NEWS: U.S. 'Minutemen' target Canadian border

I can see having a " Volunteer" movement assisting the border agents in states such as Vermont, North Dakota and other states along the border that are land tied to Canada.But Michigan???It is surrounded by water.It is no more easier to enter than it would be to enter New york state from Ontario.I would know about this since I am born and raised in a sleepy little border town along the niagara river.Organizing a Minuteman group there sends up a red flag.This is the home of the Michigan militia.Anybody remember those guys???They are the ones who said America was going to be taken over by the UN and they need to organize for that event.I can see them flocking to the minutemen,turning a good civil movement into an violent militant extremist group.

Originally posted by JoeDoaks
Here's an ODD question-



why hasn't this 'submission' been accepted


High level interest and no acceptance! Makes me wonder about this system

[edit on 27-4-2005 by JoeDoaks]

I often wonder about the system myself. You see many biased votes and one can only assume they are basing their vote on the comments section which has nothing to do with bias at all since the author can voice their own thoughts.

In case you have not noticed the thread has now been upgraded as it should have.

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If there is a problem at our northern border that should be addressed along with our southern border [where there is absolutely a problem].

These citizens have taken upon themselves to assist in upholding the law which the federal government has been too in bed with corporations to do.

Maybe they were too busy spending 1/5 of a Trillion dollars in Iraq for WMDs that don't exist to spend a half a billion securing the southern border.

'Oops, we forgot all about the fact the US has a border you can just walk across to the south. We're just your silly congress persons and president. Gosh, So forgetful. Were not really just a bunch of sleazy corporate butt lickers.
.

Minutemen or anyone else manning the borders has me spooked.

On principle I don't like it.

In reality- something has to be done and the government is not doing it.

I wonder how many of those guys voted for Bush?

Originally posted by specialasianX
TC i dont think Curme was being racsist, i think he was commenting on how racsist the rest of the population may be... and i agree, i dont think this will have nearly as much support as the operation on the mexican border...

Maybe you need to reread the post. You also need to undrstand Curme's history of posts. I do.

[edit on 28-4-2005 by Thomas Crowne]

My main concern with this project is the safety of the Americans who will be patrolling the northern border. Being a civilian patrol, one that gets lots of publicity, they have to be careful how they behave because the nation is watching. They can't just go around shooting people on sight, unless they changed the laws when I wasn't looking. The gangs don't care if they kill someone, and the first time someone points a gun at one of them, there is going to be a problem.

Something else I wonder about are the reserves. If I remember correctly, there are a few on the border. I know the First Nations on this side of the border would never allow this type of thing to happen on their land. They would set up their own armed roadblocks, and tell us to get off their land. I can't imagine them allowing armed non-aboriginals to wander about the reserve. Would the US bands feel the same way? The reserve is a prime spot for smuggling just for the simple fact that the police can't go there.

Another sad aspect of the cross-border smuggling is between the Mormon communities who practice polygamy. This may be a BC problem, because of Bountiful, but there have been a few cases reported of young girls being smuggled between the communties, so there will be a fresh supply of child-brides.

To JoeDoaks and shots,

The reason was *sigh* bias, and apathy. I received very few actual NO's. Thanks for wondering.

[edit on 28-4-2005 by Duzey]

The irony is astounding. American minutemen are lining up to get shot at with -here's the funny part- guns their countrymen sold to mobsters and bikers. Duzey's right, these bikers have absolutely no problem hurting people, and are quite good at it. I just hope Minutemen walk around in big packs, maybe then a few will get away instead of some mounties ending up staring across the border at a bunch of Americans chopped up like firewood.

Another issue is that the border is absolutely massive, and certain problems are local- for instance, the Quebec border will probably be mostly bikers and mafioso, whereas in BC the primary criminals are most likely to be Triad or Yakuza men. Who knows, we might even find some natives peddling dope across the border via reserves.

In any case, this is a poorly planned, half-assed idea and I said it first. I hope you all realize it before too many bodies pile up.

DE

EDIT: Spelling.

[edit on 28-4-2005 by DeusEx]

Originally posted by Duzey
The reason was *sigh* bias, and apathy.

Well that's a real Duh-

Apathy?

Bias- yeah, but of course!

Anyway, to the thread-

The Minutemen are going to be unarmed (supposedly) and yes gangs do care if they kill someone. They care to make sure there are no witnesses.

These unarmed 'spies' are going to lurk and report on armed thugs!

These are certainly some interesting times in which we live.

[edit on 28-4-2005 by JoeDoaks]

Who says they're unarmed, and who says they will not return fire if need be.

The sad thing is that, as I've said before, these volunteers are doing the job that the government should be doing.

Again I'll ask; Why is it that the government refuses to do its job? Why is it that the president calls these patriotic people "vigilantes"?

Something is dreadfully awry in our capital, and we'd better figure out what that is before it is too late.

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Again I'll ask; Why is it that the government refuses to do its job? Why is it that the president calls these patriotic people "vigilantes"?

The vigilante question you know the answer to. Why the government, the government- hell, why OUR government has allowed a situation like this to exist is beyond me.

I could put on the tin foil hat and come up with some provacateur angle in 30 minutes but I don't think that is it.

Homeland Security- billion$ for what? Why aren't they on the borders?

These Minutemen are frustrated and believe they have found a partial solution. I wish them well.

If this continues I forsee nothing but heartache for many people.

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne

Maybe you need to reread the post. You also need to undrstand Curme's history of posts. I do.

[edit on 28-4-2005 by Thomas Crowne]

Please, spare us your self-righteous indignation, TC. If it's racist to say a bunch of white vigilantes trying to keep the US "safe" from "outsiders" makes me nervous, then I guess I'm racist. The US has a sad history of intolerance and xenophobia. I don't think we should support organizations that feed off of people's ignorance and fears or organizations that promote an 'us against them' mentality. I'm all for a serious discussion on our porous borders, I just don't think that discussion should include a six-pack and a .22

Brother Joe, my hat is on, and I don't like the conclusions I am forced to come to.

The sad thing is that when we fall, and it seems that those in control wish this to happen, it will send a disasterous ripple throughout the entire world, endangering free people everywhere. Call me tired, call me worn out if you will, but I see no relief. Bush seemed to have been the last hope for the restoration of America, back to its rightful path, and he has chosen a path that will hasten out route to destruction. Brother Joe, I don't see any relief in sight. The one voice of patriotism and constitutionality turned out to be a lie.

hmm might do us canuks some good. just make sure that while you curtail illigal alians and contraband from entering the states that you also stop the same thing in the other direction eh. and remember you might want tanks and heavey arms as the "mafia" and "bikers" as well as other organized crime, from both countries play for keeps and use the best arms that they can get. it could end up being a mini "private" war. please keep it to your side of the border if you would. actualy i wonder could someone be charged with fireing a weapon, if said projectile crosses the border, it could cause some serious harm here so could someone be charged for it? interesting thought that

are they also planning on patrolling all that wide open coastline that can also easily be used? hmm what about those pesky cubans tha are also entering illigaly? gee i wonder how many men it would take to patroll the entire circumfrance of the states? to do any less would leave large holes in the protection of the states.

Originally posted by JoeDoaks
The Minutemen are going to be unarmed (supposedly) and yes gangs do care if they kill someone. They care to make sure there are no witnesses.

These unarmed 'spies' are going to lurk and report on armed thugs!

If they are unarmed, then I worry about them even more!!! If they had kept this a secret, they might have been able to get away with being unarmed. But they announced it, and now the gangs will know to expect them and plan accordingly. If I were a Minutewoman I would certainly not want to be out there unarmed looking for vicious criminals.

As for witnesses, they would probably kill everybody there, if given the chance. If not, accidents can happen. And strangely enough, they seem to when the Hell's Angels are involved. The HA are everywhere, and I suspect the level of infiltration of our government and police by the HA is a lot deeper than many Canadian's know. I do, however, tend to paranoia.

As for the Triads and the Yakuza, well let's just say they make the Hells Angels look like choirboys. They have absolutely no regard for human life. They will not hesitate to mow a group of total strangers down. They will shoot into a crowd of 50 people, just to kill one person.

As for returning fire, of course I would expect them to return fire if they were shot at. They would be defending themselves and have every right to do that. What I was thinking was that they couldn't just open fire, the minute they saw the smugglers; that they couldn't fire the first shot. Maybe they can, I honestly don't know. But if they can't, then they are already at a disadvantage, because the gangs have no such restrictions.

As for why the borders aren't better patrolled? Dunno. I have no answer to your question. They have these 'crossing spots' and then miles of nobody. I could travel to the border in less than twenty minutes, and spend the next 4 hours running back and forth across the border, singing showtunes, and never be challenged. Not good considering my spot of choice is less than half a mile from a checkpoint. The longest undefended border doesn't have to mean the world's longest unpatrolled border, as far as I'm concerned.

As for your government, I'm on the wrong side of the border to be able to ask them anything. I agree that it is the government's responsibility to secure the border. If this was a government operation, I wouldn't be so concerned, because they would be properly trained for the situation, and well briefed on the problem they would be dealing with.

Duzey, don't get me wrong- they might be armed. I just stated they weren't. That doesn't make it so

HA, Triad and the rest have some bad operators- no doubt. many of these Militiamen do as well. These guys are not coach potatoes.

Many may be 'over the hill' (so to speak) but the Russian General that beat back Napoleon was as well. Old=slow, not dumb.

There is a story (I looked and can't find it on Google) about an old (70 yr.) guy that was shot three times and bayoneted twice by the Brits during the Revolutionary War- after a few days bed rest for the wounds to clot (not heal) he want back at it. He was wounded again (twice more as I recall) and refused to quit.

Not in the Army because he was too old.

The American vigilantes of old while not always on the winning side cast fear into many a bad man.

I know a guy a little over 60 that can still bring down an antelope in excess of 300 yards. You think some biker with an Uzi or 12 ga. (range- what? 30 yds. effective) stands much of a chance?

Nope.

Range. Many of these 'patriots' have stalked game for days.

I'll take the old guys with experience against the young tough any day.



You think this old timer is afraid?

The minutemen could be ninjas for all I care, all I know is that there will be hell to pay because a bunch of militia types felt patriotic and get set back to their families in a dozen ziploc bags. Being some sort of spec-ops guy does not mean you are invincible. So why should a bunch of tinfoil hat types be immune to lead?

As for the comments about stalking game... so, everyone that crosses the border illegally, in any direction is in for a .3006 in the brainpan?

DE

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Curme, take your racist, condescending comments elsewhere; I'm not in the mood for them. Furthermore, do not attempt to cross swords with me.

As far as the topic of the thread is concerned, what I find disturbing is that it takes an organization of private citizens to do what the federal government is obliged to do - protect the nation's borders. Because the government refuses to do its job, that leaves the citizenry to ask just one question - why?

EXACTLY. Thats what I want to know. If the damn govornment was doing what we elect and pay them to do, we wouldnt need private citizens patrolling the borders. Why is it such a hard task for the US govornment to keep up security here on our own homefront? With all the ridiculous policies they create regarding foreign air travel, what is so hard about securing real physical borders, which are a bigger security threat than anything that might come in on a plane?

I know one reason they wont secure the Mexican border: waves of desperate illegals provide a growing body of slave labor for unscrupulous businesses and private people to exploit, to pay these people under the table for less than human wages. So, the politicos in DC are more concerned with making sure their big green lawns get mowed for 2 bucks an hour than they are concerned with security, integrity, and human dignity.

Hey who says no one wants that Canadian Cannabis?! Some of us Yanks DO want it!

Some of us live in “Blue States” you know! Some of us are Adults & Libertarians & Refuse to let the U.S. Government treat us all like Babies!

EXCELLENT! The more border watching the Minutemen do .. the
more embarrassed the government should be that private citizens
have to do the job. This should wake the feds up. We need
better security on the borders. Heck ... ANY security!! I applaud
the Minutemen. D.C. should hang it's head in shame.

Originally posted by curme
The US has a sad history of intolerance and xenophobia.

The _______ has a sad history of intolerance and/or xenophobia.
You could put just about every nation on the planet in that blank
space. It isn't an 'American thing'. Intolerance is a human thing.

Also - protecting your homeland from terrorists and illegals is NOT being
'intolerant'. The illegals are weighing heavy on the tax paying
American citizens of the S.W. They clog up the emergency rooms
of hospitals using them as primary care facilities. The schools are
overcrowded with the spanish speaking illegals' children causing
the tax payers to have to pay higher taxes to build more schools,
hire more teachers, hire linguists, etc. American tax payers have
to pay more $$ for more police and fire protection. and so on ...

The citizens patroling the border are well within their rights
as Americans to protect their homeland. It's part of their history
and culture. Thus the name, Minutemen, taken from that period
in American history when the citizens had to stand up and take
action to protect their loved ones and their homes.