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American Invasion

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posted on May, 12 2005 @ 10:42 PM
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Nuclear weapons are removed from the equation and conventional means of warfare must be fought. The EU aligns with Russia, and China agrees the U.S. can be put under the web as forced labor. The United States of America is invaded to liberate the people of their corrupt government. The alignment of all EU states, Russia, China, Japan, India, Indonesia, and the Middle East attack under the banner of United Liberation Federation. The attack is overhwhelming and the U.S. is now militarily policed, while a new government is put in place. 65% of the population decide not to fight and through the bombardment of propaganda decide the new government is for the better as the country is in ruins. Those that fight are traitors of freedom and seen on daily news as anti-freedom fighters. The words anti-freedom is deemed for every car bomb and IED device that explodes throughout the country.

The United Liberation Federation made up of billions of people wonder where do these anti-freedom fighters come from and how do they draw so many recruits? A new government is put in place as the ULF attempts to control these anti-freedom fighters who seek the destruction of the new America and democracy in general.

Anti-freedom fighters interviewed by Mexican journalists vow never to give up the fight to redeem their land and will continue to launch attacks against the ULF until they leave the country.
-------------------------------------------------------------

This thread will probably be moved by a mod, but in the war on terror have we ourselves become guilty of the very thing we fight?




posted on May, 12 2005 @ 10:58 PM
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Are you trying to say that in the event that america is invaded, the Americans who fight the EU and its so called Allies, They will be the same as the terrorists in iraq?


If so, you would be right if
1.They killed fellow americans. (purposely)
2.They beheaded fellow americans.
3.They beheaded anyone.
4.They killed any non military. (purposely)



posted on May, 12 2005 @ 11:00 PM
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To the country who is invading and installing a new government - absolutely, and they will use ervy means of Civil Affairs at their disposal to cause the citizens to cooperate.



posted on May, 13 2005 @ 05:09 AM
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Originally posted by C0le
If so, you would be right if
1.They killed fellow americans. (purposely)
2.They beheaded fellow americans.
3.They beheaded anyone.
4.They killed any non military. (purposely)


Does that not happen in America right now anyway?

Im reading that you seem to think that Americans are incapable of ever doing those things. Now, let alone during an occupation.



posted on May, 13 2005 @ 10:26 AM
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India and Pakistan who is part of the alliance ULF destroys themselves after Muslims realize the Hindus are a threat to Islam and wants to retake the disputed territory of Kashmir. Russia fights off against Chineses invasion after the country cannot support its billion people. China launches nukes at Japan who was part of the ULF, to retaliate for the biological attacks on the Chinese during the occupation in the 1930s and 40s. The EU nations who agree to help become part of the alliance to invade U.S. breaks down after France wants to take over the sovereignty of Poland, Hungary and Czeckslovakia. The UK does not want to be part of the ULF and decides to launch attacks on France who immediately backs down. In the U.S. all the currents that is going about around the world, they do nothing but watch and shake their heads.



posted on May, 13 2005 @ 11:19 AM
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We're supposed to believe that only 45% of Americans will fight of the socialist invasion? Living in a dream world cannot produce any positive effects other than when you wake up and realize that Americans, if invaded by this socialist force, will not stand for it.



posted on May, 13 2005 @ 01:06 PM
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Originally posted by Frosty
We're supposed to believe that only 45% of Americans will fight of the socialist invasion? Living in a dream world cannot produce any positive effects other than when you wake up and realize that Americans, if invaded by this socialist force, will not stand for it.


All 110% of them?



posted on May, 13 2005 @ 05:04 PM
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Originally posted by cargo

Originally posted by C0le
If so, you would be right if
1.They killed fellow americans. (purposely)
2.They beheaded fellow americans.
3.They beheaded anyone.
4.They killed any non military. (purposely)


Does that not happen in America right now anyway?

Im reading that you seem to think that Americans are incapable of ever doing those things. Now, let alone during an occupation.


Who said that? murder and roe are two diff things.



posted on May, 14 2005 @ 02:50 AM
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Do you consider the insurgents in Iraq to be murderers? Or do you believe their targets and means are permitted? Does an insurgency need roe?

Given the scenario vincere illustrated in his first post, do you think you would be using all means necessary to expel the occupation forces?




[edit on 14-5-2005 by cargo]



posted on May, 14 2005 @ 03:36 AM
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Do you consider the insurgents in Iraq to be murderers? Or do you believe their targets and means are permitted? Does an insurgency need roe?

I donot agree with what they do however, IF they target only coalition forces legit Military targets and donot attack and kill civilians on purpose then no i wouldnt consider them murderers.


Given the scenario vincere illustrated in his first post, do you think you would be using all means necessary to expel the occupation forces?

I would use any means necessary, by targeting military convoys, bases, ect.
Military targets




[edit on 14-5-2005 by C0le]



posted on May, 14 2005 @ 04:00 AM
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What about civilian truck drivers working for the Military? Can you understand how insurgents view contractors as those who are rebuilding their country under the authority of an occupation force?

I'm not saying it's right, but I understand why they would target them.



posted on May, 14 2005 @ 04:19 AM
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I'm not entirely certain the 65% ratio is so far off. There are a lot of people in the Homeland who would not fight for any cause, believing violence in any sense is simply barbaric, and that there would be other ways of solving this issue (diplomatically, democratically). There's also quite a few elderly, minor and sickly citizens. Of course, there's also a lot of people who would not fight because either they don't like America but perhaps most importantly, many would not fight because they have to take care of their families, and they can't do that if they're dead, and they will die if the opposition is strong enough to have destroyed they American military.

I have no doubt that the citizens of the United States will feel a stronger level of patriotism in the event of their nation being overrun, many people will even be driven to hostilities, but I'm not even sure I can say half of the population will fight, especially if the fight drags on very long. We, the Americans, are quite detached from our government. Not everyone votes, most people probably couldn't even name their Senators let alone their Representatives. I don't think it would be as big of a deal to everyone as some would think. While it may be a tragedy to see our government fall, people will realize that they are separate from the government, they have not fallen. It's still going to be a Representative-Democracy from what the first poster has stated.

So it is my opinion that yes, we will rise up and attempt to fight off our attackers, but the majority of people will not fight, they will do whatever jobs they are doing now and support the patriots from behind the scenes, by keeping the economy rolling, the cities functioning and the families fed, and warm. I would think 25-50% of the population becoming "minute-men" or guerillas is a more acceptable number, and that percentage will fall as time goes on, people become more accepting of what is happening, and more convinced by foreign propaganda. Besides, how many of you have weapons? How long will your ammunition supplies last? We can't keep at it forever without someone giving us more firepower from time to time as our ammunition factories are few and will be taken by the foreign militaries for sure, and it sounds like the everyone who could send us more supplies are against us, atleast in this scenario.



posted on May, 14 2005 @ 04:26 AM
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Originally posted by cargo
What about civilian truck drivers working for the Military? Can you understand how insurgents view contractors as those who are rebuilding their country under the authority of an occupation force?

I'm not saying it's right, but I understand why they would target them.


Depends realy, if that civllian is carrying military equipment then his vehicle should be stoped and everything onboard should be destroyed/taken he shouldnt be killed unless he picks up a weapon and fights, If hes carrying civillian supplies then i wouldnt consider him or his load a target.



posted on May, 14 2005 @ 07:36 AM
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45% of 300 million(+ or-) is a good size army!

One of the many reason to keep the 2A!

Roper



posted on May, 14 2005 @ 08:54 AM
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This whole thread is absurd because it eliminates the most fundamental defense of our nation- the use of nuclear weapons. How can you create a scenario where the US is invaded by hostile forces and DOESN'T use nuclear weapons to defend its very existance?

You might as well say "what if Americans had gills and were invaded by fish?"



posted on May, 14 2005 @ 01:36 PM
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someone here has to much public schooling not enough thinking.

For any nation or combination of nations to invade and maintain a military far from home and supply is a huge logistical problem..constantly draining the economies of these nations...Individually or collectively. There are only a handful of nations who can even contemplate this kind of senerio and then they must keep it up. What we have done in Iraq/Afganistan is way to difficult for the bulk of nations on this earth ..even in combinations working together ...they just dont have the economies to do this.

To do this you must have a America totally unprepared as was the case in the Revolutionary War or the War of 1812.
Attacking any country as large as the United States is a huge difficult task...then try to maintain this momentum...an even larger problem. Much larger than just attacking.

I dont put much stock in public education in this area..they are just abunch of fear mongers. All they know how to do is breed a bunch of scared...fearful...consumers... this is what they are designed to do. Not a accident.

Dont worry about invasion...worry more about your whoremongering, give away, politicians selling your nation out from under you for votes and power. By this manner they sell the very soul of a nation...this is historically demonstratable ..just as was done in Ancient Rome..the same is being done here...in America.

Thanks ,
Orangetom



posted on May, 14 2005 @ 06:19 PM
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Originally posted by orangetom1999
Dont worry about invasion...worry more about your whoremongering, give away, politicians selling your nation out from under you for votes and power. By this manner they sell the very soul of a nation...this is historically demonstratable ..just as was done in Ancient Rome..the same is being done here...in America.

Thanks ,
Orangetom


You're reading too much into the scenario. It's a means of showing that an invading force backed by overwhelming military power and finances in all probability will be successsful unless resistance is provided through guerilla warfare. It's also a means of providing the reader with viewing how he or she, if they were in Iraqi shoes, would react to such a situation - fight or be occupied. And how would you fight and by what means available? You may not believe in assaulting civilian supply trucks that provide the so called Liberation Federation with logistics, but I guarantee there will be a hundred others that would.



posted on May, 16 2005 @ 01:21 AM
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It's also a means of providing the reader with viewing how he or she, if they were in Iraqi shoes, would react to such a situation - fight or be occupied. And how would you fight and by what means available? You may not believe in assaulting civilian supply trucks that provide the so called Liberation Federation with logistics, but I guarantee there will be a hundred others that would.

You are missing a big point here.

When Americans wins democracy, civil rights, rule of law, free market enterprise, high standards of living follow. (We fight for what's right)

When the otherside wins (Facism, Communism, Islamic terrorism), dictatorships, slavery, genocide, and famine follow. They fight for what's bad.

Just look at North and South Korea, East and Western Europe, Japan and China for examples. Ask people would they rather live in Iraq now or Iraq five years ago? Ask women if they would rather live in Afghanistan now or five years ago.

Oh, and the last time European soldiers fought in the US was for the right of white southern planters to enslave other men and seceede from the US.

For a foreign army to enter the US, something VERY VERY drastic would have to happen. It would be the largest event in history.

Seeing how the Europeans failed to go into Rwanda or Sudan, something very very big would have to happen.

Also imagine what would happen to their economies if they declared war. The US would just past a law saying they are legally not paying back any foreign debt. A lot of the world economies are financed by the taxing power of the US govt. If we say we're not paying it back, they would be gone in an instant.



posted on May, 16 2005 @ 03:09 AM
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Originally posted by lukethedrifter
You are missing a big point here.

When Americans wins democracy, civil rights, rule of law, free market enterprise, high standards of living follow. (We fight for what's right)

When the otherside wins (Facism, Communism, Islamic terrorism), dictatorships, slavery, genocide, and famine follow. They fight for what's bad.


I see, so it's okay for me to drop a bomb on your house to make things better for you - in the long run I mean. If the other side, as you put it, and I don't give a crap about the label (communist, democratic, bean farmer) invades, they ARE the liberating party. Put death and destruction under any banner you like. It comes in all different colors, for all different reasons. Take a look around, wake up, open your eyes - there are 191 countries out there, 192 if you include Taiwan. Each government plays by their own rules, or by those who rule them.

You seem to miss the point - the Iraqi muslims are not going to be ruled by America. No amount of FORCED democracy is going to change this reality. The response to this of course is, they had elections and rule themselves now. They live by a different culture - it's called tradition mixed with the Quran. Yes many Iraqi's want more freedom, yes many Iraqi's are adamantly muslim and are required by a thousand years of tradition to see America as only an invading infidel. I really don't understand how people can be so naive when it comes to the traditions and culture of a people. Yes many want the U.S. there and yes, a good amount will fight to get the infidels out and it will never change as long as the culture breathes. The white house is fully aware of the cultural difference and the dozens of PhD's over the last ten years who have educated in such. Ignorance falls on those who just have an opinion on how an engine works rather than those who are mechanics in a shop. I assure you the white house, the Pentagon, and the think tanks of this nation are not ignorant. They know what they're doing and why, everyone else is BS'd on how the motor works.

The U.S. will be in Iraq until petro reserves are secure. After that there will be mass troop pullouts. "Stay the course," is a term used to bolster the masses under a banner of courage. Reality check - terrorism will never end. As long as there is a defined enemy there will be defined war. If you believe any other way, thats great, but it don't change what is.

Do I blame the Iraqi's for fighting? Of course not and we don't blame our troops for shooting them. Should anyone blame a soldier for shooting the enemy? Troops do what they signed up to do, and they are required to follow orders. If our beloved country was invaded and our neighbor's houses bombed, you can bet your arse some of us will fight those liberators, because we don't give a damn about whos right and for what reason only that Mike and Jill got wasted along with their 4 year old kid and Grandpa Jim got wasted and our brother didn't make it. Forget all the BS thats reality. If I have a bad leader in my country, and we need liberating, sure, but don't bomb my home or shoot up my streets, or you are my enemy.



posted on May, 16 2005 @ 10:38 AM
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Originally posted by vincere7

Originally posted by lukethedrifter
You are missing a big point here.

When Americans wins democracy, civil rights, rule of law, free market enterprise, high standards of living follow. (We fight for what's right)

When the otherside wins (Facism, Communism, Islamic terrorism), dictatorships, slavery, genocide, and famine follow. They fight for what's bad.


I see, so it's okay for me to drop a bomb on your house to make things better for you - in the long run I mean. If the other side, as you put it, and I don't give a crap about the label (communist, democratic, bean farmer) invades, they ARE the liberating party. Put death and destruction under any banner you like. It comes in all different colors, for all different reasons. Take a look around, wake up, open your eyes - there are 191 countries out there, 192 if you include Taiwan. Each government plays by their own rules, or by those who rule them.

You seem to miss the point - the Iraqi muslims are not going to be ruled by America. No amount of FORCED democracy is going to change this reality. The response to this of course is, they had elections and rule themselves now. They live by a different culture - it's called tradition mixed with the Quran. Yes many Iraqi's want more freedom, yes many Iraqi's are adamantly muslim and are required by a thousand years of tradition to see America as only an invading infidel. I really don't understand how people can be so naive when it comes to the traditions and culture of a people. Yes many want the U.S. there and yes, a good amount will fight to get the infidels out and it will never change as long as the culture breathes. The white house is fully aware of the cultural difference and the dozens of PhD's over the last ten years who have educated in such. Ignorance falls on those who just have an opinion on how an engine works rather than those who are mechanics in a shop. I assure you the white house, the Pentagon, and the think tanks of this nation are not ignorant. They know what they're doing and why, everyone else is BS'd on how the motor works.

The U.S. will be in Iraq until petro reserves are secure. After that there will be mass troop pullouts. "Stay the course," is a term used to bolster the masses under a banner of courage. Reality check - terrorism will never end. As long as there is a defined enemy there will be defined war. If you believe any other way, thats great, but it don't change what is.

Do I blame the Iraqi's for fighting? Of course not and we don't blame our troops for shooting them. Should anyone blame a soldier for shooting the enemy? Troops do what they signed up to do, and they are required to follow orders. If our beloved country was invaded and our neighbor's houses bombed, you can bet your arse some of us will fight those liberators, because we don't give a damn about whos right and for what reason only that Mike and Jill got wasted along with their 4 year old kid and Grandpa Jim got wasted and our brother didn't make it. Forget all the BS thats reality. If I have a bad leader in my country, and we need liberating, sure, but don't bomb my home or shoot up my streets, or you are my enemy.






we didnt force a couple of million Iraqis to the polls, they volunteered to go to the polls, and the "freedom fighters" try to prevent it from happening. think of this as another approach to a new system of democratic Islam, people power while still religious. Muslims in America have no problem while still keeping their religion. u have these "freedom fighters" intentionally killing innocent people to intimidate from going forward of a democratic country where its the people and not a religion that rules.

[edit on 16-5-2005 by deltaboy]



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