Dead, But are we really?

We then go to the funeral service where the coffin is closed. Now here's where my thought comes into place. Are we actually in the coffin? Or have we been removed for some other purpose? No one can actually see whats in the coffin, they just presume that its the person they know being interned or cremated.

If you are concerned about this happening to yourself or your loved one you can have an open casket at the funeral and after the service the family is generally allowed private 'good bye' time before the casket is closed for good. The family members can be in attendance for the final closing of the casket and you can ask to ride shotgun in the hearst to the cemetary and watch the casket every step of the way until it's safely 6 feet under and covered with dirt.

I've never really been concerned about having an empty casket burrired. My biggest fear is having everyone around me think I'm dead and being burried alive! THAT is what freaks me out.

Sure, there are some sick little freaks in the world that might bury empty coffins and dispose of bodies in their backyard, just as there are priests that molest children, teachers that have sex with their pre-teen students, random citizens that put human fingers in Wendy's chili bowls, etc., but those people are WAY less in number than the honerable professionals and citizens that most of us deal with on a daily basis.

Just out of curiosity, what made you start thinking about this?

Jemison

Originally posted by Jemison
The family members can be in attendance for the final closing of the casket and you can ask to ride shotgun in the hearst to the cemetary and watch the casket every step of the way until it's safely 6 feet under and covered with dirt.

I've never really been concerned about having an empty casket burrired. My biggest fear is having everyone around me think I'm dead and being burried alive! THAT is what freaks me out.

Let me address some points, speaking as a funeral director:

We don't allow just anyone ride in the hearse... it's really a time to be together as a family, which is why most funeral homes will provide a limo, or coordinate other driving arrangements, but 9 times out of 10, I have to let someone down when they ask to ride in the hearse.

It's against most cemetery regulations (and insurance policies) to allow the family to watch the lowering of the casket- I've personally witnessed someone fall from the ground onto the top of the casket, and it wasn't a pleasant sight... nor was the hospital bill the cemetery paid for. This is the reason very few graveside services are performed- except in the movies, of course- most services are done in an on-site chapel, with the funeral director required to be present until the lid of the vault is in place.

As for being buried alive, it's not gonna happen. Anyone even remotely familiar with the real embalming process (not that made up stuff most people have in their heads) knows that it's IMPOSSIBLE in the modern day for someone to be buried alive. Maybe 100, even 50 years ago, but not anymore... Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but it's the truth.

Think about it this way (and ironically, this is the first time I'm agreeing with Surfup)- why in the hell would a funeral director want a rotting, decomposing, smelly body lying around, when we can just as easily bury it with ease? It doesn't make sense.

It's against most cemetery regulations (and insurance policies) to allow the family to watch the lowering of the casket-

Wow! I had no idea that was the case. I'm in California and MOST of the funerals I've been to have been graveside. Now, I have yet to go to a funeral where there was a graveside ceremony WITH an open casket, but both my grandmother and father had graveside services with several hundred people in attendance and the pall bearers carried the caskets from the hearse to the plot, placed it on some sort of rig and then at the end of the service the rig was lowered and the casket was in the ground.
People were even able to walk to the plot and throw dirt on the coffin if they wanted. No one was around telling them to stay away or watch their step.

Anyway, just wanted to put in my two cents that graveside services are not just in the movies and that they are very popular in California!

Jemison

So who oversees the Adams Family Funeral Home, anyway?

What agency checks, and how often?

Civilization sucks. When I die, I want to be put up in the sky for the crows, not sold to some soylent green factory or sealed up in a plastic box under ground.

[edit on 22-4-2005 by Chakotay]

Just out of curiosity, what made you start thinking about this?
Jemison

I'm not sure to be honest. Its something ,that i suppose has always been at the back of my mind for a long time.

I have lost a lot of friends over the years to road accidents whilst out riding our bikes, so i suppose it must stem from there.
Sorry i cant be more specific. Like i said, its just some thing that has been there for a while. Strange eh?

When my father passed away, the immediate family was allowed to be in the room with him to place things in the coffin prior to the lid being closed, while everyone else waited outside. Members of the immediate family were pallbearers, so I was basically with casket from the time it was closed until the vault was sealed (this was an above ground vault, being here in FL), with the exception of the time it was in the hearse.

It's against most cemetery regulations (and insurance policies) to allow the family to watch the lowering of the casket- I've personally witnessed someone fall from the ground onto the top of the casket, and it wasn't a pleasant sight... nor was the hospital bill the cemetery paid for. This is the reason very few graveside services are performed- except in the movies, of course- most services are done in an on-site chapel, with the funeral director required to be present until the lid of the vault is in place.

While I am not disagreeing with you I have been present for this once, the person that I was with wanted to stay with their loved one through to the end, and we stood and watched the backhoe open the vault, drop the casket in, reseal it and the cover it. The process took a bit of time, but we were allowed to stay and watch it through. I can see were it would be possible to have the earth give away at the edge of the pit and for someone to fall in quite easily, however, but we were all adults there so it was really not a risk.

As for being buried alive, it's not gonna happen. Anyone even remotely familiar with the real embalming process (not that made up stuff most people have in their heads) knows that it's IMPOSSIBLE in the modern day for someone to be buried alive. Maybe 100, even 50 years ago, but not anymore... Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but it's the truth.

That is true enough, but I have personally had a patient that woke up in the morgue freezer prior to being shipped out to the funeral home. Needless to say he had suffered some brain damage due to lack of oxygen.

Think about it this way (and ironically, this is the first time I'm agreeing with Surfup)- why in the hell would a funeral director want a rotting, decomposing, smelly body lying around, when we can just as easily bury it with ease?

I guess if they sell more plots then they have available, or if their cremation equipment breaks down and they continue to accept new clients such as happened in the above case. There are several reasons that this scam could take place, but they all come down to money, and you still have to do something with the bodies.

A better question is how cemeteries stay in business once they fill up and all the plots have been sold. I would be more worried about them gathering the bodies that are decomposed to skeletal remains, and mass burying them to allow room from more clientele. When my father died my mother paid for both of their plots and funerals then and there, on the spot, there is no yearly or monthly fee for the maintenance of the site. So at some point a place with finite space is going to stop making money and start loosing money on maintenance costs, how do they handle that?


[edit on 4/23/2005 by defcon5]

That is true enough, but I have personally had a patient that woke up in the morgue freezer prior to being shipped out to the funeral home. Needless to say he had suffered some brain damage due to lack of oxygen.

That is just creepy! How do things like that happen? How did the Doctors not know that this person was alive?

Jemison

He was declared dead at the scene of an accident. Either his heart was flat lined and later something triggered an escape beat, or his vitals were too low to be detectable. I believe that it is a very rare occurrence, but I have heard of it happening before.

There as a famous story about a professional weight lifter that ate dried blow fish and if someone had not told that Doc’s what he had eaten he would have also been declared dead. Zombifacation powder used by the Voodoo Docs in Jamaica works on the same principle. There was even a movie made about it called the, “The Serpent and the Rainbow”, in which a scientist from a drug manufacturer was sent to learn the secret of Zombie powder to use it as an anesthetic. That movie is based on a true story if I recall correctly.

What they would do is hit someone with the powder, they would be declared dead, and later they would dig them up. The person would receive brain damage from the time they spent in the coffin with little air, and would be used as a slave for the rest of their lives.

Now ya all beginning to scare me a bit here.
If the powers that be, IE doctors, can make a mistake in pronouncing you dead, then what the the hell would it be like to come round shivering in a mortuary freezer?

Hell, I don't even want to think about the repercussions. Its scares me to much.

Gee, I feel kind of bad now. You were originally concerned about coffins being burried without bodies in them ... now we have you thinking about being declared dead and waking up in a freezer!

Maybe we should all tell our loved ones not to refridgerate us until they have sat with us for 12 hours and are DAMN sure we have really passed on and not just passed out!

Jemison

LOL, I've never had anyone wake up in the freezer.

I did have a fun little incident with what's called a cadaveric spasm- its a chemical reaction between the embalming fluids, and the body's chemicals, and the hands and arms actually move, basically from a muscle spasm caused by the chemical reaction.

I've never high-tailed it out of anywhere so quick.

Bobbo, I would have FLIPPED out! How do you get used to dealing with that sort of thing? I mean, hearing that it can happen and actually SEEING it happen are two different things! If I witnessed something like that I don't think I could ever be in a room alone with a cadaver ever again! I would have to use the 'buddy system'!!!



Jemison

Originally posted by Jemison
Bobbo, I would have FLIPPED out! How do you get used to dealing with that sort of thing?

you get used to it. but your reflex in grabbing a scalpel develops really fast.

but seriously, after you've started injecting fluid and the body moves, you know if they werent dead prior to the fluid going in, they are once it's in, so the only thing that makes sense is some sort of chemical reaction. still freaky, but not life-altering, in the sense that I can still do it without peeing myself.