BREAKING! 2005 ATS Council Election News: Valhall Withdraws, Announces Endorsements

ThurmalNuke it's posts like yours that councilors will have to clean up. Not a very nice post. You should not insult people or call them names, no matter if they are right or wrong.

No, You pointed out your own near sighted stupidity in a bid to slander someone. Congratulations, you have single handedly made the entire forum base more idiotic.

Im sure the ACLU and National Gay Pride Committee will take you in.

Christ, you are on the low side of special ed class arnt you?

and you alone dwell to spew forth your male cow feces.

Seriously, If you want to play imaginary world, I know a place down the road where the retards work.

[edit on 26-5-2005 by Ycon]

Originally posted by Ycon
ThurmalNuke it's posts like yours that councilors will have to clean up. Not a very nice post. You should not insult people or call them names, no matter if they are right or wrong.

Y...I think you're right. You guys have a big job ahead of you. My son - he's a flaming conservative...very much so, even more than mommy!

pffffft

haha, I saw that warn coming from 10 miles away, but I still thought it was funny to read

The Powers Of A Councilor

Originally posted by Ycon
ThurmalNuke it's posts like yours that councilors will have to clean up. Not a very nice post. You should not insult people or call them names, no matter if they are right or wrong.

I agree with the sentiment, of course.

Bashing one another and general bigotry are things I would love to see much less of on ATS.

But is that something councilors will "have to clean up"?

They will be able to slap warns on people if they see fit, but I think the moderators are the people who we should rely on for actual "clean up" -- and as this example shows, while they aren't omniscient, they are indeed on top of things.

In my opinion, the real challenge for councilors will not involve being "junior mods", but finding ways to encourage members to avoid making such posts in the first place. The culture is already geared toward that.

Among many other things, we will look to councilors to help drive that message home.

Originally posted by Majic
The Powers Of A Councilor



But is that something councilors will "have to clean up"?

They will be able to slap warns on people if they see fit,

pffft - You're beside yourself, right? Oh my.

In my opinion, the real challenge for councilors will not involve being "junior mods", but finding ways to encourage members to avoid making such posts in the first place.

Okay, I'm hoping to see the cessation of board stalking, of members who can't accept a differing opinion and still stay civil to the opposing view, of people who realize the world doesn't revolve around them, and members who realize that this is our communication forum - not a place to power-monger, or create a fallacious "empire". Let me know what your thoughts on those desires are - and I'm serious. Don't blow me off...You've got the big attitude, tell me how you're going to help me. Because in order to "avoid making such posts" you're going to have to pull something out of your verbose backside that will prevent board stalking, fallacious accusations, constant back-biting and downright delusion that leads to members like JoeDoaks thinking they're riding a horse and crusading against some weird "evil" they've concocted in their minds.

Guess why my son got a warn and JoeDoaks didn't? Because he included in his condemnation of a member that has repeatedly done nothing but spew vitriol - references to a target that can not be aimed at...well isn't that something?

Repeatedly calling another member derogatory names, or acting in a manner that repeatedly violates TOC, or some one who repeatedly personally attacks other members and falsely accuses them of things, or treats other members as if they are some one who is undeserving of respect as a fellow human being...simply because the other member doesn't agree with you... is obviously NOT crossing any line.

Good luck. You seem to think yourself worthy to deem what can be addressed here, who can address it, and how they can address it. Good luck, majik.

Originally posted by RANT
Giant Spiders

From Allah!

Tiny Cowboys riding Giant Spiders

"there's tiny little men, Keeeeept agianst their will, keeeept agianst their will...oooh there's tiny little men!"


Thermonuke?

Nuclear war? On the dance floor?

Originally posted by Majic
The Powers Of A Councilor


But is that something councilors will "have to clean up"?

but I think the moderators are the people who we should rely on for actual "clean up" --

In my opinion, the real challenge for councilors will not involve being "junior mods", but finding ways to encourage members to avoid making such posts in the first place.

Majic by clean up I meant, rid the forum of them type of posts by getting members to post friendly. thermoNuke is a newer member and probably didn't realize that posts like that are not allowed.

The Worthiness Of Opinions

Originally posted by Valhall
Good luck. You seem to think yourself worthy to deem what can be addressed here, who can address it, and how they can address it. Good luck, majik.

I most certainly have many opinions, some stronger than others. Some percentage of them are wrong, and some percentage of them are positively asinine.

Such is the nature of opinions.

As for whether I am worthy to adjudge the things you have listed, your own post outlines precisely such an agenda.

Additionally, you are cynically posting assumptions about me that are not justified by anything I have posted, which I find disappointing.

Are my opinions less worthy than anyone else's?

What Is An ATS DISC Councilor, Anyway?

What would I do as the ATS DISC Councilor?

I don't know. I have some ideas, but I've never even had access to DISC, so it would be pretty silly of me to make assumptions about something I can't even find out about yet.

Regardless of whether it's me or someone else, I do expect all councilors to act as liaisons between the membership and the staff, and to advocate for what most members want.

Some of that can come from polling, some from listening, and sometimes you just have to make a decision and go for it.

I freely and publicly admit that I don't know if I'm qualified to be the ATS DISC Councilor.

I have some ideas about what the job would entail -- and obviously some opinions -- but that's about it.

Things I Would Likely Do As ATS DISC Councilor -- Current Plan

My initial plan if elected -- and subject to change as I learn more -- is to spend at least a week focusing on “homework” -- primarily catching up on what's been going on with DISC to find out what DISC members have already discussed, what was accepted and what rejected.

It would be pointless for me to make proposals in ignorance that have already been floated and rejected by DISC.

Additionally, in that first week, I would need to find some assistants. I would be allotted two of them, per SO's post on the subject.

I would want one who was an expert and heavy contributor to the Debate Forum who I would consider the authority on that. The other assistant would be the authority on the Collaborative Fiction Forum. Both would have to want the job, and be assured that I would not get in the way of their experience in these areas.

While they would be “assistants”, I would lobby to have the staff consider granting them powers equivalent to mine, as well as access to the DISC forum. I would want either of them to be suited to take over my job whenever necessary, would make sure they knew that, and would reach agreement on who would be “next” up if I'm not available for some reason.

I would not consider them subordinates, but fellow councilors in all but name.

I would also lobby my fellow elected councilors to consider granting assistant councilors some degree of voting powers on the council, which would give us more points of view to work with, and more direct representation of the assistants.

Failing that, I would still consult my assistants on all votes.

Solving Problems Or Making New Ones?

We expect all sorts of grand things from our new councilors, but I advise skepticism. We're talking about fellow members, not messiahs. They are officially considered subordinate to moderators, and will have no actual control over staff decisions.

In other words, councilors must exercise influence through persuasion, and will have little else to work with. Great things can be done through persuasion, but expecting more from councilors than they can deliver will do nothing but create unnecessary disappointment all around.

And what of the question of who is worthy or not worthy to opine on what councilors should or should not do?

Frankly, I am concerned about the direction ATS could go if councilors were to adopt the notion that they can dictate to members what opinions are worthy and what are not.

I think it would be tragic, and I see the seeds of just such a calamity already being planted -- even in this very thread.

Am I less worthy than you or anyone else to have opinions on these things?

Are the opinions of any member more or less worthy than others?

The answers to these questions will differ, but they are important questions nonetheless.

I speak as a nominee who may or may not be elected.

Regardless of how that may go, I hope my words will not be forgotten.

Originally posted by Majic
My initial plan if elected -- and subject to change as I learn more -- is to spend at least a week focusing on “homework” -- primarily catching up on what's been going on with DISC to find out what DISC members have already discussed, what was accepted and what rejected.

That would require getting admited to DISC tho. MWa hahahaha.

Councilors will, from what I understand, not have 'power', but responsibilities. There is no 'power' on ATS except the typed weilded by Administration (the overlord, the consultant, some others, and of course the Founder). The rest of us, mods, councilors, members have responsibilities. From what I understand, councilors will be doing things like receiving complaints, suggestions, and comments, from people i about their respective topic areas. The councilors will have to find some way to communicate with each other the concners, complaints, suggestions, and comments, of their consituents (which is really just the entire board) to each other, and try to work with membership to establish a consensus amoung them and communicate that consensus to the other councilors, whether its that 'red warn flags should be bigger' or 'there should be a forum on creationist and evolution' or 'nygdan is such a frilling jackass, do something about that' and then make the case to administration for what can be done, and then explain to their constituents why some things can't be done and why other things can't be done now, etc etc. Councilors aren't 'junior mods'.

Skeptic Overlord made a good analogy, which i paraphrase in my own terminology: 'Mods are Janitors, Councilors are Aldermen' /women/hermaprhodites/grey-human hybrids/reptiloids/chicks/etc

If nothing else, I find the situation extraordinarily interesting. I hope that everyone can appreciate and contemplate the bizzareness that is going on right now, all because of 'politics and elections'. Look at what membership is doing to itself. I'm not complaining about the process, I like it, its good. Look at the nature that gets revealed from it. People assume that sinister plots to extend power are in play, that neopotism runs rampant, that the board is in chaos and mischeif is afoot.

Truth is the same thing that is allways going on in the background is going on now, 'cept now its obviously 'politics'. Whats politics anyway, but how people interact with each other? Normally all these little issues are running around on our own sides of these computer screens anyway, now we can see them for what they are.

Lets not worry about politcs. Lets not worry about 'what the other guys angle' is or who's doing what 'behind the scenes of the board'. We're all here to discuss right? This is a discussion board. The uppy ups decided it might be a good idea to give the membership a way to communicate their concerns, rather than only fillout complaint and suggestion forms. Lets all take advantage of this oppurtunity and try to work some of the issues out. These are the kinds of things that the councilors will have to address, they'll have to take in the politics, and try to cut it away and prevent it from interfereing with the rest of the board by putting it to productive and earnest use. IMO anyway, none of this is 'official' or whatnot.

As to responding to Thermonuke or Val- it's been done by other posters.

I received a u2u from Zedd pretty much telling me to 'hit the road'. I take that as a pre-ban. So that little flag that Thermo got for far worse than I am accused of doing should really mean something. Zedd also seems to be of the mis-impression I posted in this thread to 'be large.' If this were not so sad, it would be hilarious.

I started a politics at ATS thread. If it survives great. If it gets the trash-bin, well so much for politics at ATS.

Whichever way things go I do wish this experiment well. I, 100%, believe in democracy and the power of the vote.

I don't appreciate being told what to think or how to think. These also, are part of politics.

This guy named Winston re-appeared fairly recently asking why things have changed.

Mammaries On A Male Porcine

Originally posted by Nygdan
That would require getting admited to DISC tho. MWa hahahaha.

I can only imagine how useless an ATS DISC Councilor would be that didn't have access to DISC.

As it is, I am just about totally clueless about what goes on in that mystical, esoteric enclave.

Is it true that DISC has an open bar and bottomless bowls of peel 'n' eat shrimp in the lounge?

Hopefully, whoever gets tapped by the members for DISC Councilor will be permitted to find out.

[edit on 5/26/2005 by Majic]

Originally posted by JoeDoaks
This guy named Winston re-appeared fairly recently asking why things have changed.

Honestly, I think the position of these Councillors is a control mechanism to enforce the T&C of this privately-owned board.

as posted by Jamuhn
....position of these Councillors is a control mechanism to enforce the T&C of this privately-owned board.

First off, Jamuhn, it was roughly explained what the "councillors" would do and be to and within the ATS community.

Secondly, you have a problem with this, Jamuhn?
"Rules" [T&Cs] too much for you to have to follow?
I'm almost sure you must be typing your posts and comments from prison, cause if you have such a problem with "control" and "rules" then apparently in real-life, you are having major issues, as well?
If your not aware of this already, allow me to help you out here a little: "rules" and Terms and Conditions of Use are NOT restricted to simply "this" private board. Terms and Conditions exist on virtually ALL internet BBs, etc. Shocked, huh?

If your having an "issue" here, please enlighten us all, k, cause obviously I'm not seeing the 'issue' as you are making out/indicating/insinuating in your post above?




seekerof

[edit on 27-5-2005 by Seekerof]

Run Jamuhn, Run!

Originally posted by Seekerof
You have a problem with this, Jamuhn?
"Rules" too much for you to have to follow?

Jamuhn, look out! They are on to you man!

Next thing you know you'll be losing time or disappearing altogether while you renegotiate your contract, then come back even more wooden an actor than before!

Dude, he's coming for you, and he's sporting an entire case of smokes...



You need to see if the Lone Gunmen can hide you, because if not, oh dude...



phear teh uber cancer man

Edit: This terminal has been compromised. Jamuhn, they're getting closer [ack!]


[edit on 5/27/2005 by Majic]

Originally posted by Seekerof

as posted by Jamuhn
....position of these Councillors is a control mechanism to enforce the T&C of this privately-owned board.

First off, Jamuhn, it was roughly explained what the "councillors" would do and be to and within the ATS community.

Secondly, you have a problem with this, Jamuhn?
"Rules" [T&Cs] too much for you to have to follow?
If your not aware of this already, allow me to help you out here a little: "rules" and Terms and Conditions of Use are NOT restricted to simply "this" private board. Terms and Conditions exist on virtually ALL internet BBs, etc. Shocked, huh?

Amazing how you are able to see so much in just one sentence of observation. I do have a problem with ATS rules, I do have a problem with US policy. But I can handle them. And I know that fighting over the silly ATS rules is not fruitful in the slightest bit. So, frankly, I don't care what happens at this board and neither do I care to discuss your insignificant ATS rules. I just come here for news and to discuss it, that's it.

Obviously, it seems that you have a problem with my disagreement and general apathy towards ATS rules. So what are you going to do about it?

To Majic, I understand most of what you are trying to say, but other parts I don't. If you have something to say to me, then say it, and don't hide behind your sarcasm.

Sarcasm: The First Refuge Of A Scoundrel

Originally posted by Jamuhn
To Majic, I understand most of what you are trying to say, but other parts I don't. If you have something to say to me, then say it, and don't hide behind your sarcasm.

Well, actually I wasn't being sarcastic, just playing on the drama.

On the one hand, we have Jamuhn suggesting a dark conspiracy on, of all places, a conspiracy site.

On the other, we have Seekerof, a moderator with a delightfully creepy avatar, responding with thinly veiled threats.

Is that drama? Oh yes. Yes indeed. That's drama.

So how do I weigh in? With more drama, of course. I think a little drama is healthy now and then.

For fun, I decided to characterize this as Jamuhn, the renegade truth seeker, versus Seekerof, the menacing champion of the dark conspiracy.

With the X-Files avatar, the rest just wrote itself.

I'm injecting a little more drama -- perhaps wrongly -- into the confrontation.

Is drama required?

Personally, I don't see this as a classic “free speech” versus “private board” argument, but I can be terribly naive.

I don't think Jamuhn's expressed apathy is necessarily a call for member rebellion, and I don't think Seekerof's response is necessarily a sign that the tanks are about to roll through the streets.

If nobody's violating the T&C -- and I don't see either of you doing that -- then it's cool.

Skepticism about ATS rules? I am a skeptic, too.

It's troubling to see the discussion get snippy, but I get snippy too -- more often than I would like.

Is disagreement, even on ATS rules, wrong? In my opinion, a lack of disagreement on anything would be death to ATS.

That's my opinion.

Yours may vary.




Edit: Forced by The Man (meaning spelling errors)

[edit on 5/27/2005 by Majic]