What will happen when the Dalai Lama dies?

From what I've read about the Dalai Lama, and reincarnation, he can only be reincarnated within his realm of existance i.e. if he only lived in Tibet, and never left, than he would only be reborn in Tibet. That's the reason that all the previous Dalai Lama's were found.

But this Dalai Lama (Tenzin Gyatso) has traveled MUCH more extensively than any of the ones before him. So how in the world will the next one be found?

Also, what will happen to what is left of Tibet when the Dalai Lama dies?

I'd love to hear anyones thoughts on this subject

www.freetibet.org... Here's a link with some good info on it

[edit on 4/2/2005 by Lenina]

Good question, I have heard that he is the last DL.

There is a pro chinese DL around, but no one takes him seriously, or was he the one that just recently fled to India.

Some knowledgeable answers would be good for this thread

It's good you've heard of re incarnation. The Dalai Lama will come back as a 're run', re incarnated infront of a live audience. That's how you know Buddhism is true, it works just like TV! TV is the world of the "transmundane".






[edit on 2-4-2005 by Agent Orange]

When the Dalai Lama dies he will be reincarnated as the Dalai Lama. Monks will travel the world looking for him.

I am far from an expert. It is actually quite interesting isnt it?

The site encyclopedia.com has some mildly interesting background information about the Lama's.

And a small tidbit in tibet.com quotes the Dalai Lama himself explaining that his reincarnation would be found in a free country, not under Chinese control. But he does not say where that may be.

An interesting post on beliefnet.com says that the Dalai Lama leaves behind letters to his closest followers. The letters tell where the reincarnation will take place, and sometimes even the name of the family.

That is all I had time to find out about it.



[edit on 2-4-2005 by makeitso]

Terapin, I agree that few seem to really take notice of the Dali Lama.
However it seems to be a problem of his own making. Unlike Mandela, the pope, etc, other major movers, he doesn't make that great an impression on people.

I have with all sincerity wanted to hear him speak, and to take away some "real" information or personal insight, only to disapointed on numerous occasions, both in real life, and from recorded interviews.

The last time was when Michael Palin, a TV presenter of high standing, talked to him in Daramsala, he really came across as a giggly old man without anything serious to impart.

I cannot think of a single "word of wisdom" I have read from him, that would stand apart after he has gone.

Sad, but thats my impression, and not one I would want.

A while back I bought a book named The Art of Happiness by Howard C. Cuttler, M.D. and the Dalai Lama. It reads like a 300 page interview.
You might be interested in picking it up.

If it seems like he is a giddy old man, I can understand that. His home land has been taken from him and he is in exile. Even after that, he still has a optimistic view on life and the world. His way of looking at things are far different than many in the western world.
He is giddy because he takes the path of happiness .

I thought I would put up some quotes.

"Happiness is not something ready made. It comes from your own actions. "
"My religion is very simple. My religion is kindness. "
"Our prime purpose in this life is to help others. And if you can't help them, at least don't hurt them. "
"The purpose of our lives is to be happy. "
"There is no need for temples, no need for complicated philosophies. My brain and my heart are my temples; my philosophy is kindness."
"Whether one believes in a religion or not, and whether one believes in rebirth or not, there isn't anyone who doesn't appreciate kindness and compassion. "

Originally posted by Netchicken
Terapin, I agree that few seem to really take notice of the Dali Lama.
However it seems to be a problem of his own making. Unlike Mandela, the pope, etc, other major movers, he doesn't make that great an impression on people.

I have with all sincerity wanted to hear him speak, and to take away some "real" information or personal insight, only to disapointed on numerous occasions, both in real life, and from recorded interviews.

The last time was when Michael Palin, a TV presenter of high standing, talked to him in Daramsala, he really came across as a giggly old man without anything serious to impart.

I cannot think of a single "word of wisdom" I have read from him, that would stand apart after he has gone.

Sad, but thats my impression, and not one I would want.

Religious people must do more than offer prayers if the world is to become a better place to live. --Dalai Lama

Consider the following. We humans are social beings. We come into the world as the result of others' actions. We survive here in dependence on others. Whether we like it or not, there is hardly a moment of our lives when we do not benefit from others' activities. For this reason it is hardly surprising that most of our happiness arises in the context of our relationships with others. --Dalai Lama

Some smiles are sarcastic. Some smiles are artificial-diplomatic smies. These smiles do not produce satisfaction, but rather fear or suspicion. But a genuine smile gives us hope, freshness. If we want a genuine smile, then first we must produce the basis for the smile to come. --Dalai Lama

We normally strive to acquire happiness for ourselves and to eliminate our own sufferings, but if we were to take the same responsibility for others as we do for ourselves, we would be pricelessly valuable. --Dalai Lama

Someone asked the Dalai Lama, "Why didn't you fight back against the Chinese? The Dalai Lama looked down, swung his feet just a bit, then looked back up and said with a gentle smile, "Well, war is obsolete, you know." Then, after a few moments, his face grave, he said, "Of course, the mind can rationalize fighting back...but the heart, the heart would never understand. Then you would be divided in yourself, the heart and the mind, and the war would be inside you." --Dalai Lama

'This is my simple religion. There is no need for temples; no need for complicated philosophy. Our own brain, our own heart is our temple; the philosophy is kindness.'--Dalai Lama

"Love and compassion are necessities, not luxuries. Without them humanity cannot survive."
--Dalai Lama

What will happen when the Dalai Lama dies?

My guess... And remember, its just a guess. And its quite far fetched, here i go.

When the Dalai Lama dies, he will decompose, just like everyone else.

But thats just IMHO....

From Wikipedia:

Upon the death of the Dalai Lama, his monks institute a search for the Lama's reincarnation, or tulku, who is usually a small child. Familiarity with the possessions of the previous Dalai Lama is considered the main sign of the reincarnation. The search for the reincarnation typically requires a few years which results in a gap in the list of the Dalai Lamas. The reincarnation is then brought to a monastery to be trained by the other Lamas. The process is not always peaceful; at times rival groups of lamas each "discover" a child and claim it is the true reincarnation. This has historically turned into political struggle to decide who is the real Dalai Lama, in a manner analogous to the Pope and Antipope conflicts in the Christian world.

When I watched the movie Kundun, I got the sense that the search is somehow guided mystically.

From what I've read from the Book of Secrets by Osha, Buddha was able to predict how he would be reincarnated. They likely can't tell from which family.

Buddha basically said I will be born, the mother will die, I will stand up and walk right away. And apparently it happened because he was enlightened.

If you believe in that kind of stuff.

"Happiness is not something ready made. It comes from your own actions. "
"My religion is very simple. My religion is kindness. "
"Our prime purpose in this life is to help others. And if you can't help them, at least don't hurt them. "
"The purpose of our lives is to be happy. "
"There is no need for temples, no need for complicated philosophies. My brain and my heart are my temples; my philosophy is kindness."
"Whether one believes in a religion or not, and whether one believes in rebirth or not, there isn't anyone who doesn't appreciate kindness and compassion. "

I like it! alot!

Originally posted by Netchicken
Terapin, I agree that few seem to really take notice of the Dali Lama.
However it seems to be a problem of his own making. Unlike Mandela, the pope, etc, other major movers, he doesn't make that great an impression on people.

I have with all sincerity wanted to hear him speak, and to take away some "real" information or personal insight, only to disapointed on numerous occasions, both in real life, and from recorded interviews.

The last time was when Michael Palin, a TV presenter of high standing, talked to him in Daramsala, he really came across as a giggly old man without anything serious to impart.

I cannot think of a single "word of wisdom" I have read from him, that would stand apart after he has gone.

Sad, but thats my impression, and not one I would want.

The Dalai Lama left a poor impression on me when he beagn hanging around with celebrities, like Richard Gere. I say that as a (non practising) convert to Tibetean Buddhism. My dharma name is Jang-chub Ozer.

[edit on 3-4-2005 by Agent Orange]

[edit on 3-4-2005 by Agent Orange]

On the 14th May 1995, His Holiness The Dalai Lama proclaimed the discovery of the Eleventh Panchen Lama. The new Panchen Lama who was living in Tibet with his parents, however, was quickly condemned by the Chinese authorities and then abducted by the Chinese authorities becoming the worlds youngest political prisoner.

Meanwhile, the Chinese authorities had by now proclaimed their own Panchen Lama, a six year old boy called Gyaltsen Norbu, and had their own installation ceremony on November 30, 1995 with the actual 'enthronement' taking place on December 8th.

The whereabouts of the abducted Panchen Lama were not known until June 1996 when after a year of denying any knowledge of his location the Chinese finally admitted that they were indeed holding him. The reasons given by the Chinese for holding Gedhun Choekyi Nyima was to prevent him from being kidnapped by Tibetan nationalists!
As of January 1997 there have been no further developments and the Panchen Lama is still held by the Chinese.

The admission by the Chinese that they are holding the Panchen Lama at least brings an end to the conjecture of whether or not he is still alive but it does nothing to quieten concerns about his safety. Nor have the Chinese stated when they will release the Panchen Lama.

Regarding the Chinese designated 'Panchen Lama', the Chinese have been using the boy as an icon including unveiling a portrait of him in February this year and plans have been announced by the Chinese to have pictures of him hung throughout Tibet. This is in stark contrast with last years campaign by the Chinese to ban the public display of pictures of the Dalai Lama in Tibet.

tibet-society.org

Well I will probably get a few revenge flamings for mourning him.

The next Dalai Lama is traditionally chosen as being a child born a the moment of the former one's death. Buddhists tend to have a more holistic way of electing their spritual leaders rather than relying upon primitve popularity contests.

sanctum, perhaps clairification is in order.

There is a big difference between the Dalai Lama, and the Panchen Lama. They are 2 different roles. Your quote was about the Panchen Lama, not the Dalai Lama.

See encyclopedia.com for further clarification please

The Dalai Lama was proclaimed a divine reincarnation of the Bodhisattva Avalokitesvara, ancestor of the Tibetan people, and was installed in the Potala (palace) in Lhasa. He soon became the temporal leader of Tibet, while spiritual supremacy resided with the chief abbot of the powerful Tashi Lumpo monastery near Xigazê, who is known as the Tashi or Panchen Lama. The Panchen Lama is a reincarnation of Amitabha, the Buddha of Light.

I've always seen the Panchen Lama as a kind of second in command.

And regarding the Panchen Lama still being in chinese custody, has any recent pictures been released of him? I ask this because it is quite possible that the Chinese could kill him and no one would have a clue WHEN to look for his reincarnation, making him near impossible for the right people to find.

You are right the Panchen Lama is a kind of second in command.

WHERE IS THE PANCHEN LAMA?

This is very troubling because if the Dalai Lama passes away, the Panchen Lama helps find his reincarnation. Without a true Panchen Lama Tibet would have no leader after the death of the current Dalai Lama.

Free the Panchen Lama

Just like they did with the Panchen Lama, the Chinese government want to pick their own Dalai Lama too when he dies. They think that if they can force their own Dalai Lama to say what they want him to say, they can get the Tibetan people to do what they want ALL the time without question.

I have not found any indication on the web that the Panchen Lama has been located, nor have I found any pictures more recent than that posted just before the 1995 kidnapping.

However, the pressure on China to release the real Panchen Lama has not let up.

The Seatle Tibetan Youth Congress is holding a prayer vigil for him for his 16th birthday/the 10th anniversary of his disappearance.

I found some more protests that are currently going on about the Panchen Lama's disappearance, but I have misplaced them.


[edit on 3-4-2005 by makeitso]

Originally posted by Agent Orange
The Dalai Lama left a poor impression on me when he beagn hanging around with celebrities, like Richard Gere. I say that as a (non practising) convert to Tibetean Buddhism. My dharma name is Jang-chub Ozer.

Do you think he has any understanding of Gere's status? Or the status of other celebrities, for that matter? For all he knows, they're just famous people. He may not know why they're famous. I doubt he has a TV.

Originally posted by supercheetah

Originally posted by Agent Orange
The Dalai Lama left a poor impression on me when he beagn hanging around with celebrities, like Richard Gere. I say that as a (non practising) convert to Tibetean Buddhism. My dharma name is Jang-chub Ozer.

Do you think he has any understanding of Gere's status? Or the status of other celebrities, for that matter? For all he knows, they're just famous people. He may not know why they're famous. I doubt he has a TV.

I would say that Richard Gere was hanging around him. Was Jesus hanging around Paul? It is usually the case that the aspiring student is the one who is considered to be hanging around the teacher, imho.