would us being in a black hole answer many questions?

what's going to happen seems to be the question. first we must know what's happening now. do we? do you?

if you were to shrink down to the size of an atom and try to reach out and grab a proton, an electron, or a neutron ........ you could not do it, because they are just biths of energy and light compressed into what appears to be matter, but is not. the sub-atomic "particles" just phase in and out of existance.

so i pose this question:
what in the entire universe has the energy capable of inverting light and compressing it upon itself?

i read an article in discovery magazine in i believe september issue of 1995 or 1996 that adressed the issues at hand with the hubble telescope. it seems after they fixed the mirror imagery problem they utilized hubble for the purpose it was built. the top cream de la cream of the scientific and astronomic disciplines tried to date the big bang by looking at 186 gallaxies using the doppler effect (red light hitting us first it is moving away, blue light hitting us first means it is coming towards us) and what they found baffled them.

it seems out of the 186 gallaxies they studied ...... the big bang happened some 15 billion years ago. but not for 7 gallaxies traversing through the rest of them. the milky way and the 6 closest gallaxies to us in what forms a small cluster were going in the wrong direction inconsistant with the whole of everything else in a 1,400,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 light year radius.

so i pose this question:
what has the energy capable of pulling 7 gallaxies in a different course than the rest of the 179 gallaxies?

i sometimes wonder what someone meant in the bible when they wrote that 1 day to god was equal to 1000 years in the eyes of man. does this mean that god is moving faster, or we are moving slower?

so i pose this question:
what fits the requirements necessary to effectively slow time?

what fits the requirements necessary to effectively slow time?
a black hole.

what has the energy capable of pulling 7 gallaxies in a different course than the rest of the 179 gallaxies?
a very big black hole.

what in the entire universe has the energy capable of inverting light and compressing it upon itself to assume the illusion of matter?
a very active black hole.

are we nearing a singularity, or have we proceeded past one and time has reversed?

according to the latest and greatest minds the universe's galaxies seem to be accelerating or moving faster outward. could this be fact or is there another force that from a specific observation would give the illusion that distant galaxies are in fact accelerating outward at a faster rate. we must keep in mind the concept of relativity. so could it be that if we were in a black hole or some still unknown variable that shares some characteristics of a black hole, this would slow us down and make illuminating objects seem to be heading away at an accelerated rate?

if only one prophecy, or intuition, or remote viewing, or vision, or dream, or deja vu, or truth has come to pass ........ either it was subconsciously remembered because they have already happened, or these terms may not have a place worthy of recognition in our "language" to begin with.


[edit on 31/5/05 by Esoteric Teacher]

See sig. below for answer.

Such as:

What is the force of inertia?

Remember, a black hole as large as the Universe would have structure under relativity; a central singularity, an accretion disk, polar jets, accretion arcs, electromagnetic field... Judging from what we see in our part of the structure, we are probably located in one of the polar jets, in an area of expansion, far enough out that looking back in time with a telescope gives the impression of an original 'Big Bang'...

just because 6 galaxies are moving towards us while the other countless galaxies we've seen are moving away doesn't mean that we're on the outer edges of a black hole

perhaps we're at the front of this group, and as out Momentum slows, the heavier galaxies behind us start to catch up,

and the ones ahead are only still appearing towards the red end of the spectrum because the light was emitted millions of years ago when they were still moving,
or perhaps they have a higher mass than we do, so are continuing to move because of their higher Momentum

Going with the what if mindset. What if The galaxies that were an oddity by moving the other direction were just galaxies not falling into the gravity well as fast because they were travelling in some other direction. thus we are falling faster toward the centre of this gravity well and the other galaxies are appearing to go the opposite way but were just cathing up with them.

great responses, maybe a little critical, but the thread knew the intent would cause some critical (which are more than welcome) constructive outlooks.

perhaps i explained it a little off key.

the 179 galaxies were once at a central point, which is to say we know by thier current path and speeds that they were all at the same point in space at the same time.

however the world's elite (not perfect, just elite) are dating our solar sytem and some stars 3 billion years older than when the 179 gallaxies that are heading outwards from a specific point.

our galaxy, and the 6 others closest to us are headed in a direction that is more like on a path to where the big bang happened while a lot of the galaxies are heading away from the point of origin are well behind us and accelerating.

we are headed towards the belt of the constalation orion.

but from the point of view from someone in some kind of interstellar (if not a black hole) vortex wouldn't the starlight still appear to look the same?

that is probably a better question.

even though "if" we were in some kind of stellar vortex that also bends light ,which we know gravity does, from the point of the observer as seen from in side something that twists light as it twists us, wouldn't the night sky appear to look the same?

Originally posted by Chakotay
Such as:

What is the force of inertia

than why does it seem that we are also accelerating in a slight angle to, but torwards what 179 other galaxies are accelerating away from?

wouldn't we have slowed down, decelerated, or been pushed in a different direction with a big bang?

i'm sure there are plenty of variables, but it seems that we are moving in an accelerated rate which is consistant with what we see from countless other galaxies, we are just not heading away from what they are all heading away from. a little confusion on a universal scale, i thought it would make a good thread.

unsure of the date of the discovery magazine article i refer to, the the cover page title read "Crisis In the Cosmos".

Interesting information.

Is this the article?
Crisis in the Cosmos
There's not one crisis but two: the universe seems to be younger than the stars in it, and a huge chunk of it is headed in the wrong direction.
[color=orang]DISCOVER Vol. 16 No. 03 | March 1995 | Astronomy & Physics

You have to subsribe to read the article

But....
Here is a link to a copy of it.


Interesting, but hasn't science progressed just a little bit in 10 years?
Like say, The Wilkinson Microwave Anisotropy Probe, for example.




[edit on 2-6-2005 by makeitso]

Originally posted by makeitso

Is this the article?
Crisis in the Cosmos
There's not one crisis but two: the universe seems to be younger than the stars in it, and a huge chunk of it is headed in the wrong direction.
[color=orang]DISCOVER Vol. 16 No. 03 | March 1995 | Astronomy & Physics

You have to subsribe to read the article

But....
Here is a link to a copy of it.

Interesting, but hasn't science progressed just a little bit in 10 years?
Like say, The Wilkinson Microwave Anisotropy Probe, for example.

i'm sure science has, but iv'e been pre-occupied by other time consuming concerns. that's why astronomical minds as beautiful as yours exist, to teach astronomically admiring minds like my own.

yes the newer article does address the same topic as the one i referred to, just with more information. thanks.

wilkinson microwave anisotropy probe ............ excuse the teacher, he has some homework. thanks guys.

Um, perhaps the wilkinson microwave anisotropy probe was not a good example.

I was mostly observing that the article you referenced was from '95. That observation, or example listed, does not negate the premise of 7 galaxies going the wrong way.

In fact it is kind of intriguing. You taught me something.


However, I think that the Chandra X-Ray Observatory would be an example that may be able to tell us if we are in a super massive black hole, since it can measure black holes even down to how much iron they have in them. That would indicate that we would be able to observe that we are in a supermassive black hole or its streams wouldn't it?

Chandra Measures Iron in the Fire

Using Chandra spectra obtained from more than 300 supermassive black holes in the centers of galaxies, a team of astronomers has been able to determine the amount of iron near the black holes.

The distinctive X-ray spectral peaks are produced by the fluorescence of iron atoms in a doughnut-shaped torus orbiting a supermassive black hole. In this process, high-energy X-rays from hot gas very near the black hole excite the iron atoms to a higher energy state, and they almost immediately return to their lower energy state with the emission of a lower-energy, fluorescent X-ray.

Chandra is peerless as a black hole probe - both near and far.




And since Chandra and WMAP have maps of the universe, it seems to stand to reason that we would have already discovered if we were in a black hole or it's steams.


Of course all of Chandra, and the WMAP are all limited by the distance that they can "see".

Chandra Sky Map of the Universe


The Microwave Sky image from the WMAP Mission



But why are 7 galaxies going the wrong way?

There are estimated to be 7*10^32 stars in our galaxy... however, one thing to note with the current expanding universe model is that we are all on the surface of technically a bubble that keeps getting bigger. There is not really any body "behind us" and not really anyone "infront" of us... If there were then we would have a considerable ammount of stars the are not displaying any shift whatsoever since they would be expanding at the same velocity as us. Space time is a funky thing... Technically if we were in a black hole we would know about it and not at the same time because time for us would be "normal" but it would also be stopped or very very slow. As far as the expanding universe it says that it started from one point where mass was infinate but volume was zero, but that there is no real starting point because there is no real gravitational center, when the universe collapses it will be a result of the common pull of gravity of all the stars, not one of a central nucleus of the universe. So therefore that kinda says that the universe's center is in one spot but that one spot is everywhere. Make any kind of sense?

i opened up a can here. yes i did walk in with a lot of answers, but like most of us i had questions as well. intuition and best guess gets us somewhere, but even when we arrive at somewhere we are still looking at our intuition and best guess.

i do understand the majority of the educated information here, some i must do research on, but you guys are the ones pointing me in the right directions for this.

and it is highly appreciative, i might add.

what if ....... (i know that term is disliked by some, but i need not remind you all that all science fact was first science fiction) ..... what if the entire universe as we percieve it is beyond within a singularity. unsure if that is even possible, but if so ..... would time reverse?

yes, i know it sounds "out there", but i have heard from good authority that that is where the truth is ...... "out there".

also something i was wondering, may be the whole basis for wormholes, is can a black hole have different stages of evolution such as stars and planets and the like? also can a black hole have a different shape than a swirling drain?

maybe something engineered to have a form, spiral and elongated, or tube like, or folded over more than once or twice when black holes collide? maybe i'm contimplating how dimensions are born, at any rate these are the questions i ponder.

also i ponder the effects of slowing time or stopping it except for the observers within it?

without getting over biblical and appearing to shun those that have a seperate belief system, the bible says that 1 day in the eyes of man is equal to 1000 years in the eyes of god, however god was called elloheim, which is a plural term for god in the context of which i speak.

so if 1 day has passed here, then 365,000 days have passed from the perspective of at least one observer?

i probably won't be back to check on your replies and commentary until saterday, but in the mean time i'll do some more research.

thanks for all the excellent and very tasty brain food.


[edit on 3/6/05 by Esoteric Teacher]