Specifically Prescott bush, W's grandfather, was a big contributor.
A company called B&B brown I believe, provided nazi germany with 1/3 of their iron or steel, or somethin'

Originally posted by devilwasp
Or you just wont accept it....
Your definition of "right" will always be diffrent from others....therefore no one is right yet no one is wrong...

What kinda garbage is that? "no one is right and no one is wrong"??? There is a Right and Wrong in life young man...there is a Good and Evil. We conservatives tend to view the world in these terms, while the "elite" tend to look at everything in shades of grey. That may work in the Political Studies Dept at NYU, but it does not work in the real world.


Maximu§


[edit on 033030p://333 by LA_Maximus]

Originally posted by LA_Maximus
What kinda garbage is that? "no one is right and no one is wrong"??? There is a Right and Wrong in life young man...there is a Good and Evil. We conservatives tend to view the world in these terms, while the "elite" tend to look at everything in shades of grey. That may work in the Political Studies Dept at NYU, but it does not work in the real world.
[edit on 033030p://333 by LA_Maximus]

Thats just the problem with you conservatives, you see things in black and white. You cannot label a country as "good" or "evil" In every country there are pockets of people with positive uplifting intentions (good), and of course there are those who seek only personal power and greed (evil)
Thats why I cant write america off as a bunch of greedy ignorant pricks, because if I look long enough, there are little pockets of intelligent, hopeful people, although the numbers are dwindling, theres still some folks who at least "try" to better themselves.

Good and evil are such childish terms, We cant define whats good or evil, because it relates only to us, and our own preferences, One person might think a massive population reduction put in place by an elite group of people is "evil" While the planet, and all of its other inhabitants might see it as a new lease on life.

There was a time when terms like "good and evil" were non-existant.
People did not see life in this way, there was only "action and consequnce"

I honestly believe, a HUGE roadblock to humans becoming enlightened, is getting over the concept of good and evil. Its about as hindering as thinking the world is flat.

[edit on 6-4-2005 by Infamous Zordak9]

Originally posted by Jakomo
If China wants to take over the Middle East, they could do so easily with US forces stretched so thin.

HAHAHAHAHA....what a joke. I can promise you our US Air Force will turn any Chinese armored divisions into "stir-fry" within a week. Stick to the subjects you know about young man.

Originally posted by JakomoAs shocking as it sounds, I think I trust the Chinese government more than I trust the U.S. government.

You mean that? If so, than your beyond reach and like most French Canadians, your angry and confused.

Maximu§

Originally posted by LA_Maximus
HAHAHAHAHA....what a joke. I can promise you our US Air Force will turn any Chinese armored divisions into "stir-fry" within a week. Stick to the subjects you know about young man.

I believe the fact that US forces would be massively outnumbered in a hostile country being aided by a superpower would sorta tip that against you, eh? Or do you not remember Afghanistan?

You mean that? If so, than your beyond reach and like most French Canadians, your angry and confused.

At least the ChiComs come at us straight, offer us benefits, and don't try to coerce Canada into ridiculous ABMS's and wars.

DE

You mean that? If so, than your beyond reach and like most French Canadians, your angry and confused.

Maximu§

What does that mean? lol, im not canadian but im French, does that make me angry or confused?

Lets look at an average French persons educational history compared to american joes, ok I think the french have us beat on the confused part.
Next how about the anger? well if you look at statisitcs alone, I believe the anger is here in the homeland. So it looks like the average american is more confused and angry than the average frenchman,

and with good reason!!!

Originally posted by LA_Maximus
What kinda garbage is that? "no one is right and no one is wrong"??? There is a Right and Wrong in life young man...there is a Good and Evil.

This is not garbage it is simple facts..

The world is grey...tell me is the British army "good" ?
Is the american army "good"?
Is the french army "good"?

We conservatives tend to view the world in these terms, while the "elite" tend to look at everything in shades of grey. That may work in the Political Studies Dept at NYU, but it does not work in the real world.

The world is grey....unless your telling me no countries or orginisations have NEVER done anything evil and good?

posted by Devilwasp
Is the french army "good"?

Oooh, you walked right into this one DW, just watch the anti-french sentiment fly!

But yes, your right, they always see things in black and white when there is no such thing. Only children think like that (I should know, I have one), but then again, the US has behaved like a spoilt child lately, so I can't be surprised.

They also conveniantly forget all the crap and trouble the US causes around the globe, then act all surprised and hurt when something comes back to bite them on the arse!

[edit on 6/4/05 by stumason]

asposted by Infamous Zordak9
There was a time when terms like "good and evil" were non-existant.
People did not see life in this way, there was only "action and consequnce"

When was that, if I might ask?
Ancient philosophy has debated the notion of "good" and "evil" for thousands of years. They still are doing so. In the case of "action and consequence," morals and ethics do come into play. As such, moral and ethics are relative to "good" and "evil" and "good" and "bad" and "right" and "wrong".

You have two cases here:
Motive---->Action---->Intention
and
Motive---->Act---->Consequences

Where "right" and "wrong" or "good" and "bad" or "good" and "evil" are/is determined solely or based upon the intended consequences of the action or act.

I'm rather interested in when was there a time that terms such as "good" and "evil" were non-existent.





seekerof

[edit on 6-4-2005 by Seekerof]

Obviously there are some people in the Ivory Coast who don't think that the French army is "good"

Originally posted by djohnsto77
Obviously there are some people in the Ivory Coast who don't think that the French army is "good"

I will answer your post after LA's post...be patient...

Obviously there are some people in the Ivory Coast who don't think that the French army is "good"

Com'on DJ, don't make me shoot you down over the Ivory Coast again, we've been there, done that, and got the underpants....

But if you insist.....


The French are there as part of a UN peacekeeping force. They are seperating rebels in the north from the "Government" (it has to be added that the Government are just as much a bunch of thugs, rapists and thieves as anyone).

When the French attacked the Ivory Coast AF (all 3 planes of it ), that was in response to a Government breach of the ceasefire, in which the aircraft where used to bomb a rebel held town. In this attack, 9 French soldiers and several civilians were killed. In the French response, no IC troops where even bruised, let alone killed.

Those people you show are the same kind of people that prance around in Zimbabwe, or the Congo making it out as if they are oppressed or victimised. The truth is, its them doing the oppressing and victimising. The rebels have a valid grievance against a government which is corrupt, unnacountable and resposible for many civilian deaths, deliberately targeted in this war.

as posted by stumason
They also conveniantly forget all the crap and trouble the US causes around the globe, then act all surprised and hurt when something comes back to bite them on the arse!

Objectiveness or simple bashing?
Really a "black and white" case or a matter of you, as others, simply choosing to forget the "crap and trouble" you Europeans have wrought around the world, huh?

In any case, please don't leave out those infamous Europeans [UK included] and the troubles they have caused around the world, mkay?
The problems in Africa today are directly linked to European i[UK included] involvement in the past, etc.....






seekerof

Objectiveness or simple bashing?
Really a "black and white" case or a matter of you, as others, simply choosing to forget the "crap and trouble" you Europeans have wrought around the world, huh?

In any case, please don't leave out those infamous Europeans [UK included] and the troubles they have caused around the world, mkay?
The problems in Africa today are directly linked to European i[UK included] involvement in the past, etc.....

Well aware of that and you won't see me deny it either. BUT, we are actually the worlds leader at trying to sort that mess out now, so we accept what we have done and are trying to make ammends (although, not as well as what could be done)

Oh...ok...I can somewhat agree with that, but hey, what are you currently doing in Africa to remedy what is and has been transpiring, if I might ask?

With the closure of colonial imperialism, Africa became one huge sucking sound [indicating a void] as the Europeans [UK included] pulled out. Guess what, the sucking sound [indicating a void] can still be heard.



seekerof

The way I see it, we don't have to plead with countries like France. We are America, either with us or against us. You are either an allie or not, and France is the latter.

Is LA ever going to reply?

Originally posted by omega1
The way I see it, we don't have to plead with countries like France. We are America, either with us or against us. You are either an allie or not, and France is the latter.

Yeah those 300 soldiers dont support you in your fight against terror...thier there on a nice picnic...along with the british forces there as well...we're all drinking tea takeing in the scenery..

[edit on 26/02/2005 by devilwasp]

Stumason, I appreciate the links, thank you.
My apologies if I came across a bit harsh or overbearing, but my intention was to bang a reality check into the phase of the discussion.

Nothing personal was meant, given, or intended towards you, mate.
Thank you again for your, as with everyone else, continued contributions and for keeping me on my toes.

Peace.





seekerof

Originally posted by devilwasp

Originally posted by djohnsto77
Obviously there are some people in the Ivory Coast who don't think that the French army is "good"

I will answer your post after LA's post...be patient...

Well said Omega1

DW, Im not gonna let you drag this thread down this "right-and-wrong" road, because it will never recover. The point of this thread is to show that France and Germany can no longer be considered friends if they sell weapons to China.

SOS Rice seems to be concerned about this....maybe she see's and hears things that we don't. Do you think she warned France and Germany for the fun of it? She was dead serious and blunt in her warning.

She knows China is getting ready to fight America, otherwise she would not have givin this warning to France and Germany not to sell weapons to China......put the peices to together and you will see Im right.


Maximu§