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What We Iraqis Want

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posted on May, 23 2005 @ 12:58 PM
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Have you read that book? What are the interrogation tecniques the administration was interested in using?
Rape is one of the techniques, you are saying?




posted on May, 23 2005 @ 12:59 PM
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Wild thread to say the least


Sister, if you're a teenager you are feet above most relating to the world outside their own day-to-day.

Give 'em hell!

Saddam was bad and any (ANY) foreign occupier is bad. The US will not pull out until the insurgents quit, it's that simple.
-or-
after the next presidential election.

Bush simply can not leave.



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 01:10 PM
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To say that Sister is feet above most others is a unsubstantiated opinion. Another opinion might be that she is gullible in regard to what the "freedom fighters" say. To say that any "occupier" is bad, that is to suggest that the U.S. should have left after unseating Hussein, leaving the Iraqi people in a mess they could not have cleaned up, leaving them totally defenseless to foreign invasion or to another despot. That would have been the cruelest decision, regardless of the reason for removing Hussein.

As far as the rest of your thoughts, I cannot disagree.



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 01:25 PM
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Originally posted by JoeDoaks
after the next presidential election.

Bush simply can not leave.

Best case scenario would be that we'd be in this same spot had Kerry won.
Worst case would be if we had left Iraq had Kerry had won.


We can not leave yet, period. It's not Bush can't leave.



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 01:57 PM
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Originally posted by Syrian Sister
HowardRoark

Yes, i am an idealist. Perhaps if we where all struggling for the ideal, instead of accepting the injustice, this world would be a better place. Don't trust those lethargic defeatist pigs that tell you there is no hope and you might as well give up on what is just.

If being wise means losing hope howard, i'd rather live as a fool.


Oh I haven’t lost hope. I have high hopes for my fellow man. On the other hand, hope without prudence is pure folly. I actually hold the view that 90% of people ae actually caring, compassionate and helpful towards their fellow man. Unfortunately, the remaining 10 & or so are not. This 10 % seems to cause problems far in excess of their ratio to the population in general. That is why I adopt a cynical view.


You cry democracy democracy, freedom freedom, but all i see from you is hypocracy. What if iraq's people democractically chose a theocracy, what would you say then?


I would be disappointed. I do not believe that a theocratic form of government is a wise choice for any country.



You know the resistance isn't fighting for a theocracy, they aren't fighting for any particular ideology, the resistance is made up many many ideological backgrounds, ranging from communist to theocrat. Christian to muslim. etc. etc. All the resistance is fighting for, is their freedom to choose their own path, without intervention. I have my own political ideologies, but whatever iraq finally chooses, is up to them. And i support them in there struggle for true freedom, not the orwellian version the US is selling.
(i am aware of the rhymes in the above...it was by chance i tells ya)


Do you have actual proof of that?

From what I’ve seen, the so-called “resistance” is mainly concerned with power and control. Rather than offering hope to Iraqiis they are attempting to coerce them through fear.




1. I have lived under two dictatorships, a socialist one, a capitalist one, and one which claims to be democratic but isn't really.

2. It's not just the racism, granted i don't experience much of that because of my white skin. But it's more of government oppression, you think it doesn't exist here? hah. It's just covered up better. Not a few months ago, one women, and australian citizen, was sent to a detention centre for 8 months because she couldn't produce her passport in random checks on the street. Another australian citizen, was DEPORTED and lost for 4 years, because she couldn't immediately provide her passport after she had a car accident.


Somehow I think that those stories are grossly distorted or that here are significant details being left out.

Why would a citizen need to carry a passport?


Peoples homes have been raided in the middle of the night, computers have been confriscated. I take a risk speaking my mind here, freedom of speech, i've never encountered it in my life. Perhaps your only free when your not saying things against the governemnt. You know a frog can willingly be boiled in water, if you slowely turn up the heat. Similarly in australian society, and no doubt in american society, your freedoms are being slowely taken away, and you don't realise because your so indoctrinated into thinking you live in a democracy.


Certainly the possibility exists that freedoms can be lost if one is complacent. If a home was raided, was a warrant issued? Was it valid? The police have the right to investigate and act if they suspect criminal activity.

If, on the other hand, the police do make a mistake, there are methods of redress through the civil court system.

As it is. I will agree with you that there have been cases where the lines have been blurred under the “war on terrorism.” Ultimately, however, these should be corrected. It may take time, but it will happen.

3. you expose your indoctrination again, arranged marriages are a commen practice in Syria? This is a falacy. Do i have relatives that where forced into prearranged marriages? Ofcource not. Let me tell you something, in my religion, no one can by married by force, no one. It is written many times, you have to have written concent from both parties who are in the marriage. In the hindu religion yes, it is forced, but not in my religion. I understand it's some kind of cultural thing in india. But it certainly isn't part of Syrian culture.

So this is all wrong?

”Syrian men have a strong sense of individual and family honour (known as ird). Women do not have equal status with men.” . . . .

“Arranged marriages are still common in Syria, especially in villages and among the Bedouins. In the cities, there is usually more freedom to choose a marriage partner, but the parents of both partners must agree to the marriage. Before the wedding, the groom usually pays a bride-price (majr) to the bride’s family.”


cp.settlement.org...

Now it is true that the incidence of forced marriages are dwindling in more developed countries. Yet the underlying, and fundamental force behind them still exists, namely the concept of a woman’s inferiority.



4. Again here you think that somehow the Iraqi resistance is fighting for theocratic rule? This is yet another falacy. I know that there are christians in the resistance, just as there are many other ideological groups. They aren't fighting for any political agenda, they are fighting for their right to survive, because howard, "live free or die".


I beielve that the people who are fighting are doing it for one reason and one reason only. Power. They don’t care about their fellow citizens.


5. You think the US government is benevolantly out to free people, and your calling me hopelessly naive?


Where did I say that?



That is not true howard. The same people who i ideolise do share my view, that is WHY i ideolise them. The same people who perpetrated the atrocities against there people are being put back into power by non other than the US, many former ba'athists are making up the new intelligence and security forces. Look it up, it's the truth, just like they put the nazi's into power.


Nazi? What are you talking about?


Or ask and i'll give you evidence. You see, once a traitor, always a traitor. It's not what race or ideology that you belong to, bathist/kurd etc. that makes you a traitor, it's who you are intrinsically. I find it ironic also, that ONE MINUTE YOU CLAIM the resistance is made up of entirely religios THEOCRATS who have that as their only agenda, and the next minute who claim they are entirely made up of SECTERIAN (socialist) BA'ATHIST, hell bent on that agenda. There is a contradiction between these to agenda's, are you not aware?
It's not what group your a part of that makes you a criminal and an opportunist, it's who you are. The resistance are the true patriots of iraq, they are the same people who always fought for what was right from the very begining.


I don’t claim that the so called “resistance” is purely theocratic or not, I suspect that they use religion to motivate young, unsophisticated idealists to strap on suicide bombs. I suspect that they use religion to cloak their true intentions, but it is power that they seek, always has been always will.


6. They do make an effort to protect civilians. The resistance is fighting with their lives to protect the civilians, the resistance would not hurt their own families, you think about it, it's illogical. There has been alot of false flag operations going on to defame the resistance. The people who would benefit most from reducing the support base of the gorrilla army are behind these false flag operations. But as you can see from the above letter, (which actually adresses this fact), the iraqi people are not fooled.
As for my impationed "HELL NO" i don't see how that is inconsitant with the fact that i live in a western country and have aquried some of your traits.


Oh, B.S. then why do they deliberately detonate their bombs to inflict maximum damage on children and civilians?


7. I did not evade the question, my answer is right there. And you find it curious that i am only a teenage girl and i use the word false flag ops? Thankyou for the compliment, i know that i am intelligent and know quiet a bit about the way the world works. But only a minute ago you where talking about how idealistic and naive i am because of my age. Why this contradiction?
I have no reason to lie to you about my age or my location. If i wanted to lie to meet my agenda, i would have told you i was from iraq.


That is the problem with the internet. People read what they want to read and make up things from their own imaginations to fill in the gaps. Without any real world experience, you can not see just how unweildly and unworkable these so-called conspiracies and “false Flag Ops” really are. They are fine for trashy, potboiler novels, but things don’t work that way in the real world.


8. Despite our differance in age, i think i can safely say, that it is i who has seen MORE of life than you. I have seen alot in my few years.


Ah, the arrogance of youth. I remember those days

You know nothing of me, yet you are making judgments on my life


Besides, wether or not you have faith in the iraqi people, or wether you don't think "they can complete it alone" is NON OF MY CONCERN. Who do you think you are, that you have some kind of authority over wether or not iraq can do it on their own? That you will inforce "what you think is best" for iraqies? Before you accuse me of hypocracy, note that we both may have an opinion on what is best for them, but your the only one trying to IMPOSE YOUR OPINION. On an unwilling people, and you claim to be democratic. Who do you think you are, that you have any parental autority of iraqies, you are not world police!


No, we are not the world police. We don’t want to be. Yet, people keep coming to us for help.

The problem is, weather you or I likes it or not, the word is shrinking. What happens in Iraq or anywhere else in the world, ultimately affects everyone else in the world.

I don’t claim that we are always right, or that we have the right answers, but I don’t see anyone else stepping up to the plate. (an American phrase).

No one else has managed to come up with a valid solution to the problems of the Middle east.



They created civilisation while your country was thousands of years from even being created. So i suggest you take a seat and learn before you try to teach.


Again, the arrogance of youth. Who cares what they did 1000, or 100, or even 10 years ago. I care about tomorrow.


I’m going to cut this of here. I enjoy our debates. You make some good points, but I have to stop now, other duties call.





[edit on 23-5-2005 by HowardRoark]



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 02:35 PM
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Gotta love that propaganda bull crap !

I won't even waste my breath on this one.

Oh Yeah- To the sister that wrote this that professes to be a christian- If she was truly a christian- 1. She wouldn't be married to a musslim. 2. If she was a proffessed christain she would probably be beheaded unless she hides the fact which probably means she is not truly a christain. Some people classify themselves as christians just becuse they beieve in a God not The True God !

I won't even bother commenting on Jesus and the Devil-George Bush

Enough said- On to the next post where I can talk about something that matters !





posted on May, 23 2005 @ 02:42 PM
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SS, if you so feel that the so called resistance are fighting whats right, why don't you go and join them? here, put a bomb on yourself and go to iraq and bomb a US tank or something instead you here and keep talking that you are fighting for whats right.



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 02:58 PM
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Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Have you read that book? What are the interrogation tecniques the administration was interested in using?
Rape is one of the techniques, you are saying?


I am reading it right now. It weighs about 10 freakin lbs its so big. Reports, the entire mess of memos released. Analysis. You name it. If charges are ever brought up against this administration, you can bet it'll be based in part on this collection of evidence. If you wanna know what all they have permitted, its one of the very best sources.

Rape is a technique some have used (sodomy by broomstick, for example).



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 03:16 PM
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ECK, are you saying that sodomizing a prisoner with a broomstick is an act that has been commited and sanctioned by the administration? This is something that is factual, and not just an opinion of the author?



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 03:38 PM
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Originally posted by Syrian Sister
hiding your shame by claiming you were being sarcastic, tisk tisk tisk.


Lets examine my claim of Iraqi's wanting McDonald's and perhaps a KFC, or Toys R US. Since your family is Iraq, why don't you ask your family members who are in the age range of 5 to 15 years old, if they would like a Toys R US. I'm sure you will get a resounding, YES! from every Iraqi child. Do you know when McDonalds opened in Russia there was ten thousand people waiting for burgers? Before this all they said was capitalism sucked and we don't need your McDonads here! You see every poor nation desires what the wealthy nations have. They too do not wish to be deprived of the finer things in life - such as eating greasy fries and a milkshake. Why? Because it tastes good.



Originally posted by Syrian Sister
As for your talk about me being a child and that i shouldn't be talking politics but playing. Sadly in this world, alot of children are not able to play as they should. Some are out there fighting wars, some because they where pushed into it by well dressed recruiters who offered them the world, and some because they have to because they are attacked. Sadly in this world, there is not much room for children to be children.
I was born old, that's how i feel sometimes, and i know more about how this world works than people 4 times my age.


You were born old huh, and you know more about this world, than people 4 times your age. Most teenagers feel the same way syrian, but then again you said you're from Australia. You spent too much time at the beech fighting shark guerillas?

Lets get one thing straight child. You don't know more about how this world works, than people four times your age. In fact, until you grow up inot whats called , adulthood, get a job, and work for at least, at LEAST a decade, raise kids, serve in war, and experience the trials of health and life - you will know very little. You were born old? If you were my daughter speaking like this on a forum I would be ashamed, and I know your father would not be happy at your ridiculous words. No wise father with experience would.


Originally posted by Syrian Sister
They say that ignorance is bliss, but I'm not going to turn a blind eye , i'm going to fight for what is right with all my power, i'm going to defend the righteous people. And i'm going to let you know the truth wether you like it or not.


You don't know what truth is child. Maybe some day you will - when you're older.



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 03:46 PM
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Here is a good article on the subject of political responsibility in the US prisoner abuse scandals :

Demonization of Muslims Caused the Iraq Abuse
By Abdul Malik Mujahid

What is common between the images of American soldiers laughing at naked and humiliated Iraqi prisoners, the video of a terrorist group in Iraq slaughtering an American civilian, and the photos of an Iraqi mob desecrating and hanging the bodies of four American private commandos on March 31st in Fallujah? It is the hatred and inhumanity of the people doing it.

Whereas one can find a mob and a terrorist behaving inhumanly, the same cannot be expected of soldiers of an organized, trained army like that of the United States. Considering that these cases are not isolated but instances of systemic abuse as the International Red Cross puts it, one must ask why did soldiers do it? Why did only one or two complain about it? Why did our military leaders and political leadership tolerate it?

soundvision.com...



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 03:51 PM
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and on a related subject : soaring anti-muslim hate-crimes in the US :

A leading US Islamic civil rights group has released a report that indicates anti-Muslim hate crimes in the country have increased by half in the past year.


The Council on American-Islamic Relations' (Cair) study - the only annual investigation of its kind - outlined 1522 incidents and experiences of anti-Muslim violence, discrimination or harassment in 2004.

The figure, according to Cair's Unequal Protection report published on Thursday, is 50% higher than an assessment made in 2003.

The rights group said factors contributing to the sharp increase in reported incidents included the lingering impact of post-9/11 fears, increased awareness of civil rights issues in the Muslim community and a general increase in anti-Muslim rhetoric.

Other factors for growth in the number of incidents may also include an increase in local Cair chapters reporting cases and alleged abuses associated with the implementation of national security policies.

Worst offenders

Ten states accounted for almost 79% of all incidents reported to Cair in 2004, with the majority of attacks reported in California, followed by New York, Arizona, Virginia, Texas, Florida, Ohio, Maryland, New Jersey and Illinois.


english.aljazeera.net...



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 06:49 PM
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Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
To say that Sister is feet above most others is a unsubstantiated opinion. .

Perhaps I wasn't clear-
'other teenagers'

Not saying she's right or wrong, just involved and apparently trying to be aware. I don't personally know ANY teenagers that try to be aware.

As to occupiers- yeah, EVERY occupier is bad.

America (as you well know) was led into a supposed:
preemptive strike for self-preservation,
hunt for Al-Queda
-then when those didn't pan out-
freedom invasion

Democracy is not one of those 'gifts' that uninformed people do well with. Democracy works only when the citizenry at least has some understanding of the process and is receptive.

As Sister pointed out the Iraqi's may want a theocracy!

Wow- would we (America) be even further embarrassed?


I doubt it- the American people by that time (hopefully) will see what is behind 'curtain #3' and drive the rascals out. (I know, I believe in the tooth fairy also
)


TC. . . leaving them totally defenseless to foreign invasion or to another despot. That would have been the cruelest decision, regardless of the reason for removing Hussein.

Agree 100%

Whether the Iraqis like it or not we are there for the duration. Hopefully what powers do exist there will understand America is not leaving and not going to be driven out. This ain't Vietnam folks.

Riots in the streets won't happen as in the 70's because many of the American forces are Guardsmen- the neighbor kid, a brother, etc.

While Sister may be right about the mix of divergent ideologies making up the resistance she misunderstands America.


(side note- Kerry would not have pulled out either- he was another smoke and mirror guy)

The Iraqi people will have to get rid of these – what are these people anyway?

Are they freedom fighters?
Insurrectionists?

Perhaps a mix.


Howard said
I beielve that the people who are fighting are doing it for one reason and one reason only. Power. They don’t care about their fellow citizens.
-and-
I care about tomorrow.


Sad but most likely true.

Civil wars begin like that.

Old civilizations that haven't changed are anachronisms to disappear one way or the other. History is full of civilizations that ceased to exist. Most knew their time. Many in the Middle East are going to learn fairly soon that 'the bell tolls for thee.'

The saddest thing about our presence in Iraq is that Afghanistan gets forgotten! That is the real loser in all this, the Afghan people.

2005- let's see, by next election another 50-100,000 Iraqis will be dead and the US will be so angry (past the kid-gloves of today) because another 2,500/5,000 troops died that the Iraqis might want to look back in their history. Babylon was virtually destroyed by internecine war after Alexander. As a city, it all but vanished.

The Greeks brought a new culture and freedom- when they left a few years later an entire civilization disappeared (or went with them). Iraqis know this. They know that freedom is meaningless without stability.

The Greeks could not bring stability so they let the area destroy itself. Britain tried after WW II. America will do a better job.

War is painful. To the losers it is better to quit early.

(side note)


Moretti said
Worst offenders

Ten states accounted for almost 79% of all incidents reported to Cair in 2004, with the majority of attacks reported in California, followed by New York, Arizona, Virginia, Texas, Florida, Ohio, Maryland, New Jersey and Illinois.

That's where about 80% of the population lives




posted on May, 23 2005 @ 07:22 PM
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Originally posted by Moretti
and on a related subject : soaring anti-muslim hate-crimes in the US :

A leading US Islamic civil rights group has released a report that indicates anti-Muslim hate crimes in the country have increased by half in the past year.



english.aljazeera.net...


What crock many of the listed offenses were not even tracked until recently, hardly what I would call conclusive proof.

Table 5. Percentage of Incidents by Type of Alleged Abuse
Incident Type

Check it out using your own link and you will find that most are actually down except for one.

Just more poopaganda as I see it.

[edit on 5/23/2005 by shots]



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 07:43 PM
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Originally posted by SportyMB
We Love USA Thank you

Of course my friend said that thank you was spelled like think you, but it's the thought that counts...

[edit on 20/5/2005 by SportyMB]


Maybe what they really ment is: "You think, we love the U.S.A"? J/k



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 09:21 PM
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That’sJustWierd.

I’m making GOOD excuses. Ask and you shall receive. You say you have asked me, and the only thing you asked me for was to prove that the US killed more iraqies than saddam. I didn’t even mention the number of iraqies they killed in the first gulf war, and I still showed you enough links to support my claim. I’m sorry, i didn’t hear you if you asked for anything else. Ask again, and I’ll give you some. I hate spoon feeding people, but it looks like I have to. Untill you go out and learn the check wether someone is telling the truth or not ourself! You claim that you do, but you didn’t really show us the fruit of your search. ASK me, to provide you with evidence, FOR SPECIFIC THINGS. AND I WILL.

It’s not that you can’t leave, it’s that you CAN’T STAY. All your options now, are imbarressing defeat, or humiliating defeat. If you leave now, your defeat will just be imbarressing, but if you leave later, it will be HUMILIATING.

Listen to the words of, JoeDoaks. “War is painful. To the losers it is better to quit early.”
Take heed.


Shots.

I never said it was a dictionary did i?

I keep telling you again and again shots. Propoganda is just the spreading of an idea. Wether by truth or by lie. Wether it’s the wrong idea or the right idea. That is for you to decide.

Jsobecky.

OK, I will supply the proof.
Just wait, it is coming...
Soon, it will be in my next post...


I actually did provide the evidence in my next post. I’m sorry if you where so filled with blind rage that you where not able to read it.

As for the mcdonald pics etc. that was a joke with a message, but you where to blind to read the message.

Crowne

Sister, if you have evidence that there are rapes and other abuses going on, not only do I suggest that you give it here, but that you also forward it to the proper authorities. As it has been proven time and again, we actually punish those guilty of such crimes; we do not honor those who commit atrocities, as the opposing side does.


Oh give me a break crowne, the US signed papers in the UN before the war began, that makes them immune to war crimes trials. Punish those who are guilty, what a laugh , your show trials are a mockery. NOT ONLY do you not punish the big fish, you don’t even properly punish the scape goats. But since you are all asking for evidence, since you can’t get off your ass and find some, I’ll give you what I have.

Who in the world do you think you are, interfering with any country anywhere?
The iraqies where not happy, but it’s only up to a people to get rid of their leaders, imagine if each country went out and did what it thought was best for the other country. Then my country would go out, invade your country and remove George Bush. WOULD YOU LIKE THAT? Leaving them to the despot would have been crueller? THERE IS NOTHING CRUELER THAN WHAT YOU HAVE DONE!
They never asked you to put saddam into power, they never asked you to invade, all that they ask of you now is that you LEAVE! They are not content with your rape rooms or saddam’s rape rooms. That’s why they are fighting! THEY are RESISTING!

You do need to pull out. And you need to pull out now. And unfortunately crowne, there are no hords of Syrians Saudi’s and Iranians. Sadly that’s a big lie, exaggeration, propaganda right shots? If only it where true, if only.


ECK, there is some foreign intel that Hussein's bunch was involved indirectly, in a minor way


That “foreign intel” that came from germany was proved to be false in the 9/11 review. There is no link between 9/11 and iraq, if you are looking for the people who did 9/11, go look in your own back yard. Ahh it seems EastCoastKid, has already mentioned that, excellent. “TC, that source (Curveball) was discredited.”

I have read some of the memo for allowable interrogation techniques, and I must say they do not comply with Geneva conventions at all. Infact I bet many of your soldiers aren’t even quite aware of the Geneva conventions, purposely not made aware of it no doubt.

Bikkeredie


Maybe its because i actually told people exactly what they were going to view by clicking the link?


Wrong, if you where there you would not that I told people exactly what it was, and warned them that it was very graphic. If you where there that is. I stand by what I said before, don’t make uneducated comments, uneducated advice is useless.

As for my vindictive remarks against you, I don’t quiet recall what they where, if your talking about what I said, about the kind of father you are. We should have a chat about that. If my righteous indignation makes me spiteful and piercing, then so be it.

JoeDoaks

Thanks Joe
I’ll give em all I got!

The resistance won’t stop until the occupation ends. The US administration won’t leave until they’ve got their oil,
but I’m sure they are going to be forced to leave much sooner than that.

But your wrong about me misunderstanding America, I know that there aren’t going to be any riots in the street, and I know even if there was, the administration would just ignore them, as they ignored the majority of americans who came out against this war before it began.

I know you are going to be made to leave, not by the American people, but by the resistance.

You are not here for the duration,  Iraq is going to be victorious. The Iraqi resistance is going to save us both, just watch.

“War is painful. To the losers it is better to quit early.”

You should take head to those words, everyone here.

Truthseeker

I have to say I almost vomited when I wrote your nick name down because it doesn’t fit you in the least.


If she was truly a christian- 1. She wouldn't be married to a musslim.


HAAAAAAAAH!!!!!! You don’t know anything about arab history do you? Ofcource there are Christian women who marry muslim men. It happens a lot more than you think.


2. If she was a proffessed christain she would probably be beheaded unless she hides the fact which probably means she is not truly a christain.


Is that why Christians and muslims lived together peacefully in iraq for about 1400 years? Is that why there where Christians in the Iraqi government before the invasion, like Tariq Aziz? You are heavily indoctrinated by anti-muslim anti-arab propaganda.


Some people classify themselves as christians just becuse they beieve in a God not The True God !


OOOF, it looks like we have a Christian fundamentalist on our hands. And muslims are acused of being intollernat? Hah. In islam it says, muslims christians and jews all worship the same god. Here you are saying one sect of christianity worships a different god than another sect? Wow, now that's intolerance.

ulshadow
I am far more useful here, letting you know the truth.

vincere7

Yeah vincere, let’s go ask my family, if they would trade their dignity, nationality, self-determination, freedom and integrity, for mcdonalds and toys R us. I’ll let YOU ask them that shall I, let’s see what answer they give, I’ll just stand a bit further back and take cover from the firing range.

“because it taste good” HAHAHHAHAHA.

Vincere, nothing tastes as good as self-determination . So take your capitalist dream, your globolisation, and your pseudo-democracy and keep it behind your own closed doors. Your people and your children may be prepared to give up their rights for a cheese burger. But you shouldn’t expect us to do the same.


You were born old huh, and you know more about this world, than people 4 times your age. Most teenagers feel the same way syrian.


Yeah but few are right to think so, I am one of those few. I’ve already lived through a war thankyou. And I am quite sure, I have seen more in my few years that you have ever seen. Not because you didn’t have enough time to see it, because you covered your eyes, and you thought to yourself, ignorance is bliss. Go, go enjoy a big mac vincere, close your eyes and ears, and let your taste buds float you to the temporary heaven which will one day become your hell.


[edit on 23-5-2005 by Syrian Sister]



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 09:28 PM
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Maybe the Iraqis are pretty much like the rest of us and haven't a clue about what they actually want?

3 hots, a cot, a missus and some sprogs. Die old.

What more could you ask for?

Freedom - State of mind really.
Democracy - Same as before but with a day out and some finger painting.
Yankee go home - Back to wood chippers and big tashes under berets.
We love you USA - Orange Jumpsuits and broom handles in the bum.

Not much of a choice, eh? Talk about being caught between (heh heh) Iraq and a hard place. No wonder they haven't a clue what they want!

"What sign today Papa?"
"Is it Thursday?"
"Yes Papa!"
"Then it is payday! Bring out the WE LOVE THE BOOSH sign!"

Cynical, I know.....



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 09:39 PM
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Joe, this might just surprise the heck outta you, but if the Iraqi people want a theocracy, I am totally ok with that. As a matter of fact, I don't think it makes any difference if I'm ok with it or not, it isn't my country. It doesn't seem to be the way they voted in this election, but they just might go with that in the next. As a matter of fact, they might just elect to elct a leader for life who is a religious leader. Whatever they decide, I wish them the best. For the moment, though, it is our responsibility to get them back on their feet, nationally, and the insurgents are doing nothing but inhibiting that.



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 09:44 PM
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Anything is better than what we are doing, or have done, Sister? What total bunk! You claim to know "freedom fighters" who cowardly blow up innocent civilians and the like, but you apparently know very few people who lost loved ones to Hussein's regime for simply being dissenters. Save your rhetoric for those who aren't clear thinkers.

As far as the Geneva Convention is concerned, why don't you lob your own head off and mail it to the international court and explain how beheading is within the civil guidelines. Apparently, you believe beheading is a-ok, so you should have no problem with that.

*No, I am not suggesting that she kill herself, I am making a clear point of glass houses and throwing stones.*



posted on May, 23 2005 @ 09:48 PM
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Originally posted by Thomas Crowne

....if the Iraqi people want a theocracy, I am totally ok with that......Whatever they decide, I wish them the best.



I second that motion.




For the moment, though, it is our responsibility to get them back on their feet, nationally, and the insurgents are doing nothing but inhibiting that.



Aren't the insurgents a natural reaction to the presence of the US forces? What exactly is the point where the US can heroically turn and say "Our work here is done" and ride off into the sunset? When all the insurgents are dead, sorry, liberated?





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