It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
Originally posted by W4rl0rD
I already know about those, but hitting a sea-skimming missle going at mach 2 isn't easy work, even with technology on the Aegis.
Originally posted by W4rl0rD
Ok. What if the planes flown at mach 1.5 sea skimming kamikaze style, then fired the sunburns? There isn't much time for detection, around a minute or slightly more. Trust me, there are plenty of ways to sink a carrier, just that it will be difficult.
Originally posted by Odium
I've always wondered, would the Chinese pilots be willing to run a kamikazi style attack on the Carriers? And would that work? Because I think it'd be a damn good way to cripple the carriers - payload of bombs, flown right into the ship.
Anyone any ideas on if they'd do such a thing?
First you send out hundreds of trawlers parading around and through the carrier group masquerading as fishing fleet and feeding back target coordinates to HQ.
AWACS can be destroyed by ultra long range ARMs that are designed to be launched from 400km range. Any carrier group has weakness its just a matter of finding and exploiting them. There are only 4 AWACS in each carrier which means that only 2 can fly at any one time from a 2 carrier battle group. With the right missiles this would not be that hard to knock these out or neutralise them long enough to get a squadron of interceptors in close enough to shoot it down.
When that time comes men on the trawlers whip out their man portable SAMs and shoot down AWACS that are launching to replace shot down AWACS.
Once the AWACS are gone the carrier aviation effectiveness is cut in half due to much larger usage of fuel to fly cap missions. The battle group becomes dependant on AOE replenishment ships . These are what you send your long range subs against, to interdict the supply lines. If the carriers can't get the fuel, they can't fly any missions.
Once that occurs combined FAC/jet assaults with waves of antishiping missiles. I understand that decoys are in development for small high velocity ASMs to overwhelm airdefence radars, greatly reducing effectiveness of ship launched missiles, thus deploying decoys can overwhelm the battle group airdefence.No matter how good the defence some Sunburns will get through.
Mean while the Subs are slipping into the inner circle for torpedo runs ,since the escort ships are desperately tring to shoot down waves of antishipping missiles. True SSN can screen some of this but they are limited to slow ops to avoid detection. Thus they may only be able to deal with one in bound sub each. Overwhelm these with multiple subs and some will get through.
Originally posted by WestPoint23
psteel your a great story teller you should write a book titled " Stupid but amusing military strategies".
And the UAV’s would be even easier to shoot down as they are bigger and slower than a missile. Plus run our of ammunition? This is a 21st century batte group, they have something called supply ships.
[edit on 17-4-2005 by WestPoint23]
Originally posted by PeanutButterJellyTime
Not gonna happen. The trawlers will be warned off by radio, then by helo, then finally with shots fired over their bow. If they don't leave they'll be boarded or simply sunk.
True to a point. The E-2C's never go out alone. They will spot the incoming bogeys and vector aircraft to intercept. The E-2's will be able to see 400km, as will the Aegis ships, and will detect the ARM's when launched and in flight. The E-3's will probably go to EMCON then and shut down the radar until the ARM runs out of fuel. If the ARMs go close enough to one of the CG's or DDG's they are toast.
Even if a peacetime surprise attack was launched, the trawlers wouldn't be there. But to play the game, if they somehow managed to get there they would be warned off, boarded, or sunk as soon as the carrier's aircraft were attacked.
This is true, the aircraft needs fuel. However, they have enough fuel on board to fight for a long time. They carry so much fuel the other surface ships pull up alongside them to refuel. Plus, an AOE is a member of the battlegroup and will be near the carrier. They'd be on station for a long time before fuel started to become a concern. Additional AOE's would be sent, in time, but would be escorted and protected.
You have to fight through the carrier's aircraft, and available land based aircraft, and the Aegis ships to get into firing range. Most decoys used nowadays can be detected as such. Do you know how many ASM's, or how many targets for that matter, it would take to overwhelm an Aegis SPY-1 radar? The number is classified, but is HUGE! I seriously doubt China has enough aircraft capable of launching sunburns to pull that off. To do that would require the largest air raid history has ever seen.
First, the ships train by fighting in multiple threat environments all the time. The ship's CIC isn't one or two people doing everything, there is a whole team for AAW, for ASW, and for ASUW. The AAW guys will be busy with the largest air raid in history, but the ASW guys won't even see the air targets on their displays. They'll be watching the data from the hull mounted and towed array sonars, the LAMPS helos, and the sonobouys. There would be two LAMPS from each of the surface ships, I don't know how many from the carrier (a lot) and countless P-3's from the carrier and from shore facilities. LAMPS is so lethal to subs it's hardly fair. They fly around dropping sonobouys and dipping their sonar or MAD until they acquire a target. Then they fly to the target and drop a torpedo on top of it.
You have to think about more than the raid itself. Think about China's logistics for such an attack. Can they coordinate such a massive attack? I don't think so. You're talking about launching the biggest air raid in history concurrently with the largest sub raid, and with people in trawlers trying to get near the carrier. All timed just right. When the E-2C is fired on, it will be noticed right away as an overt act of war, and if it wasn't a surprise attack in peacetime the Chinese command and control, radars, etc., would have inbound TLAMS to deal with. Once they hit, China wouldn't be able to organize this massive raid and I think it would turn into the world's largest turkey shoot.
Originally posted by WestPoint23
Obviously the space between my sentences represents a change in topic, therefore when I was talking about UAV’s I was referring to the member that posted before you did.
Originally posted by twchang
Don't forget though that exercise is close to real thing but there are still some difference.
[edit on 18-4-2005 by twchang]