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Do you have any question about *Jihad* ???

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posted on Apr, 21 2005 @ 06:39 PM
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Islam,

I have a simple question for you.

Recently a very good friend of mine converted over to Islam.
He has been studying Islam for about 3 years, speaks understandable
Arabic and lived in Sanaa for about 2 years. So I could say that he is
very passionate and invloved in his new found faith.

Oh yeah, not that it matters, but he is white, 22 years old and in the U.S. Military.

Well anyways, being the hard headed stubborn man that Iam and the same for him. We always have little debates over Christianity and Islam....
just for fun. And I ask him If the Holy Qur'an mentioned anything about killing or not associating with non muslims or non-believers.

His answer was yes, there are some passages that tell Muslims go to war and kill non-Mulsims or followers of Muhammed (sp) or something like that....I cant quote him excatly.

Is this true? or not.

After googling up some stuff I found some passages that seem to be of that nature....but are from pro-atheism, redneck, and "other" websites.
So to me that makes them as not credible (sp) and I will not post them.

You may have already answered it but I didnt look through all the post.




posted on Apr, 21 2005 @ 07:58 PM
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I have a question....
What is the oposite to Jihad?
I mean if Jihad is the "holy war" , I hope I've got this right...please correct if I didnt, surely there must be a "holy peace" or something along those lines.....does something along those lines exist?


Hi devilwasp!!!

1. Jihad doesn’t mean Holy War because Holy War means to fight in order to force people to follow your religion and that is not valid in Islam.

Allah says: “There is NO compulsion (forcing) in religion. Verily, the Right (Path of) Guidance has become distinct from the wrong path. Whoever disbelieves in Taghut and believes in Allah, then he has grasped the most trustworthy handhold that will never break. And Allah is All-Hearer, All-Knower.” [2-256]

2. Jihad is simply the army for Muslim’s secure. It is like any army in any country whose aim is to secure their people. Thus, when USA declared a war on Afganistan, it is making Jihad against BinLaden and his idiot followers. Same thing in Islam, but the different is that USA, Syrian, Egyptian, or any country’s Jihad is to secure their people while Islamic Jihad is to secure Muslims.

3. Oppisite of Jihad is Peace and Tolerance with those who are
- not harming Muslims
- not forcing them to leave their religion
- not preventing them from practicing and spreading their religion.
These 3 things are the things that courage Muslims to declare a war and right now this is valid in Palestne against Israelis who are fighting or stealing the land and against some American troops in Iraq who are killing or torturing innocents BECAUSE they are harming MUSLIMS.





Islam,

I have a simple question for you.

Recently a very good friend of mine converted over to Islam.
He has been studying Islam for about 3 years, speaks understandable
Arabic and lived in Sanaa for about 2 years. So I could say that he is
very passionate and invloved in his new found faith.

Oh yeah, not that it matters, but he is white, 22 years old and in the U.S. Military.

Well anyways, being the hard headed stubborn man that Iam and the same for him. We always have little debates over Christianity and Islam....
just for fun. And I ask him If the Holy Qur'an mentioned anything about killing or not associating with non muslims or non-believers.

His answer was yes, there are some passages that tell Muslims go to war and kill non-Mulsims or followers of Muhammed (sp) or something like that....I cant quote him excatly.

Is this true? or not.

After googling up some stuff I found some passages that seem to be of that nature....but are from pro-atheism, redneck, and "other" websites.
So to me that makes them as not credible (sp) and I will not post them.

You may have already answered it but I didnt look through all the post.


Hi Sporty


1. I hope that your friend is not following Washables (>1% of Muslims) who are found widely in USA but not as extremist as those who found in Saudi Arabia (their origin).

The signs of them is to insist on having a long beard, short pants under the knees and above the ankle, prohibiting many things that are lawful such as music, and many other things.

2. Allah prohibited clearly very very clearly in Quran killing innocent people regardless their religions.

Allah says:

“Allah does not forbid you respecting those who have not made war against you on account of (your) religion, and have not driven you forth from your homes, that you show them kindness and deal with them justly; surely Allah loves the doers of justice.” [060.008]

He says also,

“There is no compulsion in religion; truly the right way has become clearly distinct from error; therefore, whoever disbelieves in the Shaitan and believes in Allah he indeed has laid hold on the firmest handle, which shall not break off, and Allah is Hearing, Knowing.” [002.256]

He says also,

“And if one of the idolaters seek protection from you, grant him protection till he hears the word of Allah, then make him attain his place of safety; this is because they are a people who do not know.” [009.006]


BUT there are 2 or 3 verses in the Quran that say something as your friend said to you, but it is for special circumstances as Muslim scholars say.

One of these verses is “and fight the Pagans all together as they fight you all together. But know that Allah is with those who restrain themselves.” [009.036]

To explain what that mean :

Firstl of all, this verse is saying to fight all pagans as they fight us. But they are not fighting us then, don’t fight them.

Second, this verse was sent on Muhammad when ALL PEGAN Arabs decided to occupy Medina and kill all Muslims.But even though, prophet Muhammad didn’t fight them. Instead, he and his companions dig a huge dig around Medina and thus the Pegan Arabs couldn’t enter Medina.

Third, if this verse means that we should kill all pegans or polotheists whenever we see thme, then why NO Islamic scholar said that in the whole history except that Bin Abdulwahhab?

Forth, what proof more that this verse is for special circumstances is that Allah say in the Quran many verses to respect and not harm any innocent regardless his religion and I mentioned that in the beginning of my reply to you.

Finally, if you wish to search inside the quran

Simply got to this link

quran.nu...

And choose any language you are comfortable with and search and search and search and you will NOT find a verse that says ((((((KILL ALL CHRISTIANS AND JEWS)))))) !!!

And if you feel not cleaer about a verse ask me or ask the Muslims scholars through this website

www.islamonline.net...

And give my greeting to your friend and tell him to ask the scholars who memorize and understand the explanations (tafseer) of the Quran before saying with no knowledge



posted on Apr, 21 2005 @ 08:48 PM
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Originally posted by Islam






Posted by shots

I know they are arresting them!

That was not the question.

Now why haven't the CLERICS called for a jihad against them?


I don’t know what CLERIC means and the dictionary didn’t give me a mean for that but I think it means the religious leader.

If so, you have to know that most if not all Muslim leaders are warning Muslims from those criminals and some courage Muslims to arrest them if they find them.

In short, WE are doing the best we can to get rid of those radical BinLadians who misshape the pretty face of ISLAM.


you do not know what a cleric is


I find that very odd since many Islam websites use the term when refering to the leaders of the islamic faith.

Come on you can do better then that.

Frankly I think you just do not want to answer the question.



posted on Apr, 21 2005 @ 09:19 PM
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Originally posted by shots

Originally posted by Islam






Posted by shots

I know they are arresting them!

That was not the question.

Now why haven't the CLERICS called for a jihad against them?


I don’t know what CLERIC means and the dictionary didn’t give me a mean for that but I think it means the religious leader.

If so, you have to know that most if not all Muslim leaders are warning Muslims from those criminals and some courage Muslims to arrest them if they find them.

In short, WE are doing the best we can to get rid of those radical BinLadians who misshape the pretty face of ISLAM.


you do not know what a cleric is


I find that very odd since many Islam websites use the term when refering to the leaders of the islamic faith.

Come on you can do better then that.

Frankly I think you just do not want to answer the question.



no, he's right Cleric isn't a muslim term. It'd be someone who is in charge of the Mosque, a Imma or Imra, Imha? Something like that would be the spelling but I lack in my Arabic.

Good to see you're trying to explain it, Islam, to people. If anyone has any questions that Islam has been unable to answer or you don't fully understand his answer, direct them to me. I can try and help.

Peace be upon you.



posted on Apr, 21 2005 @ 09:32 PM
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Yeah, I have a question, one that may seem simple at first, but is rather quite complex. Hopefully, you could answer it shortly.

Why? Why did 3000 + innocent people have to die at the WTC?

I am for the war in the Middle East for this reason. I believe that this is just survival, either us or them. We live, and always have lived in a very Darwinesque world, it is survival of the fittest.

But did the terrorists move in the name of their religion...? That is not clear in my mind. I just want a possible "Why did they do it?" clarification.



posted on Apr, 21 2005 @ 11:52 PM
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Originally posted by Islam
Is their a democracy in Korea?
...

Non of these countries have democracy and all these countries have NO Muslims in it.

I hope you mean North Korea, because SOUTH Korea is a democracy AND there are actually some muslims that live there.



posted on Apr, 22 2005 @ 12:05 AM
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you do not know what a cleric is

I find that very odd since many Islam websites use the term when refering to the leaders of the islamic faith.

Come on you can do better then that.

Frankly I think you just do not want to answer the question.


CLERIC is NOT an Islamic term that I know. Also, it is not Arabic and it doesn’t sound Arabic AT ALL. Maybe these websites are to Muslims from other nations than Arabs because only 15% of Muslims are Arab.

The Islamic leaders have many names according to their knowledge that they are most expert in and according to the slang and the language. The most popular terms are Imam, and Sheikh. Example of other terms that are Arabic and Arabic mixed with other languages are Mufti, Aalim, Aarif, Muhaddith, Qaari, Muqrii, Mawlana, Mulla, etc.

I am not escaping your answer because I answered you assuming that you ment Islamic leaders. So go back and read my reply.



no, he's right Cleric isn't a muslim term. It'd be someone who is in charge of the Mosque, a Imma or Imra, Imha? Something like that would be the spelling but I lack in my Arabic.

Good to see you're trying to explain it, Islam, to people. If anyone has any questions that Islam has been unable to answer or you don't fully understand his answer, direct them to me. I can try and help.

Peace be upon you.


Thankyou very much for your encouragement.

Are you Muslim ?





Yeah, I have a question, one that may seem simple at first, but is rather quite complex. Hopefully, you could answer it shortly.

Why? Why did 3000 + innocent people have to die at the WTC?

I am for the war in the Middle East for this reason. I believe that this is just survival, either us or them. We live, and always have lived in a very Darwinesque world, it is survival of the fittest.

But did the terrorists move in the name of their religion...? That is not clear in my mind. I just want a possible "Why did they do it?" clarification.


Why did they do it? I cant answer! Simply because I didn’t do it and I don’t know exactly why but I think that they did that fallen thing because they hate USA that support Israel.

What Islam say about it? This act is PROHIBITTED in All Islamic laws, directs, schools, etc. Even from Washabies (>1% of Muslims) who we, Muslims, call them as extrimest, and whom Osama is belong to them, many of their leaders deny that.

Read here to see the thoughts of many Muslim scholars about this 9/11 and terrorism of the new Binladenian religion which belong to its founder Osama

www.abovetopsecret.com...


For the war on The Middle East, Afghanistan is “OK” But why Iraq and maybe Syria, my country, and Iran ???? Why NOT Korea which is doing nuclear bombs without any denier ????? It is the OIL.





I hope you mean North Korea, because SOUTH Korea is a democracy AND there are actually some muslims that live there.


Yes, I mean NK.




[edit on 22-4-2005 by Islam]



posted on Apr, 22 2005 @ 01:15 AM
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Talking about the nice kind Muslim way of life is all fine and dandy - if you live on Mars. Reality is the small, minute population who is practicing what some refer to as "extreme Islam," or Jihad is not extreme at all. It's a clear choice to follow clear orders. I love the passages Islam quotes he likes to leave out the relevant verse's to paste a rosy picture of nicey, nicey.

Lets recap shall we:

Back in the late 70's Americans were teamed up with the Muslim world to take down the Godless Soviet Union. In fact the CIA was the largest contributor to Afghanistan survival with the Saudi's coming in second place with financial aid. We were running most of the cash through Pakistan ISI, who robbed millions of U.S. tax dollars (who's counting?). The great part was all the Quran's we funneled into the Soviet Satellite countries like Uzbekistan. Yes the CIA actually converted the Uzbeks to Muslim, wasn't that nice?

Bottomline, there will be always something for us Americans to shoot at and there will always be Muslims to shoot back. The question is can we co-exist? Ask Israel and I'm sure you'll get your answer. Oh by the way Israel did not steal Palestine or the Phillistines land, according to the Bible God commanded Moses to drive the sinners out of the land and Joshua, son of Nun did just that. Maybe you should consult Allah about this.

True Muslims say they believe in the Prophets. This seems to only be true when not talking about the brotherly dispute between Isaac and Ishmael. Anyone who takes the time to study history can clearly see why the Arabs are so pissed off. I'd be pissed off too if my father kicked me out and disinherited me. The ridiculous part is that after thousands of years of prophets, who Islam says they believe, and the history of Islam as we undoubtedly know, why would Mohammed create a new God named Allah instead of God, who the prophets spoke of thousands of years before Mohammed? I know thats a tricky one, better just ignore that question. All valid historical questions are ignored by Muslims anyway. You'd rather cover your ears and make noises than hear reality. This has always amazed me. Being a Muslim is living a contradiction and a format of life that you should never question. If you were allowed to - you would not stay a Muslim very long.

If memory serves me correctly Israel became a nation in 1948 against all odds and in one day - just as the Bible predicted. The city of David, Jerusalem, was taken in 67. All according to the predictions of the prophets hundreds of years before Mohammed was born.

How is it the Sufi's (clerics) can say they believe in prophets, such as Jeremiah, when these very prophets are Israeli!? Muslims agree only when they can utilize their sayings to better their cause in the Quran, however anything to do with Israel is left out. It doesn't take a genius to see through the BS - you just need a big shovel.



posted on Apr, 22 2005 @ 03:21 AM
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Why would you say your country had internet when you are in america?

If you really wanted to converse, your english would be perfect.

All the links hmm, do you carry them in a flash card?

I am a psychic and I detect serious fertilizer.

I think all you brainiacs got had.

God, these forums are probably full of them, like termites.





[edit on 22-4-2005 by JohnM]



posted on Apr, 22 2005 @ 05:05 AM
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Thank you Islam,
Thats cleared up quite a bit....thanks again!

DW out



posted on Apr, 22 2005 @ 09:41 AM
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OK Islam, let me rephrase my question since you do not understand what a cleric is for some odd reason every dictionary I have lists it and the definition is very clear.

cler·ic (klµr“¹k) n. A member of the clergy.

cler·gy (klûr“j¶) n., pl. cler·gies. The body of people ordained for religious service.

------------------------

Why haven't the majority of islamic religious officials spoken out against Osma and his followers?



posted on Apr, 22 2005 @ 09:56 AM
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Hello Islam:

Yesterday a U.S helicotpter was shot down in Iraq. One man managed to survive and was found by some Iraqis local militiamen I suspect; and when they found the survivor, rather than treating the individual as a prisoner of war....they shot him in the head. It seems to me that this is againist all Geneva Conventions as applied to war. The Islamic world was very upset about the pictures of Abu Graib (sp) so why should'nt we as Americans be equally as upset by this incident.

Is it in the Koran to kill all prisioners.....? Or were these men who murdered the lone survivor of this crash just a "small percentage" as you like to say!

Again I say to you that extremist elements of the Islamic faith such as the wahabist must be contained...if you can't or won't do it, then we will have little option but to take even more extreme measures.

Why was there not even 1 Imam who came out yesterday to say what a tragedy this incident was to the enitre world? I think we both know why!



posted on Apr, 22 2005 @ 10:11 AM
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Can I detect a major anti-islam (not just the member) feeling here?
If so ,why?



posted on Apr, 22 2005 @ 10:28 AM
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I am not sure what you detect.....but I certainly have no anomosity towards Islam...either the Religion or the Person here. However I am concerned about the lack of insight as to our current battle against the wahabist! They are an extreme element of the Islamic religion which must be contained! If the muslims will not do it themselves....then what other options are available!
Cool your detector down and study who the real battle is against! Personally I don't think we should have ever gone to Iraq...but I'm not the President! Now that we are there, and engaged in combat, I am concerned that the rules of warfare be followed on bothsides......does that make me anti-islamic? Hummmm!



posted on Apr, 22 2005 @ 11:48 AM
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problem is that there is a conflict within Islam itself, many fundamentalists change the way the Koran is sayin, killing infidels is a good thing etc. for example women were ban from schools because it was considered unIslamic even when the Prophet Muhammad had his wives and daughters go to school. they destroy the Budda statutes in Afghanistan because it was considered heretic idol. Islam does not tolerate the killing of innocents like old people, women and children. Al Zarqawi is killing innocent people and intentionally, even Muslims!!! But to the fundamentalists they can change the way they want on the Koran to their political ambitions. Many men in the ME are feeling lost in a region that is not advance, depends on oil as only means of funds to survive, got dictators and monarchs who rule with iron fist, not many jobs, women are ban from schools which would mean no education. Muslim men who are overseas cannot tolerate women who are independent and do not submit to surrender as in submission and obey to men. these fundamentalists are tryin to go back to the old days of the Arab Empire where it rule from Spain to the edges of China. they lost that empire and they want it back. the overthrow of the current governments is their top priority, attackin US of A is also their top priority so it will not get involve their ambitions since we seen America's history of gettin involve wen America's interest is threatened in making sure oil is accessible. it will be a long war to fight in the 21st century and we just have to deal with these people who have very big ambitions of an Arab empire from the ashes of divided Muslims and states for example Shiites and Sunnis, Egypt and Saudi Arabia. These fundamentalists claim they are the defenders of Islam but they target Shiites. pretty ironic.



posted on Apr, 22 2005 @ 12:14 PM
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Before I begin to rant on an individual basis, I'd just like to know what makes people on a board dedicated to denying ignorance, act like this?


Originally posted by shots
you do not know what a cleric is


I find that very odd since many Islam websites use the term when refering to the leaders of the islamic faith.

Come on you can do better then that.

Frankly I think you just do not want to answer the question.


Shots, I'm most surprised at you for posting something like this. You are often confrontational, usually to the point of rude, but you generally back it up with a lot of facts. However, in this case, it appears you're just attacking for the sake of attacking. Cleric is not an Islamic word. It's a generic term whitey uses to describe Muslim religious leaders of influence.

Our new member Islam is obviously not very well versed in some of the more subtle rules of grammar, or our slang, which this use of "cleric" is, technically.

Now, calling B---S--- on someone for bad facts, or use of speculation in lieu of facts is one thing, but calling someone out who obviously was not born in an English-speaking country, just for not knowing what a word means, that English people have made up, is downright crude and thoughtless. Especially when he did at least attempt a guess at what it meant.

Your bullying can sometimes go too far. This is one of those instances.


Originally posted by vincere7
Talking about the nice kind Muslim way of life is all fine and dandy - if you live on Mars....

...It doesn't take a genius to see through the BS - you just need a big shovel.


Vincere7, While I cannot condemn you for ignorance, as you did supply a lot of material to back up your claims, I must say that your bias borders on bigotry. You can make any group on Earth look bad by taking isolated incidents, and then claiming the entire group is like that. I'd be curious what you had to say about other religions, as every religion on Earth that I can think of, at some point, fought with someone else, or oppressed someone, or had views someone disagreed with in violent ways.

There are two sides to every coin, and if you ever want to truly advance in life, I recommend against condemning the many for the actions of the few.


Originally posted by JohnM
Why would you say your country had internet when you are in america?

If you really wanted to converse, your english would be perfect.

All the links hmm, do you carry them in a flash card?

I am a psychic and I detect serious fertilizer.

I think all you brainiacs got had.

God, these forums are probably full of them, like termites.


JohnM, you're relatively new, so I'm going to take it easier on you than I would otherwise.

We don't stand for the kind of crap you posted here. I have a mind to send in a warning, but to be honest, I'm not much for tattle-tales myself, so instead I'll address the problems with your post, and hope you are mature enough to take the criticism like a man, and improve your posts in the future.

1.) If you had read the thread (I believe it was even on page 1) you would see he has immigrated to Florida from the Syrian Arab Republic. If you had used logic, you could deduce that he is not neccesarily an American citizen, or that if he is, he still considers Syria his homeland. If you had used wisdom, you would have relized this question was completely uneccesary. I can say "My People" do not have internet access, referring to the Sac & Fox reservation in Oklahoma, while I myself live in Texas.

2.) Your snide remark about his English is both abrasive and inflammatory. Perhaps you should learn to converse in Arabic. Or are the only people capable of holding conversation those who speak fluent English? I think his command of the English language is admirable. How well is your grasp of his language? Or any other language for that matter?

3.) What about the links and quotes upsets you? This is a discussion about questions on jihad and Islam. Most of the people having questions are not going to have a Qu'ran or Sunnah handy, nor are they going to be familiar with the teachings in anything other than a 2nd or 3rd hand fashion. The user Islam is providing evidence to support his contentions. Something that I wish everyone here would do. If people supporting their claims with evidence is something that gets your goat, I suggest you find some other forum to frequent.

4.) I won't bother questioning whether or not you are "Psychic", but I'm sure there's an equal number of people here who could claim they are psychic, and are thus able to tell that you are not psychic. Amazing! No proof needed! Your Psychic Powers have zero credibility in a forum such as this. If you're going to call BS, you'd best have an educated reason.

5.) As for the brainiacs getting had, I suggest you re-evaluate your position. Even if one were to assume the user Islam was not from Syria, and wasn't even Muslim, they have displayed a solid knowledge of the Qu'ran and the situations in those countries. Bias notwithstanding, there is nothing "had" about discussing the Muslim concept of "jihad" with such a person.

6.) Finally, regarding your termite comment, I have no idea if that was in reference to people allegedly being from other countries, people defending the Muslim faith, or posts, or what you meant. And I have no idea where your termite comparison is warranted. Islam has been polite, has withstood a number of very rude, unwarranted comments, and answered all questions to the best of his ability.

I am not a moderator, I am not any sort of enforcer on this board. But JohnM, your comments are absolutely uncalled for, unneeded, unwanted, and if this is really the sort of person you are, I'd say the same for your presence on ATS. If it was simply a slip up, and you didn't realize it, or didn't know better, then I would suggest apologizing to Islam.



posted on Apr, 22 2005 @ 01:11 PM
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Originally posted by thelibra
Before I begin to rant on an individual basis, I'd just like to know what makes people on a board dedicated to denying ignorance, act like this?


Originally posted by shots
you do not know what a cleric is


I find that very odd since many Islam websites use the term when refering to the leaders of the islamic faith.

Come on you can do better then that.

Frankly I think you just do not want to answer the question.


Shots, I'm most surprised at you for posting something like this. You are often confrontational, usually to the point of rude, but you generally back it up with a lot of facts. However, in this case, it appears you're just attacking for the sake of attacking. Cleric is not an Islamic word. It's a generic term whitey uses to describe Muslim religious leaders of influence.

Our new member Islam is obviously not very well versed in some of the more subtle rules of grammar, or our slang, which this use of "cleric" is, technically.

Now, calling B---S--- on someone for bad facts, or use of speculation in lieu of facts is one thing, but calling someone out who obviously was not born in an English-speaking country, just for not knowing what a word means, that English people have made up, is downright crude and thoughtless. Especially when he did at least attempt a guess at what it meant.

Your bullying can sometimes go too far. This is one of those instances.



Sorry if I came across as being rude or crude as you took it, that was not my intention.

I stated the facts, as I knew them. Many Islamic websites as well as media sites commonly use the term cleric when talking or referring to religious leaders of their faith.

That is the reason I doubted wither he actually wanted to answer the question. Like you I am no mind reader, I can only use my gut instinct and in this case, I think Islam is avoiding answering my question with a direct answer.



posted on Apr, 22 2005 @ 01:26 PM
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Originally posted by shots
Sorry if I came across as being rude or crude as you took it, that was not my intention.

I stated the facts, as I knew them. Many Islamic websites as well as media sites commonly use the term cleric when talking or referring to religious leaders of their faith.

That is the reason I doubted wither he actually wanted to answer the question. Like you I am no mind reader, I can only use my gut instinct and in this case, I think Islam is avoiding answering my question with a direct answer.


I understand, but didn't he answer your question?



Now why haven't the CLERICS called for a jihad against them?



I don’t know what CLERIC means and the dictionary didn’t give me a mean for that but I think it means the religious leader.

If so, you have to know that most if not all Muslim leaders are warning Muslims from those criminals and some courage Muslims to arrest them if they find them.

In short, WE are doing the best we can to get rid of those radical BinLadians who misshape the pretty face of ISLAM.



I mean, he basically said, he didn't know what the word "cleric" meant, took a guess that it meant "religious leader" (which it pretty much does) and the proceeded to answer your question based off that assumption. He has stated repeatedly that the Islamic leaders have been urging their congregations not to emulate the actions of Bin Ladin, that the "washabies?" are definitely not following Muhammad's tenants, and that they are trying to get rid of them.

That's what it looks like to me, anyway...

Perhaps, rather than focus on whether or not he knew the word "Cleric" it would be more productive to address his answer?



posted on Apr, 22 2005 @ 01:44 PM
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Originally posted by thelibra


If so, you have to know that most if not all Muslim leaders are warning Muslims from those criminals and some courage Muslims to arrest them if they find them.

In short, WE are doing the best we can to get rid of those radical BinLadians who misshape the pretty face of ISLAM.




Perhaps, rather than focus on whether or not he knew the word "Cleric" it would be more productive to address his answer?



OK lets focus on his answer. He stated "If so, you have to know that most if not all Muslim leaders are warning Muslims from those criminals and some courage Muslims to arrest them if they find them. "

With that said, I would like to know where their statements are stating this is in fact the truth. I do not know about you but I have only seen a few statements issued by a limited number of their religious leaders that actually have condemned Osma and his gang of thugs, therefore his answer is wrong or he only thinks that is the case.

I do not know about you but I do think that it is wrong to go around and post information as if it is true when in fact it is false.

Just use a little common sense here, if what he said was true why haven't we heard about it. Surely you are not going to suggest that the government or media are trying to cover up those statesments are you?




[edit on 4/22/2005 by shots]



posted on Apr, 22 2005 @ 02:06 PM
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Originally posted by cafeman
I am not sure what you detect.....but I certainly have no anomosity towards Islam...either the Religion or the Person here. However I am concerned about the lack of insight as to our current battle against the wahabist! They are an extreme element of the Islamic religion which must be contained! If the muslims will not do it themselves....then what other options are available!
Cool your detector down and study who the real battle is against! Personally I don't think we should have ever gone to Iraq...but I'm not the President! Now that we are there, and engaged in combat, I am concerned that the rules of warfare be followed on bothsides......does that make me anti-islamic? Hummmm!

I am at battle with no one. I carry no hatred...Muslins are doing it for themselves...its just not reported.
My dector has no "cool" or "hot" settings....
Who was even pointing this towards you?
I was saying that some of the posts and or part of the posts are very worryingly anti islamic.....it was aimed at no one in paticular.



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