastKid
A gulag is a gulag.


Originally posted by CTOVery true... the problem is that Gitmo is no gulag... Far from it... the detainees at Gitmo get treated far better than the Russians treated THEIR OWN CITIZENS in the REAL gulags...


Yes, the Russians were very brutal. No doubt.

But you tell someone who was tortured at Gitmo - or anywhere, for that matter - that their pain and suffering was any less traumatic. Torture is torture, regardless of where you're at.

I hear the Chinese are quite brutal, too.

[edit on 6/9/05 by EastCoastKid]


CTO

posted on Jun, 9 2005 @ 08:45 AM
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Where is the evidence of torture at Gitmo?

The worst thing I heard about was that some pee got on a copy of the Quran...

These people were captured during a war fighting for the enemy... I don't understand why all of a sudden people want to treat them like they were nabbed for littering as opposed to trying to kill innocent people...

Doesn't ANYONE remember what happened here in the US on September 11, 2001???



posted on Jun, 9 2005 @ 09:14 AM
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Originally posted by CTO
Doesn't ANYONE remember what happened here in the US on September 11, 2001???


It doesn't justify torture, in any means, especially if those people haven't ben CONVICTED of crimes yet. Imagine if you were the one in there, I am pretty sure you would be pissed about your situation, especially when people justified it because of "doesnt ANYONE remember 9/11..."

9/11 was horrible, agreed, but that doesn't mean we should imprison people before they are convicted and treat them worse than we do our current prisoners. The Geneva convention affords those POWs certain rights, and those include providing a religious cleric or priest. So those of you who say "LOOK AT HOW NICE WE ARE!" when we give them freedom of religion, that is the bare minimum, America, once again, sets the bar low.



posted on Jun, 9 2005 @ 09:15 AM
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Originally posted by CTO
Where is the evidence of torture at Gitmo?


Here's an excellent place to start:



The Torture Papers: The Road to Abu Ghraib
Edited by Karen J. Greenberg and Joshua L. Dratel
The Legal Narrative

While the proverbial road to hell is paved with good intentions, the internal government memos collected in this publication demonstrate that the path to the purgatory that is Guantanamo Bay, or Abu Ghraib, has been paved with decidedly bad intentions. The policies that resulted in rampant abuse of detainees first in Afghanistan, then at Guantanamo Bay, and later in Iraq, were product of three pernicious purposes designed to facilitate the unilateral and unfettered detention, interrogation, abuse, judgment, and punishment of prisoners: (1) the desire to place the detainees beyond the reach of any court or law; (2) the desire to abrogate the Geneva Convention with respect to the treatment of persons seized in the context of armed hostilities; and (3) the desire to absolve those implementing the policies of any liability for war crimes under U.S. and international law.

Indeed, any claim of good faith – that those who formulated the policies were merely misguided in their pursuit of security in the face of what is certainly a genuine terrorist threat – is belied by the policy makers’ more than tacit acknowledgment of their unlawful purpose. Otherwise, why the need to find a location – Guantanamo Bay – purportedly outside the jurisdiction of the U.S. (or any other) courts? Why the need to ensure those participating that they could proceed free of concern that they could face prosecution for war crimes as a result of their adherence to the policy? Rarely, if ever, has such a guilty governmental conscience been so starkly illuminated in advance.
thinkingpeace.com...

Buy it here: www.amazon.com...


It's quite an illuminating look at how the policies were hammered out ahead of time and then implemented. If you don't want the truth, don't read it.


CTO

posted on Jun, 11 2005 @ 01:53 PM
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I read the piece at the link that you provided...

It's a review of a book that I will not purchase...

There are no citations of the abuses at Gitmo that people are claiming occur and it didn't recognize the fact that the Gitmo detainees failed to meet the filter placed upon captured enemies by the Geneva Convention; that they wear a uniform which identifies them as soldiers of a particular country.

These men dressed in the garb of civilians better to blend in and be able to strike at will, allowing them to kill innocent civilians and uniformed allied soldiers with equal ease...

As I mentioned previously, we have repatriated Gitmo detainees only to capture them again in battle... Does it make more sense to keep them captive where they can do no harm or put them back in the fight where they have a chance to not only kill American and allied military members but civilians, as well?



posted on Jun, 11 2005 @ 02:08 PM
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I n
knew it had to be Carter before I even opened this post. he is such a joke he has no pull with anyone, he needs to go back to his peanut farm and retire with some diginty, he's not a player any more. who cares

sorry no disrespect to the orginal poster, but Carter is a nobody that was a somebody. who's still trying to be in the spotlight



posted on Jun, 11 2005 @ 04:38 PM
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Originally posted by CTO
I read the piece at the link that you provided...
It's a review of a book that I will not purchase...


Excellent. Keep yourself in the dark.


As I mentioned previously, we have repatriated Gitmo detainees only to capture them again in battle...


Would you be so kind as to provide us with some links proving that statement?

[edit on 6/11/05 by EastCoastKid]



posted on Jun, 11 2005 @ 05:11 PM
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In Al Qaeda's trainning mannual tells its followers to report false abuse. This is because they know that the U.S. does not tourture. Also, the enemy knows that the left-wing types will jump on these reports and help them; THE TERRORISTS!

Jimmy Carter = Jane Fonda.


CTO

posted on Jun, 11 2005 @ 06:27 PM
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Originally posted by EastCoastKid

Originally posted by CTO
I read the piece at the link that you provided...
It's a review of a book that I will not purchase...


Excellent. Keep yourself in the dark.


As I mentioned previously, we have repatriated Gitmo detainees only to capture them again in battle...


Would you be so kind as to provide us with some links proving that statement?

[edit on 6/11/05 by EastCoastKid]


Sure... I'd be glad to...

washingtontimes.com...

I don't blow smoke when I talk about these things, unlike many who would mollycoddle the enemy...



posted on Jun, 11 2005 @ 06:34 PM
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Originally posted by Boatphone
In Al Qaeda's trainning mannual tells its followers to report false abuse. This is because they know that the U.S. does not tourture. Also, the enemy knows that the left-wing types will jump on these reports and help them; THE TERRORISTS!

Jimmy Carter = Jane Fonda.


Hello? Abu Ghraib? The Torture Memo? El Salvador? The School of the Americas?

As someone in another thread pointed out, Jimmy Carter knows a lot more about what he's talking about than just about anyone here.

-koji K.

[edit on 11-6-2005 by koji_K]



posted on Jun, 11 2005 @ 07:10 PM
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Originally posted by Boatphone
In Al Qaeda's trainning mannual tells its followers to report false abuse. This is because they know that the U.S. does not tourture. Also, the enemy knows that the left-wing types will jump on these reports and help them; THE TERRORISTS!


Have you seen one of these manuals for yourself? If so, can you read the language its written in?

You're going on the word of an administration that looked YOU in the eyes and LIED to you (WMD).





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