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Hypocrisy of the United States

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posted on May, 3 2005 @ 10:40 PM
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Originally posted by Quake
How do you think Iran would launch nuclear weapons in US? It simply does not have capability to reach US borders....

Check this link to find out about the Iranian Space Agency. If you can launch a satellite, you can send a warhead to anywhere on the planet. Same technology, different cargo. Sending something into orbit requires a higher apogee than sending it to another location on Earth.

I feel that you are incorrect in your assumption that Iran does not have the capability to reach the continental US with a ballistic missile. They DEFINITELY can.




posted on May, 3 2005 @ 11:45 PM
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First off I'd like to say great thread concept finalyy a nonpartisan thread that will deal with the issues.

Now to the meat of the issue I'd like to say that the whole thing comes down to whether or not you believe the Iranian governmetn is willing to destroy itself to make a minor. No government would throw itself away over nothing. There are only two scenarios I can think of where iran would nuke America.

Scenario one is a suicidal last gasp like Hitlers germany at the end of WWII where the mad tyrant was willing to sacrifice his people in there entirety to his failed dreams of racial utopia. That would however require agression on the part of the US so a containment approach woud negate that threat.
Scenario two is a rogue Iranian element stealing a Nuclear warhead for its own twisted agenda. There is no effective contingency for this scenario that the US can follow through on only the strength of the Iraninan government can prevent that.

Unfortunately the other major Islamic nation with Nukes is more likely to conduct such a scenario anyway. The Intelligence arm of pakistan is virtually a rogue element unto itself tempermental at best with ties to radical islamic groups at worst. Worst of all is that due to the structure of the Pakistani military is set up so that the intelligence arm is the group in charge of the nuclear weapons much the way the Soviet Unions nuclear program was run by the KGB.

Not to mention how musharaff isnt exactly making himself popular with the radical islamic elements of his government. All it would take is a little coup and PHHT youve got a rogue and potentially hostile nuclear program.

Back to my point with Iran just remember that just becasue a regime is despotic doesnt make them stupid or crazy for that matter. Just because a nation is willing to send out individuals to certain death doesnt mean they would be willing to sacrifice themselves in their entirety. Look at japan during WWII they used suicide bombers (also known as Kamikaze) you'd assume theyd be willing to sacrifice themselves to spite america. Yet the moment their obliteration as a people became a real possibility they wised up and surrendered.

Yeah you had the few lunatics who were willing to continue on to the doom of the Japanese race but the rest of the population straightened them out. The same way it can be assumed the Iranian population (not just the civilan population by the way) will do their best to insure their survival by a avoiding a nuclear holocaust at all costs.



posted on May, 4 2005 @ 01:16 AM
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Originally posted by xman_in_blackx

Check this link to find out about the Iranian Space Agency. If you can launch a satellite, you can send a warhead to anywhere on the planet. Same technology, different cargo. Sending something into orbit requires a higher apogee than sending it to another location on Earth.


It didnt say that Iran had launched a satellite. If it did I missed it..
Launching a satellite in space is a vague term. They could be putting a light satellite in a very low earth orbit. Also, Iran is modifying its missiles into satellite launch rockets so I pesume its missiles are better than its rockets. Lets look at its missiles




I feel that you are incorrect in your assumption that Iran does not have the capability to reach the continental US with a ballistic missile. They DEFINITELY can.

Now, NYC is 6124 miles(9855km) from Tehran. Iran's Shahab 3 missiles have a range of 1300km and a payload of 1200kg. Shahab 6 is in development and can reach 6,200 km with a 500 kg payload. So, there is NO WAY Iran can reach continental US..

www.fas.org...


[edit on 4-5-2005 by Quake]



posted on May, 4 2005 @ 01:19 AM
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How is that coming? It has been 35 years since they promised to destroy their weapons and it has been 15 years since the end of cold war. Does it really take THAT long to destroy nuclear weapons? If they are planning to destroy them then why is Britain spending $25 billion to upgrade its weapons? Why is the US researching nuclear bunker busters? Why is russia anouncing that they are creating a whole new generation of weapons? Is it just so they can destroy it in 10 or so years? If it is I'd say it is a stupid way of wasting money. If they arent they are violating the treaty.


couldn't have said it better myself.. show you that the so called treaty is not worth the paper it is written on.

every country should have /pursue their own noo klear armament - the more the merrier.



posted on May, 4 2005 @ 02:14 AM
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Originally posted by JoshGator54
For example, the India/Pakistan situation, don't you believe that India wanted to prevent Pakistan from getting nukes after India obtained them? Who could blame them? Pakistan had a history of terrorist style tactics in the Kashmir region and are at odds with India.

Not hypocritical smart!


Maybe not so smart. If India really didn't want Pakistan to have nuclear ambitions they should not have armed themselves with nukes. Once India gained them it wasn't a matter of if but when Pakistan would get them. Once they felt that they needed nukes to counter those that India had there was very little that India could have done to stop them, short of invasion. However if India did not go nuclear than it is quite possible that Pakistan would not have felt it needed nukes.



posted on May, 4 2005 @ 05:03 AM
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Originally posted by boogyman

Not to mention how musharaff isnt exactly making himself popular with the radical islamic elements of his government. All it would take is a little coup and PHHT youve got a rogue and potentially hostile nuclear program.


I agree. If the US, EU, and UN are smart they will provide Musharaff and pro-civilized forces with-in that nation the support they need. But I guarantee if a coup were to occur the world, especially the US would put Syria, Iran, and NK on the back burner and immediatly have to deal with Pakistan.



posted on May, 4 2005 @ 03:01 PM
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Originally posted by Quake

Now, NYC is 6124 miles(9855km) from Tehran. Iran's Shahab 3 missiles have a range of 1300km and a payload of 1200kg. Shahab 6 is in development and can reach 6,200 km with a 500 kg payload. So, there is NO WAY Iran can reach continental US..

www.fas.org...

[edit on 4-5-2005 by Quake]


Quake, I am in no way being mean about this, but you are assuming that they would only launch from Tehran. The problem is that these platforms being medium range can be launched from freighters out at sea off the Atlantic coast. The scud type could easily be put aboard ships. Your research is solid, but I am sure that they have thought of practical ways to extend the range since they first acquired them. Any good tactician would.

That put aside, many intelligence agencies feel that Iran will have the ability to launch from Tehran by the end of the year or next year. They feel that they have been working with North Korea for some time now because of the fuel they are using to increase their burn time. This information was also available on fas.org. There are many hands in this to be sure.

Here is one example.
Here is another.

The older I get, the more I am reluctant to say that anything is impossible. People find ways of doing the strangest things. Thanks for the quick reply. I am sure together we may be able to bring many new possibilities to light.



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