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Another robot - base guardian (Air Force!).

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posted on Apr, 13 2005 @ 03:50 PM
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It looks like the USAF people don't like humans at all! First UAVs and now robotic guard unit. They are testing various drones to guard their Air bases instead of humans.

Onerobot being tested is a Jeep-size, four-wheeled vehicle that has been equipped with radar, television cameras and an infrared scan to detect people, vehicles and other objects. It carries a breadbox-sized mini-robot that can be launched to search under vehicles, inside buildings and other small places.

Another robot is fashioned from an off-the-shelf, four-wheeled all-terrain vehicle, giving it added versatility because a human also can ride it like a normal ATV. Both vehicles can be remotely operated from laptop computers and can be equipped with remotely fired weapons, like an M-16 rifle or pepper spray.

"What we are hoping is the robots will actually detect the enemy first," said Capt. Adolfo Meana Jr., chief of the concepts division for the Force Protection Battlelab at Lackland Air Force Base, Texas.

"If you shoot the robot we don't care. We know you're there, you're hostile, and we can keep our forces in reserve to move tactically against the enemy. The robots will save our troops' lives," he said.

The vehicles can be programmed to patrol specific areas and then alert an operator by radio if they find something suspicious. They have loudspeakers and microphones for questioning intruders and the operator can pick from a variety of languages.



It will cost 200 000-500 000$, IMHO humans are much cheaper!




posted on Apr, 13 2005 @ 03:52 PM
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robots, lots of robots. we gonna have to get use to em.



posted on Apr, 13 2005 @ 04:27 PM
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Originally posted by longbow
It will cost 200 000-500 000$, IMHO humans are much cheaper!


Geez, first carpeted bunks, and now robots? The USAF gets all the goodies.

However, I wouldn't be so sure about your cost ratio. Our military members can probably validate or correct this next statement, but I'm pretty sure the training cost for one indivual to go through Army Basic Training is $8 million. That is, I assume, factoring in all the room, board, training, support staff, munitions used up, weapons used and/or broken, vehicles destroyed in war games, manuals, uniforms, equipment, health care, etc...

I know the Air Force has it easy compared to the Army (with all due respect to our USAF members) but I'd still be willing to bet their training isn't less than $500k per person. Even if it was slightly more expensive, I'd rather see a robot get blown up than our men and women in the service.

Aside from that last statement, though, good post. Interesting find.



posted on Apr, 13 2005 @ 04:33 PM
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Originally posted by thelibra
However, I wouldn't be so sure about your cost ratio. Our military members can probably validate or correct this next statement, but I'm pretty sure the training cost for one indivual to go through Army Basic Training is $8 million. That is, I assume, factoring in all the room, board, training, support staff, munitions used up, weapons used and/or broken, vehicles destroyed in war games, manuals, uniforms, equipment, health care, etc...

I know the Air Force has it easy compared to the Army (with all due respect to our USAF members) but I'd still be willing to bet their training isn't less than $500k per person. Even if it was slightly more expensive, I'd rather see a robot get blown up than our men and women in the service.
Aside from that last statement, though, good post. Interesting find.


But this should replace only guards in air bases. I don't think their training cost so much. And with the vehicle there still will be a need for human sitting somewhere who will make decisions.

But I wonder WHY DOES IT NEED RADAR!



posted on Apr, 13 2005 @ 05:03 PM
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Originally posted by thelibra
~snip

..., but I'm pretty sure the training cost for one indivual to go through Army Basic Training is $8 million....
~snip


That sounds incredibly too high to me, I googled and found this,
www.military.com...



Consider this -- the Army spends approximately $35,000-$50,000 to train a new recruit from the time the individual walks into a recruiter station until he reaches his first duty station, depending on if he goes to Basic Training, Advanced Individual Training or if he goes to One Station Unit Training. This cost represents costs from the U.S. Army Recruiting Command, U.S. Military Entrance Processing Command, and the U.S. Training and Doctrine Command.



posted on Apr, 13 2005 @ 06:36 PM
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Does this mean that the Phoneix Ravens will be replaced?



posted on Apr, 13 2005 @ 08:01 PM
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If you think, at any one point they have two guards at one gate/check point, they work on eitehr 6 or 8 hour shifts. (Peace/War time) so, for $50,000 a piece on training, that's already $400,000 (8*50,000) then you have to factor in pay over X amount of years. In the long run, robots will be better, cheaper and who would rather see a human die then a solider?

But also think of it on an economic scale, less soldiers = less money going into the military/less need for this money, more money able to go into the economy to boost the labour market and then in turn more people to work in hte labour Market. The movement from Humans to Robots is actually a really smart one and one that in the long run will:
Save Lives.
Cost Less.
Earn More.

One day, you'll see us move to fully automated robots, that will be able to guard bases, patrol the skies and land. Soldiers will only be used on:
Maintance
and Holding The Ground.

The patrols in places such as Iraq, will fall on robots who in the long run will be able to take more then a soldier and give more.

I don't see this as a bad thing? And the Radar would be used to track land based objects.



posted on Apr, 13 2005 @ 08:08 PM
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It needs more guns and armor.

This thing could be disabled with a handheld grenade.

It needs a mortar and UAV targeting. Else this thing is useless except in the high school science fair.



posted on Apr, 13 2005 @ 08:42 PM
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I cannot believe you guys see this as a possitive thing. This is, hands down, the worst thing that has ever been drempt up. I would never trust a computer over a soldier. Human's can perceive and think. Robots, well they are just computers that can move around........

1. Just like all things electronic, it can be deemed useless by the detenation of an EMP.

2. Even worse, it can be hacked.

Imagine that, your own multi-million dollar robot, decked-out with the best armor and weoponry, turning around and giving you a taste of your own medicine. Think about that.



posted on Apr, 13 2005 @ 08:56 PM
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1) You can protect from EMP.

2) You can protect against hackers the same way you protect from EMP. Only allowing it to receive a certain kind of signal while blocking others, put some good kind of encryption, and perhaps only allow it to take a singal from a certain direction would reduce the chance that someone remotely hijacked the vehicle. The antenna could always be focosed on the direction of its big brother in the sky controlling it. Much harder for someone to send it a bogus signal to try and override?

3) We know about 1) and 2) and can plan for the worst.

4) It would be hard for someone to hack them. They are more likely to get blown up then hacked.

5) Without robots you risk lives.

6) They can carry more ammo, fuel, and armor.

I would rather have an unmanned army of airplanes and vehicles then I would a manned army. As long as I still had the force to destroy them if they turned around and started shooting.

I think they can be a good compliment.



posted on Apr, 14 2005 @ 04:01 AM
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I hear that there will be a new computer control system...... skynet



posted on Apr, 14 2005 @ 05:23 AM
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It would be easier to just put a metal storm at the main gate, i can guarantee nobody will come near the base



posted on Apr, 14 2005 @ 11:25 AM
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This is a great idea. The guy mentions the most important thing too: If an enemy shoots first, no humans die and they know where and how to retaliate. But just as importantly, this thing can use IR and other sensors to see first. Win Win. This is a wondefull system!!

Robot to patrol, humans to respond.

[edit on 14-4-2005 by skippytjc]



posted on Apr, 14 2005 @ 11:27 AM
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Originally posted by longbow
It will cost 200 000-500 000$, IMHO humans are much cheaper!


I would rather the government spending the $500,000 for a Robot soldier then sending a letter to the soldiers family along with a folded flag.



posted on Apr, 14 2005 @ 12:54 PM
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Originally posted by thelibra
I know the Air Force has it easy compared to the Army (with all due respect to our USAF members) but I'd still be willing to bet their training isn't less than $500k per person.

That cannot possibly be true, the USAF spends much more to train pilots with extensive training, fuel costs, maintenance of planes etc etc. I think it would be in the order of $1 mil per pilot for training-ground/air, accomodation etc.
Here is a little info on USAF air base security:

The Force which gaurds USAF bases around the world is known as
United States Airforce Security Force, for those who didn't know, they were earlier called the Airforce Security police. The security Force is composed of personnel from security forces, Office of Special Investigations, civil engineering, logistics and supply, communications, intelligence, administration, personnel, and medical career fields etc. They are based in Lackland AFB Texas where the SF are trained and deployed around the world. The enlisted men and officers are part of the 343rd Training Squadron (Security Forces Academy), Lackland AFB TX. They also act as law enforcement on the Air Force bases so they are pretty much the guys incharge of the ground in the AB.

The PHOENIX RAVEN programme is basically an add on to the SF where aircraft transit high threat regions, basically teams of two to four specially trained and equipped security forces personnel deploy as aircrew members on AMC[Air Mobility Command] missions as designated by the AMC Threat Working Group. The Raven teams help detect, deter and counter threats to AMC aircraft by performing close-in aircraft security; advising aircrews on force protection measures; conducting airfield assessments; and assisting aircrews in the performance of their duties when not performing their primary security duties. Ravens in action in Afganistan:

I think the security bots will only be an addition to the SF and might not replace the ground forces entirely, also for these 'robots' to run don't they need to be controlled by a human operator at all times?? How would they use these robots in very volatile places where you need to land quickly and load/unload cargo/troops, would they be an integral part of the aircrafts? AF Security Force

[edit on 14-4-2005 by IAF101]



posted on Apr, 14 2005 @ 01:54 PM
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IAF101, last I checked the SAS soldiers are only worth £1.5million or roughly $3 USD. I doubt the average American Guard gets $1million worth of training, pay, etc, over a career. Math just doesn't add up.

But no matter what, a robot is always better and now we have the basic design over time they'll get better and better.

Also we will make it so they begin to fit the jobs we need. You could load them up with equipment, to transport and inside their they could be safe. Imagine how much armour you can put on something like that. It'll really help any Army, one it is all worked out and fixed up.

[edit on 14-4-2005 by Odium]



posted on Apr, 14 2005 @ 02:03 PM
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Sure the military is getting twice the robot for their buck, if they wanted to more soldiers cold be replaced with remote robots.

This arguement sparked something of a debate, linked following, for those who may have not read it.

DEBATE: Technology vs. Soldiers



posted on Apr, 14 2005 @ 02:32 PM
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Originally posted by Odium
IAF101, last I checked the SAS soldiers are only worth £1.5million or roughly $3 USD. I doubt the average American Guard gets $1million worth of training, pay, etc, over a career.
[edit on 14-4-2005 by Odium]

Why are you comparing British Special Ops with US Security Forces?? They are completely different. They $1mill I estimated was for USAF pilots not the SF! The SF gets around $40,000 of training, additional training, pay etc.
Here is a list of Airforce Expenses on its training: Airforce Initial training Cost



posted on Apr, 14 2005 @ 03:08 PM
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People here are posting as if there wont be anymore human guards on bases, not true for now. This robot is probably a patrol type of robot, and if its finds something the HUMAN guards will go and deal with it.
Its not like your going to come up to the gate and see that thing parked there.



posted on Apr, 15 2005 @ 01:10 AM
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Originally posted by WestPoint23
People here are posting as if there wont be anymore human guards on bases, not true for now. This robot is probably a patrol type of robot, and if its finds something the HUMAN guards will go and deal with it.
Its not like your going to come up to the gate and see that thing parked there.


Both vehicles can be remotely operated from laptop computers and can be equipped with remotely fired weapons, like an M-16 rifle or pepper spray.

So I think it is definitely equipped to handle "intruders" alone (of course human operator will make decisions).



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