Pictures from Inside Groom Lake

i wonder if the new stuff we will see prob in around 20 yrs will be disk shaped? will we finally have use of anti gravity stuff i sure hope so

Perhaps they're hiring janitors at this facility.

reply to post by Cosmic911


The photo of "the shack" is one I took from Hawkeye Hill. It is very close to the border.
37.347301 -115.646321
I should update the photo, but it is a matter of being at the front gate in the early AM. I rather be scanning the base in the early AM since there is little to be learned from the photographing the guard shack. They no longer have C-band TV, but have gone to Ku-Band.

The "alien" photos 404, but that is fine with me.

Originally posted by melvin2012
i wonder if the new stuff we will see prob in around 20 yrs will be disk shaped? will we finally have use of anti gravity stuff i sure hope so

Disc shapes have always been an objective for developers. Its just always been a propulsion and stability nightmare. It would be a great advancement for UAV's. The shape offers very little speed restrictions and momentum change restrictions (turning on a near dime), and used in a UAV capacity with no human body restrictions... Would yield amazing performance characteristics.

This is something my Grandfather told me when he was working for McDonnell Douglas/Boeing. He had mentioned that they did some studies on it.

Just for the record, not an alien UFO buff, just a UFO buff by it's definition, "Unidentified Flying Object" or in my opinion, terrestrial black projects or TBPs. ;-) But I respect everyones' views.

reply to post by DesertWatchdog


I basically agree with you on the disk shape being useful, but it will always have more drag than conventional designs. Basically you want to optimize the plane for forward motion.

I think the blended wing is the best compromise if you want a fatter body. I just hope you don't like window seats.
en.wikipedia.org...

You do need the front of the aircraft to be pointy for low drag. Flying triangle or diamond will work.

Originally posted by gariac
reply to post by DesertWatchdog

 

I basically agree with you on the disk shape being useful, but it will always have more drag than conventional designs. Basically you want to optimize the plane for forward motion.

I think the blended wing is the best compromise if you want a fatter body. I just hope you don't like window seats.
en.wikipedia.org...

You do need the front of the aircraft to be pointy for low drag. Flying triangle or diamond will work.

You nailed it. Compromise, much like they did with the 117. That's what I understood anyway. With a uniform shape like a disc, you could change forward energy suddenly but still maintain the computed flight dynamics. I think that's what the old man was getting at anyway. I was about 16 when we talked about it (10 years ago); I'm a youngster. He actually worked on the original BWB.

reply to post by DesertWatchdog


I suspect the F-117a's angular shape was due to limited computer power. [Modern stealth fighters are curvy.] I have never seen this documented, but I suspect Lockheed got a copy of Livermore's NEC, which is an antenna and object radio wave modeling program. Most people use it to simulate antenna designs, but you can also model shaps and see they reflected energy. In Ben Rich's book, they credit a Russian engineer for the idea in a paper written in 1964.

e-reports-ext.llnl.gov...
This report shows the program being used for RCS in the mid-60s. Either the Soviets copied us or we copied them, or great minds think alike.

The program (NEC2) runs fast on a modern PC if you want to design your own stealthy shape.

Originally posted by gariac
reply to post by DesertWatchdog

 

I suspect the F-117a's angular shape was due to limited computer power. [Modern stealth fighters are curvy.] I have never seen this documented, but I suspect Lockheed got a copy of Livermore's NEC, which is an antenna and object radio wave modeling program. Most people use it to simulate antenna designs, but you can also model shaps and see they reflected energy. In Ben Rich's book, they credit a Russian engineer for the idea in a paper written in 1964.

e-reports-ext.llnl.gov...
This report shows the program being used for RCS in the mid-60s. Either the Soviets copied us or we copied them, or great minds think alike.

The program (NEC2) runs fast on a modern PC if you want to design your own stealthy shape.

Without actually getting the book out; If I remember correctly, Ben credited Denys Overholser for finding a Russian report by Peotrio Umstev (spelling) who was working on predicting electromagnetic waves from two dimensional shapes, and Denys figured out the rest and how to make a program to read it all. Something along those lines. I can't remember exactly

For those interested, the book is Skunk Works: A Personal Memoir of My Years of Lockheed. Damn good read.

Well this is weird! I tried clicking on quite a few of those links and there are an awful lot of page not founds now! Hs someone been removing them?

reply to post by Paulow1978


The problem with old threads is the websites get re-written and links are moved. I credit ufomind.com for "freezing" pages that become obsolete so that at least you can still get the old information.

I have no idea who the webmaster is for the roadrunners website, but I'd show the person the door. Way too much stuff flashing at you, and images got rearranged a few time.

You may be able to go to archive.org and use the wayback machine to find the missing images.

Originally posted by iksmodnad
Just imagian what we may have right now in a work shop somewere, I am sure they make the SR-71 look the the wright brothers plane.

The jets they are just starting to release, probably have been in development since the early 1980s.. which makes me wonder whats in development right now.


[edit on 4-6-2005 by iksmodnad]

Most likely anti-gravity heh...

So this thread is from 2005. Too bad,
many of the links are down. The photos are really fun.
My grandfather was a SAC pilot and taught me so much
about aircraft. Well him and his monthly Air-Force magazine.

What I find interesting is how many people think the photos
are fake. Those are real folks. Yes many civilians
work on black projects.

What does that say about when alleged UFO photos
are poured over by ATS?

Thanks to gariac and desertwatcher, good stuff.

reply to post by sealing


Has the USAF ever built anything? Isn't it always done by contract? I always thought of the USAF as operators of gear that they requested to be built.

Now maybe at Redstone in the early days the USAF built those rockets. I really don't know.

You read the old papers for the U2 program and it is really proof positive of the military industrial complex. Lockheed built the plane. The Beacon Hill group was a conglomerate of Bell Labs, Kodak, Perkin Elmer, and Dr. Land from Polaroid himself.

This thread should be cleaned up/remove not working links as it is much cool stuff to find.

Very interesting thread and photos

reply to post by iksmodnad


ALL the photo links are now dead. Is this a joke or am I missing something?

Originally posted by sealing
So this thread is from 2005. Too bad,
many of the links are down. The photos are really fun.
My grandfather was a SAC pilot and taught me so much
about aircraft. Well him and his monthly Air-Force magazine.

What I find interesting is how many people think the photos
are fake. Those are real folks. Yes many civilians
work on black projects.

What does that say about when alleged UFO photos
are poured over by ATS?

Thanks to gariac and desertwatcher, good stuff.

Ahh I get it now. Newbie. Thought the thread was new. Was wondering about the dead links. Thought to myself "Man, they move fast".

That first pictures awesome! Thanks for the new wallpaper

The links didn't work for me either. Too bad, I wanted to see that stuff. You gotta know the whatever MIB agency keeps this stuff under wraps watches this site for leaks.