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AZ Gen says Army solders may not help Minuteman

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posted on Apr, 5 2005 @ 05:38 PM
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Makes me wonder if Bush issued orders preventing those stationed in AZ from participating in the project.



FORT HUACHUCA - Senior commanders on this southern Arizona Army post have told soldiers they may not take part in patrolling the border with Minuteman Project volunteers.

In a memo to soldiers assigned to the Network Enterprise Technology Command, Maj. Gen. James Hylton prohibited those assigned to his organization, to include the 11th Signal Brigade, "from participating in any active patrolling, monitoring or other intentional act associated with identifying and/or detaining illegal immigrants, either through an organized group, or on you own."

However, a former soldier, whose wife is still in the Army, said Hylton overstepped his authority in denying soldiers the right to take part in what he sees as defending homeland security.

Source






Why are the rights of the solders to protest being taken away from them is what I want to know?

[edit on 4/5/2005 by shots]




posted on Apr, 5 2005 @ 05:42 PM
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shots, first of all, are you actually taking part in the minuteman project?

Second of all, I agree this was an abuse of authority. As long as soldiers aren't on taxpayer time or misrepresenting themselves as being official envoys of the military, there should be no cause for alarm. The army doesn't stop its soldiers from participating in bowling leagues or charity fund raisers for disabled kids, why should they have any say in this matter?

I can understand why the General didn't want anyone to think the Army was officially sanctioning the event, but as far as soldiers helping out the homeland on their spare time, I see nothing wrong with that.



posted on Apr, 5 2005 @ 05:58 PM
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Originally posted by WyrdeOne
shots, first of all, are you actually taking part in the minuteman project?



Yes I am, I will be down there later this month. It will only be for a few days, but some is better then none and since I already had plans to go there, I figured why not. Better then sitting in a Casino with my wife if ya know what I mean.

[edit on 4/5/2005 by shots]



posted on Apr, 5 2005 @ 06:25 PM
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Shots,

I thought the government was against this the whole time, makes you wonder how concerned they really are about homeland security. Anyways, how did you sign up? I may be able to drive down and help out sometimes on weekends that I'm free.



posted on Apr, 5 2005 @ 06:32 PM
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Originally posted by 27jd
Shots,

Anyways, how did you sign up? I may be able to drive down and help out sometimes on weekends that I'm free.


currently you have to sign up here.

New volunteers must apply "in person" to sign up for field activities, and receive an orientation lecture, at the Tombstone Tumbleweed newspaper office at 312 Toughnut Street in
downtown Tombstone, Az.

Queries may be made via email to Civil Homeland Defense, operated by Chris Simcox, at contact@civilhomelanddefense.us
or by calling 520-457-3008.

You must provide a valid driver's license, and be issued a Minuteman Project identification card, before you will be able
to participate in field activities.

I signed up via the internet when they were accepting applications online.

They alsoi ask you to bring your state flag if you have one.



posted on Apr, 5 2005 @ 06:37 PM
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Shots the reason the government is staying away from the minute man project is very simple.

The links to other than controversial groups is something that comes to mind.

Please understand that the government can not take sides with militia groups.

If you are going to join them please I beg you to be careful, and if you see something wrong or feel that is wrong leave and go back home.

Be very careful.



posted on Apr, 5 2005 @ 06:41 PM
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shots
Good for you for putting your money where your mouth is.


I'm very impressed.

If more people would act on their desires, the world would be a happier place by far.

Speaking of, I'm thirsty. It's my duty as a human being to get a beverage. Adios.


Seriously though, good on ya'. Stay safe, and don't be one of those buffoons standing by the fire whooping and hollering in the middle of the night. Those guys have 'Rifle Target' written all over them.




posted on Apr, 5 2005 @ 06:43 PM
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Thanks for the info. I will definetly check into it.



posted on Apr, 5 2005 @ 06:55 PM
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Originally posted by marg6043
Shots the reason the government is staying away from the minute man project is very simple.

The links to other than controversial groups is something that comes to mind.

Please understand that the government can not take sides with militia groups.

If you are going to join them please I beg you to be careful, and if you see something wrong or feel that is wrong leave and go back home.

Be very careful.


They are not the Militia they have made it very clear they are working like a Neighborhood watch group nothing more. stop being so paranoid about this. you are trying to make it looke like a militia when it is not.

As for going back home, no way. I know how you feel about the imigrants, you have made that very clear in the past.

I will stand my post and report each and everyone I see you can bet on that. I also have no intention of confronting them that is against SOP for the Minuteman.

Unlike you I do not want illegals entering my country. If they enter via legal methods fine. I have nothing wrong with that at all and I doubt others do either.

[edit on 4/5/2005 by shots]



posted on Apr, 5 2005 @ 07:36 PM
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Shots... Good luck man. Stay safe and drink lots of water, the desert is no place to play.



posted on Apr, 5 2005 @ 09:26 PM
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Originally posted by Sugarlump
Shots... Good luck man. Stay safe and drink lots of water, the desert is no place to play.


Nah waters makes me wanna go pp and that might set off one of those sensors.
I will however drink gator aid you can be sure of that.

[edit on 4/5/2005 by shots]



posted on Apr, 5 2005 @ 09:32 PM
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Originally posted by shots
Nah waters makes me wanna go pp and that might set off one of those sensors.
I will however drink gator aid you can be sure of that.

[edit on 4/5/2005 by shots]


I was station in 29 palms with my husband and the desert is something you have to take seriously if you are not used to it.

It the three years I spend in the desert, military personnel and people was bitten by rattle snakes, this time of the years the babies are all over and very poisonous, and also people will get lost.

Our welcome aboard package included a survival guide and never drink the water.


Yes I was in the west onces.



posted on Apr, 5 2005 @ 09:34 PM
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shots a piece of advice. if you are going to drink a lot of gateraid you need to water it down too much of those electrolights are dangerous. i know it will taste like crap but it will keep you upright.

other than that good luck. remember to stay by someone bigger than you, he will be a much better targert then you



posted on Apr, 5 2005 @ 09:39 PM
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Originally posted by shots

Originally posted by WyrdeOne
shots, first of all, are you actually taking part in the minuteman project?



Yes I am, I will be down there later this month.

[edit on 4/5/2005 by shots]


Take some pictures for us and let us know how it went. It would be cool to get an inside, unfiltered view of how things are from the inside. Stay safe.



posted on Apr, 6 2005 @ 12:09 AM
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Like everyone else said stay safe but above all keep your cool. I think the main reason a lot of people arent more supportive of this effort isnt that they want illegals in this country its that they dont trust those militia guys thats the way it is for me at least. I know alot of the people who joined up joined up for the right reasons but I'll be willing to bet that many didnt.

Asides from the Neonazi scum out to hunt down "wetbacks" I wouldnt be surprised if the group has been or will be infiltrated by provocateurs to turn america away from the border issue. The group has given some key political players a bit of a blackeye as of late. Its hard to say your keeping America safe when you wont even make the effort to keep the border secure.

The politicians have succeeded in pulling the wool over peoples eyes regarding airline security and other such security issues but thanks to the the Minutemen like them or not alot of light and publicity has been forced on the border crisis. Do what you feel is right and dont let yourself get sucked into anything nasty because of forces bigger then you (government provocateurs )or people of smaller character (nazi scum).



posted on Apr, 6 2005 @ 12:17 AM
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Originally posted by WyrdeOne

Second of all, I agree this was an abuse of authority. As long as soldiers aren't on taxpayer time or misrepresenting themselves as being official envoys of the military, there should be no cause for alarm.
I can understand why the General didn't want anyone to think the Army was officially sanctioning the event, but as far as soldiers helping out the homeland on their spare time, I see nothing wrong with that.


One thing alot of people seem to forget, is that, as far as the U.S. Government is concerned, military members are on taxpayer's time 24/7/365. Which leads me to my next statement. Somewhere, and I durn sure have look but I can't find it, there is a rule, regulation, amendment, etc. stating that the U.S. Military has restricted operational capability within the borders of the U.S., but there are certain exceptions. Can any military buffs or ex-military help me out with that, please?



posted on Apr, 6 2005 @ 12:35 AM
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Right on Shots, be careful out there. Bring a digital camera and post some pics for us.

If our infantry battalions and armored divisions can guard the borders of Korea, Germany and Iraq...why not our own borders? Its true American military personal are on call 24 hours a day, but what they do on their off time should be their business...as long as its legal.

General Hylton sounds like another PC schmuck, we need more generals like Patton and less of this fool. He stepped way over his bounds here and its BS like this that will keep recruiting numbers low.

Maximu§


[edit on 123030p://333 by LA_Maximus]



posted on Apr, 6 2005 @ 12:47 AM
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I think missing recruitment targets has more to do with inadequate assistance to military families, prisoner abuse scandals, inadequate equipment, the perception of incompetent command (your point right?), and the general distrust of the government that circulates especially strongly in the minority communities excessively targetted by recruiters because of lower average income levels and fewer kids going off to college.

I also think I was mistaken earlier in saying military men are free on their own time, they're really not, as pointed out by Ohio_Ron. I guess they're property of the military until discharge or death, whichever comes first. Hell, some members of military are still assets even after they leave. They have to provide their 'unique' services in case of civil unrest (mutiny of the ship of state) or invasion, or other special circumstances.

As far as military men operating on American soil, there are very strict guidelines, but I don't necessarily think this protest should be considered a military operation. I don't think they'd be out there with m-16s and humvees, they'd be riding up in trucks like everybody else, maybe a sidearm and a pair of binocs. Doesn't seem like a breach of contract with uncle Sam to me.

I stopped paying taxes when I stopped working, so I really have no say in the matter. But if I were a taxpayer, I would still have no objection to individuals who happen to be in the armed forces showing up and lending their support. Many of the participants are former servicemen, why not allow current servicemen to participate? As long as they're acting of their own free will and not pretending to represent the official stance of the US Military, I see no logical reason to prohibit them from attending.

It's more of a protest than anything else. Maybe someone better versed in the legality of contemporary service can enlighten us as to the particulars...



posted on Apr, 6 2005 @ 12:47 AM
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When you are in the military, you are never on your own time. Military commanders have always had and exercised the authority to limit the activities of their commands to greater or lesser degrees.

In my day, there were off-limits areas and establishments and there were liberty limits in terms of milage that, while routinely violated, were enforced, if the commander was made aware of and could prove such a limit was exceeded.

I am often surprised at how little the all-volunteer, professional military seems to know about the terms of their service.



posted on Apr, 6 2005 @ 12:53 AM
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Ohio Run,
The law is called the "Posse Comitatus Act' June 18, 1878. It basically states that the Armed Forces of the United States cannot act in police type action on U.S. soil. This law was written due to the backlash of U.S. Army occupation of the South after the Civil War. There is plenty of information out on the web concerning this law. There has also been alot of discussion after 911 as to whether this law should be changed or updated because of the attacks on the Twin Towers and Pentagon. Part of the outgrowth of these talks has been the Department of Home Land Security.



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