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Bending Light + Building a time machine

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posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 12:50 PM

By Shadow88
how would one make an object oscillate at the speed of: light? sound?

I guess that I would refer you HERE for a basic understanding of Resonance.

When the forcing function's frequency matches the natural frequency of an object it will begin to resonate. The forcing function adds energy at just the right moment during the oscillation cycle so that the oscillation is reinforced. This makes the oscillation's amplitude grow larger and larger. These oscillations would eventually become infinitely large. However, as mentioned earlier, long before the oscillations reach infinity one of three things happens: 1) the object's dynamics change so that the resonant frequency and forcing functions no longer match, 2) the energy lost as heat, sound, or light becomes equal to the energy input. or 3) the object breaks


By Shadow88
the speed of light is not constant, as it is energy, and therefore susceptable to the variables in its present environment. and so there is no terminal velocity where one cannot continue

The speed of light is both constant and variable depending on your perspective.

A.) The speed of light in a Vacuum is constant.
B.) The speed of light outside a Vacuum is not constant.

ATS Speed of Light Discussions


By Shadow88 i am firstly inquiring about the theory of time travel

I refer you here as a starting point, but make sure you read the reference links also:
A physicist's view on an old controversy

You could also load your head with more info by searching ATS for posts about time travel.

posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 12:55 PM
yes this is the paradox theory lucas_900. i think Einstein first showed this...

Also there is a section about paradoxesHere
(just edit and find from) It sounds like science fiction, but it is taken so seriously by relativists that some of them have proposed that there must be a law of nature to prevent time travel and thereby prevent paradoxes arising, even though nobody has any idea how such a law would operate. The classic paradox, of course, occurs when a person travels back in time and does something to prevent their own birth.

Something about the law that allows for paradoxes also prevents them? i think it must mean "if i went back and killed my grandad, how would i be born to be able to go back and kill....." Until your head explodes.

[edit on 10-4-2005 by Shadow88]

posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 12:59 PM
there is a law that prevents it - relitivety. Sorry about the spelling. But yeah, it stops us going so fast (i.e. speed of light+) that we can travel at least forwards, and we can not travel backward in time to a point where the time machine does not exist.

posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 01:03 PM
If you think about it, (when everyone stops nitpickin on the wording etc. and actually starts talking about time travel:barf
this is a fantastic way to combine ideas, research, own designs etc.

its like a giant Research + Development team here. We could do well to try and combine our ideas, reasearch, thoughts etc. and begin to get some constructive work started.

Question: Does anyone actually have their own ideas on a time MACHINE?


posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 01:04 PM
As far as I know light does not travel in a linear path and it is bent around a universal center in space, and the infinity of the universe to us is similar to the infinity of the moebius strip to the ants. And supposedly when one starts to travel in one straight line in space, virtually at the end he will reach to the same point where he started. so space is actually bent or is it the light that is bent.

posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 01:05 PM
lol in a way we can see millions of years into the past by looking at stars and gallaxies etc, and we are always travelling forward in time. lmao.

posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 01:09 PM
in answer to xu's question - evrything exert a force, no matter how minimal on the universe. Think of the universe as a rubber sheet. Stretch this out and then drop a ball onto it and the rubber bends under the force. This is basically what you are talking about. This, in itself, will distort time.

In fact there was once an experiemnt whewre 2 atomic clocks were syncronised. One was left stationary and the other was put on concorde which flew at the speed of sound. When the 2 clocks were checked for their syncrnisity the one on concorde was slightly faster than the other, so even at speeds lower than LS, you still travel forward in time fasater than things moving slower, but it is so minimal that humans can not naturally experience this.

posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 02:42 PM
I'd like to see that time machine. It could be amazing to travel through time, go back to the past and change everything. Great.

posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 02:49 PM

Originally posted by lucas_900
there is a law that prevents it - relitivety. Sorry about the spelling. But yeah, it stops us going so fast (i.e. speed of light+) that we can travel at least forwards, and we can not travel backward in time to a point where the time machine does not exist.

Without sounding rude what your saying is INSANE! What mechanism is in place to stop you going back through time to befor the time machine existed, surely thats the point.

To travel back in time you need to leave our reality, you need to enter a higher dimension, once you re enter the time line a new future is written, if you dont change the past the future will be identical to the one you left but it wont be 'the' time line your from, that time line has carried on with out you.
Its because of the nature of the multiverse that paradoxes do not occur, in fact they can not occur. So if you went back to kill your mother you would not exist in the future however you as a person will still exist because you come from another time line in which your mother was not killed by you.
This does not apply if you travel forward in time as you are moving with the flow of the time line. All said you can never cross into another time line because as far as your concerned it no longer exists but for the people in the time line you originaly left life goes on, just with out you. So you vanish in you time machine, your fellow scientists never see you again, however when you return to the future of the new time line (if you havent changed anything) you fellow scientists will be there to greet you, theres just another identical set in another time line wondering where you went.

posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 02:53 PM
Ok you have to get past the paradox thing.

For us we automatically get confused when we think "how can we go back in a time machine to a time before it was built, or the materials were dug up etc."

you must realize that the theory goes that if you were able to travel back in time you would be on a different plane of existence or different dimension. therefore going back to the time paradox situation, the grandad that you killed in the past exists in a slightly different...."wavelength" of spacetime.

getting very deep in theories now guys lol

posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 02:57 PM
Motile is right in the fact that once you left your plane of existence or dimension IT IS IMPOSSIBLE to return to that exact line.

even if you had a degree of control to the extent where you could go back to the instant you left, it would not be the same plane....

posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 03:07 PM
If you just want to bend light and not the atmosphere then just use a fresnel lens, pronounced fro-nol and a cold mirror. You can actually find these components in DLP and LCD projectors. Awhile back I did a pretty weird experiment with such components.

My gut feeling though is that Shadow is trying to concoct another J Titor story for the world.

No offense Shadow. It's my opinion. If you want the details of how to use the lens and mirror so you can get back to 4317 send me a U2U


posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 03:33 PM
personally I dont think that the time exists. past or future, years, hours, minutes are all human inventions, the way we tend to identify things which we cannot solve.

when we look at the stars we dont really see millions of years into the past, we just percept the photons those hit our eye, which are right here and now, not in the past. but because of the speed of light when we see something it means the thing we see is right here and "now" which is partially wrong. if you think that way, even when we are looking to an object that we hold in our hands we are seeing into the past. because it takes time for the photons to reach our eye from the object we hold. but what we see is not the object in current time, it is the light that reflected from it which hits our eye right "now".

and in the case of atom clocks, it can be the effect of speed in physics. maybe the speed can in some way affect the working of the clock etc., I mean that can not count as the proof of time or past exists.

think of "0 Kelvin", absolute zero. it is not naturally observed or artifically reached ( they came very close) but it is a known fact that when the temperature gets close to absolute zero the vibrations of atoms slows, and theoretically if you reach the absolute zero. everything comes to an halt. so lets asume you put an atomic clock in a tank wwhich is later cooled down to absolute zero, then after a thousand years you open the tank and see the date and time on the clock which points to the time it has been cooled down to the absolute zero a thousand years ago, so did that clock traveled 1000 years ahead in time?

you see the time doesnt change nor we travel forward in time, time is an illusion of "changing nows". so time travel cannot be possible where there is no "time". that is what I think ofcourse.

posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 03:38 PM

My gut feeling though is that Shadow is trying to concoct another J Titor story for the world.

I agree.

And Shadow said he was going to post his design for us to see. We're still waiting for that. Shadow? Where's it at?

posted on Apr, 10 2005 @ 03:41 PM
lots of good points there, and i see what you mean, but time is obviously apparent as i havnt always been the size, weight and age i am now, once i was only a single cell, and now i have grown into trillions. even if we do not understand time it is still there, but prehaps the only time that actually exists is the present, there is no future, apart from what we think of in the present, (predictions of what we believe will happen, or what we know will happen), and no past except in our memories and in literature and historical sources. once it has happened it is gone, and it doesnt exist until it has happened, and then it is gone, thus time travel is impossible.

This is all getting very philisophical now, but it makes good discussion.

posted on Apr, 11 2005 @ 05:31 AM
Sorry its taking so long but if i put it up and it was wrong then you'd all go "AHA!!!! STUPID HED....
" I cant bleev they moved the blog though just when it was getting interesting!

general chit chat.......HA!

i tell you what. since i was a tad optimistic (VERY OPTIMISTIC) about me finishing the designs etc i will start a new blog in the next couple of days in sci/tech.

o and Lucas_900 not exactly correct yea some sort of time is present but we can only understand and describe it in linear or 3 dimensional terms, which we are beginning to realise that it is not.

[edit on 11-4-2005 by Shadow88]

posted on Apr, 11 2005 @ 05:36 AM
Don't you have to fold space and not bend light to achieve time travel?

posted on Apr, 11 2005 @ 05:49 AM
no the bending of light is to create an artficial instibility of spacetime. normally objects of immense mass (black holes, supernova etc.) are required to create warps in spacetime.

gravitrons, photons, electrons etc are all interconnected so warp one you subsequently warp them all.

it is theorised that if you were able to pass through the centre of a black hole where the warp on spacetime is so great, that one would be able to pass through in another dimension. (11 dimension and string theory)

:bnghd::bnghd::bnghd::bnghd::bnghd: head exploding yet? it should be by now if youve read the whole blog like some people

[edit on 11-4-2005 by Shadow88]

posted on Apr, 11 2005 @ 06:11 AM
THIS!!! this it what i was looking for!!!!!!


posted on Apr, 11 2005 @ 07:42 AM
This topic has been very enlightening and intellectual, i applaud everyone who contributed positively to this thread. unfortunately the thread has now been moved to "general chit chat", as i think there were just too many separate issues addressed in the thread and was too general. Regardeless of the reason it has been a great help and i have a lot to ponder. I am going to create a new thread in sci/tech as a spin off from this topic. cheers y'all

[edit on 11-4-2005 by Shadow88]

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