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There is no such thing as Al-Zarqawi.

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posted on May, 10 2005 @ 11:13 AM
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Zarqawi "was very interested in accomplishing something in Europe," Shahdi Abdella, a former Zarqawi associate now in custody in Germany, told his interrogators last April. "He needed people outside of Afghanistan," Abdellah said, "and particularly in Europe." Abdellah's lengthy description of Zarqawi and his network is contained in a memo that resulted from Abdellah's questioning by German authorities. A copy of the memo, whose information has led to several arrests in Europe, was provided last week to The New York Times.

www.globalpolicy.org...



Seems like far more claim to have known him then those that claimed he does not exist




posted on May, 10 2005 @ 11:15 AM
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Well, it seems apparent that Zaqawi does exist, just that some of the finer points of his movements are blurred.

I have to laugh at Syrian Sister, she obvioulsy is desperatley trying to cling to her warped beliefs, not once offering ANY evidence to support ger claims.
This is the type of person who could argue that the earth is flat no matter how much evidence you present


I'm surprised that some of you are so persistent, quite frankly I don't know why you bother, SS obviously spends too much time in the kitchen to live in the real world.



posted on May, 10 2005 @ 11:21 AM
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I can't red all of this thread as it has absolutely exploded! Let me remind folks, though, that this is a conspiracy "theory" message board. One does not have to have proof for a theory, does one?

Personally, I think Sistah girl has raised some very good questions and made some pretty good observations.

Come on! How many of you super patriots, good nephews of ol' Uncle Sam, haven't stopped here and there along the course of this "righteous war" and thought to yourself about some piece of news, "That doesn't make sense!"?



posted on May, 10 2005 @ 11:23 AM
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Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
I can't red all of this thread as it has absolutely exploded! Let me remind folks, though, that this is a conspiracy "theory" message board. One does not have to have proof for a theory, does one?



Personally, I think if a person claims to have proof, then the must have it.



posted on May, 10 2005 @ 11:26 AM
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Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
I can't red all of this thread as it has absolutely exploded! Let me remind folks, though, that this is a conspiracy "theory" message board. One does not have to have proof for a theory, does one?



No. But one should be able to put up some argument and some evidence for a theory.
For myself, I believe that Zarqawi is either dead, captured or insignificant militarily in Iraq. That doesn't make the thread originator's argument any more correct if all she/he is doing is basing a theory on an ignorant hoax put about elsewhere and repeating it parrot fashion. The fact that the end result happens to be similar doesn't mean that the detail should be overlooked.



posted on May, 10 2005 @ 11:32 AM
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Originally posted by SpittinCobra

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
I can't red all of this thread as it has absolutely exploded! Let me remind folks, though, that this is a conspiracy "theory" message board. One does not have to have proof for a theory, does one?



Personally, I think if a person claims to have proof, then the must have it.


I am with Cobra on this. SS claims she had proof yet has spent more time in the kitchen cooking then producing what she claimed she had.



posted on May, 10 2005 @ 11:34 AM
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I'll go along with that, Leveller.
But, you know what? How long should people hear about an highly mobile mobile peg-leg who is in ill health before some start wondering if this guy wasn't a fabrication used as a rallying point?



posted on May, 10 2005 @ 11:39 AM
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I agree, if one claims to have proof, then one is obligated to show, demonstrate or explain the proof. I still haven't read each of these pages (I'm missing 10 and 11, I think), but I've come across no proof as of yet.

Lookit, I don't care what anyone says, I'm on Sistah Girl's side. Any girl who spends that much time in the kitchen is A-ok with me!

*Ducks the plates thrown by all the ladies in the house!*


Ok, I agree, if proof is teased, proof should be displayed. Regardless, though, it seems a bit hinky to me, too.



posted on May, 10 2005 @ 11:42 AM
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Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
I'll go along with that, Leveller.
But, you know what? How long should people hear about an highly mobile mobile peg-leg who is in ill health before some start wondering if this guy wasn't a fabrication used as a rallying point?


I seriously doubt he was a fabrication since there are thousands of sources that state he was born and then we have a huge number of accounts by individuals who claimed they knew him or spent time in jail with him. Those alone prove he did exist at one time, wither he is still alive or not possibly could be questioned.

But to insist he does not exist simply because a select few think he is a myth is wrong.



posted on May, 10 2005 @ 11:53 AM
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Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
I'll go along with that, Leveller.
But, you know what? How long should people hear about an highly mobile mobile peg-leg who is in ill health before some start wondering if this guy wasn't a fabrication used as a rallying point?



This is what makes it an interesting subject and why it should be discussed properly - not left to somebody who can't be bothered to offer good argument:

I've read in plenty of places that Zarqawi actually had both legs. The mention of amputation came from Powell but was reported to have been US security misinformation.

msnbc.msn.com...

What I find even more interesting is that the stories of Zarqawi being the head of an Iraqi insurgent group did not originate with the US but actually came from German intelligence!!!!



posted on May, 11 2005 @ 05:45 AM
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Syrian Sister
[...] Also read george orwell's 1984 [...]



Apollyon:
No politically motivated person should be with their copy of 1984.


I've heard it is a decent read - But I have the impression that George Orwell is somewhat pessimistic, like he doesn't draw any conclusions as to how we should go about correcting the problems... It is my understanding that the book was writter somewhat humourously and ironically... But does point out some critical facts...



Apollyon:
Are you really a Marxist?


Yep ...


Marx·ist: Pronunciation Key (märksst)
n.


  1. One that believes in, or follows the ideas of Marx and Engels
  2. An advocate of Marxism
  3. A political or emotionally charged term used to refer to extreme radicals or revolutionaries

See also; Communism, Socialism, Lenin and Trotsky



posted on May, 11 2005 @ 06:12 AM
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Originally posted by shots

Originally posted by Syrian Sister
(possibly born on October 20, 1966)

Possibly?

How'd you know that, do you have his birth certificate?


You do have a problems reading don't you? it was in one of the previous posts that stated his mother died in feb 2004.


Here are some more you can call liars they claim they spent time in jail with him.

www.csmonitor.com...

Now I would say it is kind of hard to spend time in jail with someone that never existed wouldn't you say?

Now lets recap Germany wants Him, as does Jordan, Spain and of course the US. Note three out of the four countries are other then the US kind of makes you go hummmmmmmm again since they think he is real.

Then you have a google search with approx 45,000 hits that state he was born in Jordan, Granted some are duplicates however even if you take 50% of 45000 you still have 22,500 that state he was born in jordan unlike you, I provided all the original links



Again you get another F


Notice. I asked you to prove the existance of his MOTHER , not him.

But i will still adress your sources.

So what if they say he was born in jordon? People say santa claus is from the north pole, do we belive them?

you said,

"You do have a problems reading don't you? it was in one of the previous posts that stated his mother died in feb 2004."

his birth certificate is in the previouse post? not to my knoweledge it's not.

Besides, my santa annology from the very begining, read it and you'll see. I said, "santa claus does not exist. Saint Nicholous may have existed at one point in time. But all the subsequent stories there are about "Santa" are false, and santa does not exist".



posted on May, 11 2005 @ 06:18 AM
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not of Zarqawi, but of his mother. You continue to ignore my request

. However, i will again adress what you wrote.




Seems like far more claim to have known him then those that claimed he does not exist


Those that claim that he does not exist, are the people that the US claim were among him.

Those that claim he does exist, are proven to be wrong.
Did you ever notice, that all those that claim to have seen him, here or there, turn out to be wrong?
All the information the US is given about his ware abouts, turns out to be false, since they can never find him in those locations.

(This brings me to part of the food i was preparing for you)

So who are these sources, that keep claiming to have seen him? Criminals, and opportunists, by your own admition!




www.indybay.org...

Quote:

US military intelligence agents in Iraq have revealed a series of botched and often tawdry dealings with unreliable sources who, in the words of one source, "told us what we wanted to hear".

"We were basically paying up to $10,000 a time to opportunists, criminals and chancers who passed off fiction and supposition about Zarqawi as cast-iron fact, making him out as the linchpin of just about every attack in Iraq," the agent said.

"Back home this stuff was gratefully received and formed the basis of policy decisions. We needed a villain, someone identifiable for the public to latch on to, and we got one."




posted on May, 11 2005 @ 06:23 AM
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You said: "Well, it seems apparent that Zaqawi does exist, just that some of the finer points of his movements are blurred."

Some of the finer points of his movements are blurred? HAH! Yes, because he's a ghost, he is blurry when he moves.

Not offering any evidence you say? Well the fact that the tiny city of fallujah, no one has even seen this mythical figure. Isn't evidence?

The fact that any source that does say they have seen him, turns out to be false.

That isn't evidence?

Well don't worry, THERE IS MORE Evidence on the way. BUT WAIT, THERE'S MORE, you GET a free set of stake knifes!!!!



SS obviously spends too much time in the kitchen to live in the real world.


If you spent some time in the kitchen doing some research, perhaps you would come to intellectual conclusions. BUt you know those people who can't hack the heat, should get out of the kitchen.

Truth hurts, doesn't it rogue?

[edit on 11-5-2005 by Syrian Sister]



posted on May, 11 2005 @ 06:24 AM
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Originally posted by SpittinCobra

Personally, I think if a person claims to have proof, then the must have it.


I gave you the evidence that i promiced, and more is on the way.

[edit on 11-5-2005 by Syrian Sister]



posted on May, 11 2005 @ 06:29 AM
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Originally posted by Leveller

No. But one should be able to put up some argument and some evidence for a theory.
For myself, I believe that Zarqawi is either dead, captured or insignificant militarily in Iraq. That doesn't make the thread originator's argument any more correct if all she/he is doing is basing a theory on an ignorant hoax put about elsewhere and repeating it parrot fashion. The fact that the end result happens to be similar doesn't mean that the detail should be overlooked.


my original statement was "Zarqawi DOES not exists". Not, "Zarqawi DID not exists". Saint nicholous may have existed, but Santa does not. Zarqawi is a ghost, a phantom. I'm basing a theory on an ignorant hoax?

I'm basing MY "theory", on my own observations, logical conclusions, and evidence to support my theory.

I made a statement.

You asked me to provide evidence.

I did.

The next post has the rest of the evidence i promiced you.



posted on May, 11 2005 @ 07:49 AM
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I have already demonstrated, that the people who are meant to be seeying him, the iraqies, have not seen him, and do not belive he exists.

Now, The contradictions within the official story.

------------------------------------------------------------------
www.iraq-war.ru...



Asked if he thought al-Zarqawi escaped during last month's U.S. assault on Fallujah, Majid smiled, took a drag on his cigarette and said, "Who knows that al-Zarqawi was ever in Fallujah?"


So let me get this straight, you where so sure that Zarqawi was in fallujah, that you made an ultimatum for the fallujans to hand him over, and when they asserted that he isn't in fallujah if at all he exists, you where so sure thay they where lying, that you flattened the whole city.

And then after you used "Zarqawi" myth to attack fallujah, you admit, you didn't even know wether he was there or not.

--------------------------------------------------------------

www.indybay.org...

Claims to have new photos of AL Zarqawi. From CNN. They claim not to know, where CNN got it from.

But those very photos, where from a police station in iraq that claimed to have captured Zarqawi, hence the front and profile shot. The idea that he was captured was quickly denied by the US government.

Also, you invented that the photos you gave came from the laptops? The photos existed months before the laptop story. Why is it that you invent things to suit your own agenda?
--------------------------------------------------------------

www.iraq-war.ru...

There is a hole in the story above, they say they are checking wether or not the prisoner is Zarqawi, by using DNA. But where did they get the refrence for the DNA check? You need, blood or hair sample etc. No such refrence exists.

------------------------------------------------------------
The contradictions in the official Story.

abcnews.go.com...

abcnews.go.com...

This source says the US 100% belive, He was healthy enough to jump of a truck,leave a laptop behind.


www.iraq-war.ru...

A week later, this source says they belive he is a sickly man in hospital.

One momment, the US media claims, that without a doubt they knew absolutely Zaraqawi is healthy enough to jump of a truck. Then a few days later they are using the excuse that Zarqawi is sick, to attack a hospital in Ramadi.

SO which is it, do you belive he is healthy or un healthy? You can't belive both at the same time. or are you just making things up to suit your agenda?

------------------------------------------------------------------------
abcnews.go.com...

abcnews.go.com...

Again. This source says that the US 100%, belive he jumped off a truck , left a laptop behind, and ran into a house (with 1 leg). They belived he ran into the house so much so, that they raided the house and arrested everyone inside.

But alas, Zarqawi was not there. Why is that, if they where certain he ran in, certain enough to arrest everyone. Why was he not found. Did he run away? What does he run at the speed of sound with just one leg? Why couldn't the US go that extra metre to catch him, if he was on foot (pun intended) as they claimed he was?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

www.iraq-war.ru...

The article above says that they intercepted his letter, and yet they can't intercept him?

They know exactly where he is, fallujah, ramadi. And yet, they can't find him? how is that so?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Us says he is the master of disguise and frequently changes his physical shape.

Yet he keeps the beard, LOL!!!!

If if what they say is true, and no one can even recognise Zarqawi (because he can morph in a mutant kind of way), then how can any of their "tips" as to where he is, be credible?

I'll show you how creddible your sources are.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

How many times has he been killed?

www.cbsnews.com...

www.msnbc.msn.com...

www.absoluteastronomy.com...

From the last one above.



Early in 2002, there were unverified reports from Quick Facts about: Northern Alliance
A multiethnic alliance in Afghanistan who practice a moderate form of Islam and are united in their opposition to the TalibanNorthern Alliance members that Zarqawi had been killed by a missile attack in Afghanistan. Many news sources repeated the claim.

Later, Kurdish groups claimed that Zarqawi had not died in the missile strike, but had been severely injured, and went to Quick Facts about: Baghdad
Capital and largest city of Iraq; located on the Tigris RiverBaghdad in 2002 to have his leg amputated. On October 7, 2002, the day before Congress voted to give the President permission to go to war against Iraq, President Bush gave a speech in Quick Facts about: Cincinnati, Ohio
Quick Summary not found for this subjectCincinnati, Ohio that repeated this claim as fact.


The US said all these sources are wrong and that he is still alive. There can be two explanations for this. One of those sources are right, Zarqawi is long dead, and the US is lying and continue to lie. Explanation number two, all of those sources are wrong and ficticous , just like most things that talk about Zarqaw.

The fact is, he DOES (at this momment) not exist, and even if he ever existed, he is long ago dead. So the stories they keep coming up with about this ghost, are lies!
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

How many times has he been captured? Here is a few?


www.iraq-war.ru...

www.iraq-war.ru...

www.iraq-war.ru...

www.iraq-war.ru...

www.iraq-war.ru...

There is a hole in the story above, they say they are checking wether or not the prisoner is Zarqawi, by using DNA. But where did they get the refrence for the DNA check?

www.iraq-war.ru...

Captured again but they quickly deny it.

www.iraq-war.ru...

so close and yet so far.

www.iraq-war.ru...

and again.

And then it turns out "not to be him". Now the US can't have their
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

How many aides does he have? (same number of elfs that santa has)

www.iraq-war.ru...

www.iraq-war.ru...

in the above, 10 aides at once? what did you find the north pole?

www.iraq-war.ru...

www.democracynow.org.../06/21/1410218

www.iraq-war.ru...

Now it's a "key associate".
www.iraq-war.ru...

It's funny how they can always catch his "aides", and yet never catch him? Surely if they have so many of his aides, then atleast one of them, would reveal his location, how he hides, his hidden underground tunnel system.. oops i better not give your government ideas.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
sketchy information indeed.

www.indybay.org...

Quote:

US military intelligence agents in Iraq have revealed a series of botched and often tawdry dealings with unreliable sources who, in the words of one source, "told us what we wanted to hear".

"We were basically paying up to $10,000 a time to opportunists, criminals and chancers who passed off fiction and supposition about Zarqawi as cast-iron fact, making him out as the linchpin of just about every attack in Iraq," the agent said.

"Back home this stuff was gratefully received and formed the basis of policy decisions. We needed a villain, someone identifiable for the public to latch on to, and we got one."

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
You wrote, that the Zarqawi went back to baghdad to get surgery on his leg in 2002.

But when i asked you why would he go BAGHDAD for the surgery.

You wrote, "he knew the Iraq war was coming". again you make things up to suit your agenda. We are expected to belive he is phsycic? Also aren't you the samer person that claimed the leg story was false?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

The man doesn't even have a history... stay tuned next post!



posted on May, 11 2005 @ 08:12 AM
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this is where the mood turns fierce.

Shots, i asked you to prove the existance of his mother.
What you provided me with was not even a name, it was a time of death.

Now what was it you said to me? "I want a dead body, only a dead body will convince me". LOL. Well i won't say that back to you. I'll ask for something you can possible, how about a death certificate? Give me a death certificate, go on then. Back up your claims, give me proof.

Well since you where so incompetant in the kitchen, i did my own research. I found that the date of death that you gave came from a sketchy letter from an unamed source. How convenient that the women is dead, now we don't have to ask her about Zarqawi's history, nor some photos of him as a child.

You also, couldn't even provide a name for Zarqawi's mother. So naturally, being a truth seeker, i went out and did the research for you, and tried to look for her name. Well i found a "name" lol, Umm sayel. But in arabic Umm sayel means "mother of Sayel" .

Now In arabic culture out of respect you call a mother, mother of (insert sons name), or a father, father of (insert sons name).

Infact, "Zarqawi" is just one of supposedly many aliases. Abu Mussab Al Zarqawi in arabic means "Father of Mussab from the city of Zarqa" . Zarqa being the cit he is supposedly from, if at all he exists. Other aliases includes,
Ahmad Fadeel al-Nazal al-Khalayleh, and Sayel.


www.google.com.au...:Zarqawi

So when i tried to find Zarqawi's mother's name, i found "um sayel" which translates to, "mother of Zarqawi". Wooow so much information we have got about her.

Shots, i've shot you down.

Besides, I wrote in the very begining.



posted on 7-5-2005 at 09:44 PM Post Number: 1370185 (post id: 1392078)

If the man every existed

he is long gone now


Even if a man by the name of sayal etc (saint nicholous) may have exited once, a man by the name of Zarqawi, does not exist at this time.

I gave you the evidence and the reasons behind that opinion.

I always said from the begining, 3rd post down.

" Sure, i've got evidence And reasons behind that opinion."

And i gave you evidence.

But you kept saying that i said i will give you a "proof", but i always maintained, you can't prove a negative, 2nd and 3rd pages. You can only expose a positive proof to be false.

So i have given you, exactly what i said i would.

Enjoy!



posted on May, 11 2005 @ 08:16 AM
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Originally posted by Syrian Sister
not of Zarqawi, but of his mother. You continue to ignore my request


oh contrare SS I did not ignore your request at all, I posted an article that clearly stated she died she died in Feb of 2004,



Those that claim that he does not exist, are the people that the US claim were among him.

Those that claim he does exist, are proven to be wrong.
Did you ever notice, that all those that claim to have seen him, here or there, turn out to be wrong?
All the information the US is given about his ware abouts, turns out to be false, since they can never find him in those locations.


Some intelligence reports have been wrong centuries or didn't you know that? Example, before the start of the conflict many nations other then the US believed Sadman had WMDs according to their reports and they firmly belived at one time, they were right, but the conflict has proven them all wrong. And no I am not talking US reports. I am talking Germany, France, England, Norway, the list goes on and on.



(This brings me to part of the food i was preparing for you)

So who are these sources, that keep claiming to have seen him? Criminals, and opportunists, by your own admition!


www.indybay.org...

Quote:

US military intelligence agents in Iraq have revealed a series of botched and often tawdry dealings with unreliable sources who, in the words of one source, "told us what we wanted to hear".

"We were basically paying up to $10,000 a time to opportunists, criminals and chancers who passed off fiction and supposition about Zarqawi as cast-iron fact, making him out as the linchpin of just about every attack in Iraq," the agent said.

"Back home this stuff was gratefully received and formed the basis of policy decisions. We needed a villain, someone identifiable for the public to latch on to, and we got one."



The part you were preparing for me


I thought you said it was in your archives and three years old


Here is the date on the article Saturday, Mar. 05, 2005 at 10:42 AM
which you can clearly see is only two months old, yet you claimed the information you had was in your archives and it was three years old.
Frankly I think you have been making this up all along


BTW I do believe someone else or myself already posted the very same link yesterday
using another portion of the page.


Originally posted by Lanotom
Wait. There's new photos.

And notice how they made sure to give him a profile in the photo.

www.indybay.org...


Again you get another F.

Just because there is faulty intelligence or the fact that some of those making the statements are in or have been in jail does not mean they are all not creditable. You are really stretching here and I think not only are you running out of rope you are about to hang your own theory.


Now where is that source you claim is three years old








[edit on 5/11/2005 by shots]



posted on May, 11 2005 @ 08:24 AM
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DAMN, i can't belive how much i rule!


the truth just has a heat that some people can't handle.



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