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Europe's Economic Woes

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posted on Jun, 5 2005 @ 08:48 PM
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Pretty shocking:



The core fact is that the European model is foundering under the fact that billions of people are willing to work harder than the Europeans are. Europeans clearly love their way of life, but don't know how to sustain it.
...
All this was illuminated last year in a study by a Swedish research organization, Timbro, which compared the gross domestic products of the 15 European Union members (before the 2004 expansion) with those of the 50 American states and the District of Columbia. (Norway, not being a member of the union, was not included.) After adjusting the figures for the different purchasing powers of the dollar and euro, the only European country whose economic output per person was greater than the United States average was the tiny tax haven of Luxembourg, which ranked third, just behind Delaware and slightly ahead of Connecticut.

The next European country on the list was Ireland, down at 41st place out of 66; Sweden was 14th from the bottom (after Alabama), followed by Oklahoma, and then Britain, France, Finland, Germany and Italy. The bottom three spots on the list went to Spain, Portugal and Greece.

Alternatively, the study found, if the E.U. was treated as a single American state, it would rank fifth from the bottom, topping only Arkansas, Montana, West Virginia and Mississippi. In short, while Scandinavians are constantly told how much better they have it than Americans, Timbro's statistics suggest otherwise. So did a paper by a Swedish economics writer, Johan Norberg.
...
I think it's way too early to write Europe off. Britain looked like a basket case in the 1970s, and recovered dramatically in the Thatcher years. Democracies have a way of reinventing themselves when the pressure is on, and Europe is beginning to notice that the pressure is on. What's more, the economies of Eastern Europe are far more entrepreneurial, and the voters more suspicious of government promises, than those of Old Europe.

Who knows: In 20 years, European leaders may be suggesting that the United States needs to adopt a more free-market, capitalistic approach. If they do, they'll probably be right!

MSNBC


What is Europe going to do to pull out of this?




posted on Jun, 6 2005 @ 01:09 AM
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I have to cast doubts about the quality of journalism. Other then France & Germany only one other countrie is mentioned. Europe stretches from the UK to asia minor. Now unless the liberal media as american consertives put it has forgotton to report WW3 the author is an idoit.



posted on Jun, 6 2005 @ 02:05 AM
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Originally posted by xpert11
I have to cast doubts about the quality of journalism. Other then France & Germany only one other countrie is mentioned. Europe stretches from the UK to asia minor.


You mean other than:

"which compared the gross domestic products of the 15 European Union members (before the 2004 expansion)

Those thirteen countries?

Did you even read it? It mentions more countries than Germany and France. It talks about several European nations - let alone the study was for the entirety of the EU before expansion.

Even if it was just refering to those countries that's two-thirds of the big three in the EU.

It's alright, I have doubts on the quality of journalism in Europe too. You all think the US is a cesspool and you're living in a land of milk and honey.


The bottom line is China has the most robust economy on Earth right now. The Western world is hurtin'.

[edit on (6/6/0505 by PistolPete]



posted on Jun, 6 2005 @ 03:18 AM
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I dont live in europe.

How many of those 15 countries did the author name ?
Is Ireland one of those countries or is in terms of econmics is it a part of the UK?
Ok correction 5 countries are mentioned if you count Luxembourg and the refernce to the dutch. So what conclusions dose the article draw?
Europe is made up of 2 -5 countries.

As for the refernce to comparing gross domestic products of the 15 European Union members strange that no other refernce is made to these countries union members could be cities for all the info the author convoys.

You do realize that most if not all the states of america would be large in terms of land mass then Luxembourg.
The entire article is a logical fallacy you cant compare the econmic performance of a state of america to any countrie. There is no denying France and Germany face econmic problems but one must deal with facts not idoitcy.


Only a fool would take an article like this at face value.

Bad journalism exits globaly it just so happens this is an american example

Dosnt it bother americans that the lack of WMDs in Iraq was browsed over by the media and they feed the public BS like this?



posted on Jun, 6 2005 @ 03:38 AM
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xpert11,

The excerpted piece mentions all these countries: Luxembourg, Ireland, Sweden, Britain, France, Finland, Germany, Italy, Spain, Portugal and Greece. Austria, Denmark, The Netherlands and Belgium were left out of the quoted rankings.

So out of 15 it mentions by name 11, why are you saying it only says 2 - 5?



posted on Jun, 7 2005 @ 01:10 AM
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So out of 15 it mentions by name 11, why are you saying it only says 2 - 5?


I am saying the author is making grosss asumations based on the econmic performace of two countries see my below post for the other flaws.



posted on Jun, 7 2005 @ 09:52 AM
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Germany continues to suffer the cost of reunification.

France has low growth.

The overall level of growth in the EU - excepting some exceptions doing very well - compared to some, appears low.
(usually until you look at the 'real' growth figure; our growth may be low but then so is our inflation figure; growth - inflation; at which point it is not quite the disaster some imagine)

But, for all that one has to be highly selective to paint the disasterous picture some want to paint.

......and anyone thinking that Europe is set to follow the USA's example is in for a serious disappointment.
It might be the fashion to 'outsource' everything in the US but here in Europe we see no need to, nor any real possibility of, doing that.

It might cost us a little more but so what?
Given the quality of life benefits we see it in the round as an overall benefit which we'll keep thank you very much.
We prefer a safe society worth living in, thank you.

If you want to be frightening yourselves silly over India or China (only the latest scary example being held up to us all) feel free.


[edit on 7-6-2005 by sminkeypinkey]



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 09:45 AM
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that report is grossly misleading! If you are to believe it you would draw the conclusion that european countries are third world economies


The GDP of the us is approx $9612 billion dollars

the next largest is china at $5019 billion.

The largest EU country is Germany at $2062 Billion

the average GDP per state would be in the region of $192 billion.

The UK (inc northern Ireland) is £1404 Billion

France at $1426 Billion

and Ireland way down at number 51 with $113.3 billion



posted on Jun, 18 2005 @ 11:46 PM
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Arnold not to nit pick but some of your statistics I believe are wrong or completely out of date you can get some pretty reliable figures at the link below.

world economic figures

[edit on 18-6-2005 by danwild6]



posted on Jun, 25 2005 @ 09:17 AM
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Originally posted by arnold_vosloo
that report is grossly misleading! If you are to believe it you would draw the conclusion that european countries are third world economies



go sucking some swedish toes



The GDP of the us is approx $9612 billion dollars

No, its 12,438.873 idiot


the next largest is china at $5019 billion.

no its 1,843.117 idiot


The largest EU country is Germany at $2062 Billion


No its 2,906.658 idiot.



the average GDP per state would be in the region of $192 billion.


the average GDP doesnt matter, as there are states with between of 400,000 and 83,000,000 citizens in europen union, so here the GDP of
European Union: 13,926.873
Europe: 16,061.654



The UK (inc northern Ireland) is £1404 Billion


I dont know the exchange rate, so maybe its correct, but here is what its in US-$:
2,295.039



France at $1426 Billion

Its 2,216.273



and Ireland way down at number 51 with $113.3 billion

No its 206.467


numbers are in billion US-$, in year 2005
sources:
en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...




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