geniuses on the concept of "god"...

what did geniuses say about the concept of "god"???

can you name a genius, and then tell me his / her religion???

also, did they give any "evidence" or "reasoning" for their beliefs???

for example:

www.2think.org...

Einstein and Hawking believe in their god comes from the common quote: "God does not play dice with the Universe."

ctinquiry.org...

What Did "God" Mean for Einstein?
Early in his life Einstein came to refer to God as "cosmic intelligence" which he did not think of in a personal but in a "super-personal" way, for, as he learned from Spinoza, the term "personal" when applied to human beings cannot as such be applied to God. 12 Nevertheless he resorted to the Jewish-Christian way of speaking of God who reveals himself in an ineffable way as truth which is its own certainty. Spinoza held that "truth is its own standard". "Truth is the criterion of itself and of the false, as light reveals itself and darkness," so that "he who has a true idea, simultaneously knows that he has a true idea, and cannot doubt concerning the truth of the thing perceived." 13 Hence once a thing is understood it goes on manifesting itself in the power of its own truth without having to provide for further proof. 14 Thus when God reveals himself to our minds, our understanding of him is carried forward by the intrinsic force of his truth as it continually impinges on our minds and presses for fuller realization within them.

In this way Einstein thought of God as revealing himself in the wonderful harmony and rational beauty of the universe, which calls for a mode of non-conceptual intuitive response in humility, wonder and awe which he associated with science and art. It was particularly in relation to science itself, however, that Einstein felt and cultivated that sense of wonder and awe. Once when Ernest Gordon, Dean of Princeton University Chapel, was asked by a fellow Scot, the photographer Alan Richards, how he could explain Einstein's combination of great intellect with apparent simplicity, he said, "I think it was his sense of reverence." 15 That was very true: Einstein's religious and scientific instinct were one and the same, for behind both it was his reverent intuition for God, his unabated awe at the thoughts of "the Old One", that was predominent.

mindprod.com...

On the topic of religion, Einstein said the following:

- "I cannot believe that God would choose to play dice with the universe." He was upset at the lack of order implied in Quantum Mechanics. I think he might prefer the Many World's Interpretation which avoids that gambling element.
- "I want to know God's thoughts... The rest are details.", and by that I think he meant the design intentions behind the physical properties of the universe.
- "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."
- "The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. He to whom this emotion is a stranger, who can no longer pause to wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as good as dead: his eyes are closed." I suspect Einstein was thus impatient with religions that claimed to have pat answers to all questions. He might have thought along the lines of my real god essay.

what about this???:

E = MC2 Disproves Biblegod

lets start a discussion!!!




[edit on 3-5-2005 by they see ALL]

I'm a genius. Technically, low-end anyways, 149.

I thought in certain instances E=MC2 was flawed, its great for use in basic physics and the all around principal. Like trying to explain the universes with outdated theories.


Sir Issac Newton: www.newton.cam.ac.uk...

VII RELIGIOUS CONVICTIONS AND PERSONALITY Newton also wrote on Judaeo-Christian prophecy, whose decipherment was essential, he thought, to the understanding of God. ... The full extent of Newton's unorthodoxy was recognized only in the present century: but although a critic of accepted Trinitarian dogmas and the Council of Nicaea, he possessed a deep religious sense, venerated the Bible and accepted its account of creation. In late editions of his scientific works he expressed a strong sense of God's providential role in nature.

[edit on 3-5-2005 by TheJeSta]

Newton was also very involved in alchemy. There is heavily spiritual side to alchemy if people didn't know. But I believe Einstein hit theology spot on.

lol yea I am technically a genius I got a 151 lol lower end too but I don't understand how E=mc2 proves that there is no God....I have never imagined God as someone I could touch, so mass and other things wouldn't matter, and if you could go with the idea that since God could do anything he could make it so the rule doesn't applyI mean he is God. Dependin on where this thread is headed it might be moved to the Conspiracy in Religion Forum.

thanks for your comments...

are there anymore????

I believe there is certainly a higher power/God. Most people have a fairly innate sense of it I think, but logic supports the concept of a God aswell. We live every day (as a species) discovering new things, pieces of this design we live in and learning how the design functions etc. I think that it is senseless for some people to believe that this reality is somehow, magically, design we have encountered with no designer.

logic supports the concept of a God aswell.

Actually logic negates the existance of an improvable etherical divine presence.
If, then, and, or... the idea of a god exists outside this definition.

Personally, I feel organized and structured religion is the greatest failure of mankind. Assigning beliefs with labels created by man is in complete hipocracy to divinity. There are those who would label me as agnostic.. I am not willing to say with certainty what is or is not that which I have no true knowledge of. To those, I give a big F-YOU with the appropriate hand gesture, because I do not label my ideas about faith and spirituality. I am a spiritual person, but I do not attempt to give thought structure to form beliefs, because there is no possible way for me to actually possess the information needed to form these constructs. This is where 95% of humans fail in their quest for divine enlightenment.

Can't really put it into any more words... this is beyond words, beyond thought, and definitely beyond anything any man has ever known.

"The gift of mental power comes from God, Divine Being, and if we concetrate our minds on that truth, we become in tune with this great power.
My Mother had taught me to seek all truth in the Bible."

As to e=mc2 proving GOD does not exist, it doesn't even govern sub-atomic particles(quantum mechanics) how could it explain GOD?

Another good quote:

"When you have closed your doors, and darkened your room, remember never to say that you are alone, for you are not alone; God is within, and your genius is within—and what need have they of light to see what you are doing?"

~ Epictetus (c. 50-120)
Roman Stoic philosopher, former slave & tutor of Marcus Aurelius

thanks...

and good quotes

I think anyone who wants to prove God exists has to wait till they have died in this life and send proof of existence to people still living . I know some claim this has been done but its not proven.Scientists ought to set up an experiment along theses lines i think.

Originally posted by they see ALL
what about this???:

E = MC2 Disproves Biblegod

Their argument begins with:

"But is such an infinite energy source even possible in our universe?"

They make an assumption that God cannot also exist outside our universe.


[edit on 5-5-2005 by Raphael_UO]

Originally posted by apc

logic supports the concept of a God aswell.

Actually logic negates the existance of an improvable etherical divine presence.
If, then, and, or... the idea of a god exists outside this definition.

Thank you.
Logic indeed negates the existence of divinity.... atleast the "humanish" forms of gods we have running around for a few thousand years.

You have voted apc for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have two more votes this month.

Ehem ignoring the F-You's thrown around. BAAAAD!

I personally reserve the word “genius” for people like Da Vinci etc. If Einstein believed that there existed a pattern in everything and that it was God’s doing, obviously he’d have problems digesting QM. Uncertainty and probabilities are not something you can digest if you believe in God (esp. the “he” “she” kinds) Here we go again with free will....

Good thread TSA but I hope you’re not trying to rationalize the existence of God by quoting a couple of scientists’ beliefs?

quote: "logic supports the concept of a God aswell."

quote: "Actually logic negates the existance of an improvable etherical divine presence."

Let me clarify-

Yes, logic would deny the possibility of a infinitly divine being, such as God. However, logic would support the concept of Intelligent Design, which is a very prominent aspect of most theistic beliefs. But yes, I agree that logic would suggest no ultimate divinity.

I_s_i_s...

"Good thread TSA but I hope you’re not trying to rationalize the existence of God by quoting a couple of scientists’ beliefs?"

maybe and maybe not...

these men were very smart...

they could know...

Originally posted by they see ALL

these men were very smart...

they could know...

Maybe not.
Its not fair for me either to just pick some very very intelligent athiests and try to rationalize the non-existence of god now is it?

Besides smart people make mistakes too. A lot of smart people can make the same mistake too.

EDIT: Someone already had posted what i originally typed lol....should have read the whole thread first lol.

[edit on 5-5-2005 by Vesuvius 13]

Originally posted by they see ALL
what did geniuses say about the concept of "god"???

can you name a genius, and then tell me his / her religion???

also, did they give any "evidence" or "reasoning" for their beliefs???

Yes, I can name some geniuses: Yehoshua Ben Yosef (AKA:Jesus), The Upanishads, Russell Targ, Winston Churchill, Jelauddin Rumi, Philipus Aureolus Paracelsus, Plato, Max Planck, Nobel Prize-winning Father of Quantum Theory, Confucius, Galileo Galilei, Ralph Waldo Emerson.

Their religion: Truth

Their evidence or reasoning (respectfully to the order stated above):

"The Kingdom of Heaven is ruled by GOD, the One True Father."
“If those who lead you say to you, “See, the Kingdom is in the sky,” then the birds of the sky will precede you. If they say to you, “It is in the sea,” then the fish will precede you. Rather, the Kingdom is inside of you, and it is outside of you. When you come to know yourselves, then you will become known, and you will realize that it is you who are the sons of the living father. But if you will not know yourselves, you will dwell in poverty and it is you who are that poverty.”
--Yehoshua Ben Yosef (AKA: Jesus)-- (All the sayings of Jesus gathered from ancient sources and compiled into a single volume for the first time. Compiled by Ricky Alan Mayotte) From “The Complete Jesus”. (Page 71)

“The spirit down here in man and the spirit up there in the sun, in reality are only one spirit, and there is no other one.”
--The Upanishads--

“Although each of us obviously inhabits a separate physical body, the laboratory data from a hundred years of parapsychology research strongly indicate that there is no separation in consciousness.”
--Russell Targ--

“Man will occasionally stumble over the truth, but usually manages to pick himself up, walk over or around it, and carry on.”
--Winston Churchill--

“Everything you see has its roots in the unseen world. The forms may change, yet the essence remains the same. Every wonderful sight will vanish; every sweet word will fade, but do not be disheartened, the source they come from is eternal, growing, branching out, giving new life and new joy. Why do you weep? The source is within you and this whole world is springing up from it.”
--Jelauddin Rumi--

“That which the dream shows is the shadow of such wisdom as exists in man, even if during his waking state he may know nothing about it… We so not know it because we are fooling away our time with outward and perishing things, and are asleep in regard to that which is real within ourselves.”
--Philipus Aureolus Paracelsus--

“….Perhaps there is a pattern set up in the heavens for one who desires to see it, and having seen it, to find one in himself.”
--Plato—

“All matter originates and exists only by virtue of force …. We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent Mind. This mind is the matrix of all matter.”
--Max Planck, Nobel Prize-winning Father of Quantum Theory--

“To put the world in order, we must first put the nation in order; to put the nation in order, we must first put the family in order; to put the family in order, we must cultivate our personal life; and to cultivate our personal life, we must first set our hearts right.”
--Confucius--

“I do not feel obliged to believe that the same GOD who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use.”
--Galileo Galilei--

“What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters to what lies within us.”
--Ralph Waldo Emerson--

"The Kingdom of Heaven is ruled by GOD, the One True Father."
"..... the Kingdom is inside of you, and it is outside of you."
--Yehoshua Ben Yosef (AKA: Jesus)-- (All the sayings of Jesus gathered from ancient sources and compiled into a single volume for the first time. Compiled by Ricky Alan Mayotte) From “The Complete Jesus”. (Page 71)


[edit on 5/5/05 by Esoteric Teacher]

[edit on 5/5/05 by Esoteric Teacher]

[edit on 5/5/05 by Esoteric Teacher]

LOL and them some, at myself. It seems I'm failing to grasp the concept behind this quoting in little grey boxes. Can someone shed some light on it for me? How do I just quote the portion intended and end the grey box after that?

Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher
LOL and them some, at myself. It seems I'm failing to grasp the concept behind this quoting in little grey boxes. Can someone shed some light on it for me? How do I just quote the portion intended and end the grey box after that?

(quote) PUT TEXT HERE (/quote)...

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