The Secret Cardinal:Will His Name Be Revealed?

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posted on Apr, 4 2005 @ 05:45 PM
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Ok,
This isn't really a conspiracy so I put it in the news forum instead of the religious conspiracy one...


Basically, John Paul II ('The Great') elevated a man to the rank of Cardinal in 2003... but he did not reveal the man's name. This mystery person was elevated en pectore ("in the heart"), a method of elevation usually used to protect the identity of a catholic leader in a country where the church is actively repressed (like China or North Korea, let's say). Such secret cardinals might, for example, be members of an underground church... and so the revelation of their identity could tip off the authorities as to the location of their followers.

If this man is under the age of 80 he would be able to vote in the Conclave (and become Pope, even... though any unmarried catholic male is eligible)... but the problem, here, is whether or not this cardinal 'counts' because, according to some legal interpretations, his name must be publicly announced inorder for his elevation to have occured:

abcnews.go.com...

So... if the JPII put this man's name down on paper does that count as public recognition? Might even a private revelation to his aides count? We'll have to wait and see... but one thing is certain...

There may be a completely unknown voter/candidate at the Conclave.




posted on Apr, 4 2005 @ 06:14 PM
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Originally posted by onlyinmydreams

There may be a completely unknown voter/candidate at the Conclave.



At least there is no systematic disenfranchisement of Cardinals nor any corruptible, fraudulent voting machines leaving no paper audit trail.



posted on Apr, 4 2005 @ 06:22 PM
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He's the favorite among cardinals.



posted on Apr, 4 2005 @ 06:42 PM
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Half of the world's Catholics now live in Latin America, and 40 percent of the current Catholic bishops are from the Third World, which means that after the death of the first Polish pope, the cardinals may feel compelled to go beyond Europe.

"There's a much closer ear kept on what the international church is saying. That in itself, I think, is an indication of the church being far less Roman in the narrow sense of meaning mostly Italians leading and heading it up," Cardinal Wilfrid Napier told ABC News.

There are several strong Third World papabili (Italian for "popables" or possible popes), like cardinals Francis Arinze of Nigeria, Jaime Lucas Ortega y Alamino of Cuba and Dario Castrillon Hoyos of Colombia.

Cardinal Oscar Rodriguez of Honduras, another papabili, told ABCNEWS he expected the field for the next pope to be "very wide open."

"The time will come when a pope will be from Latin America, and the time will come that a pope can come from Africa or from Asia," he said.

John Paul was criticized by many bishops for running a highly centralized church. "I've heard different cardinals say that perhaps what we need is to have more decision-making come from the different nations rather than from the central headquarters in Rome," said the Rev. Michael Fahey, editor of the Catholic quarterly Theological Studies.


The entire article can be found - here

It's quite an interesting read. Can you imagine a South American pope? Would definitely shake things up a bit.



posted on Apr, 4 2005 @ 07:01 PM
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Actually... I think that a South American pope sounds just about right. Latin America is the center of the catholic faithfull, nowadays, and it would be wrong to continue ignoring the fact that it is one of the most thoroughly catholic places on earth (though evangelicals are growing in strength there).

I, personally, would have no problem with an african pope. I just think that the church in s. america has reached an age and size where it would be unfair to continue to ignore it.

But, getting back to the Secret Cardinal... Don't you guys think it might be interesting to see such an underground figure become pope? Imagine what the effects would be if this guy was from china or N Korea.



posted on Apr, 4 2005 @ 07:15 PM
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There have been 3 African popes:

Victor 1 188-89
Miltiades 311-314
Gelasius 1 492-496

But were they black? is the 128 thousand dollar question.



posted on Apr, 4 2005 @ 07:22 PM
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Chances are if they were African they were at the very least dark olive.



posted on Apr, 4 2005 @ 07:41 PM
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Originally posted by SomewhereinBetween
There have been 3 African popes:

Victor 1 188-89
Miltiades 311-314
Gelasius 1 492-496

But were they black? is the 128 thousand dollar question.


I think these were all N Africans who would have been of Carthaginian, Roman, or Greek colonial stock (or men who were related to the native hamitic and semitic populations). There's no reason to assume that they couldn't have been, at least partially, what we think of as a 'black' person... as the roman empire had a variety of trade routes that went south of the sahara.



posted on Apr, 4 2005 @ 08:10 PM
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Actually, a friend, who's a member of a religious order, told me that the "secret Cardinal" was from China. Whether my friend knew the truth is subject to conjecture. Just thought I'd throw that idea in the ring.
Personally, I'm hoping the Cardinals will choose someone from the Third World.
JPII will be a tough act to follow, but broadening the Papacy to better reflect those who make up the majority of Catholics, worldwide, would be a good thing.
joey



posted on Apr, 4 2005 @ 09:09 PM
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Originally posted by onlyinmydreams

Originally posted by SomewhereinBetween
There have been 3 African popes:

Victor 1 188-89
Miltiades 311-314
Gelasius 1 492-496

But were they black? is the 128 thousand dollar question.


I think these were all N Africans who would have been of Carthaginian, Roman, or Greek colonial stock (or men who were related to the native hamitic and semitic populations). There's no reason to assume that they couldn't have been, at least partially, what we think of as a 'black' person... as the roman empire had a variety of trade routes that went south of the sahara.
I absolutely agree! Romans were whites, loved being white and loved enslaving anyone who was not white.

Chances are they were of African birth because they were planted there by the roman senate, and with white backgrounds.



posted on Apr, 6 2005 @ 12:16 AM
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Originally posted by joey
Actually, a friend, who's a member of a religious order, told me that the "secret Cardinal" was from China. Whether my friend knew the truth is subject to conjecture. Just thought I'd throw that idea in the ring.
Personally, I'm hoping the Cardinals will choose someone from the Third World.
JPII will be a tough act to follow, but broadening the Papacy to better reflect those who make up the majority of Catholics, worldwide, would be a good thing.
joey


The pope had named four Cardinals "in the heart" (meaning secret) three have been named to the pulbic, one was from China, but the last is still a mystery.



posted on Apr, 6 2005 @ 03:06 AM
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Been hopping on quite a few international flights this week. Amazing thing is that in almost every waiting area, I see people reading Dan Brown. His book sales must have shot right up recently.



posted on Apr, 6 2005 @ 05:03 AM
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A quote from a news article:
full article



VATICAN CITY (AFP) - The Vatican still does not know the identity of a cardinal nominated by Pope John Paul II two years ago but whose identity he kept secret, Vatican spokesman Joaquin Navarro-Valls said, adding that it may be contained in a testament he had left for cardinals.

"At the moment, nobody knows anything about it. Before the pope's death, it wasn't revealed," Navarro-Valls told reporters at the Vatican.

"We don't know if there is something in the text of the testament left by the pope. Naturally, if there is something we will communicate it when it is read."

He said the document has not yet been read by cardinals, who have so far convened three times since early Monday to discuss the pope's funeral arrangements.



posted on Apr, 6 2005 @ 03:43 PM
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Originally posted by dgtempe



He's the favorite among cardinals.


think that ID badge has RFID?



posted on Apr, 6 2005 @ 08:37 PM
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It's a very interesting situation, and one that none of us may ever know the answer to.

If he left the answer in a document, then it will be revealed I suppose, but there are also two other possibilities.

1) That it was some sort of a safety issue, and only the cardinals will know the identity of the person.

2) This literally was a "of the heart" appointment only, and the secret of who it is will never be revealed unless the guy comes forward. Of course that would bring about a billion "prove it" statements too.

Complex...



posted on Apr, 6 2005 @ 08:39 PM
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The details of the will left by the Pope will be made public tomorrow, so we may find out more on this issue then.



posted on Apr, 6 2005 @ 09:16 PM
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It has already been confirmed that the Pope never mentioned a secret cardinal nor was there mention in his will, as posted on CNN today.

For all of you conspiracy hunters, maybe theres a coverup.





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