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Is Alcoholics Anonymous a secret society?

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posted on Jun, 12 2005 @ 02:01 PM

Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by Majestic12
It seems any group these days is regarded as secret and a threat to society.

What next? The Cub Scouts?

Or Girl Guides, Civil Servants, Teamsters. Oops that last one is probably wrong.

Meals on Wheels, a secret society.

posted on Jun, 12 2005 @ 02:28 PM
Ok, I am new here and still trying to read but there is quite a bit to this site. But to actually try and think that AA is a "secret society" just makes me giggle and think of "conspiracy theory type people". If AA is a secret society than what is Weight undercover government organization attempting to turn us into "the perfect human being" for mind control? Ok, ok, not trying to offend anyone but this thread is a bit much for me. Have fun with it.

posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 10:20 PM
Anyone who thinks it's a cult want to explain why exactly? Do any of your reasons fit a "cult checklist"? Not that they have to, it's just a good checklist though.

a good cult checklist

I've been going to a weekly meeting for six months. I've been off the sauce and any other drug for as long. At the least, I have a good laugh every week because it's not all depressing and I always hear something to remind me why I need to stay clean.

Some people probably need the encouragement and support to stay sober. In no way do I feel that I'll drink if I don't go. If someone tells me they are having trouble, I tell them they are welcome to come along with me and sit there and drink coffee (ours is ok, but I brink my own high octane).

Every group is different, if for no other reason than their members. I'd try to be careful when making sweeping generalizations about aa if you've only gone once in one location, but if that's your thing, go ahead.

posted on Jun, 26 2005 @ 10:41 PM
okay....wanna know something? this is the DUMBEST thread ive seen here.
yeah CAN leave AA. the reason there is no exit is because there's no cure for alcohalism. you will always need help because the temtation is always there. yes, it is pretty straight forward a christian little shin-dig. ive been to over 100 AA meetings with my mother, and this is what happens there.

1. every1 talks to their friends over donuts and coffee.
2. they have some group talk
3. they have individual alcohalic speakers
4. they end in a prayer
5. people talk to each other over donuts
6.every1 leaves.


posted on Mar, 16 2006 @ 09:05 AM
AA has Open and Closed meetings. Bob off the street can walk into an open meeting but not a closed one. My father has been in AA for about 30 years, he attends a yearly meeting thats held abroad (from the UK). Rich and influential people go to these meetings. So in my mind AA has aspect of secrecy, maybe 10% of it.

AA a cult? Damn straight. A brainwashing mind numbing cult. I can tell from a person's speach or writing the they believe in the AA doctrine... Im so fraking familiar with it.

AA has their bible, they have their god and devil, their eternal sin (sickenss) but surprisingly it isnt compatible with christian doctrine, despite the surfacesimiliarities. google search: Alcoholics Anonymous doctrine

My personal beef with AA isnt the cult or secrecy bit its the attitude that you as a person are sick, sick to the bone, in fact everyone is sick, if AA isnt working for you , its because you are [insert favourite "slogan thearpy"].

AA has kept my father in a psychological loop, its as if he only gave up yesterday, and its true because the idea is to take "one day at a time"... groundhog day more like.

AA has touched millions of peoples lives and that number is growing, I wouldnt be surprised if it the fastest growing new religion the world has seen.

posted on Mar, 16 2006 @ 10:57 AM
Yes, this may be an old thread, but it's worth bringing back up the stack simply for the excellent link to 2ht's 'cults checklist' alone

posted on Mar, 16 2006 @ 11:57 AM

You have voted Cug for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have two more votes this month.

Almost a year later!
Wow, excellent thread, I wasn’t going to read it (cause the title appeared ludicrous) and then I’ve noticed who started it, so I gave it a shot. – almost a year later, thanks for bumping this one.

Originally posted by Cug
Well AA forces you to have a God (any God, much like the masons).. There have been some lawsuits when an atheist was ordered by the court to go to AA for just this reason.

Although I don’t agree that the AA acts like a secret society, I do believe the other theory brought forward in the thread that they act like a cult. Also I was unaware of the “God” element in AA. Is this also present in NA?

I will forward Cug’s Initial post to a few people I know who will enjoy it a lot!


posted on Mar, 16 2006 @ 04:33 PM

Originally posted by ConspiracyNut23
Almost a year later!
Wow, excellent thread, I wasn’t going to read it (cause the title appeared ludicrous) and then I’ve noticed who started it, so I gave it a shot...

Just curious but you and a couple of people thought the idea that AA could be a secret society as an "out there" theory. Admitedly I wouldnt have called it one either but a certian % of AA is not open to Joe public. I do wonder what secrects are held close, for instance suicide rates or abuse from sponsors. Too many similarities to catholicism - and the not very nice bits to boot.

The prevalent idea that AA has helped "millions" is really wrong, recovery, as mentioned before is the same as not attending AA. There is no proof behind that claim. Heh, Ill even go as far to say that the breaking up of families is just the same whether attending AA or not!


posted on Mar, 16 2006 @ 05:35 PM

Originally posted by Dae

Just curious but you and a couple of people thought the idea that AA could be a secret society as an "out there" theory. Admitedly I wouldnt have called it one either but a certian % of AA is not open to Joe public. I do wonder what secrects are held close, for instance suicide rates or abuse from sponsors. Too many similarities to catholicism - and the not very nice bits to boot.

This is an old post.

Anyway one of the things I wanted to get across with this post is that many of the "bad things" that secret societies are claimed to do are in fact practiced by many groups. Groups that if you claimed were secret societies would get you laughed at.

That and I just saw the Penn and Teller BS show on Showtime on AA a few hours before I posted it last year.

posted on Apr, 13 2006 @ 02:35 AM
No AA itself is not a 'secret society', It was founded by members of a secret society, but not one itself.

But with an internal structure where nothing is reported. So, secret things CAN happen deep within the bowels of AA. There are branch groups of AA that push the limits of 'cult behavior',Like the infamous "Pacific Group" in LA.
There are also many very closed meetings of AA as well, by invtation only.

I suspect AA is ust a tool of freemasons for some unkown purpose.
I thought it odd how so many AA social events like dances are held at masonic temples.

Possibly AA is just a recrutment front for the freemasons. But very low pressure recruitment. And recruitment for what I don't know. Whatever it is they want them all cleaned up first.

And actually AA as a whole does not portray wilson & smith as holy men. If one reads the other books about their lives AFTER the founding of AA it is reminded that these guys are no more pefect than any of us. Bill Wilson spent the late 50's on '___'! And a marijuana smoker, this s no secret withn AA.

AA is harmless though. It helps people find what they need. For most, a life beyond AA. Only about 1% actually "make it" and become "oldtimers". Everyone else figures out what BS it is and finds some other solution to their problems after years of sittng on uncomfortable metal chairs, drinking bad coffee, hearing the same guy tell his life story for the 800th time.

If there's any "big secret" AA is hiding is that only 5% of people coming in ever get more than 90 days"sober". Even fewer get years. And even though courts mandate AA meeting attendance, there s no way in hell AA meeting attendance can EVER be verified. it's anonymous! I don't know why judges even bother.

And then there are the middle aged guys with decades 'sober" who like to "sponsor" teenage girls... AA is full of predators, all kinds. many of these folks may stop drinking, but don't stop other behaviors. And though the book says one thing, attend years of meetings and you will learn a different story.

But secret society... no. just the blind leading the blind.

[edit on 13-4-2006 by pete1051]

posted on Apr, 13 2006 @ 05:16 AM
Fantastic perspective on this thread, GREAT JOB on this pick of Cultish groups.

I once dated a girl, who was brilliant and headstrong, though she liked to have innocent chilltime with the sauce and the smoke. Due to a family obligation on my part, we separated and she "fell" for someone else. She kept up her pattern of behavior, and ended up being sloshed and flying like a kite one night, and cheated on him. She told him of her mistake, and he would never take her back.

This headstrong Brilliant woman was broken at what she had done, so she turned to AA and got herself "cured".

I cannot give an accurate description of how she changed, but she lost her individuality, and she became a sheeple. She then started pulling family members into this group, who did not have any history with substance abuse. Then like a pack of "Koreshies", they would attend meeting 4 or more times a week, their whole lives revolved around it, no better description they lived it, it was now an unseperable part of them.

Did she need help in the form of AA? Who knows for sure. My guess of a diagnosis is she had a nervous breakdown, and thought this place would be where she could get help. Not only did they "help" her, they reprogrammed her to be a self loathing, non-confident, AA movement zombie. It wasn't going to bring this guy back, but I bet she thought it would, and now she's in so deep they tell her it's raining, when it's sunny, and she believes it.

Personally, I feel it was poor decision making, that she cheated on this dude. She could have just disciplined herself not to cheat again, it was not a pattern of behavior she had before, then again she was a swinger before she met him. So old habits die hard and you think the drugs made you cheat, honey please... However, that spark that made her amazing is gone, and now she is just a sucking pit who let AA take the reigns while she functions on autopilot.


posted on Jul, 1 2008 @ 07:27 PM
OK, so I would say that AA is a Secret Society for a couple of reasons. One being that they have meeting that are what they call "closed". The reasoning behind this is that only the alcoholics may go. Meaning only the members. But according to the 3rd tradition of AA anyone may join AA, and there is nothing said about you have to call yourself an alcoholic. But if you don't call yourself an Alcoholic you are frowned upon. A lot of people get real upset if you go to AA and call yourself anything else IE: drug addict, over eater, gambler, etc...

The majority of members of AA do believe they are chosen. Chosen to be awakened by their Higher Power. This is interesting, because the first thing they pound into you when you go is the fact that you are powerless. You are powerless over every aspect of your life. I have heard it to many times in these meetings that people know they will die if they go back out and drink. There are to many relapse rs in the program to be true.

There is brain washing and reprogramming in the AA program. At first look this seems like a good idea, because nobody likes a miserable drunk. (They would much rather have a sober miserable alcoholic). The start teaching your ways to cope etc... but I think they go wrong with the whole you are nothing without us stuff.

AA is filled with people wall to wall with low self esteem. To me this seems to be the biggest part of the whole programming issue. Just like Moonies, Mormon, Freemasons, they make you believe you need them instead of teaching you too be independent. The seek out the weak soul to reform and train.

I am not saying AA is a bad thing, don't get me wrong. I believe AA is a step on the way to bigger things, but if you don't have enough self to seek further you become stagnant, complacent and bored. This leads to many people relapsing.

posted on Jul, 2 2008 @ 12:59 AM
I have been a member of AA and NA for over 18 yrs. . We are a group of people who have seemingly been in the grip of a deadly disease that defies the use of will power and good intentions. We use the process of attraction and not promotion. We use a set of 'spiritual principals' to arrest the progress of the disease. It is not a process of abstaining only that promotes sober and clean behavior, it is the application of spiritual principals in our daily lives that relieves us from active addiction.

The Big Book and the Basic Text are quite clear about the process of getting and maintaining sobriety or clean time. Purists in the program of AA refer to their time as 'sobriety', NA nazis refer to it as 'clean time'. A slight nuance for non-members but a point of contention for the hard cores of each group.

I suggest reading their literature with an open mind and stop guessing about how it works. The 12 Steps are quite simple and clear to follow, we also have 12 Traditions that we use in our daily lives. The 'program' is not for everybody, I watch aquaintences and friends screw with this disease all the time, very few get out alive. It's pretty sad really.

I personally have tried every possible combination of therapy, group work, psycho-active drugs prescribed some of the "best professionals' in the business, abstaining, and standing on my head spitting nickels to stop from using and drinking, but this set of 'spiritual principles' is the only set of tools that has worked for me day in and day out.

Call it what you want, but I get a daily reprieve based on using simple spiritual, not religious, principals to stop my active addiction. This is not to say that I don't have times when I think about drinking and using, because I do, but I am free from the craving and active addiction.

I will relate a short discussion that I recently had with my 21 yr. old son concerning this vary subject. His early childhood, by the way was absolutley destroyed because of my addiction, but I digress.

He asked me last weekend if I thought that I could drink socially, now that I had 18 yrs. sober. I hesitated in my response, because I didn't want to sound like some meeting Guru. My reply to him upon reflection, was that I realized that I never used or drank socially to begin with. I drank and used alone and if I did go to a party I always made sure I brought enough for the people at the party, but I always had my own bottle of what ever it was, because I did not share my sh!t with anybody. Most 'normies' don't even have a clue what I'm talking about. I was completely owed by my addiction. Some folks can walk away from it, I was lucky enough to crawl away almost completely destroyed from the disease to get sober and clean.

If you aren't one of us then you won't get what I'm talking about, if you are one of us you will. Call it a 'secret society' or a 'cult' if you like, don't go to meetings if you don't want to and dance with the devil alone. It is a heroic and epic thing if you can dance with devil, but he usually wins when facing mere mortals. The disease takes no prisoners, only souls. I speak of it in almost mythic terms because it defies explaination sometimes. It is the dragon and the dragon fears no man.

[edit on 2-7-2008 by sharkman]

posted on Jul, 2 2008 @ 01:18 AM
reply to post by Cug
It definitely is. I do think that they will try to form a union and abolish all forms of religious and possibly Amish ways of thinking. This is a crucial step in preparations of total world domination. Hopefully they will be stopped by the Budweiser foundation and brought to justice!

posted on Jul, 2 2008 @ 03:54 PM
OK so you say that AA has been your only answer, and you have claimed to tried everything. But I am going to make another hypothesis. How about you haven't tried everything.

How about honesty? The most overlooked detail in life. The book says "... they too recover if they have the capacity to be honest". Well to me that looks like honesty is an issue. Mostly honestly with ourselves though. The ability to admit, confess and let go. The hardest being to let go, cause if we do not we carry guilt.

When looking at the behavior of anyone recovering from anything, the fear and guilt tend to over ride the need to be honest. After all how humiliating has the past actions been? The system of the world is devised on lies. You cannot tell anyone your deep dark secrets (especially if it is something illegal), with out the fear of jail and prison.

I was told a couple things by an AA member once that seemed very important, and I still think they are important. 1) That everyone has one big deep dark secret that they are never gonna tell anyone. 2) That this secret involved one of four things... incest, rape, molestation, or murder. These things are never uncovered. Not taking care of these issues will get the alcoholic drunk again, guaranteed.

AA is not the place to discuss these issues. People inside the program need to wake up and realize there can be other ways to sober up, places they can get the help they need. I have been involved with AA since 1982. I am no better or worse than any one else. But if left to the beliefs of AA I would be a real mess still. It took the help from many places to create the world I wanted.

There is a strong political game that goes on inside of the AA system. The game of one upmanship is the most obvious to me. That and the blame and guilt game. Often heard is the following: "What step didn't you work?", "How much time do you have?", "You should have let go...", etc...
This is all fine, but what happens when they did all they could do and yet still go back out? They come back to this statement, "oh you relapsed", like its a character defect or something.

If you believe this is a disease you need to treat people like they have a disease. If you have cancer, it goes into remission and then it may come back. But if it does come back do you berate the person who has it?? If the cancer comes back and they choose not to have therapy for it does that make them a bad person?

Point being, AA is NOT the only answer for alcoholism. I know many who do not go to AA for help, and are very happy and sober. Or have been there and discovered what I did. There are other ways than to be brain washed. Oh sure AA helps and I wont deny that. They have helped me change my life, in many ways that are good. But to live inside the walls of AA and not expand your universe is a death trap.

I use to believe AA was the only answer as well. It wasn't till I got the courage to go outside the barriers of AA that I discover that other things in my life needed improving. Most of us need more than to quit drinking. I think that is where the saying about the drunken horse thief comes in. If you take the alcohol away from a drunken horse thief what do you have? Well you still have a horse thief, but he just isn't drunk anymore, thats all.

Steps 6 and 7 of the AA program are way over looked and need more emphisis.

AA is a good first step... that's all... gotta keep seeking, like in the eleventh step... "sought through prayer and meditation, to improve our conscious contact....

posted on Sep, 8 2008 @ 08:25 AM

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 04:51 AM

posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 07:28 PM
My major gripes with AA are

1. It defines "alcoholic" too broadly. There are alcoholics who have a physical addiction to alcohol. These people are not capable of drinking in moderation without destroying themselves.

There are also people who have or once had "less than ideal" drinking habbits. I (and many of you) could be considered one of them. I used to binge drink while in college. A couple years ago my wife and I got drunk on New Year's Eve.

These people are not really alcoholics as AA claims. They can drink in moderation. For example, I have a glass of wine with dinner about once a week. After my single glass of wine, I go several days without touching alcohol. I feel no urge to have alcohol. Yet according to AA, once you are what they consider to be an "alcoholic," drinking in moderation is impossible.

2. AA is also too simplistic and binary. It defines the world in terms of alcoholics and people who do not suffer from alcoholism, sobriety and drunkenness. Perhaps this is helpful for the unsophisticated person, who cannot understand nuances. There are however sophisticated people that need help with alcohol problems that will not take help from a source that lacks credibility.

posted on Nov, 29 2008 @ 11:13 PM
This is a June 1947 letter to the grapevine from Bill W.
The pyramid inside Circle is 1. Masonic, 2. Majick, 3., the a.a. symbol.
Google the FEMA symbol. And Solomon's circle.
Anyway, one key word to me in this article is ROCKEFELLER. A.A. moneyman.
There are other names I have yet to research.
There is only one still pure, UNDEFILED Religion and that is James 1:27. LDAeHAtgeXo5j-CA&usg=AFQjCNH7hIeowA1DEGx1DRbF-UzAOKss1g&sig2=skFHCLxA02s54wRo1gJ6SQ

This is also VERY interesting to me.

Today, we look at time going backward. We see 15 billion years. Looking forward from when the universe is very small - billions of times smaller - the Torah says six days. In truth, they both may be correct. What's exciting about the last few years in cosmology is we now have quantified the data to know the relationship of the "view of time" from the beginning, relative to the "view of time" today. It's not science fiction any longer. Any one of a dozen physics text books all bring the same number. The general relationship between time near the beginning and time today is a million million. That's a 1 with 12 zeros after it. So when a view from the beginning looking forward says "I'm sending you a pulse every second," would we see it every second? No. We'd see it every million million seconds. Because that's the stretching effect of the expansion of the universe.

The Torah doesn't say every second, does it? It says Six Days. How would we see those six days? If the Torah says we're sending information for six days, would we receive that information as six days? No. We would receive that information as six million million days. Because the Torah's perspective is from the beginning looking forward. Six million million days is a very interesting number. What would that be in years? Divide by 365 and it comes out to be 16 billion years. Essentially the estimate of the age of the universe. Not a bad guess for 3000 years ago.

posted on Nov, 30 2008 @ 12:57 AM
This topic is highly offensive. As someone who has family members who have gone through AA and changed their lives around, I am flabbergasted at your assessment that it does more harm than good. In what way? By helping people who are hurting themselves and the community? This is a group that encourages people to do something with their lives and to stop being dependent on alcohol. The original poster is absolutely off their rocker, and should probably stop spreading messages of hate about an excellent organization.

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