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Why do some people feel the need to post outright lies about Masons and Masonry?

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posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 12:06 AM
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Originally posted by TxSecret[/i

You CAN'T divorce freemasonry from the fact that it DOES have "sway", albeit a very heavy sway on ones spiritual path. (A seemingly veiled sway at that) The devil works through deception. In the Bible, God is very clear about what he thinks about people who lead his sheep astray. (I hate to call people sheep but I'lll be God's sheep ANY DAY.)


But thats just it TxS, masonry doesnt hold sway over your spiritual path.. all the order asks is that you HAVE a spiritual path, and they leave it that.

eleboration to that might come up in private between masons cenversing together, but as the nature of your own spiritual path.. the lodge doesnt care.. it breaks down like this

Q. Do you belive in the existance of a supreme being who is responsible for the creation of all things

A. Yes.

Q. Do you belive in a "Hereafter" (Heaven, valhalla, ellysium)

A. Yes

Q Do you have a desire to help your fellow man, to aid those in both physical and spiritual need?

A. Yes

Thats all the lodge cares about.. and the reason for this.. is that they know that people know God by many different names.. and God spoke to the people in many different voices, and as long as you belive in the existance, and belive that God wants us to do good.. then the lodge has enough faith in it's members not to concern itself with the name that you know God by.

Now you have admitted to not knowing as much as you should about the masons, that is good.. admitting you dont know enough is the first step in learning more.. and to that end i have some suggested reading for you.

Freemasons: Inside the worlds oldest secret society, By H. pual Jeffers
The temple and the lodge, By Michael Baigent & Richard Leigh
The templars, By Peirs Paul Read (not so much about masonry itself, but the templars are a huge part of the masonic history)
The lost treasure of the knights templar (The legend from which the movie "Nation Treasure" is based)
A Dictionary of Freemasonry, By Robert Macoy


Now to the best of my knowlege.. only the last title is written by a mason. although one of the books.. Ether F:ItWOSS, or TTaTL was written by the grandson (isnt is always the grandson?) of a mason

I have found the first three books to be very unbiased and for the purpose of laying out historical fact with very little specualtion (save for the William Morgan affair for which very little concrete facts are known)

I would also caution you against readin anything by david icke, but if you do read anything by him. .. you will likely find like i did that he is little more then a propagandist that uses christian fears to sell books.

As i once again state.. i am not a mason.. but i refuse to take anything at face value.. i wanted to know the truth.. so i did my homework and while there have been more then one mason to tarnish the silverware in the cupboard, the whole of the order does not reflect this...

now i'm not gonna name any names of those less then polished masons.. but here are a few of the good ones

George Washington
Benjamin Franklin
Harry S Truman
Winston Chruchill
Robert the Bruce
King James (Yes THAT King James)
The Late King Abdula of Jordan (One of the single greatest allies of the US and the UN in the middle east)
The current King Abdula II (a facinating fellow, he acually dresses up as feeble old men and then makes use of his nations own civil services to test them and see if they are being good to the people)

this is but a tiny.. tiny list of some of the best that the order has been blessed with in calling it's own




posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 12:11 AM
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Originally posted by Khonsu

Originally posted by resistance

So this verse does not mean some brotherhood of man, universal church, world religion type of connotation at all. It means just that anyone is welcome in God's House if they love God, believe in Him, and serve Him.

[edit on 20-10-2005 by resistance]


Key words:"Anyone is welcome in God's House if they love God, believe in Him, and serve Him."

Exactly, God, not Christianitys God, not Islams God, just the one and only G-O-D. Sounds a lot like Freemasonry to me.


Wrong. It's very specific. It is Christianity's God (Isaiah 56) -- one must have "joined himself to the LORD, keep the sabbath, choose the things that please me (God), and take hold of my covenant; ... join themselves to the LORD, to seve himm, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of MY (i.e.the Judeo-Christian God's) covenant :

This does not apply to every Tom, Dick and Harry that might walk into God's House. This refers to those who are truly God's people. FYI, Christianity's God is the one and only God. Satan/Lucifer/ Ra/Bel/Baal/Osiris/etcetera, Allah, Buddah, Krishna, whoever, are false gods.



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 12:51 AM
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English is my second laguege .
English is not the subject here u'r off the subject , don't get upset with me
but that is what i belive.
I told you who would scream the loudest would win, it would be a paradise for you to talk about this matter with out any strong evidence

One must be blind not to see it.
If you are going to debate this mater do it with knolege, with what you know not with insults.
I came to this conclusion cause of the material i have reviewed documentarys, enciclopedia and articles that show solid evidence that sustains the opinion i have.
It is what i belive but you are free to have a opinion.



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 12:57 AM
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Originally posted by Becon of Light

now i'm not gonna name any names of those less then polished masons.. but here are a few of the good ones

George Washington
Benjamin Franklin
Harry S Truman
Winston Chruchill
Robert the Bruce
King James (Yes THAT King James)
The Late King Abdula of Jordan (One of the single greatest allies of the US and the UN in the middle east)
The current King Abdula II (a facinating fellow, he acually dresses up as feeble old men and then makes use of his nations own civil services to test them and see if they are being good to the people)

this is but a tiny.. tiny list of some of the best that the order has been blessed with in calling it's own



I don't know about some of these, but King James was not.

Here's a link. George Washington hated the Masons. It's true he joined when a young man but he disavowed them. The Masons like to say everybody good was a Mason. The Masons had some kind of dark hold on George Washington, it's true. They bore his body in funeral procession, and Martha would not even appear. I've always wondered what the real story is with George Washington and the Masons and still haven't found out to my satisfaction.
www.saintsalive.com...



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 01:15 AM
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Originally posted by resistance
FYI, Christianity's God is the one and only God. Satan/Lucifer/ Ra/Bel/Baal/Osiris/etcetera, Allah, Buddah, Krishna, whoever, are false gods.


Ok dude, you're crazy!


Originally posted by resistance
I don't know about some of these, but King James was not.

Here's a link. George Washington hated the Masons. It's true he joined when a young man but he disavowed them. The Masons like to say everybody good was a Mason. The Masons had some kind of dark hold on George Washington, it's true. They bore his body in funeral procession, and Martha would not even appear. I've always wondered what the real story is with George Washington and the Masons and still haven't found out to my satisfaction.


Yup, see, CRAZY!

Im' done with you.



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 01:22 AM
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Originally posted by resistance

Wrong. It's very specific. It is Christianity's God (Isaiah 56)


Dont you mean the Jew's God? that the christians claimed as their own? lets remember that the book of Isaiah is from the old testemant.. from the time before Yeshua and the new testement.

And yes.. James was very much a freemason, and he broke from the catholic chruch to start the protestant movement (root word Protest) because the vatican was pressuing him to disavow masonry and give up the knights templar, whom he had granted refuge within the british isles



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 06:10 AM
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Originally posted by Khonsu

Originally posted by resistance

So this verse does not mean some brotherhood of man, universal church, world religion type of connotation at all. It means just that anyone is welcome in God's House if they love God, believe in Him, and serve Him.



Key words:"Anyone is welcome in God's House if they love God, believe in Him, and serve Him."

Exactly, God, not Christianitys God, not Islams God, just the one and only G-O-D. Sounds a lot like Freemasonry to me.


Oh Khonsu,

Don't go confusing resistance with facts. His brain will explode (or his toilet, perhaps)



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 06:16 AM
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Originally posted by Becon of Light

Originally posted by resistance

Wrong. It's very specific. It is Christianity's God (Isaiah 56)


Dont you mean the Jew's God? that the christians claimed as their own? lets remember that the book of Isaiah is from the old testemant.. from the time before Yeshua and the new testement.

And yes.. James was very much a freemason, and he broke from the catholic chruch to start the protestant movement (root word Protest) because the vatican was pressuing him to disavow masonry and give up the knights templar, whom he had granted refuge within the british isles


The Catholic Church is the biggest Illuminist conspirator of all. They tried to blow up Parliament to prevent the KJB from being distributed. They are a perfect example of the eye of Horus, the pyramid, with the evil pope at the top pulling the strings, using mind control, torture, and dirty tricks to run everybody's life below them, using all kinds of fancy titles. It's another copy of the Freemasons, the KKK, the Nazis, the Illuminati. Same bag of tricks, different costumes.



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 06:19 AM
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Originally posted by resistance
This does not apply to every Tom, Dick and Harry that might walk into God's House. This refers to those who are truly God's people. FYI, Christianity's God is the one and only God. Satan/Lucifer/ Ra/Bel/Baal/Osiris/etcetera, Allah, Buddah, Krishna, whoever, are false gods.


I think you'd better check your theology here....particularly concerning the Buddah. (I'll give you a hit, though...he was a Prophet) I'm not sure about this false god named "etcetera" though...I'll have to look into that myself.

In the mean time, have fun. I'm finished with you until you call me a devil-worshipper again and here's the reason which you as a "fundie" should be able to understand.

You see when you say Masons are devil-worshippers, you're calling ME a devil worshipper and consequently you're LYING about me.

Isn't lying a sin?

Or do born-again-fundamentalist Christians like yourself think it's OK to lie and spread hatred like you're doing when you say I'm a devil worshipper?

I've NEVER worshipped Satan, Lucifer, or even your false god "Etcetera" and I will not allow YOU or your ilk to LIE about me. Understand?



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 06:24 AM
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Oh Your Excellency, Most Notorious Senrak -- You are the one who bills yourself as a "notorious" freemason. You are bragging that you are a bad boy. I don't think it's cute, and I don't think the Freemasons are cute. I think it's a thoroughly wicked organization, and I would advise anyone in it to get out NOW.



[edit on 21-10-2005 by resistance]



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 06:27 AM
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Originally posted by resistance
The Catholic Church is the biggest Illuminist conspirator of all. They tried to blow up Parliament to prevent the KJB from being distributed. They are a perfect example of the eye of Horus, the pyramid, with the evil pope at the top pulling the strings, using mind control, torture, and dirty tricks to run everybody's life below them, using all kinds of fancy titles. It's another copy of the Freemasons, the KKK, the Nazis, the Illuminati. Same bag of tricks, different costumes.


Now I see into you resistance. You're a self-proclaimed born-again Christian, yet at the same time, your'e a hate-monger. You're not just anti-Mason, you're anti-Catholic and anti-anything and anyone who doesn't think the way you do.

You think that YOUR beliefs are adamantly RIGHT and anyone who thinks contrary to this is undenyably WRONG. How ironic. The God I know is the God of Love not hate. I feel very sad for you.

And as for the "evil Pope" as you said....yep. John Paul II (upon whom be Peace) now there's evil for you. I'll tell you what though (and this will probably put you into cardiac arrest) someday when you die (and assuming you actually make it to Heaven)...look around. John Paul II will be there.





using all kinds of fancy titles.


This seems to be a real problem for you as well. Are you jealous of TITLES just because no one's ever bestowed one upon you?

Oh well, keep spreading your hatred...it sure puts a good light on fundamentalist Christianity. [sigh]



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 06:34 AM
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Originally posted by resistance

Oh Your Excellency, Most Notorious Senrak --


Ah, more titles. Thank you resistance, you're TOO kind.



You are the one who bills yourself as a "notorious" freemason.


Actually that was given to me at a Masonic gathering in Washington DC some years back, but thank you for noticing.



You are bragging that you are a bad boy.


That's absurd.



I don't think it's cute,


and I don't CARE what you think



and I don't think the Freemasons are cute.


That's fine. There's a wonderful lady in my life named Mary who certainly thinks THIS Freemason is cute and neither of us cares at ALL what YOU think.



I think it's a thoroughly wicked organization,


Yep. Giving free medical help to crippled and burned children, caring for widows and orphans, assisting those in need. Evil stuff there. I'll bet your god "etcetera" would NEVER stand for such horrid acts, huh?



and I would advise anyone in it to get out NOW.


Well, boys, there you have it. Let's all drop by the Lodge Hall and turn in our aprons and rings and even our funny hats. Resistance has "advised" us and we all respect his opinion and advice so deeply.

Resistance, I'll say it again....you're WONDERFULLY entertaining.



[edit on 21-10-2005 by resistance]


[edit on 21-10-2005 by senrak]



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 06:43 AM
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Senrak -- You said:


Now I see into you resistance. You're a self-proclaimed born-again Christian, yet at the same time, your'e a hate-monger. You're not just anti-Mason, you're anti-Catholic and anti-anything and anyone who doesn't think the way you do.


I'm anti pyramid, eye of Horus, NWO devil-worshippers. That includes KKK, Mafia, Nazis, Catholic church, UN, CFR, Trilaterals, National Council of Churches, Church of Satan, Skull and Bones, Illuminati (which takes all you guys in), Mormons, and a few more. All you guys work with the pyramid, eye of Horus, and you are all trying to get your man (Satan) positioned to run the whole entire world, eliminating "fundies" like me altogether from the scene, saving the world by killing most of the people on it, ushering in your NWO utopian nightmare of microchipped robots.

educate-yourself.org...

The Illuminati Formula Used to Create an Undetectable Total Mind Controlled Slave
educate-yourself.org...

Deeper Insights into the Illuminati Formula
www.whale.to...

Monarch Mind Control Programming: What It Is
mindcontrolforums.com...



[edit on 21-10-2005 by resistance]



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 06:49 AM
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Originally posted by resistance
I'm anti pyramid, eye of Horus, NWO devil-worshippers. That includes KKK, Mafia, Nazis, Catholic church, UN, CFR, Trilaterals, National Council of Churches, Church of Satan, Skull and Bones, Illuminati (which takes all you guys in), Mormons, and a few more. All you guys work with the pyramid, eye of Horus, and you are all trying to get your man (Satan) positioned to run the whole entire world, eliminating "fundies" like me altogether from the scene, saving the world by killing most of the people on it, ushering in your NWO utopian nightmare of microchipped robots.


Interesting...you say "all YOU guys" (emphasis mine) and yet I'm not a member of any that you mentioned (unless I personally fall under "a few more")

You're not anti-this and that resistance. You're narrow-minded and paranoid. I do NOT mean that as an insult. You just don't know how to open your eyes or to think for yourself, so you have someone else think for you.

I'm not suggesting any love for the KKK or the Mafia, etc. But to spread lies about people you don't know anything about (I'm referring directly to your having called ME a "devil-worshipper") I take serious offense at that. I don't like being lied about, particularly by someone who a: does not know me and who b: CLAIMS to be a Christian. The Jesus I know wouldn't spread lies and hatred like you're doing. Maybe you know a different one, huh?



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 07:06 AM
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Originally posted by Becon of Light

now i'm not gonna name any names of those less then polished masons.. but here are a few of the good ones

George Washington
Benjamin Franklin
Harry S Truman
Winston Chruchill
Robert the Bruce
King James (Yes THAT King James)
The Late King Abdula of Jordan (One of the single greatest allies of the US and the UN in the middle east)
The current King Abdula II (a facinating fellow, he acually dresses up as feeble old men and then makes use of his nations own civil services to test them and see if they are being good to the people)

this is but a tiny.. tiny list of some of the best that the order has been blessed with in calling it's own

Becon

Your list is a little suspect. In common with 99.9% of historical figures, there is no evidence either way that Robert the Bruce was a freemason, and very little to go on for King James I (VI)

Although Lodge Scoon & Perth No. 3 (Scotland) claim James was made a mason in that lodge in 1611, further studies under the auspices of QCCC regard that claim as highly questionable (source: "The Master Masons to the Crown of Scotland," Edward Macbean [Junior Warden of Quatuor Coronati Lodge]: "...we may remark that the reception of the Scottish King is generally considered apocryphal." Ars Quatuor Coronatorum, vol. vii, London : 1894. p. 105.)

The lodge put the claim forward as part of an argument demonstating their age, and therefore their precedence, within the Grand Lodge of Scotland. Thus they were incentivized to make themselves as old as possible, and as there is no other primary data regarding this alleged initiation it must be regarded as unproven.

It is even less likely that Robert the Bruce (1274-1379) was a freemason as speculative freemasonry didn't exist then. You've been misinformed I'm afraid.

However the core point you are making is quite true. Many many great and honorable men have chosen to become freemasons and there are several sites where these lists can be found.

Not all of them were satanists



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 08:01 AM
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*Reads page*

*weeps for the 5 minutes I'll never get back*






posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 08:11 AM
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Originally posted by resistance
All you guys work with the pyramid, eye of Horus, and you are all trying to get your man (Satan) positioned to run the whole entire world, eliminating "fundies" like me altogether from the scene, saving the world by killing most of the people on it, ushering in your NWO utopian nightmare of microchipped robots.

All this time I thought resistance was just a brainwashed fundamentalist. Now I know he's actually crazy!


Microchipped robots...



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 08:46 AM
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Originally posted by TxSecret
*snip*

Golfie said something along these lines: "since we can't better our members without faith and we need a religion to have faith we will pick ANY old religion and use it to grow by"

Are you "seeing" the problem with this?

It may not matter to -you- what "god" anyone chooses to worship/"grow" by but it matters to the one and only REAL true living GOD. Seems like some of you get -real- irritated with scripture but I'm going to throw some more your way:


Wrong...I said no such thing.....

I said:



Masonry makes good men better. It does this by use of three tenets Faith, Hope and Charity. It's hard to have Faith without religion is it not? So to use Faith to better the man, Masonry must urge its' members to use the members' own personal religion (Faith) to better themselves. This means that a Christian Mason would put Christ at the center of their lives. It doesn't matter if you're sitting in a Lodge Meeting or a PTA meeting Christ is at the center of any Christian's Life. To a non-christian Mason...you are correct Christ wouldn't be at the center....but then again he might not even get an honorable mention.


I said that Masonry urges it's members to use the member's own personal religion to better themselves.

We don't pick "any old religion".....members have their own religion before they come to Masonry. We don't care if you're Christian, Jewish, Muslim....whatever....just that you believe in a Supreme Being. It's a novel concept...freedom of religion...so no I don't see a problem with that...believe it or not discussion of religion is strictly prohibited in Lodge.

Please don't manipulate my words.....



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 09:30 AM
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Originally posted by intrepid
*Reads page*
*weeps for the 5 minutes I'll never get back*


LOL! Aw C'mon Intrepid, It reminds me of the days when drivel was here displaying his vast knowledge

...well half-vast knowledge anyway....




posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 10:10 AM
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Originally posted by resistance

I don't know about some of these, but King James was not.


It is sometimes mistakenly said that King James was a Mason. He was not, but he was still important in Masonic history. He was the one who issued a charter to the Masons Company of London, which in turn chartered the four Lodges that eventually would create the first Grand Lodge a century later.




George Washington hated the Masons. It's true he joined when a young man but he disavowed them. The Masons like to say everybody good was a Mason.


This is NOT true. Washington served two terms as Worshipful Master of Alexandria Lodge in Virginia, and attended "tent Lodge meetings" on the battlefield during the Revolutionary War. After the war, he continued to attend Lodge, and was active in Masonry. So much so that Lafayette's wife made a Masonic apron for him, which her husband presented to Washington as a gift, after he became President of the United States.

On September 18, 1793, a Masonic ceremony was held to lay the cornerstone of the Capital Building. George Washington presided as Worshipful Master.

LETTERS OF GEORGE WASHINGTON

3 January 1792

To the Ancient York Masons of the Jurisdiction of Pennsylvania.

Gentlemen & Brothers,

I receive your kind congratulations with the purest sensations of fraternal affection; and from a heart deeply impressed with your generous wishes for my present and future happiness, I beg you to accept my thanks. -- At the same time, I request you will be assured of my best wishes and earnest prayers for your happiness while you remain in this terrestrial mansion and that we may hereafter meet as brethren in the eternal Temple of the Supreme Architect.

G. Washington



December 27, 1792

To the Grand Master of the Free & Accepted Masons, for the Commonwealth of Massachusetts.

Flattering as it may be to the human mind, & truly honorable as it is to receive from our fellow citizens testimonies of approbation for exertions to promote the public welfare; it is not less pleasing to know that the milder virtues of the heart are highly respected by a society whose liberal principles must be founded in the immediate laws of truth and justice. To enlarge the sphere of social happiness is worthy the benevolent design of the Masonic Institution; and it is most fervently to be wished, that the conduct of every member of the fraternity, as well as those publications which discover the principles which actuate them may tend to convince Mankind that the grand object of Masonry is to promote the happiness of the human race.

While I beg your acceptance of my thanks for the "Book of Constitutions" you have sent me, and the honor you have done me in the dedication, permit me to assure you that I feel all those emotions of gratitude which your affectionate address & cordial wishes are calculated to inspire: and I sincerely pray that the Great Architect of the Universe may bless you and receive you hereafter into his immortal Temple.

G. Washington



The George Washington Papers at the Library of Congress:

memory.loc.gov...




[edit on 21-10-2005 by Masonic Light]




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