A Fresh Start: Masonry Good or Evil.

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye
Is the light of the Merkabah the light that masonry alludes to? Is Illumination, being in the presents, of the Merkabah?

I do not know who Merkabah is, nor do I believe he has anything to do with Freemasonry. The "light" that Freemasonry alludes to is UNDERSTANDING and KNOWLEDGE. Again, if you are trying to imply somethinng sinister by this, you're wasting your time.

Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye
Is the light of the Merkabah the light that masonry alludes to? Is Illumination, being in the presents, of the Merkabah?

I do not know who Merkabah is, nor do I believe he has anything to do with Freemasonry.

Here is a good explanation:
www.jewishencyclopedia.com...

I wasn't sure what it was either.. pretty interesting.

Thanks Justme74, it is the ball park.

Sebatwerk, here is a link for you to educate yourself on the Merkabah

Merkabah

Please review the material and then give me your educated opinion on this subject.

"The Ma'aseh Merkabah should not be taught to any one except he be wise and able to deduce knowledge through wisdom ('gnosis') of his own"

The Merkabah mysteries, which remained the exclusive property of the initiated ones, the "Ẓenu'im" or "Ḥashsha'im" (see Essenes), have been preserved chiefly in the Enoch literature of the pre-Christian centuries, and in the "Hekalot" of the geonic time, known also as the "Merkabah" and "Enoch Books"

Such spiritualistic experiences through mystic rites had their origin in Egypt rather than in Persia. Jamblichus ("De Mysteriis," iii. 4, 5) describes the optic and acoustic illusions under which the Egyptian mystic labored as if they were realities, and at the same time he states that in the ecstatic state brought about by magic songs and proper environment the soul is encompassed by a chariot of light

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[edit on 8-6-2005 by All Seeing Eye]

Peace 'All Seeing Eye'.

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye

The symbols you mention, were broken down to a degree in this thread:

Kemetic Symbolism of the Salt Lake Masonic Temple


According to my understanding, the Kemetic symbol of the All Encompassing Divinity or Winged Sun-Disk, is where the Kabbalistic idea of the Ain Soph Aur or Solar Absolute comes from.

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye

And, what are your thoughts concerning the Jewish mystical "Merkabah"?

Gnostic Glossary


Mercabah (Hebrew) Literally, “chariot.” Refers to the Soul the Initiate must build.


“With patience ye will possess thy souls.” – Yeshua Hamashiah


Sahu (Egyptian) The Egyptian Sahu is the same as the Greek To Soma Heliakon, the Hebrew Merkabah; it is the Physical, Astral, Mental and Causal Solar Bodies as a whole.

To Soma Heliakon (Greek) Literally, “The Golden Body of the Solar Man.”

This is the one who has raised the Five Kundalini Serpents(the other two are never fallen).

That is, one who has passed the Initiations of Malkuth, Yesod, Hod, Netzach and Tiphereth.

It is taught that this one has the choice to enter Nirvana.

To incarnate The Christ however, one has to renounce Nirvana and keep working as a Boddhisattva, by taking the vow to liberate all Sentient Beings from the Wheel of Suffering(Samsara) until there are none left to Liberate.


I would suggest studying Kabbalah if you really want to know about it.

It's not as "tenebrous" or "Satanic" as you think it may be(or at all for that matter).

You'll see that if everyone studied the Tree of Life, of which life itself is based on; the World would obviously be a much better place.


Gnostic Kabbalah



HOTEP



[edit on 8-6-2005 by Tamahu]

Number one criticism that is indefensible, besides the crime of secrecy already mentioned:
Lack of women.

As has been said before, women are the driving force behind men.
"only cause the wife wanted it done that I'm doing it. I had no intentions of getting it done"

And yet, where do we find an ABUNDANCE of Feminine reference?

Well, there is the Mother Lodge, for one...

She also quietly motivates men to do her bidding. If they so choose, they can benefit from listening to her.

Originally posted by akilles
Number one criticism that is indefensible, besides the crime of secrecy already mentioned:
Lack of women.

What? Is there something wrong with having something for yourself? I don't see it. akilles, are you married, if so, for how long?

BTW, how many things are out there for women specifically, myriads. Why is one thing for men alone a bad thing?

As to the secrecy, I don't have a problem with it. What they do is none of my business as it doesn't affect my life. I affect my life, hell, my wife affects my life more than the Masons do. Sheesh.

Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by akilles
Number one criticism that is indefensible, besides the crime of secrecy already mentioned:
Lack of women.

What? Is there something wrong with having something for yourself? I don't see it. akilles, are you married, if so, for how long?

BTW, how many things are out there for women specifically, myriads. Why is one thing for men alone a bad thing?


As to the secrecy, I don't have a problem with it. What they do is none of my business as it doesn't affect my life. I affect my life, hell, my wife affects my life more than the Masons do. Sheesh.

I really cant see where this line of thought came from. If its your intention to covertly invite us out of the thread with the Merkabah information, so be it. Ill start a new thread........


[edit on 8-6-2005 by All Seeing Eye]

Originally posted by akilles
Number one criticism that is indefensible, besides the crime of secrecy already mentioned:
Lack of women.

As has been said before, women are the driving force behind men.
"only cause the wife wanted it done that I'm doing it. I had no intentions of getting it done"

And yet, where do we find an ABUNDANCE of Feminine reference?

Well, there is the Mother Lodge, for one...

She also quietly motivates men to do her bidding. If they so choose, they can benefit from listening to her.

This is completeley absurd! I agree with Intrepid, what's wrong with having a men's only club!?!? There's TONS of women-only clubs, channels, gyms, books, shows, etc etc etc.

How is this ANY kind of criticism? You're absolutely out of your mind, trying to find ANYTHING you can to criticise Freemasonry. Give it up already.

I certainly don't think there is anything wrong with an all male group and I think I can see the wisdom in having one.


To clarify, I was just making a connection to 33 and the Masons with that M&D quote here is the exact quote. -

The Gothic Mysteries were carried Northwestward from the East, by Odin; who, being a great warrior, modelled and varied them to suit his purposes and the genius of his people. He placed over thier celebration twelve Hierophants, who were alike Priests, counsellors of State, and Judges from whose decision there was no appeal. He held the numbers 3 and 9 in peculiar veneration, and was probably himself the Indian Buddha, Every thrice-three months, thrice -three victims were sacrificed to the Tri-une God.

The Goths had three great festivals; the most magnificent of which commenced at the winter solstice, and was celebrated in honor of Thor, the Prince of the Power of the air. Da,da,da,da.

Thor was was the Sun, the Egyptian Osiris and Kneph the Phoenician Bel or Baal.

M&D p 368

Originally posted by akilles
Number one criticism that is indefensible, besides the crime of secrecy already mentioned:
Lack of women.

www.hfaf.org...

www.co-masonry.org...

www.droit-humain.org...

I hereby put it to you, Akilles, that you have no earthly idea what you are talking about.



BTW - freemasonry isn't a secret society.

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye
I really cant see where this line of thought came from. If its your intention to covertly invite us out of the thread with the Merkabah information, so be it. Ill start a new thread........


[edit on 8-6-2005 by All Seeing Eye]

I have no idea where this came from, I'm not allowed an opinion? I stand by what I said, what's wrong with a society for men only? If my innocent post has you on the defensive, well, that say something to credibillity. BTW, you know I'm not a Mason, nor do I speak for them. I can read and think though and this(society) seems logical to me.

I still can't understand why people have such a downer on the Masons.

Could anybody expand on this for me?

The way I see it is that it is a society that anyone* can join if you had the desire to do so. There is official information everywhere on their websites. The Masons that I know haven't even made it a secret that they're members. By this I don't mean that they shout it around either, but when I asked the question they just gave me an honest answer.

I have expressed an interest and I'm going along to a gavel night at our local lodge in the near future to hopefully find out more about them and, should I wish to, perhaps join. This seems a far more realistic way to increase your knowledge about something than to just say:

'Masons are evil and taking over the world'
'Oh? Why say you that then'
'Well it's well known fact'
'Where did this fact come from then?'
'It's all over the internet, innit?'

In other words, he hasn't answered the question because it's just heresay (Blimey! Only one letter away from something else!) and rumour. The only resistance I have had against this is from the mother-in-law who is a devout, verging on fundamentalist, Christian and thinks that they are evil. She did, however, attend a Templar gathering which I found interesting due to the John the Baptist link where, allegedly, they reverred the Baptist above Christ, and she saw nothing wrong with that...

I reckon that if people put half the time and effort that they spend trying to find non-existant conspiracies within the Freemasons into something more useful the world would be a much fuzzier, kinder place to live...

*Male, admittedly, but I see no problem with this, but that can wait until another rant....

Originally posted by Trinityman

Originally posted by akilles
Number one criticism that is indefensible, besides the crime of secrecy already mentioned:
Lack of women.

www.hfaf.org...

www.co-masonry.org...

www.droit-humain.org...

I hereby put it to you, Akilles, that you have no earthly idea what you are talking about.

BTW - freemasonry isn't a secret society.

Are you saying Co-Masonry is the Mother lodge my friend?