Bohemian Grove, The Owl: Not Satanic!

Originally posted by santjime

@onthelevel, do you honestly not think that it spells out mason, i feel like you just proved my point, now i respect your opinion so im curious as to how you do not see that it clearly points to the letters of mason. . .

It only "clearly" points to the letters "MASON" if you completely ignore the pyramid. It's hard for me to believe a conspiracy that is both thorough and lazy.

it may not point to the middle of the letter M but the line is at the edge of M that does not disprove anything . .

The fact is that it doesn't point anywhere near the M. Look at the image I posted, where the line forming the edge of the pyramid is clear, and the superimposed lines are too thin to "accidentally" clip the M to prove a point. The line down the right side of the pyramid not only misses the M completely but barely touches a corner of the U. Now if you want to blame the Freemasous for this, you might have something.

and also curious if you were to show people on the street the photo that you showed me, out of 10 people how many would you say would disagree that the triangles do not point out to the letters of mason?

Whether two equilateral triangles superimposed on the Great Seal connect with the letters "MASON" and the line provided by the pyramid is a matter of geometry, not opinion.

reply to post by OnTheLevel213


@onthelevel213
LOL, im going to go out on a limb here, and say that your assuming I am a fool by trying to convince me that I am imagining something that is clearly there, (like I said this is only a limb, I am not accusing you, I am making an assumption and correct me if I am wrong) I understand what you are doing, and the power to convince people that what they clearly see is not really whats there is strong, the power of " suggestive imagination" but like I had said I am not a fool you see. For I did it myself and i even took pictures for you, go ahead do it yourself, its too close to be just a wee coincidence. And I'm going to assume that you were wishing that I had not discovered something else while closely examining the dollar bill. I even traced it out so you can see my proof. Go ahead do it yourself you will see it is clearly there. And if you wish to tell me that what I am about to reveal is just another mere coincidence, I will be disappointed to admit that you have lost credency in my book.

HERE IS MY OWN TRACING OF THE LETTERS MASON....A BIG COINCIDENCE...as you claim it to be

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/fcdc47edfe98.jpg[/atsimg]


Now for my second image, If you carefully count the feathers on the birds wings (Im assuming that you know exactly where im going with this) you will notice that on the right wing there are 32 feathers. As opposed to the left wing which as 33 feathers, Signifying the large difference between the 32 degree the average degree and the 33 the much more prestigious.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/509768fd0f0b.jpg[/atsimg]


And I also noticed the star above the Eagle. . .It represents The Seal Of Solomon, or perhaps the Jewish star, but most likely the seal of Solomon.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/28ffa808ca0b.jpg[/atsimg]



Now please tell me how crazy you think I am. Because if I really am that lost, show me the way.Reveal to me the enlightened path.

For Any One Else Reading This, Please Verify This For YourSelf, Dont Just Take My Word For It, Conduct The Test I Just Conducted!!!!!!

@onthelevel

Real "Lazy" Right? And Not Thorough One Bit, and You Failed To Mention Anything Of The Owl, Why? I Am Assuming Because It Is Near Impossible To Disprove, Unless You Also Are Going To Try To Suggest To Me That It Is Clearly My "Imagination"




OHHHHHHH AND!!!!!! I Just Made Another Discovery. . . . The Seal Of Solomon Is In The Same Shape As The Two Triangles On The Pyramid. . .Look At It. . .See Both Bottom And Upper Tips Of The "Star" Are Like The Ones In my "imaginative Mason Pyramid" The Seal Is Just a Triangle Flipped Upside Down interlacing A normal Triangle. . . As are The Triangles That Spell Out Mason.....BUT, i guess. . . . . onetheleve, you could be right...chances are very slim. almost slim to nothing.
SOOOO, What Do You Think??

Originally posted by santjime
reply to post by OnTheLevel213

 

@onthelevel213
LOL, im going to go out on a limb here, and say that your assuming I am a fool by trying to convince me that I am imagining something that is clearly there, (like I said this is only a limb, I am not accusing you, I am making an assumption and correct me if I am wrong)

I don't assume you're stupid. Just wrong.

I understand what you are doing, and the power to convince people that what they clearly see is not really whats there is strong, the power of " suggestive imagination" but like I had said I am not a fool you see.

Suggestive imagination works the other way too. It's called confirmation bias. You want to believe that the 33rd degree runs the world, so you find sources that confirm it.

On another note, the fact that you've suddenly turned to analyzing my motives instead of facts is telling.

For I did it myself and i even took pictures for you, go ahead do it yourself, its too close to be just a wee coincidence.

And yet too far to be what you claim. Once again, it's hard to believe a conspiracy that is both thorough and lazy.

And I'm going to assume that you were wishing that I had not discovered something else while closely examining the dollar bill.

You know, a person can disagree with you without trying to control your brain. Just saying.

I even traced it out so you can see my proof. Go ahead do it yourself you will see it is clearly there. And if you wish to tell me that what I am about to reveal is just another mere coincidence, I will be disappointed to admit that you have lost credency in my book.

I'm not saying it's a coincidence. Actually, whether it would be a coincidence is a whole other argument, one that presumes that you're right about it being there in the first place. As you seem to know well, I do not concede that.

HERE IS MY OWN TRACING OF THE LETTERS MASON....A BIG COINCIDENCE...as you claim it to be

You obviously don't understand the word coincidence. I'm saying it's not there at all.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/fcdc47edfe98.jpg[/atsimg]

Though I usually try to avoid reposting pictures, it is for this comment necessary.

Look at the capstone (the bit with the eye). See the rays emanating from it, the ones of a lighter color? Now look at your red line near the top of the capstone. There's clearly "daylight" between the red line and the capstone. In short, the line you've traced does not follow that of the pyramid.

Now for my second image, If you carefully count the feathers on the birds wings (Im assuming that you know exactly where im going with this) you will notice that on the right wing there are 32 feathers. As opposed to the left wing which as 33 feathers, Signifying the large difference between the 32 degree the average degree and the 33 the much more prestigious.

I'm not willing to count the feathers on the eagle, so for this one I'll assume you're correct, and here I will claim coincidence. Especially given that the Great Seal was designed in 1782 and the Scottish Rite wasn't formed until 1801.

And I also noticed the star above the Eagle. . .It represents The Seal Of Solomon, or perhaps the Jewish star, but most likely the seal of Solomon.

And neither of those have anything to do with the 32nd or 33rd degree.

Now please tell me how crazy you think I am. Because if I really am that lost, show me the way.Reveal to me the enlightened path.

Stop pretending I'm calling you names to win some sort of sympathy. You're not crazy, stupid or lying. You're just wrong. It happens to the best of us.

For Any One Else Reading This, Please Verify This For YourSelf, Dont Just Take My Word For It, Conduct The Test I Just Conducted!!!!!!

Yes, please do. He's just exemplified exactly why this is not to be read into.

and You Failed To Mention Anything Of The Owl, Why? I Am Assuming Because It Is Near Impossible To Disprove

Whether a near-microscopic owl is hanging out on the corner of the dollar bill is a matter of opinion, and there's no use arguing about opinion. Whether a line corresponds with a point, however, deals in fact.

Originally posted by santjime
Now for my second image, If you carefully count the feathers on the birds wings (Im assuming that you know exactly where im going with this) you will notice that on the right wing there are 32 feathers. As opposed to the left wing which as 33 feathers, Signifying the large difference between the 32 degree the average degree and the 33 the much more prestigious.

I want you to do something. Please look up when the Scottish Rite was started and when the Great Seal was designed and then inform us of your findings.

reply to post by OnTheLevel213


I am Not going to refute everything you have just said, for I feel it to be a waste of time, but instead present you with more information.
But here i will refute some things

Look at the capstone (the bit with the eye). See the rays emanating from it, the ones of a lighter color? Now look at your red line near the top of the capstone. There's clearly "daylight" between the red line and the capstone. In short, the line you've traced does not follow that of the pyramid

Yes, sorry and you will also notice that not all the sides are equal: Sorry I am not a perfect artist.

I will claim coincidence. Especially given that the Great Seal was designed in 1782 and the Scottish Rite wasn't formed until 1801.

Yup it is all just a big coincidence, nothing else. . . . . . . . .and you are a bit misleading with the statement of scottish rite forming until 1801. Because you are contradicting yourself. It first originated in America in Lousianna in 1763, Yes Yes i know this was not "officially" Scottish Rite, but on the account of The Grand Constitutions of 1786 Extending the Rite to 33rd degrees, One would be safe in assuming that talk and formation had been going on about the Scottish Rite before 1782 (the year of the great seal) As we can assume it took a great deal of work, to form these Orders. So what I just stated was that the 33rd degree was official in the year 1786. . . not 1801. What happened in 1801 was the First Supreme Council on the new Grand Constitution.
Ahhh Haa! lol
www.scottishritecalifornia.org...


That is a Freemason Official website. . . .

And neither of those have anything to do with the 32nd or 33rd degree

Can you quote me when I ever mentioned that it did?
Does the Subliminal Mason have anything to do with the 33rd degree?
But King Solomon plays a large part in Freemasonry.
www.masonicdictionary.com...
Again another Masonic website.

All Im doing is showing the Masonic Symbolism on the Dollar Bill, that you claim does not exist.
Please debunk any of what I am saying. Not how I word it, for I am young and foolish in my wordings. But The Idea behind my words.

Stop pretending I'm calling you names to win some sort of sympathy. You're not crazy, stupid or lying. You're just wrong. It happens to the best of us.

I dont care for anyones sympathy? Typically people will use the phrase "go put on your tinfoil hat" and ive seen masons say it as well. But I do appreciate you not using that phrase.

He's just exemplified exactly why this is not to be read into.

Oh But In My Opinion It Does, And I, Just Like Anyone Else willing to Conduct the Test, Are entitled to Their Opinions. So Telling fellow readers "It does not need to be read into" Is going against their ability to decide for themselves.

Whether a near-microscopic owl is hanging out on the corner of the dollar bill is a matter of opinion, and there's no use arguing about opinion. Whether a line corresponds with a point, however, deals in fact.

And this onthelevel is where you most assuredly fail. For The Owl just chillin in the corner is in deed FACT, get a magnifying glass, If you have one around your house, I will honestly be more then happy to mail you one, if you cannot get your hands on one. But with that magnifying glass, or even better a microscope (it is not needed) Magnifying glas will be just fine. you can undoubtedly see a owl. No It is not a mater of opinion Because it is clearly visible. !!!! where did you even get that logic from??? And a line varying a few millimetters from a letter would be most definitely undoubtedly certainly an opinion.

Suggestive imagination works the other way too. It's called confirmation bias. You want to believe that the 33rd degree runs the world, so you find sources that confirm it. On another note, the fact that you've suddenly turned to analyzing my motives instead of facts is telling.

Dont worry, I understand that, my goal is to eventually get my Doctorate in Psychology, I am infatuated with psychology.

and sorry i may not have been clear with my words, when i had stated "(like I said this is only a limb, I am not accusing you, I am making an assumption and correct me if I am wrong)"
i was referring to THIS comment i had made
"I understand what you are doing, and the power to convince people that what they clearly see is not really whats there is strong, the power of " suggestive imagination" but like I had said I am not a fool you see."
Sorry for the misunderstanding i was not accusing you, it was just going out on a limb, i dont believe those were your intentions, it was just mere speculation, I can assure you, Like I stated earlier, I value your opinion.
whether you believe so or not.

And you may have missed my last comment so im going to repost it
OHHHHHHH AND!!!!!! I Just Made Another Discovery. . . . The Seal Of Solomon Is In The Same Shape As The Two Triangles On The Pyramid. . .Look At It. . .See Both Bottom And Upper Tips Of The "Star" Are Like The Ones In my "imaginative Mason Pyramid" The Seal Is Just a Triangle Flipped Upside Down interlacing A normal Triangle. . . As are The Triangles That Spell Out Mason.

And I had read on a preivious post im not sure which thread by Masonic Light, that only 1% of freemasons actually become 33rd degree'rs, But according to you and Many other masons on this website logic I can and will become a 33rd degree mason?
I will reveal to you my actual age, now i know this will discredit alot of my opinions in some peoples eyes, and to those people I am sorry, for you do not know me, so do not judge me based on my age, but by the nature of the topic and my opinions.
I am 18, I have been interested in Freemasonry ever since I was Ten! I still have not forgotten the FIRST time I had ever been aware of Freemasonry, ever since that moment I had been curious. Now that I am 18 my thirst for masonry has only grown. Freemasonry is in my family. The whole conspiracy about freemasonry is not what got me interested, I had loved the idea that these men give back so much to society, and that so many of these men went on and did great things in this world and became prominent people! but ill save you my life story and get to the point. So i am planning on Applying for my Masonic Membership very soon. Now if what you say is true and I indubitably devote a part of my life to Freemasonry, then eventually just naturally I would indeed become a 33rd deegre'er if I really truely wanted to, and if my heart was in the right place.
So in these next 20-15-10 years of me becoming 33rd degree'er, I would love to come visit you in your lodge and as some Freemasons say "grab a beer with you...or a few"

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


LOL already did and i think you will see how what i have presented is still very very presumably valid.
You can not say "NO" for a fact, because it is still an open idea. Does the government let you know everything the moment the thought occurs in thier minds. No. They usually take years and years and years of getting it all together and sorting it out for you.

Originally posted by santjime
LOL already did

and i think you will see how what i have presented is still very very presumably valid.

How can it be 'very very presumably valid' when the Great Seal predates Scottish Rite Masonry in its final form which included the 33rd Degree?

Back to the topic… To suggest that the 'Grove' is yet another good old boy's club' smack's of PR work. Proof that's a haven of evil? Proof that it is not. There lies the struggle. The membership roster is impressive. The devil is in the detail's. Follow the money trail.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

How can it be 'very very presumably valid' when the Great Seal predates Scottish Rite Masonry in its final form which included the 33rd Degree?

If you are having difficulty swallowing my idea and the logic behind my idea. I JUST got this email from CHASE Bank. . . .The senior vice president sent me (and im assuming all other Chase users?) a message which is not important. BUT here is a passage from the email that relates to my argument.
."As always, we are advising our customers of everything we know as we know it, and will keep you informed on what impact, if any, this will have on you."
Advising our customers on everything we know as we know it.

that is where my emphasis lies. Do you believe that your government tells you almost everything they know as they know it? OR do you believe they wait a few years to obscure the facts to make them seem not as they are, but as they would want you to perceive them. Do you understand what i am trying to say???
It is still clearly valid because, If one would like to believe that there is another secret agenda going on the group would not be blatantly obvious about it.
You must admit, that the information I have presented throughout this thread does in fact have validity for a pretty sturdy argument. And in fact you are making the weaker argument defeat the stronger, because of a few difference in years and how information was presented publicly.

Originally posted by santjime
Do you believe that your government tells you almost everything they know as they know it? OR do you believe they wait a few years to obscure the facts to make them seem not as they are, but as they would want you to perceive them.

To what end would obscuring the creation of the Great Seal achieve? The original notes and drawings are dated and there are copius records dealing with its design and creation.

It is still clearly valid because, If one would like to believe that there is another secret agenda going on the group would not be blatantly obvious about it.

What you are basically saying is that since I do not believe (or are aware that) it is a conspiracy it very well could be a conspiracy.

You must admit, that the information I have presented throughout this thread does in fact have validity for a pretty sturdy argument.

I will admit no such thing as the information you presented proves nothing what so ever.

And in fact you are making the weaker argument defeat the stronger, because of a few difference in years and how information was presented publicly.

The 'few difference in years' is what soldily disproves any conspiracy regarding the Great Seal and Scottish Rite symbolism. It either developed from the Scottish Rite or it predated the Scottish Rite. You are also presupposing that there was a manipulation of the drawings and dates of the same. This is only your hypothesis and you have presented nothing to support it other then your opinion.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


Do you have any links to these???

The original notes and drawings are dated and there are copius records dealing with its design and creation.

This is only your hypothesis and you have presented nothing to support it other then your opinion.

I have presented nothing except my "dubious" information i have laid out for you
so in a nutshell, my nothingness consist of. . .
When drawing out The Seal Of Solomon over the pyramid in the dollar bill it spells out mason,
on the left wing of the eagle there are 33 feathers representing the greater 33rd degree, as opposed to the right wing which has 32...I PROMISE YOU this IS legitamite, try it out for yourself regardless of what OnTheLevel tells you not to do.
As to the significance of the left and right wing, I have not concluded yet.
The Seal Of Solomon is directly above the eagle.
For those who believe that Elite FreeMasons are in alliance with the New World Order, Novus Ordo Selorum-New Order Of The Ages....NOT New World Order, which some people believe. But what does the new order of the ages mean. . . . leave it up to your imagination, or do research, No It does not mean the New age of America, But a New Order.
and as for the "imagined owl" . . . lol do I really have to argue this one? As you say the Great Seal has records keeping up with the design...would I be safe to assume that there are records keeping up with the design for dollar bill? Show me in the records where you see the Owl being publicly announced.
But you always ask other for factual evidence when stating claims, SO. . .Where are these records?? the records for the seal and the design of the dollar bill in general. I would really enjoying reading about them,, honestly.
Now this may be a bit farfetched, but we do take pride in showing every angle of conspiracy. So that being said...the image i am about to show you, well im sure you know exactly what I am getting at
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/03d4b6af2141.jpg[/atsimg]

The cross of the Knights Templar.
yes yes it is out there, But look at all the 1's in the corners, they do seem to follow that same design, and If im gonna say that Freemasonry plays a part in the dollar bill, Why wouldnt that design be purposeful either? (assuming that the other "coicidences" were on purpose)
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/c935b1626981.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/2b27ef8a6a7c.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/37951174a726.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/28be470e2fd6.gif[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/28ffa808ca0b.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/509768fd0f0b.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/afbc48f0200e.jpg[/atsimg]
Im just putting it out thier how i see it.
I understand where you come free in your vehement feelings for defending freemasonry, because believe it or not, when I hear people who do not know very much about freemasonry make claims such as mine about the craft. I jump in thier and defend it with the knowledge that I know to be fact (not the conscipiracy claims) Yes i know i am not a freemason just something in me wants to defend it. So you can defend it all you want on this site. Thats OK, but when your with yourself and your pensive thoughts, be true to yourself. And Ask yourself, Does this make sense?!

Originally posted by santjime
But you always ask other for factual evidence when stating claims, SO. . .Where are these records?? the records for the seal and the design of the dollar bill in general. I would really enjoying reading about them,, honestly.

www.state.gov...
greatseal.com...

reply to post by JoshNorton


Thank You Josh! For Helping Me Prove My Point

Both of those documents actually helped me prove my point!
Ill explain in more depth later, as of i have not slept in over 40 hours. And I am exauhsted!

@onthelevel I am still going to expect a full debunking analysis from you about the information in which i have presented you

Originally posted by santjime
Do you have any links to these???

Josh already supplied them.

When drawing out The Seal Of Solomon over the pyramid in the dollar bill it spells out mason,

That is not the Seal of Solomon, it is two crudely drawn triangles that do not share equal shapes. If a Mason were going to place geometric symblosism on an objectt why would they not take the time to make sure that it was correct? Sacred Geometry is not a mishmash of shapes that are almost perfect, they are perfect.

...on the left wing of the eagle there are 33 feathers representing the greater 33rd degree, as opposed to the right wing which has 32...I PROMISE YOU this IS legitamite, try it out for yourself regardless of what OnTheLevel tells you not to do.

Why does it matter since the Seal predates Scottish Rite Masonry. What you keep doing is like implying that World War II led to World War I.

and as for the "imagined owl" . . . lol do I really have to argue this one?

I always thught it looked like a spider.

As you say the Great Seal has records keeping up with the design...would I be safe to assume that there are records keeping up with the design for dollar bill?

Yes, there are numeorus paper currencies which preceded the current dollar.

Show me in the records where you see the Owl being publicly announced.

You are assuming everyone agrees that it is an owl.

The cross of the Knights Templar.
yes yes it is out there,

We finally agree on something.

I understand where you come free in your vehement feelings for defending freemasonry,

You are very arrogant to assume what I feel. This has nothing to do with Masonry and has more to do with spreading nonsensical information which is easily refuted by a small amount of research.

reply to post by santjime


The "owl" kind of looks like a spider, and since there is a web all around the dollar, it kind of makes sense that it would be a spider. But nether the owl or the spider have anything to do with masonry to my knowledge. And the Grove has nothing to do with masonry either. I think it would be cool if masonry somehow put it's symbolism into things that everyone would see daily. It might make everyone think more about what those symbols mean and help them live their lives a bit better.

Originally posted by santjime

Yes, sorry and you will also notice that not all the sides are equal: Sorry I am not a perfect artist.

That's the thing, though; every illustration of this has the same problem.

Yup it is all just a big coincidence, nothing else. . . . . . . . .and you are a bit misleading with the statement of scottish rite forming until 1801. Because you are contradicting yourself. It first originated in America in Lousianna in 1763, Yes Yes i know this was not "officially" Scottish Rite

Nor was it "officially" America.

but on the account of The Grand Constitutions of 1786 Extending the Rite to 33rd degrees, One would be safe in assuming that talk and formation had been going on about the Scottish Rite before 1782 (the year of the great seal) As we can assume it took a great deal of work, to form these Orders. So what I just stated was that the 33rd degree was official in the year 1786. . . not 1801.

And the Seal, as has been mentioned, was designed in 1782.

Can you quote me when I ever mentioned that it did?

Perhaps I misunderstand your theory. Wasn't it about the 33rd degree controlling the dollar or whatever?

All Im doing is showing the Masonic Symbolism on the Dollar Bill, that you claim does not exist.
Please debunk any of what I am saying. Not how I word it, for I am young and foolish in my wordings. But The Idea behind my words.

I haven't touched your "wording". I haven't needed to.

Telling fellow readers "It does not need to be read into" Is going against their ability to decide for themselves.

No, telling them not to do it would go against their ability to decide for themselves. Telling them it's a waste of time is just advice.

And this onthelevel is where you most assuredly fail. For The Owl just chillin in the corner is in deed FACT, get a magnifying glass, If you have one around your house, I will honestly be more then happy to mail you one, if you cannot get your hands on one. But with that magnifying glass, or even better a microscope (it is not needed) Magnifying glas will be just fine. you can undoubtedly see a owl.

Whether it's an owl is certainly a matter of opinion.

And a line varying a few millimetters from a letter would be most definitely undoubtedly certainly an opinion.

No, it isn't. It's geometry. A line must be straight, and a straight line does not connect the right side of the pyramid with the M. Whether the factual divergence is of significance is a matter of opinion, but the pyramid not pointing to the M is factual.

OHHHHHHH AND!!!!!! I Just Made Another Discovery. . . . The Seal Of Solomon Is In The Same Shape As The Two Triangles On The Pyramid. . .Look At It. . .See Both Bottom And Upper Tips Of The "Star" Are Like The Ones In my "imaginative Mason Pyramid" The Seal Is Just a Triangle Flipped Upside Down interlacing A normal Triangle. . . As are The Triangles That Spell Out Mason.

Sure, if you're willing to warp and distort the image to make it fit.

And I had read on a preivious post im not sure which thread by Masonic Light, that only 1% of freemasons actually become 33rd degree'rs

1% of Scottish Rite Masons. That you still haven't acknowledged the difference suggests a serious research flaw.

But according to you and Many other masons on this website logic I can and will become a 33rd degree mason?

I don't see how that's true.

Now if what you say is true and I indubitably devote a part of my life to Freemasonry, then eventually just naturally I would indeed become a 33rd deegre'er if I really truely wanted to, and if my heart was in the right place.

Not at all. The 33rd is an honorary degree bestowed either on the leadership of the Scottish Rite or another person with a notable contribution to Freemasonry, usually in the form of Grand Lodge leadership or a lifetime of research. It cannot be applied for, and must be declined if requested. To say that the 33rd degree would just naturally come to you because you devoted a part of your life to Freemasonry is an insult to the very many Masons who have done the same thing and not received it.

I would love to come visit you in your lodge and as some Freemasons say "grab a beer with you...or a few"

Not in my lodge. Most southern Grand Lodges have outlawed alcohol.

Originally posted by santjime

When drawing out The Seal Of Solomon over the pyramid in the dollar bill it spells out mason

Unless you care about the Seal being accurate.

on the left wing of the eagle there are 33 feathers representing the greater 33rd degree, as opposed to the right wing which has 32

From a body that didn't exist yet.

I PROMISE YOU this IS legitamite, try it out for yourself regardless of what OnTheLevel tells you not to do.

As has been stated, I never told anyone not to do it. As a matter of fact, I joined in your encouragement of people to see for themselves. I just also said the whole thing was a waste of time.

The Seal Of Solomon is directly above the eagle.

Unless you care whether the points on the triangle are connected. You know, like Solomon did.

For those who believe that Elite FreeMasons are in alliance with the New World Order, Novus Ordo Selorum-New Order Of The Ages....NOT New World Order, which some people believe. But what does the new order of the ages mean. . . . leave it up to your imagination, or do research, No It does not mean the New age of America, But a New Order.

And how can you state factually that New Order of the Ages does not refer to the first presidential republic in the Western world?

and as for the "imagined owl" . . . lol do I really have to argue this one?

Yes. It really only looks like an owl if you're looking for an owl.

As you say the Great Seal has records keeping up with the design...would I be safe to assume that there are records keeping up with the design for dollar bill? Show me in the records where you see the Owl being publicly announced.

You presume the owl is a generally accepted truth.

Once again, I apologize for the repeat image:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/28be470e2fd6.gif[/atsimg]

A black-and-white image more clearly illustrates the absurdity of the whole thing. You cannot honestly deny that there is no white background between the red line and the black outline of the bricks in the upper half, and the grayish terrain in the lower half. The "Seal" has been distorted to touch the letters necessary for the conspiracy.

I understand where you come free in your vehement feelings for defending freemasonry, because believe it or not, when I hear people who do not know very much about freemasonry make claims such as mine about the craft. I jump in thier and defend it with the knowledge that I know to be fact (not the conscipiracy claims)

Really? Because this is one of anti-Masonry's weakest points.

So you can defend it all you want on this site. Thats OK, but when your with yourself and your pensive thoughts, be true to yourself. And Ask yourself, Does this make sense?!

You know what? You're right. Now that I've stopped lying to myself to defend a fraternity that values honesty, I can clearly see that the Freemasons (who didn't design the Seal) put symbols of a body (they weren't a part of) on the Great Seal (four years before that body existed). Thank you for telling me what I was actually thinking; I'd never have figured it out myself.

Please Just Try To Entertain The Thought, Just For A Minute
-the thought of freemasonrys presence on the dollar bill


Ok and with this I rest my case, because we are going nowhere. But my evidence clearly points to one thing. Freemasonry's presence in the dollar bill.

@networkdude, yes i know, ive seen that on many conspiracy sites, But if you infact get a a magnifying glass and do it yourself, like i had asked yall too, it is clearly an owl. Yes the spiderweb and the spier make sense, it is simply not a spider. But that would raise so many more questions as to why is there a spider and spider web? but ANYWAYS.

1% of Scottish Rite Masons. That you still haven't acknowledged the difference suggests a serious research flaw.

Yess i am fully aware of this. I understand York Rite and Scottish Rite. Next time i will be more carefull with my word choice.

Not at all. The 33rd is an honorary degree bestowed either on the leadership of the Scottish Rite or another person with a notable contribution to Freemasonry, usually in the form of Grand Lodge leadership or a lifetime of research. It cannot be applied for, and must be declined if requested. To say that the 33rd degree would just naturally come to you because you devoted a part of your life to Freemasonry is an insult to the very many Masons who have done the same thing and not received it.

I dont care for being a 33rd, so that would not be my intentions, Sorry once again with my word choice. Im 18, i Love humanity, im a philanthropist. In Highschool I got the award for most community service hours. Ive been to Kenya on mission trips, ive been to Guatemala multiple times on mission trips, Im planning on going to visit the orphanages in Russia this summer. Thats how my heart is, as im sure some of you will understand.
What i meant to say was that. Im 18, if i Apply for my apprenticeship and get it. It is very realistic that I would be honored enough to be requested to become a 33rd in years to come. Im sorry for saying that it should naturally come to me. I did not mean for the "expected entitlement" thats not how i wanted to come off, as to yes i can see how that would insult many.

Not in my lodge. Most southern Grand Lodges have outlawed alcohol.

Cool, I'm from the south too, Coffee is great! (:
Now, For One Of My Last Refutations
Thank you Josh Norton for giving me this evidence.
The Great Seal Of 1782!! As Displayed here the, Right Wing Has Only 23 feathers;
not 32 like the Seal we use today, we dont even use the great seal of 1782, If you Josh Actually read the website, as I did, this would be more evident to you. They continued to make minor detailed changes to it until the 1900's.
Thankyou

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reply to post by santjime


Just to the point out the obvious here:

If you try to spell "Mason" correctly on the Great Seal, you don't get a hexagram, you get this instead:

Originally posted by santjime


Now for my second image, If you carefully count the feathers on the birds wings (Im assuming that you know exactly where im going with this) you will notice that on the right wing there are 32 feathers.

Are you sure about that? Because I just counted it twice, and both times I got 17 on each side.