Originally posted by AceOfBase
BTW, do you have per state figure on gun ownership in the US?
The best I could find was a survey from 1996 on regional ownership.
It looks like gun ownership is lower in the North East than it is in the South and I think crime is lower in the New England than it is in the
South.
If anyone has better regional gun ownership data please post it.
I'll try and hunt out some accurate statistics of gun ownership in the U.S.A. it's nearly impossible to find it though as the way they do it is by
phoning someone up and asking them. Now if you had a stranger phone you up and ask you if you had a gun this is going to make the answer biased.
But the difference between the North and South might be the population, states like California have one of the largest populations and so more guns;
same goes for Texas, etc. But Cali has one of the lowest crime rates about 5.9/100,000 last I checked and texas is also below 7.0/100,000.
You also need to look at the State Laws, a lot of the northern States have very relaxed laws on gun control especially in states like New Hampshire
where you only need to get a permit to carry a firearm, not to buy one or to register owning one. Iowa again is another, with laws which lack. Teh
trend goes on, a few states such as N.C. are exceptions to this but the majority with less strict gun rights tend to have lower homicide rates.
Originally posted by Badger
I find it quite bizarre that some people are still clinging to the belief that introducing more lethal weapons into a society can have any other
impact than increasing the possibility that said weapons will be used.
You can pull statistics out of your backside all you like, but the basic premise is rather simple.
Don't get involved in this then? It's clear that to display if something works you need to talk about
statistics. It's fairly simple to see,
otherwise we just go on our opinion which has no place on ATS and also goes against the Terms of Service.
Originally posted by Badger
More cars on the roads- more road traffic accidents
More planes in the sky- more airplane disasters
More people take up surfing- more people drown in the surf
More people have access to firearms- more people end up dead as a result
Really? Then why does France have one of the highest traffic accident rates in the World? Why does Britain have more people per-100,000 in Prison then
China? (139/100,000 and 118/100,000 respectivly) Oh wait...this is statistics...damn. I like what you've done, this way nothing you say can be wrong
because it is all facts. Good idea.
Originally posted by Badger
Sure Switzerland has a lot of guns and a low homicide rate, big deal. That's an argument for Swiss society, not an argument for more access to
firearms. If gun crime in the UK is increasing can anyone with even a modicum of common sense seriously argue that the way to address the issue is to
introduce an even greater number of firearms?!
So anyone who thinks different to you lacks common sense now? Also, the fact your above statement claiming: "The more of one thing, the more that
thing causes" is clearly disproven with Nations like Switzerland, Norway, etc. Otherwise they would have a higher homicide rate then the U.K.
does.
The reason gun crime is increasing in the U.K. is because of:
A) The Growing gun culture
B) Ability to get ahold firearms (which is easy).
C) Ability to get away with the crime in both the short-term and the long-term and;
D) Lack of education from Schools on violent crimes.
Originally posted by Badger
Having personal knowledge of law enforcement in the UK I can assure you that you can forget your Hollywood BS about defending yourself with a
concealed weapon if someone tries to assualt or rob you in the street. Anyone doing so with the intent to use the firearm they are pointing at you
will shoot you dead before you can draw your concealed weapon. Anyone who doesn't never had it in them to do so in the first place.
Then why are there statistics in the U.S. from the department of Justice claiming otherwise? Oh #...statistics again. I do like this idea, where you
say what you want and deny statistics. Makes it easy to be right. So which area of Law Enforcement did you work in? Which area of the U.K?
Originally posted by Badger
So is a firearm useful for defending your property and family during a burglary for example? Well I guess this might be the one area where there may
be something in this gun ownership idea. But in my opinion it isn't much. If you disturb an intruder they are FAR more likely to flee the property
than confront you. There is a simple logic to that, they don't want to be apprehended or injured, and they generally don't want to be facing a more
serious charge.
It has also been shown to help in over 50% of rape cases, attempted burglary, etc, etc, list goes on.
Originally posted by Badger
Gun control in a society that isn't already flooded with guns does work. The rise in firearms offences in the Uk has been significant,but really only
when you compare it with a rather low starting point, and a significant proportion of these offences don't actually involve "firearms" at all but
often replica weapons, which are often included in the overall statistics, and in my opinion cause a false representation of the real situation.
That's why we were using the statistics that didn't involve replica weapons. We also looked at the start and then the rise, which helps to display
that once guns are taken away only criminals have them. The low starting point of course was when people were able to get firearms such as pistols,
semi-automatic rifles, etc, prior to 1997. Also the thing people seem to be forgetting is the fact you can still get firearms in England and Wales;
shotguns and single shot rifles. So if someone is wanting to rob a bank, kill someone, etc, they can legally get a firearm and it isn't that hard. It
just takes 6months.
It's fairly simple to understand what needs to be done; firearms should be legal as long as people have a back-ground check and the gun is
registered, even with new technology we can get a sample of every bullet from guns before they are sold and if that gun is used in a crime it is easy
enough to trace. It has been shonw World over that if you educate children that guns are not toys and not to be used in such a manor the effect it has
on the Society. It has been shown World over that it helps prevent Burglary, Rape and other crimes. Otherwise we will just turn into a Nation where
the population are taken advantage of by the growing gun culture; which won't be stopped while illegal firearms are easy to purchase.
Sources:
www.kcl.ac.uk...
www.guardian.co.uk...
www.nraila.org...#
www.disastercenter.com...
. 
Different cultures have different results. The Swiss don't have a stupid
attitude towards guns like we do, because they aren't as easily led by gung ho action flicks, or rap music videos I'd imagine.
