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Safe or satanic? Church leaders argue over Freemasonry

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posted on Apr, 28 2005 @ 11:31 AM
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ok

you said what charity do these guys give ?
David Icke
Joe Vialls
Jim Marrs
Jack Chick

i have no clue who they are actually so i dunno lol

isnt david icke the guy who invented the common reptiles shapeshifting baby eater storys
lol
ya that guys rediculous
fiction writer i suppose lol

you know; just because you give charity doesnt mean much yet
if you were truely charitable
you would offer me a job lol

ill do just about any kind of work for reasonable pay
i have a wife and 9month old child to feed
and i would love to work for you

i am reasonably clever , no genious by any means; but i can figure out fast efficient ways to get the job done
im cheerful positive and a Hard worker

Bottom Line
Ill get the Job done Pronto
in top notch quality

so; i know you rich people got a job opening somewhere for me!

so im ready to work whenever your ready to hire me
(im serious i need a job)

and what better job is there than that?

i clean your pool; do your taxes; mow your yards; paint your house; tile your roofs; wash your car

whatever you want me to do its done
you say "do this" i say "i did that an hour ago
"
thats how fast i am

so if you are interested in having a great employee who is a hard working american; than please contact me thru U2U
and we can make arrangements for me to bust my butt for you

thanks for your time hehe
have a good 1




posted on Apr, 28 2005 @ 11:49 AM
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Originally posted by Mirthful Me
To infer that there is greed in the hearts of Freemasons ignores the charity extended worldwide by Masonic organizations. The depth and breadth of which is unparalleled. Do the detractors and critics of Freemasonry have edifices devoted to helping others? 22 hospitals (these would be the Shriner's Hospitals) for the completely free care of orthopaedic, burn and spinal defect care? Hospices for cancer patients? Charitable kitchens and shelters for the homeless? Homes for the aged and disabled. Reading programs for children and adults, ocular and otological (that would be eye and ear) programs for people with impairments. And finally the everyday extension of goodwill within the community that goes without sign or herald, the decency of helping our fellow man... That's our secret. All these projects are funded out of the pockets of six million men worldwide, no government aid, no Ponzi schemes, just hard work and generosity.


Let's not forget to mention that, when in Freemasonry, even if one did not normally give to charity, masons eventually feel compelled to be charitable simply because that is the general attitude of Freemasonry, that is what their brothers are doing and so they voluteer and give to charity themselves.



I don't believe that ASE is being attacked, merely refuted, "his" (actually someone else’ s) arguments and points being exposed for what they are (the same stuff I threw at visitors when I was a Zoo Monkey... A less than stellar moment in my "career path").


HAHAHA but didn't you get your shiny masonic ring dirty with the same material that spews out of ASE's posts? You are right when you say that his arguments are actually someone else's. Like the majority of anti-masons on this forum, they get 100% of their material from somewhere else. I think I will start calling them "anti-parrots".



Originally posted by Muzzleflash
If you were truely charitable
you would offer me a job lol


Can't you look in a paper, or Monster.com? Don't hustle members of a forum that likely live way far away from you. Just saying.


[edit on 28-4-2005 by sebatwerk]



posted on Apr, 28 2005 @ 04:50 PM
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There are different kinds of Satanism. You know real people do worship Satan. I could only imagine worship of darkness.

I am not saying all Satanists do of course. I've seen very spiritual Satanists around online and the like that dont.

These days you dont know whats out crawling in the shadows. People on this forum provide things you would have never of thought of.

To say people who worship Satan cant call themselves a true Satanist is very stupid. Oviously people who do worship Satan are called a Satanist.

Being a Satanist can be very hard as people will think you worship darkness, because a lot of them dont.

Satanism can have very different kinds of worship. You have the people who use demonic spirits as tools and the ones who dont.

[edit on 28-4-2005 by phantomviewer]



posted on Apr, 28 2005 @ 07:19 PM
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Originally posted by muzzleflash
i have no clue


Hmmmm.....those four words sum it up now, don't they.



posted on Apr, 28 2005 @ 07:53 PM
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It's bunk...a christian boogeyman constructed to capitalize on a fearful flock.
Those sheep herd better when they're cautious.

What's next for America? The War on Satan?

What does it matter to the billions of people on this planet who aren't christian? They never heard of satan...maybe exu, but not the horney red guy in tights and brandishing a trident.

Satanic bricabrac...

hail bridget!



posted on Apr, 28 2005 @ 10:42 PM
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Quote: "What's next for the U.S.A.? The War on Satan?"

You know that would be Funny - if I so Couldn't Imagine those words actually coming out of that
Bush Puppet’s Mouth! Already has to a Certain extent - "Axis of Evil" - Iran is next & all that!


[edit on 28-4-2005 by Seraphim_Serpente]

[edit on 28-4-2005 by Seraphim_Serpente]



posted on Apr, 30 2005 @ 02:48 AM
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hey ill be the first to admit that

the only thing i know for sure
is that i do not know for sure

intelligence is knowing your own stupidity

sanity is knowing your own insanity


ancient words of wisdom
go very far indeed



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 03:48 PM
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Freemasonry is an odd natured beast. I am pretty confident that no one can really know what happens in the upper eschilon of freemasonry, except for those who have been through it. And I'm guessing they're not in any hurry to divulge their secrets.

The myth of the occult and ties to satan really began when Leo Taxil (a former mason writing under a pen name) claimed that pike's Morals and Dogma contains passages pertaining to lucifer. He later denied these claims he made. The meaning of the word lucifer means morning star, it has to do with the position of venus, and that for half the year it is the morning star and the other half of the year it is the evening star. Lucifer means nothing morew than "bringer of light" (loosely translated)

Now, look at it this way, the church persecuted those scientists (whom i might add were loosely connected with magism, and kabbalism.) who thought the earth was round. According to Pike's book in the 32nd chapter entitiled "sublime prince of the royal secret" he goes into detail about this and how, what was secret knowledge to the kabbalists, was herecy to the cuhrch. Even though as we know now it is 100% true.

One thing I know is that Pike says in his novel (same chapter), is that religion is the medium but which the ignorant are controled. I am merely loosely paraphrasing the actual quote, but the meaning is retained.

If you really wanto to go deep into the foxhole, check out thephilosophy of the kabbalists and their almost untranslateable text "the sohar"



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 04:41 PM
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Originally posted by Eyeofhorus
Freemasonry is an odd natured beast. I am pretty confident that no one can really know what happens in the upper eschilon of freemasonry, except for those who have been through it. And I'm guessing they're not in any hurry to divulge their secrets.


GOOD GOD!! FOR THE LAST TIME THERE IS NO UPPER ECHELON OF FREEMASONRY!!!!! It is a FRATERNITY and thus all members are EQUAL. The ONLY masons with any authority are lodge officers, including Grand Lodge officers which are elected for one-year terms and have authority over all lodges in their jurisdictions. There are 51 Grand Lodges in the United States.

And the ONLY secrets that Freemasons contain are their modes of recognition and the details of the rituals. THAT'S IT!!!

:bnghd:


[edit on 1-5-2005 by sebatwerk]



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 05:15 PM
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Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye
Dont get your undies in a bunch. Think this out, new concept. Open your mind and consider the possibilties, that maybe, just maybe, thier might be a satanists or two in masonry that are giving you guys a bad name. after all, its your dogma that let them in, and your dogma that protects them.


Do you even KNOW what a true "Satanist" is? How many REAL satanists do you think there really are in the world?!? Satanism is not as prevalent as you might like to make people think...


sebatwerk Let me take this one!

All seeing Eye. Like sebatwerk asked do you even know what real Satanist are? In my mind there are two to types of Satanists

THE REAL: The self-indulgence live life to the fullest without restrain, do thou wilt, yadda friggin yadda. Also in a sense a rebellion against Christianity

THE "LAVEYIST": The Ones who screwed it up for all of them, The Destroy the church, Sacrifice things, Sell your soul to the Devil. They preach all that, but I do give them this much, they at least sort kinda
follow the original plus all the extras.

In other words real Satanism is not as down right evil as the world thinks it is, But it's what the church put in are minds (Sorta like Witchcraft is evil). Well I am witch and have been for 18 years and I will tell you it isn't. I also have a friend who is a Satanist, and he will tell you the same thing I just did, about what Satanism really is.

So if your reading Lavey's "Satanic Bible" as guidlines STOP!



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 06:37 PM
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I love this... apparently some kind of Masonic discrepency, and I see it every thread that there is a debate over "Masonic Secrets"...


Originally posted by senrak

Sorry you think the Masons should stop having secrets.....apparently you haven't awakened to the fact that there really ARE NO Masonic secrets....except the ones we hold in our hearts....and those secrets can't be put into words...so I guess you're s.o.l. there.




Originally posted by sebatwerk

And the ONLY secrets that Freemasons contain are their modes of recognition and the details of the rituals. THAT'S IT!!!


[edit on 1-5-2005 by sebatwerk]


Gotta love that...

Now... learn about a religion BEFORE you become an athority on it, please:

Originally posted by mobhitmusic

THE "LAVEYIST": The Ones who screwed it up for all of them, The Destroy the church, Sacrifice things, Sell your soul to the Devil. They preach all that, but I do give them this much, they at least sort kinda
follow the original plus all the extras.
...
So if your reading Lavey's "Satanic Bible" as guidlines STOP!


LaVeyist Satanists do not believe in sacrafice... maybe ritualistic sacrafice, but a true LaVeyist does not believe in sacrafice. Laveyists DO NOT sell their souls to the devil, nor do they preach it. Laveyist believes in no actual being called Satan. A LaVeyist believes in him or herself as their own god... they believe that they are in charge of their own lives and everything around them, and that everything that happens to them are the result of their own actions. I am an ex-Laveyist, now agnostic, but I still hold dearly the values of LaVeyism. Most LaVeyists practice not as a religion, but an ideal of a better life. We are not selfish, although we teach self indulgence... but hey, if ya want, everyone who is alive today is selfish! You eat because you want to stay alive, right? That's pretty selfish act... feed yourself.



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 07:19 PM
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Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by Eyeofhorus
Freemasonry is an odd natured beast. I am pretty confident that no one can really know what happens in the upper eschilon of freemasonry, except for those who have been through it. And I'm guessing they're not in any hurry to divulge their secrets.



And the ONLY secrets that Freemasons contain are their modes of recognition and the details of the rituals. THAT'S IT!!!

:bnghd:


[edit on 1-5-2005 by sebatwerk]


Still these are secrets. They are not to be divulged, whatever is said and done within a ritual, is secret, and not for non masons or the profane. Also, unless you have been through all the degrees of blue lodge masonry (1-3) and the other(4-33) degrees offered in scottish rite masonry, the truth is you have no clue what secrets they hold. Maybe they are completely unimportant, but then why should they be secrets. The masons propose a different way of looking at the universe. The kabbalists and the freemasons belive in a perfect equilibrium of nature and the unverse. They see symbols in nature, we see nature as a tool, or something we can grasp scientifically. The truth is we don't see the same symbols they see every day in nature because we have been taught to dominate it and dissect it. These are the mysteries of the masonic tradition and the mysteries of the ancients. Pike elaborates on these topics in Morals and Dogma.

People give way too much credit to religion, Lucifer and God are merely representations of people's willingness to believe something that cannot be proven beyond the shadow of a doubt. One thing I noticed is that the masons are on a sworn quest to seek the truth. This is a huge symbolism in masonry. It seems anti-pragmatic to think that someone who has been in masonry thier whole life would trust an organization such as religion. Pike's book (Morals and Dogma) to me is nothing more than a unified philosophy of the freemasons, and some detail into their ritual. Albert pike was proficient in archaic languages such as latin, aramaic, hebrew. This man was pretty brilliant, and his text nye represents the true capabilities of his understanding.

As far as the ties to satanism go, completely unfounded. Prove to me first that satan and god exist and i will accept defeat. I refuse to follow something blindly. Freemasonry is a wide scale organization, with many different teachings and philosophies. But why is is that you must first go through blue lodge masonry to enter into the next level of freemasonry. Considering the luciferian conspiracy, was started by a former freemason who later recants his story completely. Saying things like Pike had a bracelet that supposedly allowed him to confer with the devil himself. Why does he do this? And who are the people making the accusations? Im guessing it is the church, the same people that denied our solar system is heliocentric, and that the world is round. I'd be more likely to think that christianity's ties to paganism would suggest that it is the satanist organization. But that is just my honest opinion.





[edit on 1-5-2005 by Eyeofhorus]



posted on May, 1 2005 @ 10:55 PM
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Originally posted by Eyeofhorus
Still these are secrets. They are not to be divulged, whatever is said and done within a ritual, is secret, and not for non masons or the profane. Also, unless you have been through all the degrees of blue lodge masonry (1-3) and the other(4-33) degrees offered in scottish rite masonry, the truth is you have no clue what secrets they hold.


I hope you realize that after the 3 blue lodge degrees, there are MANY more than just the Scottish Rite degrees. There's also the York Rite with 10 degrees, the Memphis Rite with 97 degrees, and various other. So please understand that the Scottish Rite's 33 degrees are NOT considered a main part of Freemasonry. They are additional degrees, just like the other branches.



Maybe they are completely unimportant, but then why should they be secrets.


Because if they were available for every Average Joe to defile and make fun of, they would lose their value to masons. They would no longer be seen as special knowledge attained by only a few, and therefore the lessons would not mean as much. The teachings of Freemasonry are too special to be available for any person's amusement. They mean too much for us to allow that.



One thing I noticed is that the masons are on a sworn quest to seek the truth. This is a huge symbolism in masonry. It seems anti-pragmatic to think that someone who has been in masonry thier whole life would trust an organization such as religion.


Actually, every mason is on a sworn quest for his own purposes. Some masons have no interest in the esoteric and spiritual parts of Freemasonry. That is fine, but that is what Pike was talking about when he wrote about the "fraternity within a fraternity" in the quote that anti-masons LOVE to take out of context.

But remember that masons are taught, above all else, that their Volume of Sacred Law (ie: Bible or Koran, etc.) is the un-erring truth and law of the Universe. Masons are told to find their own conclusions based on their faith and understanding. In other words, Freemasonry encourages men to be more faithful to their respective religions, and to base all their actions towards the purpose of reaching that celestial Lodge in the sky as a perfectly built temple.



Pike's book (Morals and Dogma) to me is nothing more than a unified philosophy of the freemasons, and some detail into their ritual. Albert pike was proficient in archaic languages such as latin, aramaic, hebrew. This man was pretty brilliant, and his text nye represents the true capabilities of his understanding.


While you are partially correct, Morals and Dogma was more of an assessment of the Philosophy behind the Scottish Rite degrees, AS HE SAW THEM. Since the Scottish Rite degrees are just an elaboration of the Craft Degrees, it can be argued that the book refers to all of Freemasonry in general, but Albert Pike's work was mostly concerned with, and for, the Scottish Rite branch of Freemasonry.



But why is is that you must first go through blue lodge masonry to enter into the next level of freemasonry.


There is no "next level" of Freemasonry. There is the MAIN CRAFT, and then appendant bodies. You must become a REAL Freemason first because the appendant degrees are nothing more than an elaboration of the first three degrees. REAL Freemasonry is Craft or Blue Lodge masonry, the other rites were not created until hundreds of years later for the purpose of elaborating and expanding the legends of Craft Freemasonry.



Considering the luciferian conspiracy, was started by a former freemason who later recants his story completely. Saying things like Pike had a bracelet that supposedly allowed him to confer with the devil himself. Why does he do this? And who are the people making the accusations? Im guessing it is the church.


You're absolutely right. I read that Leo Taxil did have connections to the Vatican, supposedly, and created his stories for the church.



I'd be more likely to think that christianity's ties to paganism would suggest that it is the satanist organization. But that is just my honest opinion.


Every religion has ties to paganism. But paganism does not denote Satanism. There is a very distinct difference.



posted on May, 2 2005 @ 02:08 AM
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Sebatwerk,

you are thourough and well versed, very respectable post.



[edit on 2-5-2005 by Eyeofhorus]



posted on May, 2 2005 @ 03:25 AM
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Quote: "claimed that pike's Morals and Dogma contains passages pertaining to Lucifer."

Oh Boy - the word "Lucifer" appears - I sure am Scared now! The word "Occult" Frightens me too! Freaking Fear Mongers! Why don't you just allow people to READ Morals & Dogma themselves & make up their own minds - they might just Learn something:

www.sacred-texts.com...

Check out "THE SECRET TEACHINGS OF ALL AGES by Manly P. Hall" while you are at it - "Lucifer" is Mentioned in there too - Perhaps you will become "enLIGHTened" by its true meaning:

www.sacred-texts.com...

Quote: "Luciferian Conspiracy"

Oh-Oh - "NWO" Head Alert! I can't believe that you guys actually believe this Right-Wing Propaganda Crap!

If you read the two Incredibly Insightful Pieces of Work above you will see that Lucifer is NOT the same Entity as Satan! Lucifer (Latin: Luciferum) is none other than Prometheus the "Light Bringer". The "Light" could be interpreted as an analogy for "Esoteric Wisdom" or "Universal Mind". Where as Lucifer is the Light of the Mind or Intellect - CHRIST is the Light of the Soul or Heart! Satan on the other hand is the Tempter & Ruiner of Man. Maybe explaining this again is a Lost Cause & I am just Wasting my Time - but I figured that I would give it one more shot!

P.S. God gave us all Free Will & a Brain/Mind which he wished us to use - unless we would not have it! People are allowed to exercise Free Will as long as they remain with-in the Boundaries of Reason & Law (i.e. Do not go off on Murderous Rampages). Were do you get off calling people who are Intellectual & Think for themselves = "Luciferians"! Even if this is the case - I am not so sure that it is such a bad thing - as long as you are not Absolutely Selfish & Greedy (then we could have Problems). You know I believe that it was Buddha that claimed that *IGNORANCE* was a Root of Darkness & Evil! Buddha Recommends the Middle Path - the Balance of Wisdom & Compassion! The Balance of Mind/Spirit & Matter/Material!


FEAR, HATE, Greed & Selfishness are the "Ruiners of Man" - Certainly NOT "il-LUMIN-ation"!


[edit on 2-5-2005 by Seraphim_Serpente]

[edit on 2-5-2005 by Seraphim_Serpente]

[edit on 2-5-2005 by Seraphim_Serpente]



posted on May, 2 2005 @ 01:13 PM
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The only masonic meaning of the word lucifer that I can find is the one pertaining to the "bringer of light" which has been brought up. However, when taken further one would see, after reading these texts, that this "bringer of light" is merely a symbol. It is symbolic of the Morning Star/Evening Star. I am sure most of us know what this is, it is the planet Venus. It is representative of the Balance and harmony of the unverse, and it also represents the feminine (mars represents masculine). For part of the year Venus appears in the morning sky, and the other part of the year it is contained within the evening sky. Lucifer in this case means nothing more than the obsevation of the natural tendancies of Venus' movement in our sky, something not even relevant outside the viewpoint of earth.

You are right about Buddhism, go even further and you will find Animism, the beilef that every living thing has a soul. This becomes the basis of most world religions. The masonic brotherhood is no different. They believe that every person has a soul, capable of being both good and evil. I have seen passages that intimate toward a one-mind, one conciousness thoery. The main thing that Masons and buddhists have in common is they both believe that the universe is goverened by its ability to balance itself. The universal equilibrium is Pike's final "mystery." If you look closely you will find that the thoeries of buddhism parallel that of the Pikes text (Mroals and Dogma, XXXII)

What is Lucifer without God? What is good witout evil? One thing the masons do empahasize is that over thinking, and over analyzing have a tendancy to produce anti-pragmatic thought patterns. Truly lucifer (supposed Evil, ooooooooh) cannot even exist without God (goodness, righteousness, oh please). It is this duality of nature that brings us to realize that, lucifer is within us, as well as god. Light and dark, black and white, night and day. All are the myst that is our universe. According to the doctorines of Zoroaster, as stated in morals and dogma, "everything that exists has eminated from a source of infinte light" (Light represents wisdom, truth, etc). The darkeness is that of the unknown, the unelnlightend, Risk, the meduim of diffusion. Light is merely a symbol in masonry. The infinte source represents perfection, the universe as a whole, in harmony. The darkness represents nothingness, chaos. The tendancy for everything to diffuse evenly is something that happens naturally. The two extremes represent our ability to seek the light, and not settle for living in darkness.

Like light traveling across the vast expanse of ether, energy and heat aren't created unless they touch the surface of our earth, and make themselves known to us. What results when light is shone onto our planet is a cone of darkness behind, the shadow it casts So is it that our souls are infinte, and they have no shape or foem until projected into our body, as well the projection casts a shadow of "darkenss" through which we cannot see. There we are at the middle of darkenss and light, forced to chose, to explain the unexplainable.

Lucifer is just a word. It represents different things to different people. It's true meaning has been lost to time, along with the ancient religions and languages that masonry is based on. But the ideologies are still there, right in front of us, taunting our inability to percieve it.

Pike also argues that action and decisons, made by us are in fact forces. Beings that i have been through three years of the most thourough phyiscis programs in the country, i can contend beyound the shadow of a doubt, that everything is seeking equilibrium. Everything has a third law partner (newton, Action-reation) and that objects will remain in equilibrium until a force is applied to it. It is the natural way of the unverse. Lucifer is an unnatural idea, it really leaves something to be desired (like maybe the the explantation of the other half) And how it pertains to the unversal TRUTH of equilbrium.

As far as the church goes, just another thing that offsets the balance.

"Black then white are all I see in my infancy.
red and yellow then came to be, reaching out to me.
lets me see.
As below, so above and beyond, I imagine
drawn beyond the lines of reason.
Push the envelope. Watch it bend.

Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind.
Withering my intuition, missing opportunities and I must
Feed my will to feel my moment drawing way outside the lines."
-Tool

[edit on 2-5-2005 by Eyeofhorus]

[edit on 2-5-2005 by Eyeofhorus]



posted on May, 2 2005 @ 02:14 PM
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Quote: "It is Symbolic of the Morning Star. I am sure most of us know what this is - the Planet Venus (& Goddess - i.e. Ishtar/Ashorah)... It also represents the Feminine (Mars represents Masculine)."

Yeah that too - Good Call!


Quote from the Secret Teaching of All Ages: "Pythagoras' Teachings are of the most Transcendental importance to Masons inasmuch as they are the necessary fruit of his contact with the leading Philosophers of the whole civilized world of his own day and must represent that in which all were agreed - shorn of all weeds of Controversy. Thus the determined stand made by Pythagoras - in defense of Pure Monotheism - is sufficient evidence... to the effect
***that the Unity of GOD was the Supreme Secret of all the Ancient Initiations is Substantially Correct.***"


P.S. TOOL Rocks!


[edit on 2-5-2005 by Seraphim_Serpente]

[edit on 2-5-2005 by Seraphim_Serpente]



posted on May, 2 2005 @ 06:31 PM
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So does anyone know where the connotation between Lucifer and Satan came from? Possibly an early Christian attempt to demonize some other religion, maybe the Greek pantheon as Lucifer also apparently relates to Prometheus, the Titan in Greek mythology who brought fire to mankind.



posted on May, 3 2005 @ 05:02 AM
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Sure the Early Catholic Church turned all sorts of Pagan Gods into Christian Devils! They were in the Business of Converting Pagans & Jews into Catholicism - Those who would not Convert were to be Demonized & Killed. Everything that they did not have Power or Control over was called "Satanic". Were do you think the "Devil" got his Horns, Tail & Hooves from (hint: Catholic Church Fathers!)?

Oh yeah to answer your original question:

The History: The error came in when translating the Hebrew "Helel" (Meaning Day/Morning Star - that is the "Venus" Association as they are the same thing) - Which was a Reference to an Arrogant "King of Babylon" - to the Closest Latin Equivalent. The Monks came up with "Lucifer".

The Biblical Myth: Lucifer of course then became an "Adversary of God" - because of the Rebellion - the
Arch-Angel Lucifer (The most Beautiful of Gods Creations) would not Obey Gods Orders & Bow to God's Newest Creation = "Man". Lucifer felt that this was beneath him - so he "Fell" & was Banished to Hell by God. This is were Lucifer supposedly became Satan. What I find interesting is that in any case Lucifer & Satan are still ultimately answerable to GOD - therefore they must be serving some function that God Requires - the Testing of Humanity Perhaps.

Back to History: Later on (in 1667 England) the Writer Milton Fleshed this story out in his Novel
"Paradise Lost". This ended up cementing the association between Lucifer & Satan - even though originally it was a Bad Translation of Hebrew into Latin by a Catholic Monk in the Middle Ages! Ironically - Later on in the Bible - Jesus Christ himself announces that he is like a "Bright Morning Star".

The confusion continues to this day - seeing as we have gone over this topic many times on many different ATS Threads & yet - even Recently, like on this Thread - people still ask this same question! People still try to frighten other people with the Boogieman "Lucifer"!


[edit on 3-5-2005 by Seraphim_Serpente]

[edit on 3-5-2005 by Seraphim_Serpente]

[edit on 3-5-2005 by Seraphim_Serpente]

[edit on 3-5-2005 by Seraphim_Serpente]



posted on May, 10 2005 @ 08:41 AM
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From a Christian perspective Freemasonry is definatally Satanic.
Even the 1st degree has openly Satanic elements in the way an initiate is brought out of spiritual darkness and into "The Light."
Ummm... a Christian is in spiritual darkness...how does that work?

The whole emphasis of creating your own god and the idea that every man is free to define his own ideas about the "Divine Being" mirrors the LaVey Satanist doctrine verbatum.

As Pike explains at the end of Morals & Dogma,
"Of that Equilibrium between Good and Evil, and Light and Darkness in the world, which assures us that all is the work of the Infinite Wisdom and of an Infinite Love; and that there is no rebellious demon of Evil, or Principle of Darkness co-existent and in eternal controversy with God, or the Principle of Light and Good: by attaining to the knowledge of which equilibrium we can, through Faith, see that the existence of Evil, Sin, Suffering and Sorrow in the world, is consistent with the Infinite Goodness as well as the Infinite Wisdom of the Almighty."

Ultimatally Freemasonry depicts "The Supreme Being" as one where all things must be in balance, light vs darkness, ignorance vs knowledge so that the good vs evil struggle no longer has a finite border, one man's interpretation of good is another man's evil and this ultimatally causes the conflict which drives humanity to greatness.

Ultimatally this is a religion that revels in war and conflict and has NO fixed morality at all.

Smells like Satanism to me...
...even as an athiest.



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