Thermal Depolymerization is the Energy Crisis Solution by Turning Trash into Treasure

Originally posted by zappafan1
Carbon-based waste only.... that's how it works. Oh...... "global warming" is caused by water vapor and solar activity...... but that's detailed in another thread. Carbon dioxide is plant food, not a polutant.

The Ford Motor Company disagrees with you.

www.worldchanging.com...

Here is the full report here (PDF WARNING!) media.ford.com...

I've read a book about peak oil which mentioned this technology. (the book is called The Long Emergency, by James Howard Kunstler).

The TD way to produce oil, still needs an oil-based econemy, without cheap oil, there's less waste, and thus less waste to process back into oil via the TD technology. So TD still requires cheap oil.

As others said, it sounds too good to be true, though it is quite interesting.

"If a 175-pound man fell into one [TD machine], he would come out the other end as 38 pounds of oil, seven pounds of gas, and seven pounds of minerals."

The TD process is suposedly 85% energy efficient.

(This should be in another thread, I think... it's off - topic)

"..... The Ford Motor Company disagrees with you."

REPLY: Ford motors? Their just getting their sales promos up and running.

Research, research research... hydrogen-based vehicles are decades away because of the lack of nationwide infrastructure, and even with the newest technology, it takes huge amounts of coal/oil to produce hydrogen; in fact, the energy required costs more than the energy (Hydrogen) produced; a net loss.

As to Global Warming (please read with an open mind):
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2. Paragraph 2 (of Att. A) states that the geologic record “provides evidence of larger climate variations associated with changes in atmospheric carbon dioxide” (emphasis added). This statement, while technically correct, gives the impression that increases of the greenhouse gas CO2 are the cause of climate warming in the geologic past. Yet recent results [Wahlen et al. 1998], analyzing the 400,000-year record of the Vostok ice core, conclude that every one of the three deglaciations (the major warming associated with the end of an ice age) was followed by a CO2 increase after about 1,000 years. This important finding establishes, if anything, a reverse causal relationship, namely that warmings can lead to an increase in CO2.

Links:
www.sepp.org...
www.sepp.org...
www.sepp.org...
www.sepp.org...

There is much to read here, and links to more.

"If a 175-pound man fell into one [TD machine], he would come out the other end as 38 pounds of oil, seven pounds of gas, and seven pounds of minerals."

That percentage is indeed correct, considering that most of human bodies are made of water.
As for a "supply" for the process, anything carbon-based, from animal guts, to rubber tires (we're not going to run out of those anytime soon) will work.
As for the "oil" produced, it has the added benefit of being VERY pure... more-so than even Pennsylvania Crude, and it can be broken down into eight different compounds and gasoline, just like "regular" oil.

(edited for content addition)


[edit on 21-12-2005 by zappafan1]

Coal-burning power plants, automobile exhausts, factory smokestacks, and other waste vents of the human environment contribute about 22 billion tons of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases into the earth's atmosphere each year. Animal agriculture, manure, natural gas, rice paddies, landfills, coal, and other sources contribute about 250 million tons of methane each year. About half of human emissions have remained in the atmosphere. The atmospheric concentrations of CO2 and CH4 have increased by 31% and 149% respectively above pre-industrial levels since 1750. This is considerably higher than at any time during the last 650,000 years, the period for which reliable data has been extracted from ice cores. From less direct geological evidence it is believed that CO2 values this high were last attained 40 million years ago. About three-quarters of the anthropogenic emissions of CO2 to the atmosphere during the past 20 years is due to fossil fuel burning. The rest is predominantly due to land-use change, especially deforestation.

Taken from Wikipedia Article on Global Warming

This site reports that greenhouse gasses are at the highest levels in over half a million years. Its time we stopped turning away from this fact and started doing something about it.

As for TDP, the federal Energy Policy Act now grants a dollar per gallon tax incentive on turkey biodiesel. This technology will see success sooner in Europe than anywhere else because of the Kyoto Protocol. Also, the US government is behind this, having provided half the construction funds for an entire plant.

Originally posted by TJ11240

Coal-burning power plants, automobile exhausts, factory smokestacks, and other waste vents of the human environment contribute about 22 billion tons of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases into the earth's atmosphere each year. Animal agriculture, manure, natural gas, rice paddies, landfills, coal, and other sources contribute about 250 million tons of methane each year. About half of human emissions have remained in the atmosphere. The atmospheric concentrations of CO2 and CH4 have increased by 31% and 149% respectively above pre-industrial levels since 1750. This is considerably higher than at any time during the last 650,000 years, the period for which reliable data has been extracted from ice cores. From less direct geological evidence it is believed that CO2 values this high were last attained 40 million years ago. About three-quarters of the anthropogenic emissions of CO2 to the atmosphere during the past 20 years is due to fossil fuel burning. The rest is predominantly due to land-use change, especially deforestation.

Taken from Wikipedia Article on Global Warming

This site reports that greenhouse gasses are at the highest levels in over half a million years. Its time we stopped turning away from this fact and started doing something about it.

As for TDP, the federal Energy Policy Act now grants a dollar per gallon tax incentive on turkey biodiesel. This technology will see success sooner in Europe than anywhere else because of the Kyoto Protocol. Also, the US government is behind this, having provided half the construction funds for an entire plant.

WIKI is not correct in all cases, being relatively new, and growing.... a fact that was brought to me in a discussion on Sweden

Go to the links and read the information... it'll only take a day or two. Over 12,000 scientists worldwide can argue the the merits on the information you provided. Their intellect, scientific databases, and common sense is something
we should defer to, I would think. They have nothing to gain by being contrary.
Mount Pinatubo put more Co2 (and other, true greenhouse gases) into the atmosphere in two days than we did in the entire industrialized revolution. Americas air now is cleaner than it has been in over 100 years... without Kyoto; something even Clinton threatened to veto if brought to him (probably because he couldn't figure out a way to make millions from the deal.... but that's another issue.)

Sorry to revive an old thread...

Saw someone mentioned Kunstler. See, the thing I don't appreciate about Kunstler is that, if he were dictator of the world, we'd start doing without a lot of things humanity has taken for granted for a long time, in some cases centuries, possibly millenia, to have a small chance of turning around climate change in a century or so. No, I'm not just talking about oil, I'm also talking about international trade (definitely centuries in the least, though there's millenia-old evidence of trade between China and some South American tribes) medicine, education, anything resembling life of the last few hundred years. Maybe it's necessary, but I rather hope not; I'm hopeful we can do what we've always done as a race and just adapt and transform.

No one solution will be a one-size-fits-all solution. I could see the results of this being used as a lubricant, perhaps. Here in America, we need to build up public transportation as well as a more efficient parcel service. Power can and should be produced by solar, wind, nuclear, and so on. Towns should be relatively car-free. Cars and trucks should be largely either a luxury or the mode of transportation for rural America (and powered by electric, stored-heat steam, and so on) and international trade should go back to smaller vessels with passive power for most the trip. Diesel should be reserved for short-distance freight hauling.

Having said all that, hey, I think it's a great idea, as long as we're not doing away with recycling and no-till farming to feed the oil habit.

[edit on 16-5-2008 by regeya]

Changing World Technologies. CHANGE? sound familiar? william hambrecht has a heavy hand in this company, as well as deep pockets. he donated almost a million dollars to the democrats this past year, Obama, Clinton, Pelosi.. i get the feeling change is gonna come in the form of this company building sites all over the country- right next to the "concentration camps". seriously people, the word change was not drilled into our heads for nothing. this company goes public feb. 9. - expect to hear about this in a future presidential speech. new "green employment opportunitie" at this company. and it is really odd/bothersome that someone would point out how much fuel a human would become if they "fell" into a machine.......human fuel=ghost in the machine? haha.

I thought I would reply to this old thread and give it a little nudge. Thermal depolymerization seems like a great way to address the waste problems we are experiencing on the planet today. If the costs haven't come down on industrial scale applications, I think it could still be viable at the household or farm scale. I've been wanting to produce my own fuel for years now. Being able to produce my own fuel from waste products would be a nice way to become more energy independent on a personal level. This is defenitely on my wish list.

This process is old and based on the Fischer–Tropsch process from 1938.

They are just using new modern equipment and calling it a new process under a new name because all the patents on the Fischer–Tropsch process have long since run out.
en.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: ANNED

Indeed. This is all simple chemistry, essentially. Too bad it's not been more widely adopted.