Democracy? I DONT THINK SO!

Democracy is defined by voting/representation, napkins and dancing have nothing to do with it either way.

Since you look at it from your unique perspective....

Known Members of Bohemian Grove
How are they known members? What is a 'member' anyway? Do they attend many meetings and pay dues? Or were they just seen there once? Do they consider themselves members or do the other members consider them as such? If there is a photo showing the bushes there, were they members? Or were they guests of freinds in it? Or were they there because, well, what do politicians do if not attend social events?

You are only there if you are a member

and this a very special sort of social event wouldnt you say? Or do you do cremation of care in your hood as well? Is it hip?

The Grove membership is wealthy, and becoming more so, while the middle class is steadily becoming poorer.

The wealthy allways become more wealthy (well, more or less). You are ascibing a sinister slant to something that is not sinister.

And there is nothing wrong with these picture?

This close-knit group determines whether prices rise or fall (by their control of the banking system, money supply, and markets),
Demonstrate that they have control of 'the banking system'. Define 'the banking system' and how it can 'make prices rise and fall'.

Why dont you ask George Soros, or educate yourself

They determine what our rights are and which laws have effect, by appointing judges.
Judges in the US are voted on by the public, and federal judges are usually voted on by congress. Those judges have to work within the precedent of caselaw and the rule of law itself.

Yes, they have to, but DO THEY ?

They decide who our highest officials shall be by consensus among themselves,
The BC? You are saying that the BC people are the secret sinister rulers of all that is?

Bingo, now i can see how you are a moderator on this forum

there goes that "its not an owl" statement
Who said that the giant owl statue is not an owl? The babylonians did not worship moloch, a group of hebrews did.

someone did, by conciously trying to take the conversation from the important matters in this topic.

here are some of your "leaders" having a nice cup of tea in the grove...proof that the big honchos DO go there.....a
And? Are they guests? members? Leaders of the group? Any pics of them doing anything more sinister than having tea? Are you suggesting that they are discussing how to manipulate the whole world right then and there?

well what can i say.....

[edit on 16-4-2005 by nukunuku]

Originally posted by nukunuku
Since you look at it from your unique perspective

You suggest then that Democracy means something other than what it means and is?

You are only there if you are a member

Your own links state that guests are more than welcome. And I doubt that they'd tell a president to sod off if he wanted to make a press appearance. Obviously they do just that.

and this a very special sort of social event wouldnt you say?

Heck, apparently its so special that they've only ever done it once. That lends credence to the idea that they aren't taking it seriously and that part of what these guys do is go out into a campground and monkey around, appparently quite elaborately.

Or do you do cremation of care in your hood as well? Is it hip?

Things like cremation of care are quite popular, as I noted, 'don't sweat the small stuff' type books are popular. The Burning Man festival in central US is very popular and cathartic too. Heck, some protestants have picked up on Ash Wednesday, 'cept they write their sins on paper, burn the paper, and smear it on their heads.
We don't even know that this is a purifying/absolution of sin ritual (even if we pretend its taken seriously and piously by members). It might be, ala burning man, merely cathartic.

And there is nothing wrong with these picture?

? Wrong? Profit isn't wrong. There's nothing immoral about making money.

Why dont you ask George Soros, or educate yourself

So then you don't know.

Yes, they have to, but DO THEY ?

As I see it the judges, as a whole, in the US have done a fabulous job of resisting the trends and fashions in society and upholding the law itself.

The BC? You are saying that the BC people are the secret sinister rulers of all that is?

I mean as opposed to the Trilaterals or the Bilderbergers or anything else. The BC people aren't a policy group, they're not an official organ of government, they're not a registered NGO, they're really not anything other than a loosely associated Fraternity. I see no reason to say that they, as an entity, are runing the world. The only thing the BC seems to run, as a group, are BC campouts.

well what can i say[/quiote]
you could try answering the questions you aren't answering.

ie
And? Are they guests? members? Leaders of the group? Any pics of them doing anything more sinister than having tea?

Your suggestions are just that, suggestions. Yet you state it as if you have said anything definitive. YOur ideas lack support and substance.

Since you look at it from your unique perspective
You suggest then that Democracy means something other than what it means and is?

Hey this is a ridiculous q, and lets stay on topic.

You are only there if you are a member
Your own links state that guests are more than welcome. And I doubt that they'd tell a president to sod off if he wanted to make a press appearance. Obviously they do just that.

where does it state that and why did Alex J have to sneak in then....are you trying to say hes faked it?

and this a very special sort of social event wouldnt you say?
Heck, apparently its so special that they've only ever done it once. That lends credence to the idea that they aren't taking it seriously and that part of what these guys do is go out into a campground and monkey around, appparently quite elaborately.

i doubt they did it only once....

Or do you do cremation of care in your hood as well? Is it hip?
Things like cremation of care are quite popular, as I noted, 'don't sweat the small stuff' type books are popular. The Burning Man festival in central US is very popular and cathartic too. Heck, some protestants have picked up on Ash Wednesday, 'cept they write their sins on paper, burn the paper, and smear it on their heads.
We don't even know that this is a purifying/absolution of sin ritual (even if we pretend its taken seriously and piously by members). It might be, ala burning man, merely cathartic.

Oh c'mon, burning man is an art festival, an interesting one at that. It has nothing to do with cremating your care

And there is nothing wrong with these picture?
? Wrong? Profit isn't wrong. There's nothing immoral about making money.

ITS HOW YOU MAKE THE MONEY DUDEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!

Why dont you ask George Soros, or educate yourself
So then you don't know.

Oh nooooo, I DO KNOW, i just dont wont discuss it here, maybe make a separate topic about it.

Yes, they have to, but DO THEY ?
As I see it the judges, as a whole, in the US have done a fabulous job of resisting the trends and fashions in society and upholding the law itself.

well if you live there i guess you should know...

The BC? You are saying that the BC people are the secret sinister rulers of all that is?

I mean as opposed to the Trilaterals or the Bilderbergers or anything else. The BC people aren't a policy group, they're not an official organ of government, they're not a registered NGO, they're really not anything other than a loosely associated Fraternity. I see no reason to say that they, as an entity, are runing the world. The only thing the BC seems to run, as a group, are BC campouts.

EXACTLY! They are not an official organ of government, yet a lot of evidence points to the conclusion, that a lot of really important stuff gets decided there and that these people are actually very different from what theyre selling to the public. I have nothing against them taking a breather from their "hard" and "demanding" lives to do some fishing, but again, evidence points in the way of a lot of freaky stuff going on here. What if you are the prez., you get to relive your boyhood fantasies over and over again?..... in the woods?

And if they try that hard to not care, is it really strange that the world is in the shape its in today?

well what can i say
you could try answering the questions you aren't answering.
ie
And? Are they guests? members? Leaders of the group? Any pics of them doing anything more sinister than having tea?

Your suggestions are just that, suggestions. Yet you state it as if you have said anything definitive. YOur ideas lack support and substance.

yeah check above posts for the lack of support and substance and you will se you have provided us with nothing that would point to the contrary. You either belive what you see, or you dont. The fact, that you can not accept the obvious is well....obvious

Originally posted by nukunuku
Hey this is a ridiculous q, and lets stay on topic.

*shrug* You are the one who brought it up.

You are only there if you are a member
Your own links state that guests are more than welcome. And I doubt that they'd tell a president to sod off if he wanted to make a press appearance. Obviously they do just that.

where does it state that

The numerous photos seem to indicate at least that they aren't trying to cover it up.

and why did Alex J have to sneak in then

Apparently he literally jumped out of the car that was taking him there and ran in himself because he was completeley spooked. I don't know what kind of arraingments the other people that had organized that show had made. Do you?

are you trying to say hes faked it?

The footage? No.

i doubt they did it only once

Why? Do you suggest that they've been doing the buddhist ceremony ever since last century then also?

oh c'mon, burning man is an art festival, an interesting one at that. It has nothing to do with cremating your care

? It has everything to do with it. At least, thats why the organizers made it. One was upset over some girl he had broken up with apparently there was another man or something, so him and his buddies 'ld go to the desert, have some beers, and everyonce in a while burn a little man made outof straw.

Why is it ok for people to go to burning man but not bohemain grove? Thats rather unfair don't you think? I ma sure that there are a heck of a lot of people who think that what goes on at burning man is ultra satanic and evil. Heck, there are almost certainly more practicing pagans and witches there than at teh BC. So why the double standard?

ITS HOW YOU MAKE THE MONEY

Ok, so what have they done that is wrong?

i just dont wont discuss it here, maybe make a separate topic about it.

u2u me so i don't miss it.

a lot of evidence points to the conclusion, that a lot of really important stuff gets decided there

Such as what? What evidence suggests that they decide anything there or even talk policy? the only time I have seen anything in that respect, it was from a long time ago, and it was over protecting professors who have unpopular political opinions from being fired and from having free speech oppressed. So that really means that the evidence supports that good stuff comes out of it.

and that these people are actually very different from what theyre selling to the public.

Why? I didn't see GWB at that ritual. Why assume he is that invovled?

evidence points in the way of a lot of freaky stuff going on here.

Whats wrong with freakiness?

And if they try that hard to not care, is it really strange that the world is in the shape its in today?

We do not know what the cremation of care ritual is intended for, or even if anyone attending it actualy beleives in it. Are they having a cathartic release? Are they 'confessing' their horrible horrible sins? Or are they taking a moment to reflect on life and say to themselves, 'try not to worry over the small things?"

yeah check above posts for the lack of support and substance and you will se you have provided us with nothing that would point to the contrary.

I have provided photos that demonstrate tht the club takes an interesting in pantomine, high jinx, and compartative religion studies and cross cultureal studies. I have provided evidence that, if policy is really discussed, its in favour of that which is 'good'.

The fact, that you can not accept the obvious is well....obvious

Why 'accept' someone elses interpretations and opinions? Do you have anything to present that demonstrates that these guys are evil, that the run the banking system, that they aren't christians,or anything that you have been saying? Anything? You've failed to do so so far.

[edit on 16-4-2005 by Nygdan]

like you said Nygdan, lets let everyone decide for themselves, i have stated my case on the subject.

Originally posted by nukunuku
i will in no way try to prove anything to anyone here, as i said, plenty of evidence floating around for everybody to see. And dont talk crap about my religious beleifs as i am not religious per se, never once been to a church.

There IS NOT plenty of evidence for everyone to see. There is only heresay and assumptions, nothing solid or conclusive. If you still think so, then you have a real warped idea of what evidence is, and I hope they never let you on a jury.

Originally posted by Dr Love
Just the fact that world leaders, including our own freakin' Presidents, are participating in a ritual like this is cause for concern. If it's no big deal, why shouldn't the public have the right to know what's going on if they want to?

WHY!?!?! They have private lives! And they have the right to do whatever they want without someone like you violating their right to privacy! Or does that not count in your eyes?

You're all hypocrites... you scream and yell when government passes the Patriot Act, then try to pull the same thing on these individuals and insist that they must disclose whatever they do on their own time in private. That's as hypocritical as it gets.

Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by nukunuku
i will in no way try to prove anything to anyone here, as i said, plenty of evidence floating around for everybody to see. And dont talk crap about my religious beleifs as i am not religious per se, never once been to a church.

There IS NOT plenty of evidence for everyone to see. There is only heresay and assumptions, nothing solid or conclusive. If you still think so, then you have a real warped idea of what evidence is, and I hope they never let you on a jury.

And you have a really warped idea of what the worlds leaders should be and represent.
And how dare you point at us about hipocricy, if this is hipocricy at its best what goes on right there
Bwaaah dont even answer, im sick of your personal attacks, its about all you can do

Originally posted by nukunuku
And you have a really warped idea of what the worlds leaders should be and represent.
And how dare you point at us about hipocricy, if this is hipocricy at its best what goes on right there
Bwaaah dont even answer, im sick of your personal attacks, its about all you can do

And I'm sick of your guys' half-[baked] assumptions and inability to simply back up your claims with some hard evidence. You state it as fact, make it so!
[edited for vulgarity - nygdan]

[edit on 16-4-2005 by Nygdan]

oh theres more than enough facts in this post to get people started.

No point arguing with your thick head though

Originally posted by nukunuku
oh theres more than enough facts in this post to get people started.

No point arguing with your thick head though

You have refused to provide evidence THREE TIMES already. You are only making excuses and acting like a little kid. I've got you up against a wall, ands you are trying to weasel your way out of it. BE A MAN and back up your claims, or admit that you cannot. But don't just avoid the challenge because I have a "thick head". I think everyone here would like for you to provide the "facts" that you claim you have.

and what exactly would be the point, go debunk the links i have provided, then i can find a couple of hundreds more for you....

untill then, go bark up another tree.

Originally posted by nukunuku
and what exactly would be the point, go debunk the links i have provided, then i can find a couple of hundreds more for you....

Honestly nukunuku, I read your links, and the pages they linked to. I just don't see it. Yea you probably could show me 100's links, and I'm damn sure they will all say the same thing, word for word in a lot of cases. But they all seem to share the same source. The Alex Jones video and some generic "workers".

I have read an account of a worker there, from all accounts they were a bunch of elitists a******* who didn't tip well and goosed the pretty waitresses. But I don't see anything nefarious in that.

Face it the rich and powerful are allways going to meet in places where the average Joe can't go. It may be a country club, a VIP bar, A private island someware, you have to just live with it.

look ill live with it either way

i wasnt accusing anyone except i stated the facts that are known, in general.
Even what you say, that the rich and powerfull will always meet somewhere.....of course they will.....

but its the rituals that are questionable. What they represent. So some here claim they are nothing but stupid pranks...well excuse me it doesnt look like that to me....

but as far as the proof goes....there you have it...a video of a freaky ritual and plenty of proof that the mighty do in fact gather there...

so 1+1=?

Originally posted by nukunuku
oh theres more than enough facts in this post to get people started.

What? No there isn't. YOu haven't even begun to make a case of any sort or say anything other than 'that don't like right to me'. Present some evidence, you even said that there is lots of it, present it.
Also, notice, the photos above, are from the Annals of the Bohemian Club. If they didn't want people to know, why would they be publishing this book?

[edit on 16-4-2005 by Nygdan]

what exactly can i give you as proof? top secret documents? my own paparazzi pics i took last summer? mmmmm?

what exactly am i trying to prove?

Originally posted by nukunuku
what exactly can i give you as proof? top secret documents? my own paparazzi pics i took last summer? mmmmm?

what exactly am i trying to prove?

YOU YOURSELF said that there was "plenty of proof" regarding what goes on there being nefarious or evil, in those exact words. Producing for us what you were referring to when you said that would be a good start.

[edit on 16-4-2005 by sebatwerk]

i am sorry why are you taking this so personally?

if its not enough proof for you i can live with that, why keep up the flaming?

Originally posted by nukunuku
i am sorry why are you taking this so personally?

if its not enough proof for you i can live with that, why keep up the flaming?

I am not flaming you, I am simply making sure people know that you have refused to provide the proof you claimed was available, and that therefore you DONT HAVE said proof. Furthermore, you cannot be a man about it and admit that you can't back up your statements, preferring instead to making lame excuses. You talk the talk, I just want you to walk the walk.